Her excuse for leaving is to be with her father while he goes to the Dr. Which her sister also goes with them. But I feel she makes it sound worse then it actually is. It is only the excuse to be there with OM.

I am not certain where I stand in regards to her abondoning us. When I spoke to an attorney she wanted me to file for D when WW left but I absolutely will not do this. The home is much more stable when she is not there. She has no remorse and only contibutes anger and negative thoughts and feelings when she is there. I am still not sure how keeping her out will help my Plan A.

I did mention to her last night that if she has no intentions of trying to work on our marriage she should stay where she is. She got mad and couldn't beleive that I "thought she would do that to her children". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Thanks,
FT

LA,

I did tell her that this did affect our relationship and the fact that she refused to let go has always affected our M. I always knew that she felt that way but never wanted to confront her about it. I regret that now. I asked her about counseling in early November she wants absolutely nothing to do with anything that has a chance of helping our M.

I did mention, not the dream but the fact that I missed her smile and the way she made us laugh. I didn't get a response nor did I expect one but it felt good to tell her. Even though she only wishes to see everything as a negative, I know she hears this stuff and it will make a difference.

I know her behavior is standard fog behavior but it is still tough to deal with. I really was doing great, sleeping, taking care of myself but last night was tough. I know that this is just one of the bumps in the long road.

I don't like feeling like this again. I refuse too let myself stay in this mindset and I will pull myself out of it today.

Take care,
FT

Her threat to you about "killing" his parents is simply that - a threat - to prevent you from spoiling her affair and the fantasy by exposing it to everyone.

Expose it as soon as you can to everyone you know. Her family, his family, every single person. Tell them that you need their help to end the fantasy and the affair, and to save your marriage, and the only way to do that is to end the secrecy and the fantasy she is in. That you love her, and that you need their support for your marriage and children, and that the OM is an intruder in your family and marriage.

Ask them to support marriage and family, and not adultery and infidelity. Ask them to support her by helping her see that her behavior is not in her own interest, nor in the interest of her children. That she should return home, get marital counseling, and work hard to recover the marriage.

Expose, expose, expose. She fears it because she KNOWS it will damage the fantasy and the relationship, and because she KNOWS the relationship is fragile.

SB

It looks like I will be skipping Plan B and moving into Plan D. I am feeling like I let myself slip past the negative in my LB.

WW kind of talked me into progressing with D last night. She doesn't have the $$ to spend on the D. She mentioned her Attorney said our home would need to be sold... After some talk she agreed to basically walk away. Giving me the home and primary of kids. She of course is worried about having to pay child support. Which I told her I want nothing if she is willing to walk away.

Her main concerns have been her credit and money. I don't know who she is right now and I have a hard time caring. I am willing to stand at the front door and wave bye at this point. Any person that can be that obsessed with another person that they can forsake her own children is not someone I want to be with.

I am not sure when I went into the negative in my LB but her actions over the last couple of months have shown me that she is not worth fighting for. It's not just the A, it's what she says and does to the kids that concerns me. I honestly think the things she says and does to them is more damaging then the D will be.

FT

I think, at this point, if she is willing to give you the house and primary custody of the kids it would be almost foolish not to take it, or at least strongly consider it. Divorce itself is not necessarily final, and if you still love her you might tell her that.

I'm sorry it hasn't gone as you wanted fasttrack, but the opportunity to get out, without a drawn out legal battle and a fight over the time with the kids is not the worst outcome either.

I wish you the best.

I am really struggling with what I should do. I think I played right into her hands. I know she was provokig me to agree to D and I fell in the trap.

But I have a hard time with this, considering that what she is offering is my best bet? Not jumping on this opportunity to salvage our home for the kids and myself is not the right thing to do? I am sure if this does go into a D all equity in the home will go to attorney fees.

Any thoughts on this?

Thanks,
FT

Well, imo it simply comes down to a risk/reward analysis.

The best outcome is that you are able to save the marriage. I believe that it is still possible that you could do this, however, it has to be acknowledged that your Plan A efforts did not have the result you hoped for, and a weak Plan A does not set up a strong Plan B. Doesn't mean its impossible by any means, just means that in reality, you are not in the "ideal" position MB plan-wise.

In the event that you cannot save the M, the next best scenario would be a D with you getting full custody of your kids and retaining your fair share of of the marital assets. She's offering you that now.

IMO if its real its a tempting offer. Yes, its playing into her hands. She's buying you off, how aware she is of what she's doing, how much she really means the things she's saying and doing, how much is fog and how much is real? Who can know? But that doesn't change the fact that it is a very tempting offer. You know that if you don't take this offer, there is still a real chance that you end up in Plan D anyhow, and at that point she might not be so accomodating.

That's just my take FT, I'd suggest you hear many other opinions before making a decision.

Thanks Tyk, your points validate my thoughts on the situation.

I kind of threw it out there not really knowing what her response would be.This was after her insisting that I don't listen to her and her telling me what she wants to make herself happy. But her eyes lit up when I mentioned it. It was heartbreaking to see her reaction. I could not beleive it myself. It was like the bell sounded for her and she had just thrown the knockout punch. I think she wanted to go out and celebrate...

I feel like I am losing respect with my DS. He sees the mean things she does and hears the mean things she says. I worry about what he thinks about me. I tell my DS and DD that I am doing all I can to save our family and my marriage. I just feel like I am validating her actions and words by continuing to Plan A.

If she is really willing to give me joint custody but me being primary household, and the home I am not sure I can pass it up. I honestly still can't beleive she agreed. But I think what sealed the deal for her is that she was concerned about having to pay child support. Not necesarily what is best for the kids. It really is shocking too me.. my stomach is in knots at the thought of D and it was a restless night.

FT

Have another question about how to handle her new found joy and freedom and how great she feels now. I want so badly to have an AO and do some serious LB when she tells me how much she is enjoying her new self. I won't allow myself to get sucked into the AO and DJ trap. I know I am the better person. But it is still hard to digest this poopoo when it is spewing from her mouth.

FT,

How are you sleeping now?

I wouldn't buy into her fog, even about walking away, until I had it signed and notarized at an attorney's office. I'd work out a visitation schedule, including holidays, etc., what she's required to have at her abode (how many dressers, how much clothes, toys, etc.)...very detailed...so she can really see where these choices may lead...

I can share that when you feel like a crappy wife, mother, daughter...whatever role you have...doesn't look like abandonment (and it is)...looks like you're doing everyone else a favor.

Of course you aren't. Doesn't mean that's where your WW is...however, that's more fantasy...may factor in.

Your job in Plan A is to bring reality...act from respect...get out of the way of her consequences. Then you won't want to LB so much...

Your own DJs, I believe, are kicking in your anger big time...your resentment...and you're doing them to yourself.

Here are a few: "Her main concerns have been her credit and money."

"But her eyes lit up when I mentioned it. It was heartbreaking to see her reaction. I could not beleive it myself. It was like the bell sounded for her and she had just thrown the knockout punch. I think she wanted to go out and celebrate..."

These hurt you...and aren't true...see the fog is full of justifications...fantasy...where you control everything she does, cause her feelings, her resentment, and are the cure for her stuff...when you KNOW you are not...so she could have lit up because in her self-deception, where she lied to herself that you didn't love her, wouldn't care if she had an A or not...she may have had a moment of feeling "right" in all her wrongness...because she guessed she could get you to talk divorce...doesn't mean it won't kick her to her very soul...you don't know...

Don't forget this is very much like a drug addict...and they want to score, to stop pain, distract...they focus on their own feelings...so do not focus on yours.

Know them...stay aware of them...do not react from them, 'k?

Plan A is preparation for Plan B. If you choose to settle custody and residence, that's a huge part of an LSA...not a divorce...maybe this could be your preparation for Plan B...which IS about saving your marriage.

Do not doubt it.

Your own LBs can wipe out your feelings of love for her...if you justify her stuff as causing your stuff...not all about her actions, reactions, choices...it's complicated and overlapping...and yes, focusing on how important FC is to you and how she's currently going negative in the flow of meeting that one...good to know for you...where your heart is, what matters...and to make sure you're meeting that EN with a lot of focus and care.

You are. Watch your focus. When it goes all over her, where you have no control, then you aren't in respect, are not bringing reality (fantasy, instead) and are betraying your own goal. Stay aware, FT.

Plans matter...choose well, follow thoroughly...your personal recovery is solely in your own hands.

LA

I was not expecting this avalanche of emotions I am feeling today. I want so badly to throw in the towel. But I can't get myslelf too let go of the hope that my W will crawl out of the WW monster that I have been living with.

I have seen glimpses of my W in the last week. But the WW has returned in full force the last couple of days. It is because of her need to go see OM. She was planning a trip next week and I threw a wrench in those plans and this unleashed the beast. So the WW returned and has been on the rampage.

She did an excellent job convincing me that she was not worth all the effort. She told me she couldn't understand why I even wanted her after what she had done. She told me it would be another affair if not this one. She has done almost nothing in the time she has been home. She is still not working and does little to no upkeep with the house.

I know it was all babble but my daughter came into the room when we were talking. She proceeded to tell my WW that she did not want to move and she wanted all of us to live in our home forever. When this had little effect on my WW it was just so hard to justify my fight. She doesn't see the pain she is causing, she chooses to focus on her "happiness".

I have been praying for guidance. I just feel that the biggest mistake in my life is going to be made if I let her have the D without more of a fight. But the circumstances that she is offering are so hard to pass up.

Any thought are appreciated.
FT

Thank you LA for your guidance.

I did not sleep much at all last night.

I knew what I was doing last night was all wrong. I let her provoke me. She was relentless and I gave in. I knew it was all wrong. But I won't beat myself over what I should have done. I am focusing on the now.

I knew it was all part of her plan so she could leave again. When I asked her not to go she told me if I thought she was going to be doing something wrong I could go with her, I accepted the invitation. Next day she decided she wasn't going, and the next day was yesterday and now we are here.

I am pretty sure she will leave tomorrow since my father is coming to town and she wants nothing to do with any of my family. It will be a good excuse for her to leave sooner.

I will clean up the mess and move on.

Thanks,
FT

So you're giving up because your WW says so? If that's what you want. From a legal perspective however, promises out of her mouth right now don't mean squat when it comes to signing on the dotted line. You CANNOT base your decision on whether to let her go and the fact that she is "willing" to give up her children and the house. She can change her mind in a New York minute and there wouldn't be a thing you could do except fight it out in court... which is what will happen anyway.

No child support? She is OBLIGATED to provide for her children if she chooses to leave the home and not be the custodial parent. Why let her out of that? More reality she needs to experience.

You're right. You ARE playing right into her hands. Why not do a VERY VERY DARK Plan B? She hasn't had to experience the reality of life without you in it.

Your children need their father to STAND for his family. Quit reacting to her. Let her go and fall down on her own.

This can be fixed.

Princessmeggy,

When I said I will clean up my mess and move on. I did not mean I was giving up. I am going to continue to with the plan. But I am looking at doing my Plan B sooner rather than later.

I appreciate you taking time to help me. I knew it was wrong when I was doing it. I am sure that's why I didn't sleep. I knew I was reacting but she caught me off guard. She had been so nice and pleasant prior. The switch just got flipped a couple of days ago. I saw it coming but I didn't prepare myself for it.

I got caught up in the "good" that the WW was letting me see. I have learned a valuable lesson.The WW beast is still there and will be there until OM is out of the picture. I know he is the one feeding it.

I will go back to focusing on my kids. We have had lots of fun. Went mountain biking with son the other day. It felt good. It's something I used to do all the time. My daughter and I went hiking Tuesday and we had a blast. I feel great and receive compliments on my appearance all the time. I lost about 44lbs last year. I had started working on it prior to all this but the infedelity diet definately made a difference in the end and sped up the process. A lady at church asked me if my kids were my brother and sister. My WW was telling me the other day how ugly she feels. Not that it makes me feel better, and she is beautiful. I just think she is in a different place then me. And maybe not as happy as she thinks.

Thanks,
FT

If you are not ready for D, then DO NOT DO DIVORCE FT, I agree with everything these people have said about that.

If you're gonna fight, then FIGHT, and throw everything into so you don't have to look back and wonder if you could have done something else.

Good man! But before you go to Plan B make sure you're prepared... Plan B letter showing her the way home when it's time, finances in order, any necessary legal protection, intermediary available, good Plan A memories for her to miss... etc.

Tyk,

Wednesday night I was ready for D. She had me convinced it was best. The restless night I had after that proved to me it was a bad decision on my part to let her drag me down that path.

I let myself forget why I was fighting. This decision to fight is not just for me it's for my family, my kids that can't fight for themselves right now. I let myself forget that.

PM,

Tyk still has valid points about my Plan A. As much as I try and get her to do things with me or even go places with the kids and myself she has nothing to do with it. So my plan A is weak in my eyes and I have too question how effective it will be. Regardless I will continue to do the best I can. I will just focus on making myself a better husband and father and hope she notices.

Thanks to you all, I had a great nights sleep last night. I owe you. I had some peace of mind last nigth. I know I am doing the right thing by continuing the fight.

Thanks,
FT

I had a good weekend with my dad and stepmom. Kids had a good time with them also. Stepmom was and dad were both very supporttive and of course it feels good knowing they are there. I wish they lived closer.

WW left as expected on Friday afternoon. Didn't tell me where she was going and I didn't ask, it was obvious what she was going to do.

We didn't hear from her all weekend until late Sunday afternoon. She called too let us know whe was coming home but changed her mind when she found out my parents were still there. She ended up texting me that she would be there to send DS and DD off to school in AM.

I had already decided to take the day off. She did show up and went and tried to hide on my DS room. She was waiting for my parents to leave.

I really let my taker get the best of me. I reacted horribly and asked her why she was even there. I asked her to please leave. Told her we didn't deserve this cause we had done nothing to her. SHe said she hadn't done anything and left to take DD to school. Didn't see her until the kids came from school.

It is obvious she is being coached by her attorney. As she knows not to leave the house and to be there for the kids going and coming to school.

I ended up really letting my taker get the best of me again as she was leaving for the evening. I was doing some serious lovebusting. It's hard for me to keep my taker in check right now. I have to think that it's time to move to Plan B if I can. I know if I have another day like yesterday any Plan A work I have done will be useless. I was hoping to have a better Plan A then I have had.

Her continuing to see OM is not something I am dealing with very well. I have so much respect for all of you that endure this. I hope you can offer some advice to help. I feel like I am doing good and yesterday was horrible. I don't think I have done bad overall she is just not receptive to allowing me anything close to 15 hours a week.

It all just seems hopeless and I know it's not just me that feels this way. I read other peoples stories and their continuing to fight for and their recoveries of their marriage and family gives me strength to do the same for mine. Thanks to all of you for all you do regardless of wether you realize it you are an inspiration.

Thanks,
FT

You are WAY overdue for Plan B, ft. I would get your ducks in a row with a legal separation before this just explodes and there is no turning back. It is in NO ONE's best interest to continue allowing her to use your home as a flop house while she carries on like an alley cat in heat. It is detrimental to your mental health and horrific for your children to see this going on unabated. They need to be protected from her bad influence.

I see you wearing down fast from her abuse, and that will not only effect your mental health, but will cause you to hate her. Dr. Harley says once a BS grows to HATE the WS, it is hard to ever turn that around. You are all your kids have at this time, so they need you to be in good mental shape. That is why Plan B is called for. Continuing in this abusive situation decreases any chance of saving your marriage in the future, IMO.

Thought I would give some detail as to what I actually did yesterday. Maybe you all have some input on if it was as bad as I think it was.

WW quit her job in November. She has not workied since. She continues to live in the home. She makes it clear that I owe her for everything she has done...

I asked her that she help pay for living expenses and half of house payment. She feels she does not have too and refuses. She is content to hang out and come and go as she pleases.

I buy the groceries and do pretty much all the cooking, I can only think of one occasion in the last 2 months that she actually cooked. I have been doing pretty much all the housework. She has done some laundry and actuall did some cleaining last week. Not sure why, but I think it was because my dad was coming. She clearly stated that was not the reason.

She told me when she cam back from her last 2 week leave that she did want to work on the marriage. She did nothing to show that. And last week she said she does not want to work on it. She said she only said that because she wanted to come back to the home.

Do I continue to ask her that she contribute to the home? She has money to go out to eat and leave town for the weekend. But tells me she has nothing when it's time to maintain our home. It is defiantely a struggle for me on just my salary. I can't get a second job. I do have a goal set for my carrer this year and have something in work to help me support my family regardless of what happens.

I feel like I am being a doormat for her by saying nothing.

Thanks,
FT