|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
So she claims she's seeing OMM, and that her plans don't include OM...hmmmmm Don't believe it for a second.
Several weeks ago she mistakenly sent me the text meant for OM "...where r u? Do u want 2 meet me later?"
Then she told me when I confronted her that she subsequently sent him a text calling it off, telling me that "it was just too much"...what the #ell does that mean?? I asked her and she didn't answer...
Today, in preparation for this w/e, I sent her this:
WW,
First off, I miss you very much.
I hate it that you disappear before I get there.
Pulling into our driveway and seeing your car already gone feels like a hot knife being twisted into my gut.
Please stay home this weekend.
....................
Perhaps OMM thinks she’s being a “safe haven” for you. Next time you see her, ask her directly how she justifies having supported her son in an adulterous affair. What kind of role model is SHE? What the ****** does she believe IN?
I'd like to like her, but she has shown she has no respect for either me or my family, so she can expect the same from me.
You are truly an amazing person, WW, more than you know. I love you with all my heart. Please stop making choices that are destructive to you, me and our children. You deserve better, we deserve better.
I know you’re not happy…problem is, I don’t know what would make you happy. Do you?
I married you for life. That’s what I vowed to do. This is the “worse” part of “for better or worse”. I love you for who you are and are trying to be. I am committed to you and this family. I support you and this family. That’s what a husband does. That’s what the father of your children is doing. I am here for you. To anyone else, these would all be good things…please stop seeing it as a threat.
Please stay home this weekend so we can talk. If not, then at least please do not leave before I get there.
If you do leave, then please have the courtesy, courage and respect to tell the kids exactly where you’re going, what you’re doing and who you’re going to be with. They deserve to know the whole truth—it is not fair to make them continue to carry this burden of secrecy for you. [edit: they already know about the A, but WW doesn't tell them where she goes when she leaves]
If you don’t want to tell them…ask yourself why that is.
L2F
I sure wish she would stay long enough to talk. She commented the other day that she doesn't feel like talking b/c I don't listen to what she says anyway... Yup, much of it is fogbabble.
Am I pleading too much? Hard to be objective.
This whole thing would be so much easier if I didn't have to be gone during the week, but 5 hours of driving each and every day would take it's toll oh so quickly.
Last edited by Learning2Fly; 02/07/08 05:20 PM.
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560 |
I think that letter is just great, and I think you are absolutely amazing for standing by your WW this way.
Just don't have any expectations of her reaction, which will range from indifference to anger. You are giving her your truth and asking her to stick around for what she says was lacking in the M to begin with, so I do not think it is too pleading.
I hope she is there when you come home...I really do!
You need to continue the war on this A. She is not strong enough to end it, and the continuation of it is going to drive you mad! I know you have exposed, your children know, his great role-model of a mother (barf) knows...we need to help you come up with an alternate plan. Is your state an AOA state? Can you talk to the Harleys and see if Plan B is around the corner?
I think he is the weakest link, because he is a loser and cannot support her "in the manor in which she is accustomed." I would love to see that email that he wrote back to you...it may give us an idea of where to put pressure on him. That is why I suggested Plan B....I think it would end the A quicker than anything else would. I dunno...just IMHO.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
Thanks LaLa <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> His email response...it makes me sick. I'll look for it, it's not on this computer. No AoA here...we're too "advanced" out here in the west... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> I have NO expectation that she will be there, so my grasp of reality is firm...trying to stay one step ahead of denial... She led OM to believe early on that his "inability to support her in the manner to which he has become accustomed" was not an issue...they were so "in looove"... (why is there no emoticon for puking??) His behavior in the following months/year has been clearly non-committal, although he professes to continue to love her. Pretty easy from where he sits. Focussing on OM has caused me much frustration b/c his (and his family's) failure to even comprehend social norms/morals is notably absent. Trying to focus on WW, but I'm afraid that letters like the above might just put too much pressure on her...hard to tell how much is too much, ya know?
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560 |
Yeah-I feel ya! Especially when we are (were) in the fog...icey reception at best!
That's why I say he is the weakest link. He will not give her what she wants if she leaves you. Maybe you should let her go...how is she being about that? Does she expect you to move out if it goes that route?
If it's any consolation, my OM was a POS music person (no offense to musicians-I am one!) and had not a pot to pi$$ in...I know where her silly head is. If you can hang in there, it will die!! The key is to get them apart for long enough. That's what I want to help you accomplish!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
Hers is more of a raging inferno than a fog... here is her response to my last letter: L2F,
I am sorry you miss me. I really don't know why. I have told you for months that I don't want to be married to you any more. That you continue to absolutely ignore me, even after I hand you papers, is incomprehensible to me.
I will not be staying here with you. If you were not working somewhere else during the week, we would each have a home here and when you were spending time with the kids, you would be at yours and I would be at mine. I wouldn't be going to your place with them.
As far as sitting at a table letting everyone we know share their opinions, they have not walked a mile in my shoes and can only formulate opinions based on the mask they were allowed to see. Those opinions don't mean much to me.
I am sorry it offends you that OMM continues to be my friend whether she agrees with what I am doing, or not. In my opinion, that is what a friend is supposed to do. If someone cuts you off because they don't like what you are doing, what kind of friend are they? I have NEVER judged people that way.
I spoke to MC at length about whether or not to tell the kids where I am. She recommended against it. They can always call me.
You married your first wife for life, too... You can't force or bully me into staying with you because that is what YOU want. That is what I feel you are trying to do. You ABSOLUTELY disregard everything that I say. What I want matters, too. I'm just so tired of this...does anyone have any inputs? I just can't be objective after this body slam...
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087 |
Hey L2F,
I don't really know what to say...
My gut instinct after reading this last letter from Mrs. L2F leads me to think that you should give the Harleys another call then contact your Lawyer and try to get the 'best' deal that you can as far as protecting yourslef, your kids, and your financial assets.
Mrs. L2F is correct in that you can't MAKE her do anything... unfortunately, she is not allowing you an opportunity to even show her that you are changing.
The sad part in all of this is that she is willing to throw away the love of her own children for her own "happiness" when later in life, her "happiness" is going to seem very empty when her children will no longer speak to her.
L2F, YOU will be OK through all of this... and by no means am I suggesting or recommending that you throw in the towel here... I'm here to support you with whatever decision you make... I just don't have any personal experience with a walk-away-wife, so I'm at a loss as to what to say to you...
My prayers are with you and Mrs. L2F and your children...
Semper Fi,
RIF
Me, BS
Her, Forgiven
Married Dec 86
Multiple A's that ended '90
Rebuilding In Faith since then...
Currently deployed to Iraq, but TEXAS is Home!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
Thanks for that RIF. No, I can't make her do anything--don't want to. I want her to WANT to act differently, but that's a pipe dream. She clearly let HER love bank balance fall too low long ago and it was "too late" by the time I realized. I really DO know that I'LL be ok, i'm so very sad for my children. They are so truly amazing-each in their own way. I know very well what it's like to be a child of divorce, and it will suck, big-time. My job over the last coupla years has been to try to "shield" them from all this, and it's crushing to realize I can't. On the bright side, had a great victory today! My DS has been wanting a dog for YEARS. He's so very good with animals but WW had some experience in her past w/ dogs and didn't want one. WW had promised he'd get one, but always found excuses. Since I was gone so much, I let her make the decision. In retrospect, I let her make WAY too many decisions for us all...look where it got us. She finally acquiesed shortly before her A started, but the dog was a nightmare. It was a lab mix from the local pound that instead of being an advertised 9 months old, was probably only 3. It grew into a horse and was totally unwieldy or trainable. It ended up biting her and went back to the pound. Turns out they ended up putting it down b/c it was so unwieldy. Since then she's always been saying that she's "not ready" for another dog, but would never give a timeline for when she WOULD be ready. Anyway, after steady gentle pressure from DS (and some frank "this is about HIM, not YOU" discussions from me), she again finally gave in and my son is now the proud owner of a 3 yr old black lab/husky mix. He's a total sweetheart!!! Housebroken, doesn't bark, and has in the span of an afternoon become DS's absolute best buddy. It brings tears to my eyes to see him so happy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> At least we won that battle...
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560 |
I'm so sorry, L2F. That letter was ruthless, but that's what waywards are most of the time. Selfish, cold and ruthless.
I agree with RIF. Talk to your L and get things set up and go Plan B. In essence, you are almost there except for the nasty emails and occasional passing as you are coming and she is going. But, my question is, if she wants a D so bad, why hasn't she filed? I know she threw papers at you a while ago and told you to fill them out or something, but she has yet to get a L and file.
Does she want you to leave or is she planning to leave the family home? She is leaving the children unattended to go "do her thing" without even telling them where she is going, so there is a strong case for you to gain custody if you can make other arrangements on your job. Is there any way you can work closer to home so that you can be home with your kids in the evening? I know it's a long drive, but even if you could arrange to have them say T&TH nights and then weekends, at least they wouldn't have to be with just her all week. I feel so bad for them. You could leave Monday morning, stay the night and then return T afternoon, leave W morning and return TH afernoon. Something like that...? If you could get something closer it would be ideal. But talk to your L and get things set up.
You will be in my prayers tonight...my heart goes out to you and your children!
(((((L2F)))))
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
I like your idea of working my schedule to spend more time at home...I'm on it. I can't change my job situation. It is what it is. She doesn't leave the children unattended...either I'm there on the weekends or the kids are at friend's homes when I'm gone. So at least to that extent she's not irresponsible--just hurtful. Her long term "plan" is not clear, but she alluded to it in her letter. It seems she thinks she'll be in the home and I'll have my own...kind of like the temporary set up we have now. That's why I really do like your idea to spend a couple of weeknights at home. Had a crappy night. Sent this letter this morning. My dearest WW,
It hurts me that you don’t understand why I miss you.
I miss you because I love you.
I miss you because we’ve built a life together
I miss you because we’ve always been there for each other
I miss you because together we are more than we are apart
Your feelings aside, we are married, I am your husband, you are my wife, we are our children’s parents.
I vehemently disagree with former MC.
While a good individual counselor, I think she has totally missed the boat where our family is concerned.
I have no clue what good she thinks your keeping our children in the dark can bring.
In all honesty, I think it’s emotionally abusive to make them co-conspirators in your dirty little secret.
Why don’t you ask DS how he feels about not knowing where you are?
You don’t really need to, do you? You already heard how he felt in children's counselor's office.
They know basically where you’re going, but not really knowing, not having you talk with them about it, still makes it a barrier to honesty.
Your silence has everything to do with protecting you, not them.
It has to do with your desire to avoid the pain of their knowing that you’re doing something they rightfully find hurtful and wrong.
It does NOT protect their feelings.
It does NOT protect them from the feelings of doubt about their mother.
How is that in their best interest??
They want to know that their mother can be trusted.
But right now she can’t
They want to know that their mother isn’t doing something distasteful
But right now she is.
So to me it appears that you don’t want to talk about it because the truth is ugly and it will make you look bad.
They don’t understand how you can “pal around” with an unemployed loser, or his 60+ yr old mother.
What you’re doing hurts them, embarrasses them, and makes them feel that they are of lesser importance to you than they should be.
They love you, but you are creating an environment of deceit and distrust that in my opinion will lead to an emotionally fragile relationship with them as they continue to grow older and need a better role model and confidante.
Most importantly, WW, it is destroying their trust in YOU.
Once that’s gone, and it damn near is, it will be incredibly hard to rebuild.
How can they come to you with their problems/questions when you show yourself to be so untrustworthy?
My urging you to be honest with them has nothing to do with my wanting you to feel bad; rather it has everything to do with their feelings and the health of your current and future relationship with them.
Don’t mistake your “telling them” with “talking about it with them”. “Telling them” is merely an announcement of your actions, while “talking with them” is having an open dialog.
They deserve to be part of the discussion.
They deserve to be heard.
They both expressed their opinions in their counselor's office but you did NOT respond.
How do you think it makes them feel?
They tell their mother how she’s hurting them and she’s silent?
You say that I’m not listening to you…what about how they feel about your ignoring them???
They are YOUR CHILDREN, for God’s sake!
“Handing me papers” doesn’t end the marriage.
How is your handing me papers any different from my finding out that you’d been sleeping with some low life scum for months behind my back?
How is your handing me papers any different from your not sleeping with me for years?
If you want to get divorced, have me served.
I will get a lawyer
We will end up in court
That’s really a shame.
I will not “agree” to destroy this family
That’s all on you
It does not need to happen this way. Like in “A Christmas Carol”, you can choose to change the course of our future.
Love, L2F Will probably be seen as LBing, but I really don't care. Will arrange to see L again and start rearranging my schedule to spend more time at home.
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560 |
Sorry-I know it's LB-ing in there a little, too, but I LOVE IT!!!! I love it because it says everything you need to say. Because it addresses the children very specifically, and I know that is the part that really might break through the fog. Doubt it, but MAYBE!! And also because it is strong, not weak and needy, yanno. I'm glad you liked my idea-I hope you can work it out. Maybe if she does go her own way (and I pray that doesn't happen), you can find a place (with custody of the children!) that is closer to your work. She can do the driving to come see them, if it doesn't interrupt the shameful nature of her current life too much, that is! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Sorry! I'm in a MOOD today! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 261
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 261 |
L2F, just caught up on your thread for the first time. I must say I see so many similarities b/w you and I (and our WW's) that I couldn't stop reading.
I'm only 2 months in from D-day where you've been at this for an eternity. God bless your strength and resolve!! I hope I have as much.
But man, I could insert my WW's words into almost everything you've posted. And, some of the letters you've sent, emails you've sent, etc......those could be MY words too. We are eerily similar!
I also have WW's threats of D. No papers, but she threatens to serve me when she gets upset. Then she says what are WE going to do. She hasn't had the guts to take the necessary steps and doesn't want to spend $$ on lawyer or a long battle either (nor do I). I do get the feeling that she will eventually file though....just trying to wait it out, plan A, and hope she wakes up in the meantime.....similar to you.
I feel like plan B for me will be when she files papers (which I got her to push back 2 months now.....that's if she was really serious in the first place). But, like you, plan A for me is hard. I'm working on ME and doing my best to not LB but it happens occassionally. WW hasn't lived at home since this started so plan A is difficult. When we talk I get the same B.S. said to me that you've just heard....nearly word for word.
Today I contacted a L and Monday will consult with another. I'm trying to get my ducks in a row financially and legally if we have to go the D route. Sounds like you're there too. But, I don't plan on triggering anything as long as I can wait this out. Seeing how you've done it is inspirational to me, that's for sure.
I too, get a lot of pressure from some on MB to be more forceufl and stand up to this A/lack of respect. But, like you, my WW seems like she'll only run away for good if I do too much. My WW is cake eating too, no doubt.....but as much as we love them I don't know if we have too much alternative right now if we want to give the M's a chance.
Good thing you have is the kids (not suggesting them as a bargaining chip of course) but it still binds you together. Also, she is still living at home, even though elusively. Also sounds like your OM might be more of a schmuck than the one my WW is with....so maybe he'll blow it eventually.
I wish I had more answers or suggestions for ya. Just wanted to know how similar I feel in my situation....like I said....not only b/w the way you and I act/react/communicate, but also with just how similar our WW's stance/comments/fog/ambivolence seems to be.
I'll definitely keep following your thread and chiming in with anything I come up with. Best of luck my man. You are a true hero in many ways. Keep up the good work.
- ILA
Male 34 (1st Marriage)
WW 32 (2nd Marriage)
Met 7/02
Moved In 10/02
Married 6/07
EA D-Day 1/5/08
PA D-Day 1/8/08
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,149
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,149 |
Hi L2F
Here's my take on the underlying message in your WW's response to you.
"Because you are making me feel guilty, I'm going to say the most hurtful things I can to get you to stop.
I will only listen to people who agree with me or who encourage my choices. Every one else I will label as judgmental.
Because I'm being selfish-I will accuse you of being selfish and a bully.
It's really only about what I want."
That's what I read between the lines.
johnstwin-
"I may not know what the future holds, but I know who holds my future." -Martin Luther
Remarried my FXH 25 years to the day of our first M. God is so good-and sometimes so unexpected!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
LaLa, love your mood!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> Don't want to change kid's school situation...so they can't come live w/ me. In almost a year I will be deployed anyway...making any living arrangement/agreement in a dissolution that much trickier. ...she is still living at home, even though elusively Well put, ILA. Sorry you are experiencing the same thing. If I did NOT have kids, I don't think I'd still be here, to be honest. My kids are what gives me the power to continue when I'm tempted to throw in the towel. I really do think OM blew it long ago...he proved untrustworthy...go figure <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Even if he hadn't, he doesn't have the patience or committment to deal with her full-time anyway. Perhaps it IS time for plan B. Thanks for piping up and the moral support, ILA..
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
JT...wow...
That's exactly what she's saying.
So what possible response is there besides "want a cookie?"
How about our wonderful weather, eh??
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087 |
Good Letter L2F.
However, I don't think it will make much of a dent in her thinking.
Have you exposed the A to the FRG and the base? I'm just thinking aloud here and exposure to her "peers" may just shame her enough to reconsider her actions. Obviously, exposing to her children wasn't enough.
Semper Fi,
RIF
Me, BS
Her, Forgiven
Married Dec 86
Multiple A's that ended '90
Rebuilding In Faith since then...
Currently deployed to Iraq, but TEXAS is Home!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
Hey RIF.
No FRG to speak of. She derives no support whatsoever from the military community, and has nothing to do with any of our old friends and acquaintences.
She's pretty much ditched all of her "old life". "Shaming" her at this point I feel would only be retribution rather than constructive. As JT pointed out, her defense mechanisim is so well-developed that she'd only get angry...
She didn't stay this w/e, as you can probably gather.
Heavy snow shut down the primary route to OM's/OMM's town so she would have had to drive an additional 3+ hours to get there. That's how "dedicated" she is either to getting away from me, or getting to him/her.
I can feel that hot knife twisting.
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,087 |
Hey L2F,
Do you have another appointment set up with the Harleys?
I'm really at a loss as to what to think. It blows my mind that a W would throw away her family and just walk away like this...
I'm praying for you guys.
Semper Fi,
RIF
Me, BS
Her, Forgiven
Married Dec 86
Multiple A's that ended '90
Rebuilding In Faith since then...
Currently deployed to Iraq, but TEXAS is Home!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
Spending a quiet morning reading some other great threads...
I am just so impressed by the dedication and strength of this band of BSs and FWSs.
MB rocks!
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 395 |
RIF, we cross-posted... It does blow the mind. She rated me a 9 as a husband (out of 10, not 100 <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ) at the marriage boot camp last summer--higher than anyone else did, btw. Yet I'm not worth being married to...WTF! I'm wondering if I'm being too "agressive" with my letters, but not having her here to talk to is difficult. She "flees" because it's too "difficult" to face me, I'm thinking... I can continue to Plan A but throttle back on the judgmental tone, I guess. That's probably what she's avoiding. What if she just needs a break from me? That I can understand. What if she's no longer in the A but driving down the D road due to momentum? The military life is sure tough on families. The only way I was able to bear the separations was knowing (or thinking, at any rate) that my wife was my rock back at home... Looking forward to a good day w/ DS/DD and new dog! L2F
If God is a DJ, life is a dance floor, you get what you're given, it's all how you use it... Pink
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,560 |
I was so bummed when I read about your upcoming deployment! RIF is deployed, and he was able to recover his M, though, so I would move as quickly as I could if I were you. The first thing is breaking up the A (which is still going on). Can you talk to the Harley's and see what they think? You will not be able to do anything else besides Plan A from a distance until this happens. The military life is sure tough on families. The only way I was able to bear the separations was knowing (or thinking, at any rate) that my wife was my rock back at home... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" /> I know, L2F...I hope you can get things back on solid ground before you leave!
|
|
|
|
0 members (),
697
guests, and
49
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
