mvg,

I'm STILL learning, in the process of learning. I can't really speak to the differences between enabling and co-dependency, but I can tell you that I, too, could be manipulative.

I had a lot of resentment built up, and the associated anger was WHOA, like Mount Vesuvius! That leads to withholding on many levels, not the least of which is affections and care. Basically, if I was angry, there was no lovin (only I didn't see it that way). I saw it as being tired from HAVING to DO everything, so I didn't have energy to spare for PWC. Now, if he had HELPED me, instead of leaving me to do EVERYTHING, I might be inclined to be 'in the mood'. Oy, pretty typical, I'm sure, but devastating to our M.

I'm not taking all of the blame for how our M was. The truth is, we needed to sit down and figure out how we were going to get things done around the house and with our son; division of duties, but we didn't. I attempted to, by asking for MORE help with this or that. That didn't work. So, I just did it ALL. WRONG WRONG WRONG.

Most of the work that I have done has been through these boards (talking with BR, Mimi, Lousy Golfer, and talkign with those who were in the same boat--Like LilSis, Chrisner, sdguy, Wildhorses, Lunamare and so on and so forth). I continue to use the boards and those who have been through this. I also read books and research online. I practice. You cannot change without putting things into practice. That means doing things that are counter to what you HAVE done in the past.

It can be awkward at first. I even felt, initially, like I was letting PWC 'off the hook' for his infidelities. I'm not. I just realize that those choices are his to bear, and he put himself up on that hook. Yes, I have to deal with the fallout of those choices, and the pain he caused me, but I cannot change what has been done. I've chosen recovery, and that means *I* have work to do.

I don't live my life according to what PWC does or doesn't do. I appreciate MORE what he DOES do, and drop the focus off of what he doesn't do. I've noticed in the last few weeks, teensy changes.

Is it fair to have to endure so much more, NOPE. THis is not about fairness, not recovery. It's about fixing what is wrong with the M, and with yourselves. Since you can only control you, you fix YOU and the poor habits you have in regards to your M, regardless of what your FWH does.

Need some reassurance and support here....
On top of dealing with my emotions regarding WH, learning about ME,etc...My youngest daughter is getting married Saturday so very chaotic time. On top of that Saturday night MY poor dog had a stroke (another emotional issue to deal with). Doesn't look good, but we're going to with the help of vet give her a few weeks and see where we are then. Now on to my request...

I realized this morning that I'm getting very anxious about the wedding, not just daughter getting married, but my expectations of my WH. I'm hoping he will see this as a very romantic event and emotional for me too. I'm hoping he'll stick close to me and be attentive.

Ok HELP! I can't set myself up for this and then it not happen. Tell me what to do to distract myself.

I hear ya! Thank you. I'm practicing. He IS trying. Sounds good doesn't it?! Maybe one day I'll actually feel good too.

If you want things to be romantic YOU make it romantic or ask for what you want; a dance? a kiss? a hug? a hankie? Whatever you need, you have to ask for. Do not EXPECT him to just KNOW and give it to you.

I'm sorry to hear about your doggy. It sounds like you are dealing with a lot of stress, a lot of change all at one time. Can you go to a quiet place and just be for a little bit, 30 minutes, 2 minutes, whatever you can muster? Just breathe.

Breath...oh yeah I remember what that was like. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks...just a little freaking out going on.

(((mvg)))

So sorry to hear about the dog. Hope she's doing ok now.

As I read your post, I am reminded of what my friend used to tell me. Plan A is the time to have no expectations. I know it is tough, very tough actually. You would think that after all the pain that he has caused you, he would make ALL the effort to make it up to you. Well, I guess you and I both know by now that it doesn't happen all the time. So, totally agree with silentlucidity, TELL him what you want. It doesn't work all the time for me but it does for some times. Like yesterday, I told him that I felt very depressed suddenly and he just gave me a blank look. I had to tell him that it would be good if he could hug me for a while right now. But after he did that, we both felt better. I used to feel that if I had to tell him and then he does it, it takes the romantic feeling out of it. But I figure out that guys are wired in a different way. Just be thankful that he is still willing to do what you asked.

As for distraction, taking deep breaths is good. Or try looking into the mirror and telling yourself to stop freaking out. That you are in control and you are going to enjoy your daughter's wedding.

Sounds like my situation. I can't offer much help except that it appears to be normal for WS to act like this. Mine did the same thing. He had one session with MB and never filled out the questionaires. He just moved out Tuesday nighht for a second time. I found out he was with OW Monday night. He had a reasonable explanation of course. I sense he isn't on board with recovery yet.

jcool, thanks! I will tell him, or I'll just hold his hand so tight he'll get the picture!

I'm feeling a bit better right now. I got alot accomplished yesterday so I'm on schedule for the wedding and I'm taking deep breaths.

We brought my dog home yesterday. She's improving a tiny bit but I wanted her home so we'll treat her here and the vet is so sweet told me to bring her back the day of the wedding just so I wouldn't worry. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I will give some kudo's to the ole WH...he wouldn't let me take pup to the vet alone because I was afraid (prepared) we were going to have to put her down. HIS suggestion wait for me to go with you. YEAH!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Ani6209 I'm sorry! Da## WH's!!!

mvg,

I want to make a comment about "imposing consequences". Your husband isn't a child, so you won't be in the business of imposing consequences or presenting ultimata unless you want to be his mama. Making him do what you want him to....will be unsatisfying even if he does it.

Your duty is protect yourself....not punish him.

For instance, the natural consequence of his procrastination is that you're losing faith in your marriage and his inaction is destroying your love for him. You don't have to impose those things....those things will naturally occur.

In your quest to let go of the outcome, control, and codependency....you will have to stop rescuing him, and rescue yourself. The most difficult thing for someone who is looking for validation outside of themselves is to stop measuring their happiness based on the action/inaction of others.

The other problem with threats (it's either this way or over) is that you probably won't follow through with them...you love your husband and you're looking for a way to stay....not a way to leave. After 30 years of marriage....is it really likely you're going to throw in the towel? If you were the one having the affair, you might leave....but what you really want is for your husband to honor you as his wife and show you through action that he's interested in building a better marriage.

I'll try to post more later....but my daughter's wedding is now only two days away.....so it's getting pretty crazy.

star*hug

mvg.......you're amazing and so much more than a threrapist's poster child!!!! (your comment from the enabler's thread!)

By the way.....way to link...how'd you learn that? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I know that getting all this help is sometimes addictive and I see you logged in when you've obviously got tons of other stuff to do with a wedding in 2 days. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Know that many are praying for you and look forward to hearing how well it went afterwards.

On my Smiles and Trials 2 recovery thread, LC said something that helped me, but may also help you.

EXPECTATIONS......they can make or break memory-evoking events. Don't allow them to ruin your daughter's wedding. If your H does not ask/do/say something you would expect him to, just mention it. He's possibly as stressed as you are, (but guys don't allow it to be known, right?).

So don't build up expectations that he does not have any way of knowing unless he is clairvoiyant (sp?) and I'm sure it will go well.

Log in and vent here briefly if ya need to....we'll all be praying for you.

Ace

PS Somewhere, I think on this thread, Mark said somthing about EA's being more difficult to overcome often than a PA b/c the WS does not think he/she has done anything wrong. In my case, my WH knew he was wrong, but the OW did not think she had done anything wrong, that I was overeacting. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for your thread mvg, b/c that's the first time I've seen such a sentiment expressed on these forums and I truly appreciate it.

Star are you talking about my holding his hand tight post? I'm really not trying to impose consequences on him or me. And yes it is very unsatisfying. I was really just trying to get advice on HOW not to have the expectations


Thanks for the reminder. This is hard.


Things are going on the good side...so the my way or the highway is not on the table right now.
And Star, my daughter's wedding is Saturday also, I totally UNDERSTAND crazy...plans and me! Good luck on wedding. And thanks for posting especially during this hectic time for you. I do feel good knowing you took time to do that.

I know that getting all this help is sometimes addictive and I see you logged in when you've obviously got tons of other stuff to do with a wedding in 2 days. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> [/quote]

LOL @ U, acey...I'm thinking of adding Obsesive Compulsive disorder to my LONG list! And some REALLY kind people taught me to link! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Truthfully, when H goes to work at 4:30AM sometimes it wakes me so I try to relax at computer...then I try to learn. SEE OCD!



It is such a wonderful feeling to actually know I do have people praying for ME!!!!


Hey I actually got almost all the way thru the Smiles & Trials 2! And thanks for the Expectations reminder....I'll remember.



Thanks Ace!!! What thread? My rantings of a crazy BS this thread?! Ace, I appreciate your support.

Hey mvg.....I'll reply after your DD's wedding....plus I have no time, either.....just wanted to say I'm praying for you.

"Lord, please give mvg's entire family and friends the peace that passes all understanding, and please make all the memories of this wonderful event beautiful moments in time. And may all the details go well, too.

Amen"

Ace I read your prayer for me...tears welled up. Thank you.

More of a vent/rant read if you dare...
Rehearsal & Wedding .....smiles, trials, and breakdown (Ace hope you don't mind me borrowing a bit of your title)

Grandmother (matriarch of his family) and I were the contact people for this wedding. Future SIL's Mom never was involved. From the get go I was informed GM was the contact. GM, SIL, DD & I had met previously to discuss wedding. They have a REALLY large family (all local - my family is not local traveling a couple of hours) so GM offered to help with reception and decoration if that was ok with me. Ok with me. We had a complete agreed upon list of decorations, food, everything.

GM and I talked several times, especially within the last few weeks till present, just to make sure we had everything covered. We did, UNTIL last week I was given the reception food list and a modified list of what I was to bring. DD pleaded with me to be nice and not cause a commosion within the family . I mentioned to GM that I didn't think the additions were necessary there was more than enough food. I was over-ruled. Ok, to please DD I did it (GM had already changed the entire buffet menu- I never said this to her or DD) .

GM wanted to decorate the window sills, okey dokey no problem. I was to decorate the alter area and reception hall. GM was just suppose to help with food for reception. Last week GM then came up with candelabras, flower arrangements etc for church and table centerpieces for reception tables, bows.....pretty much everything. Before this all came to light I had ordered, purchased, borrowed everything per DD's request as to how she wanted the wedding & reception. I asked DD ok, WHAT DO YOU WANT? Well she really thought their centerpieces & othr things were quite pretty, BUT we could still use the ones she had requested IF I really wanted to. I told her whichever is fine, just let me know. (And yes I was resentful at this point...not to DD but with the situation and GM, I played nice, acted nice, went with the flow).

DD, future SIL, H, me and 3 grandkids went to decorate for reception before rehearsal. We had a good time, relaxed, fun. GM had tables already set up with a note to me that I could change it if I wanted to. Centerpieces placed,etc. So basically I just had to get our food refrigerated, platters arranged that type of thing, along with putting tablecover on and resetting centerpieces.

Rehearsal went as normal especially with small children...wild! But it was fun and exciting.

Rehearsal dinner was nice.

After dinner Future MIL comes to me and informs me that I will be doing the serving of food during the reception. WHOOOOOOOAAAAaaaaa, nope that's not happening. I informed her, HER MOTHER told me she had 3 people to do that. Nope I'm mistaken, I'm to do it. (Ok I'm sure I had the deer caught in headlight look on my face). We find GM, I'm right 3 people to serve, MIL wrong. Future MIL also informs me that she has video person, really....DD asked her aunt to do this. Nope MIL has it covered.....well thank goodness my sister did bring her stuff anyway cause the OP didn't show.

Wedding day, we arrive to prepare food table early to find MORE decorations and layout of how food was to be placed on serving table. I was chuckling a bit, but also a bit pi$$ed. Wedding party starts to arrive, getting dressed, exciting, happy, very nice. I went to find Ushers to tell them I wanted my 8 family members to sit on the pew with H & I. We are all very close, and so few I WANTED them there. Well as I'm asking ushers to do this GM TOLD me that's not how it's done and wasn't going to happen. I looked at her startled and in keeping the peace said fine whatever, I was then informed they COULD be seated behind me. DD doesn't not realize any of this has taken place today.

Oldest DD was younger DD's maid of honor. GD was flower girl. DD getting married was beautiful. All of them were. Everyone was just so pretty!

Wedding went fairly well AFTER ring bear (who is yDD's 3 yr. old) had a screaming fit and had to be removed, flower girl after picking up all the pedals she threw down then had a meltdown of her own and had to be removed. Very pretty service. Twins thankfully were pretty quiet and they got to stay.

Then the pictures. Ugh....Thankfully we had done some before, but of course the bride & groom pics had to be taken. Took a little while. Then MIL insisted that EVERY family member of theirs have their pic taken with B&G too. Not what DD had wanted and had JUST talked to MIL the day before to clarify that wouldn't happen. Ha ha, it did.

Finally get to the reception area, everything I thought was going well. Announced again B&G, they danced 1st dance then sat down. The bridal party and parents start going thru what was leftover of the buffet line. Next thing I know I look up and they've cut the cake, have cake really smeared all over each other BAD. I went over I thought sorta cute way said hey y'all are covered in cake and I missed it. They go out to clean up, they are gone awhile, come back and I look at her and mouthed you ok cause she didn't look ok. She mouthed no, so once they sat down I went over and asked her what's wrong honey-I thought she was upset with her new H because makeup ruined, hair messed up and icing in it... Her response, YOU HURT MY FEELINGS with the cake comment. I was shocked. I looked at her and said oh no, I'm so sorry I just meant I missed cutting the cake. I wanted to see that, well YOU hurt my feelings.

I apologized again trying not to cry, I could feel it coming, so I walked outside away from anyone out there, out to my car in a secluded area and wept, my heart breaking - NEVER would I intentional hurt her feelings, I felt I had runied her wonderful wedding. I was very upset with myself. Kudos to WH...he came to find me, then my sisters. They all calmed me down, I dried my face, checked my makeup and put a smile on my face and went back in...all in all gone maybe 10 mins. Rest of reception went on. They finally left in a cloud of bubbles and clean up began.

I found at later from my sister that DD told her I yelled at her in front of everyone and then caused a scene in the parking lot. THAT did NOT happen. Her perception but not reality. I know everyone was nervous, weddings are so emotional. BUT I did not yell nor cause a scene. I did as she asked just do what they want, and I did.

All in all a very pretty wedding, there was however NO need for my family to be there. SIL's family gave her a beautiful wedding and I went along so not to cause a problem for DD as per her request. Doesn't make me feel any better tho....I guess there is that co-dependency thing again.

I am so glad the wedding is over.
I'm still sad that DD feels the way she does.

MVG,

So, are you gonna tell us about the wedding or not?

Mark

MVG,

We were simulposting I think.

Just read the story of the wedding but no time for chat now. Gotta get to church.

Mark

That's Ok. It's a looonnnngggg post anyway! I'll check back later on. But thanks for checking Mark!

Wedding sounds like a typical wedding. And at least, they DID have it. My step-daughter and her fiance ELOPED after planning the wedding for a year. His parents drove them crazy, and they decided to save the trouble and money and secretly eloped.

I don't know about typical, just thank goodness it's over. I WISH they had eloped.