Dear SD-
I had posted on your post the first day you were here. I too am a newbie. I entered this forum only 2 days before you. My response to your post was VERY negative. And for that I am sorry. I WAS enraged. But...to defend myself, I have alot of pain. I want you to know I am NOT a bad person, just a person who had alot of bad stuff happen to her. And I am working VERY hard to get well again. So, again,I apologize. Never judge a book by its cover. Right? SORRY! I now see that we ALL have something to learn here. Even the ones that have done the cheating. I will continue to keep up on your post and see if I can get a better idea where my WH is coming from.

Always blessings, Never losses
God bless
love always

Finally! Something we agree on. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Just kidding. That's what's so great about MB... there can be conflicting opinions every once in awhile (is that an understatement or what?) but most of us are all here for the same reason... to support the building or rebuilding of marriages and each other.

Has anyone ever heard of "projection".

I saw sincerity in SD. Others saw other things. Usually, we project onto others what is in our own hearts.

(It's like one of those ink blot tests... what you see... reveals something... about... YOU.)

If she says she is sincere... and she sure seems so to me... where does all the cynicism come from?

No forgiveness for SD from some... even when she apologizes.
No sensitivity to her feelings from some... just more excuses to bash and further attacking her post like it was "intended to cause harm".

Really? I can't see it. I just saw a person sharing.

Jesus loves us right where we are at. "Come to me ye who labor and are heavy laden. I will give you rest."

When people come here... what are they given??? Not rest or a warm welcome and grace and love and... if a person is not Christian... just a community sense of acceptance and belonging... just cause they are... here.

I'm not sure how many perfect people have found their way to the Lord. Last time I checked... it was He who had mercy on wretched sinners. Guess some people forgot where they came from... and how they got here.

I don't think anyone here is better than SD... even if they never had an affair. That's my position. (I be

My Bible tells me (that's my basis for my conjecture) that even if a person doesn't commit adultery... if they commit ONE SIN (even the smallest one)... it's just the same in God's eyes... as if they'd committed adultery, murder, etc... cause they've broken the whole law.

Well, I only see a lot of people on this board who are exactly alike in this: in God's eyes... they've ALL broken the WHOLE law.

All of them.

Just as equal as any adulterer in the house... even if they think they are better.

Well I had to post to at the very least change the subject line. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> My name was all over the place and I wasn't even here! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> Hm.... now that in itself is telling since this thread has taken a turn to the debate land and practically forgotten the reason for the initial thread in the 1st place.

Is that important to those reading and posting? To help the one who started this thread or bash them? If you are gonna offer constructive criticism, please do so. If not, stop with the bashing.

POVs are fine but no one has to be forced to swallow it.

One interesting thing..... H read this thread before I got home from work. He warned me about how long it got. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Says he even noticed a few changes in POVs. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

SD, let us know if you would still like to know how to move forward. You mentioned your XH is not interested in what you may be willing to say about the past. That is his choice but if he were willing would you be willing to help him have closure? Then you can move forward.

The piece where we kept losing the focus is because some were stuck on the fact that there was no real closure from your 1st M before you started another R. Think about it.

I recommend you start another thread.

take care,

L.

"I am not that person any more but obviously, many of you don't believe that and I guess based on my post, I can't blame you. I am different now. I don't want the same life again and I am doing every thing in my power to make sure it never happens again..."

As you are still involved with your adultery partner, you are still an adulteress. I was married for 25 years to a serial adulterer like you. Just like you he always blamed me for each adultery, AND for each failed recovery too. But the fact remained that his serial adultery was his problem - not mine. You see no matter who you are married to, and even if he does his best to meet your emotional needs, you will still find some excuse to cheat. Any man you get involved with is just a mere mortal, and when the time comes, when you get bored, you will point to one of his imperfections as your excuse for your next infidelity. You will find SOMETHING that he does wrong, or doesn't do well enough, because you will want to cheat again AND you will want to blame your cheating on your betrayed spouse. Oh, and my WXH also believed that it was never going to happen again...

Even if you had known about EN's, and even if your betrayed husband had done a Plan A, you most likely would have kept on cheating, because you are a serial adulterer. The recidivism rate for serial adulterers is high. In addition to the usual marriage counseling, even if MB principles are applied, individual counseling is advised. And until you deal with that fact, nothing will really change (except your partners and your excuses). Your current optimism, thinking that your serial adultery has been solved, is based on nothing more than the lust you feel for your current adultery partner. That will fade and then you will once again face the temptation to cheat.

If you REALLY were doing all in your power to change you'd END the adulterous relationship you are currently in, apologize to your betrayed husband, and get some counseling specifically for serial adultery.

Ok MEDC, let's address some of your areas of concern. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


Orchid: MEDC, you are aware H said he isn't a regular MBer, that he stated his opinion and agreed where he felt the same then asked questions. How is that judgemental?


Orchid: Really? Because I took a ganter over some of your posts and well..... you should see how they are being viewed. If you honestly don't believe you are judgemental, then ask how others are viewing your posts or read those who have mentioned it?


Orchid: You challenge me? Ok, you are the one that brought up the 'drama statement'. As for you slamming this SD, you can go back and read it yourself.


Orchid: I want sooo much to believe you but have not seen the proof. You speak from your heart but often without regard to tact. I don't doubt you are sincere but your delivery is much left to be desired. You probably have good things to say but it is masked by your delivery. So you have the tools to be more effective, are you ready to do so?

MEDC, I realize you are still carrying your pain in you. Once you get past it, it may help with your move forward. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Keep moving forward.


L.

Orchid, just because your H is not a regular MB, that has NOTHING to do with the point about him being judgmental regarding others posts at the same time he was criticizing people for being judgmental.

I NEVER said I wasn't being viewed as judgmental....in FACT(based on what I really wrote) I said I DO judge people based on their actions.

So...you couldn't come up with me slamming this poster huh?

Orchid...my pain and the source of it are long gone. As for my delivery...well, you are entitled to your opinion...but I am VERY comfortable with that aspect of my posts. My life is pretty darn good right now and I wouldn't change places with anyone. Frankly, it sounded like it was your H that was carrying pain. I hope he gets over it soon enough. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Be well.

Aloha.

Orchid:

I can't pass up a chance to let you know what a fan I am of your posts. You are truly one of the beautiful people. I hope that your H knows what a gem he has in you. I suspect that he does.

That being said, I'm a big believer in positive reinforcement. Whether for raising children or dogs (I have both), it works a lot better than negative reinforcement. I have to say that I was very impressed with the way MEDC spoke in this thread toward SD. While I still disagree with him regarding SD's need to end her current relationship (and there is probably much that I disagree with him about, when you get right down to it) I cannot fault him for how he spoke to her.

I thought that he used restraint, moreso than other posters. There is much in his posts *lately* which would indicate that he has reached a better place in life, as he says.

MEDC, sorry to speak about you in the 3rd person.

And Orchid, please tell your H that I appreciated reading his post. He shouldn't hesitate to come around again.

PK

Thanks for noticing PK. While I still pull out the big guns when needed, I have made a conscious decision to tone down my posts a bit. I appreciate you taking notice.

And based on SD's comments yesterday (which I think contradicted what she said earlier in the thread) I am on the fence about her ending her current relationship. Her main issue right now is coming clean with her fiancee...about everything (including that when they met she was still interested in returning to her H...which is a BIG sticking point for me!). If has not let her ex know about her affairs, she needs to do that too.

I truly hope that if she does nothing else, she does not marry this bf without having exposed those parts of her past that would be a concern to any partner.

MEDC

If all sins are equal in God's eyes, then why does He consider adultery the only legitimate reason for divorce?

I'd like to think that the omniscient creator of the entire universe can distinguish between using foul language and child rape.

all sins are not equal in God's eyes. That point is made very clearly in the Bible.

1. Christ tells Pilate that the Jewish leaders have committed a worse sin than him, saying “he who has handed me over to you has committed the greater sin” (Jn. 19:11).

2. Certain sins in the law are distinguished in a particular context as an abomination to God, implying that others are not as severe (e.g. Lev. 18:22; Duet 7:25, 23:18, Isa. 41:24) .

3. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is set apart as a more severe sin than blasphemy of the Son (Matt. 12:31)

4. Proverbs 6:16-19 lists particular sins in such a way as to single them out because of their depraved nature, separating them from others.

5. There are degrees of punishment in ****** depending on the severity of the offense (Lk. 12:47-48).

6. Christ says of the Pharisees “You strain out a gnat while you swallow a camel” (Matt. 23:24). If all sins are equal, Christ’s rebuke does not make any sense.

I just want to say that through these months posting here, I have needed the gentle messages from people like Orchid and MicheleG and the "more direct"...uhm...spirited messages of MEDC and Melody.

I needed all of you. Sometimes we do need the delivery to blast us. Sometimes we need positive reinforcement.

When MEDC first started posting to me, I DREADED reading what he was going to say. But he became one of my strongest allies because of his directness to point out what I did NOT want to see. And his and Melody's "just do it" approach gave me focus that I needed when my mind was whirling.

When I read posts from MicheleG and Orchid, I felt understood and comforted.

I needed ALL those approaches to help me deal with the OVERWHELMING agony I was feeling everyday. When I needed focus, I found it on my thread. When I needed comfort, I found it on my thread.

When my FWH came to this board, I sought out MEDC to "watch over" him, because I knew I could count on him to tell it like he sees it.

From reading Swingdancer's post, it appears to me that she needs both blasted and understood.

We want her to stay and receive the help she OBVIOUSLY needs if she is willing to ACCEPT that she DOES need help. Her original post sounded more like, "Haven't I done a great job? I am here to teach you." And yet, it was full of wayward entitlement and half-truths (lies) that she could not see.

Her post did not offend me. It made me laugh. She so desparately needs MBers to work through the past she thinks she's overcome, and to face a future that will be riddled with more adultry if she does not find help here.

Ya know Mel,

You got me to thinking: Did I really bully and badger JM? Did I attack him or call him names? I didn't think so at the time, but it happened many months ago. If I went back and read my posts to him now, would I see the error of my ways?

So I did go back. And I looked up the thread. *********

And quite honestly, I think my posts to him were respectful. I'm a little embarassed about trying to bring others into the discussion about radical honesty.. that was silly. And I shouldn't have used the phrase "...failing in empathy 101". That was on the rude side. But I don't see how you, or he, or anyone else can say I was bullying or badgering him.

--SC

Oh, I definitely noticed, MEDC, and with pleasure. I have always felt that your observations are keen, but your delivery could be rough. I have felt most in agreement with some of your posts when you were swimming against the current (ex: Lil Sis).

As for SD, you state:


Agree completely.

PK

I read the thread and no you did not badger him or post to him in a manner that would cause him to run off. **************edit*********