Thx Who and Chrisner,

I guess that I already knew that sending WH Truehearts letter would be futile, I think it’s just that I want to give him the benefit of the doubt in all of this but I should know better by now! If I let him he would probably continue his cake eating ways forever and I’m no longer willing to put up with crumbs!

Had a pretty good w/end. I started helping in a new dance class in a nearby town and we were worried that maybe no-one would turn up but our fears were unfounded as over 60 people arrived to begin learning ballroom and Latin-American dancing! It was great, we taught 4 classes, children and adults and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I can’t believe that I’m getting paid for doing something that I enjoy so much. It has done wonders for my self esteem.

I didn’t get home til 10.30 and WH had been and put some pictures that DD14 had wanted printed through the door. He must have wondered where we all were but it’s none of his business anymore.

Saturday I helped out at the dance class that DD8 attends and she got her first exam results – 95 out of 100 – so she was thrilled. WH called in the evening to speak to DD’s, something he has only done about a dozen times in the last year. According to DD14 he just called to chat and even she noted that this was unusual.

Sunday the girls and I had a mini home spa day. I gave them both pedicures and painted their toenails, funnily enough neither of them wanted to do mine so I had to do it myself! I’m going to try to keep this up with mini manicures, facials and hair and makeup, especially while the weather is so bad as we all need to feel pampered now and again, plus it gets us all in the same room at the same time with no games consoles or pc’s to distract us.

My intermediary received an email from WH asking to change a day that he sees the girls and to say that he is at a loss as to how my “new attitude is going to help either party” (check the legal speak lol). I asked K (my intermediary) to reply that the change is ok and to refer back to my pbl as to my reasons for not wanting direct contact with him. I also asked her to add that I am just getting on with my life instead of waiting for him to get off the fence. So, WH is not too pleased with how I am doing things, well tough! I haven’t been pleased with how he has been doing things for a long time now so now he can see what it’s like! Honestly, does he think I’m going to rollover and say “oh sorry for hurting your feelings, why don’t we be friends”. Well, it ain’t gonna happen! I’m liking plan B and I’m not going to be his friend. I’ll be his wife in every sense of the word but no way will I just be his friend.

Because K didn’t send me the details of WH’s email till yesterday he sent her another saying that if he hadn’t heard back by Monday evening he would get in contact with me directly! Well, he can try but I’m staying dark!

Tarnsy

Hi Charlotte,

Thx for popping in. I have read some of your thread but there is so much!!

Having WH stuff around is weird. I packed a load of his things away ages ago but WH has never bothered to collect it so it is just cluttering up my bedroom. I have no spare room anywhere to put his things so his wardrobe is still full, his book collection is still here, his cd's, dvd's, his star trek memorabilia, his photos from his army days, everything basically. The only thing he has ever asked for is his Magic cards!

If he decides he wants anything I will box it all up and ask someone else to be here when he collects it.

I shall look in on you to see how things are going for you. Speaking for myself, I think plan B is going to help ME a lot!

Tarnsy

Tarnsy,
Hi there, another SB here.
You know what I did with my WH's stuff? I packed it up and delivered it to the doorstep of the OW' house. LOL! It was awesome.

He had several weeks to collect it at first, but when he didn't, my girlfriend and I first put out his futon, chair, and lamps. Next day was boxes of clothes, knicknacks, photo albums and dvd's,cds. The OW was so po's she called a police friend of hers to call me...he was stupified, b/c I hadn't broken any laws, but was "trying" to help her. It was hilarious. He was stuttering. She owns a condo, so unless the association did something to me, it was THEIR property not hers...and they aren't located on premises, so....nah, nah to them. Harlot.

Good luck to you. I haven't read all your thread, but I'll get to it. Seems like we are around the same age and are both in Plan B so that is comforting cuz we can be supportive.

Have you checked out Mimi's GODDESS thread?

I can completely sympathize with your wanting to add this bit. My advice is that you refrain from these kinds of add-ons, and try and prevent your intermediary from doing the same thing.

Total darkness is better and will likely be more effective.

You may have had a sub-motive of thinking your Plan B is going to "get" him to do something. You must have realized that you can't control him and what he does, right? A better way of thinking about Plan B is that you are attempting to preserve your willingness to reconcile. It will take you longer to reach the peace of Plan B if you think about your plan B is going to make him change.

Regarding his stuff, how much is it really bothering you? If it makes you angry, can you put it somewhere out of the way where you won't see it? If you try to make him take it or send it to him or the like, that will lead to drama and interaction with your WH, and that won't help your love bank any. It would be an invitation for your WH to break your Plan B.

Every interaction with your WH has the potential to trigger an emotional response from you, which will ultimately drain your love bank.

I've only skimmed your story, but it sounds like you're doing pretty well in Plan B so far. Keep up the good work and Stay Dark!

Hi Tarnsy,

As tempting as FreeToBeMe1970's suggestion is - believe me I would like to do it. There are serious legal ramifications to that kind of action in the UK. Consult before taking it and anything similar.

All the best,

P

Hi all,

Free, Thx for the advice re WH belongings. I would love to do that but I don’t need the agro that would surely come with it. And I have no desire to see OW or to give her any kind of satisfaction that she has “got to me”. As far as I’m concerned she doesn’t appear on my radar! It does seem we are at similar points in all of this and I’m sure we could be a lot of help to each other. I have read your thread and will pop over to see how you are.

SD I totally get what you are saying. It’s hard not to add a little bit in here and there but I will try harder to just stay dark, but with WH still putting in his pennies worth its difficult not to say something in way of explanation (see below for more!). WH’s stuff doesn’t bother me, it’s not a trigger, it just takes up space that I don’t have! I have seen the thread on why don’t W’s take their stuff and my take on it is that they just think they will get round to it but once any doubt starts to creep in that they may have made a mistake, it’s a kind of insurance that they can then say “well, I left everything here so I must have known deep down that I would be back”. It would help to ease their guilty conscience perhaps?

Thx for the advice Principled, are you in the UK?


Need a bit of advice on how to handle WH saying things to DD14 and her then repeating them to me. WH had DD’s yesterday evening and during the course of the evening told DD14 that my prediction (from before I discovered MB!) that he would end up a single man living in a bed-sit is probably going to come to true. Apparently OW wants to be there whenever WH has DD’s (doesn’t she have him to herself enough already!) and this is causing arguments between them.

As anyone who has read my previous thread knows I managed to keep OW away from DD’s for over a year. They spent a few hours in her company for the first time on xmas eve and currently have no wish to repeat the experience. Anyway, WH told DD14 that if they split up he won’t be coming home because my not talking to him is reverse psychology and it won’t work on him. I can understand that Plan B could look like that to WH but he is conveniently forgetting that he has been trying to keep me hanging on, waiting on the sidelines for when/if he finally comes to his senses and as stated in my PBL I need to take myself out of this situation for my own sanity.

So, do I talk to DD14 and ask her not to repeat anything that WH says to her (which doesn’t seem healthy to me, I don’t want her to think she can’t talk to me) or do I get my intermediary to ask WH not to discuss such things with DD14? And this is the guy who told me that I shouldn’t have told DD’s about OW, I’m not allowed to tell them the truth but he’s allowed to come up with reasons as to why I am doing this? Waywards!?!

WH also called this morning and left a vm telling me (not asking) that he would be round later to pick up his mail as he is waiting for something rather urgently. If it was so urgent why didn’t he have it sent to OW’s house or his office? I tm’d intermediary to ask her to tm WH to say that mail doesn’t arrive till late and I will send it with DD’s this evening. Apparently this isn’t good enough for WH, so I will tm intermediary should any mail arrive and she will tm WH who will send one of his employees to pick it up. Wonder what could be so important it can’t wait a few hours? But I guess I shouldn’t wonder what he is up to!lol

Tarnsy

Tarnsy,

Sorry to hear the WS has now resorted to using his children as his WS weapon. It's not working is it? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Still they are your children also and to tell them NOT to tell you is bad for them.

So here's an idea. Ask if they w/b willing to e-mail his convo to you or TXT msg it. Whatever communication method is interesting to them. Use it. Otherwise as their mother you should let them talk to you. It is important you be a part of their support group as much as they need t/b a part of yours.

As for him ending up alone with just a bed.....you can certainly wonder out loud how come that OW can't give him $$. LOL!!! I did. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> Yea.... long story.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

JMHO,
L.

Tarnsy wrote: 'Thx for the advice Principled, are you in the UK?'

You're welcome. Yes I am.

Good morning!

I agree with Orchid on your DD. She is going through a hard time, too and needs you to talk to.
Just say mm-hmm, nod your head, yes dear, I'm sorry, etc.

I have a DD16 and she witnessed too much hurtful words and had a lot to say about it. Of course, my WH was her stepdad, not her bio father, which made her allegiance to me stronger.

Anyway, the stuff he says is total fog babble. There are some good threads on here about that. LaLa has a fogapalooza link.
Of course he is going to say anything that is selfish and hurtful. One of the revere babble suggestions is to say something in agreement with what the WS says.
I.E.
WS: I just don't think I love you anymore.
BS: I think I may feel the same way.

WS: I haven't loved you for a while.
BS: I noticed my feelings for you changed a while back too.

It just helps, it gives them less control over the situation and sure does confuse the heck out of them!! LOL

Small victories are worth it for self esteem.

Tarnsy HI!

Gosh you are doing great. Keep it up.. I agree with your posters, I would just allow DD to say what she needs to say and just listen and don't take anything WH says to heart, it always blows my mind how they (WSs) can turn everything around so that they are victim in all of this.

Sounds to me that OW is a bit controlling, sounds like he's not getting all his EN's meant,,poor baby,,(not)

Stay strong ....

I had a word with DD14 about WH’s comments and just told her that I completely understood why he thought that I was using reverse psychology but as I had explained previously to her (she also read my pbl) this wasn’t why I was not having any contact with WH. I also told her again that WH wouldn’t be welcome home just because he and OW had broken up, that he needed to accept that he had made a mistake and would be willing to work on our R.

It’s difficult to know how much to tell her, I don’t want to influence her one way or the other. I just hope that she will eventually see that I am in a better place as I am no longer having my heart and mind played with.

Orchid, I love the RB, I used it successfully a few times in plan a. It’s one of the things I miss being in plan B!

Principled, whereabouts in the UK are you? There doesn’t seem to be many of us Brits on MB. If you don’t want to say where you are, I understand.

Free and F26, thx for keeping up with me. I need all the help I can get.

Well, WH contacted K (intermediary) to say that he needed the last 6 mths bank statements he had previously asked for. Apparently he had asked the bank to send them to him but they hadn’t arrived. Seeing as I give him all the mail that comes here for him I knew that I probably didn’t have them but managed to find three of them. Why he doesn’t change his address I don’t know! WH sent his employee to get them who then gave me a note from WH.

“Thanks for your help Tarnsy, Having to go through K is not ideal make no mistake. I am very uncomfortable having to discuss personal matters with her. I know she has the best intentions and for that I am grateful. But I don’t want to do it! Dx”

Firstly, I don’t know what personal matters he is referring to. As far as I am concerned, nothing that has occurred since plan b started could be regarded as personal. Secondly, WH has been given the option of using K’s fiancé A as an intermediary but he has not done this. And doesn’t that last sentence sound just like a 2 yr old? Me thinks he needs to stop throwing his toys out of his pram!lol

Tarnsy

Tarnsy, I'm here for you. Plan B is hard, isn't it? But the statistics work in our favor as most Waywards come home in this Plan and not in Plan A.

My WH told me that I was being ridiculous for having an intermediary and that he wouldn't do it. Such disrespect.

Keep strong! Stay dark.

I think you're doing really well, Tarnsy. Any communication from the WS has triggering potential, but you brought it here, posted it, vented out the frustration, and probably went about your day.

Most importantly, you didn't respond to it.

Awesome job, Tarnsy....I'm following in your footsteps!

I don't have any advice to give, only this: YOU ROCK!

Ron

Orchid: You can determine how much to tell her by asking her for her POV. That will help you set the ground rules. Then share principals and build on that the importance of moving forward as a family. You will find she c/b a good aly. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Respect that she does not want to lose her R w/her dad. Let her know you want to support her R with her dad but need her support in protecting each other from the WS. Teach her the difference. Let her know it is ok to let her dad know when he is being a WS jerk. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> This will give her support that while she needs to be respectful, she also can speak her POV. That is why I fee it is important to keep our children in the loop. They often feel left out in the lurch when a parent keeps the children in the dark and does not discuss the A's affect on the family.


[/quote]Orchid, I love the RB, I used it successfully a few times in plan a. It’s one of the things I miss being in plan B![/quote]

Orchid: U can still use it. I even recall during my plan B, he would attempt contact of sorts (mostly by VM and e-mail), I would RB..... he wouldn't hear it (i.e. plan B silence) but it didn't mean I couldn't respond in the comfort of my own place of safety. LOL!!! It was a form of therapy for me. I was able to vent and then refocus.

JMHO,
L.

Hi all,

Well WH is still kicking and screaming against plan B. He called K to say that he is a busy man and this is not working for him! Funny that, his living with OW doesn’t work for me either!lol

He then tried another tactic. DD14 called her dad and during the convo he asked her how I was looking and what was I wearing. When she told him I had tight leggings on he said “I’d better not say what I’d like to say”. Honestly, what does he think he is doing? I know what he wanted to say but to say things like that to his daughter!!!

WH’s sister is coming round tomorrow. We don’t get to see a lot of her as she lives a couple of hours away. She is the only one in WH’s family that I have any contact with - never even had a phone call from mil/fil. I’m wondering how much she knows of the current sitch, whether WH has told her that I’m “not talking to him”. Not sure if I should bring it up myself or just see if she says anything. Either way I shall make sure that she sees that I’m doing well and am content with my lot even though I would prefer for WH to be home and in love with me.

It should be WH’s w/end with DD’s but he is only seeing them Sunday as his family have paid for him to drive a race car round a track for his 40th birthday which he can’t cancel without losing the money. Unfortunately this has led me to have some not so nice thoughts about what would happen if WH was involved in an accident. I know that worrying over something that has not happened is a complete waste of time and am doing my best to put these thoughts out of my head but I can’t help wondering how I’d cope being his next of kin but knowing that OW would be at his bedside.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not sitting here pondering the “what ifs”, it was just one of those thoughts that popped into my head and is one that I don’t have an immediate answer to. Still, I’m not going to waste anymore time thinking about it (getting it out here helps) and I’m going to be busy for the rest of the day and all day tomorrow so there will be little time left to think about anything!

Hope you all have a good weekend, I shall try to catch up with some threads on Sunday

Tarnsy

YES! You're doing very, very well.

Have a great weekend.

Could use a little pick up I suppose.

WH’s sister visited at the w/end and it was good to see her and her 2 children. We spoke briefly about WH and she said she completely understood why I was not having any contact with him. She and WH are very close so I guess he has told her that he had been sitting on the fence as she said that it wasn’t fair of him and that he needed to decide what he wanted. I did tell her that I was happy with my life as it is but to give her brother a slap for me!lol

WH had DD’s on Sunday afternoon and took them to OW’s house as he had no money and she was out. Received a phone call from DD14 about 10mins before they were due home to ask if they could stay for another hour so that they could see the rest of the film they were watching. I reluctantly agreed as I didn’t want them there long in case OW turned up. Which she did.

5 mins before the end of the film OW came in saying that she had been throwing up (ha!). She went upstairs where DD8 was playing on the laptop and tried to act interested in what DD8 was doing. OW has obviously figured it will be easier to get round an 8yr old than a 14 yr old! DD14 ignored her attempts at conversation lol.

On Monday WH picked up DD’s for one of their clubs and asked DD14 why she had “blanked” OW. Honestly, does he really need to ask that? So OW must have said something to WH about DD14, who knows, maybe she LB’d!

Oh and he also told DD14 that he wanted to crawl into a black hole and disappear. (!) He also commented on it being a full moon and said that maybe he would come and howl outside my window. I have to wonder if he is just saying things like this because he knows DD14 will tell me and it’s his way of keeping me dangling.

Yesterday WH called the home phone and left a message asking if he could have a word. I then received an email apologising for contacting me direct but that intermediary’s phone was switched off. He had a problem with picking up DD’s and then went on to say:

“I wish you would have taken my call this morning as I am in rather a pickle and it would have been good to talk to you.
I won’t discuss via email as I know you don’t want me to. I know you wont call me so don’t worry about it.
Maybe you will take my call next time.

I hope you are well.

Dx”

And then to top it all off WH called again and spoke to DD14. I don’t know what he said to her but it persuaded her to pass the phone to me pleading with me that I must talk to her Dad as he was upset. Against my better judgement, I took the phone off her and just said “D, you know I can’t talk to you”. He said “I know, it doesn’t matter now, there are too many people around”. And that was it apart from saying goodbye.
He then sent me a tm saying that it was good to hear me albeit briefly and signed off with a kiss.

I know I shouldn’t have spoken to WH but how could I not when DD14 was asking me so imploringly? DD14 does understand my reasons for not speaking to her Dad but when she perceives that he is upset she thinks that I should “act like a grown up not a child” (her words!) Any advice on what to do in this sitch would be much appreciated.

Also I’m finding it a bit more difficult not to wonder what it is that WH is upset about. I know that this is not conducive to my plan B but for some reason I have got it into my head that OW maybe pregnant. WH has previously stated that this would be a major problem for him as he does not want any more kids (OW has none) and with her being sick at the weekend and him being upset my mind has been in overdrive. I know I’m putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 5 so please feel free to give me a 2x4!!

Tarnsy

(Sorry this has been so long!)

Hey Tarnsy,

Chin up and just stay dark. If you do get seduced into speaking into contact, just ask the question: 'have you left her yet?' then 'ok well contact me when you have' i.e. just remind him of the conditions that have to be in place for you to be with him again. Kinda like mim_here did with her H.

Tarnsy I agree stay dark, you have always been his rock and now he is loosing his footing stay strong.

As hard as it is try not to worry about her being pregnant, you have enough to handle without worring about things that may or may not be. I'm very proud of you, F-26