L2F,

You didn't face your wife Sunday night...you faced the very juvenile, justifying, self-deceiving WW. You know that. I'm reminding. Very child-like...not adult.

I'm behind your Plan B and D...you know your limit. Your pain comes all the way through.

Gotta ask in my support of you...Respect, honor, decency, integrity...are valuing these things in yourself right now?

I totally agree with Resonance on the way you chose to respond to WW...I want to offer an option, not for you, for those in your position reading your thread...which is hindsight...that when a WS threatens to abandon...take them up on it. "I know you're choosing to do this." Immediately get on the phone and state, "My wife is leaving my kids without anyone to watch them tomorrow night and get them to school Tuesday morning. Will you do it?" Be it neighbor, relative, hired babysitter. Calmly...take them up on it.

When the WS changes their mind...then they can call the person back...provide the name and number of whom you called. Not you. Not P/A...bringing reality.

Please expect a WS to justify, self-deceive and rage...act childish and give ultimatums...that's the world they are living in their mind. Up to the BS to really understand this and NOT expect rational behavior...only for themselves to act rationally.

Does not mean you didn't do it right, L2F...I trust you to hear that from me...your fight is not in vain...ever. Your thread is important and it ripples...as do you.

You cannot look bad to your children...that's what DS was saying. He was bringing reality...you exampled that to him and he was honest. Take a moment and take that in.

Divorce is ultimately destructive to them...does not determine their future relationship with you. To be worked out, over time, as you have been doing...adversity is not wrong...you know that. I'm reminding. You love through, hold to your code, anyway.

What matters...can you see yourself as "that guy"? You chose to not ditch your marriage...to fight for it...and possibly, to fight for it in another way...the next step...standing for your marriage. You're not really giving up...you're moving forward...getting out of the way of the consequences to your WS's choices...

Would you consider you will be civil because that's who you are? It's in your code...doesn't spare the children further conflict (or pain/fear/anger..their own stuff)...means you are exampling how to respond to conflict in a healthy way. What a gift.

No one deserves what she's doing...that's WS talk. She's doing and you are doing...each choosing. You know your own choices, your goals...focus on them.

Sounds like Plan Reality to me...part of Plan A...Plan No More. Still a plan...with guidelines...in you.

I believe you're still Learning2Fly...no matter what.

LA

Hey ILA...



Thanks so much for the thought, and the head's up...that possibility would never have occured to me...

But then, that's because the possibility of that's about as high as snow in July in the Sahara...

Seriously, as much as I think I was hoping for that to one day happen, part of my epiphany (or the end of denial <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />) was that I know very well who and what she really is, and this would just never happen.

I have asked her too many times over the last 17 years why she has such a chip on her shoulder...she will never be wrong...she'd rather die than be wrong.

Her loss.

I WILL be strong...heck, I AM strong. I looked at myself in the mirror today and saw a strong MAN...one that's tired of prostrating himself at the alter of an ungrateful biatch.

I felt ALIVE today...I felt the spirit of who I was BEFORE I found out about the A.

With how I feel, her flipping wouldn't make me whacko...it would just make me shake my head.

That's just it, I realize that I will be a better man, and a better example to my children by STOPPING this beating my head on a brick wall...it shows more respect for myself...and more intelligence as well... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

LA, as always...thanks for the reply...I've had to reread a coupla times... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />



Yes...and no. What I faced (and that was part of my epiphany), was the same woman I married...or at least a part of her that was always there, but that I tried not to acknowledge.

It's not as though her character completely changed w/ the A...



That's just it...I AM!...and it feels GOOD!



That's BRILLIANT! Wish I had. I was just so entirely dumbstruck by her actions that I had absolutely NO idea how to respond... If another reads this and learns from it, so much the better!



<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

...I needed that... And you know your trust is not misplaced...



He is truly stronger than I ever imagined...I have learned from him as well...

DD cowered in her room and couldn't look me in the eye that night. The next day whenever I hugged her, she held me SO tightly

God I love my kids...



Yes, I AM that guy. I can HONESTLY say I did ALL I could. It's time to acknowledge reality. I'm the doctor who performed CPR until the reality of death seeped in...finally...like the last rays of a sunset...only in this case...the first hint of dawn...



I won't lie...being civil right now will be a challenge...but when I am, it'll be for ME, not for her.



period...dot! Couldn't have said it better myself... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />



Hey, at least I'm trainable... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

With appreciation and respect...

L2F

L2F,



I am so sorry that you are having to go thru this. I noted the above statements with more than a little recognition.

They could have been written about me several years ago. I share some of the qualities that your wife has. I guess the big difference is that I finally opened my eyes and saw that and didn't much like me.

I suspect that your wife, at this point doesn't see these qualities in herself and would be shocked if anyone even attempted to point them out to her.

Change, though very difficult, is not impossible if the desire to do so is present. I wanted to become a better person and fought hard to overcome some my natural tendencies.

I see that as the difference here, I wanted to change, your WW doesn't appear to recognize that anything about her needs to change. Not good for you or your children.

I think you have fought the fight to save your marriage admirably. I also think that it is unfortunate that due to your work situation, you were unable to go to a dark plan B because I think it might have helped.

I strongly sense that your love for your WW is nearly used up. Right now, that might be just what she wants, or at least thinks she wants. Only time will tell if she will ever come to have regrets.

FWIW, she's a fool.

Take care of yourself L2F.

Best,

Who

She too saw that she didn't much like herself...problem is that she associated all her bad traits w/ the M, rather than owning them herself...

I became the thing to flee from...and the rest is history...

People HAVE tried to point out some of this, but anyone who "judges" her ceases to be her friend, and she's said that her family doesn't even like her...the latest to come out of her mouth on Sun evg...

HeyHoo... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

She too saw that she didn't much like herself...problem is that she associated all her bad traits w/ the M, rather than owning them herself...

I became the thing to flee from...and the rest is history...

People HAVE tried to point out some of this, but anyone who "judges" her ceases to be her friend, and she's said that her family doesn't even like her...the latest to come out of her mouth on Sun evg...

I read w/ interest Mr W's observation on LaLa's thread about WSs attacking the BS in order to "bring them down" amongst friends/families...how timely it was...

Will she regret this? Perhaps, but not for a long time, and I'm guessing not to the extent that would allow her to verbalize or make changes in our R...that would be an admission.

I just don't understand that mindset...I have dragged myself over the coals, both internally, and openly to WW about my own "contributions" to the state of our marriage...no reciprocity...which means either she doesn't feel she has any blame, or she won't give me the "satisfaction" of seeing it...

Will she change? She already has...in many ways she showed many of the traits I wanted in a W...but to OM... predictably, he is not evolved enough to get it... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

All academic at the point...

On my way to the gym, then to see L tomorrow.

Tons of fun!

Hey there...

So life got in the way this week and L was not available until a week fron Mon... (I'm out of town until next Fri)

WW has been pleasant.

I come home a day early this week to see DDs play (A Children's Hour)...she was truly amazing! She played the grandmother...it was truly bizarre to see my 15 yr old looking 30 years older than me! She's REALLY good...her performance in the final scene brought tears to my eyes.

Had a good day w/ DS as well

Picked up the mail and found check from OM to WW... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />...you can see that story in the "need quick response" thread.

The fact that this moron...who she considered a soulmate...who she brought into our house...who she let stick his **** God knows where...can't even spell her NAME is so astounding as to be inconceivable...

WW is no dummy...(as much as she IS a fool, Who)...and that she can't SEE how much of a user, idiot, moron, loser this guy is just makes me so sad...

Right now I'm temporarily back in the town where WW and I met, married, had DD and lived for almost 10 years.

Lots of triggers.

Lots of "why did it have to happen this way" kind of thoughts...

sigh....

Will be busy--in a good way--this week...doing "God's work"...

L2F

L2F,

Was just thinking about you and wondering how you are doing???

It's been a rough week around here for many of us. Sometimes that's the way it seems to go.

Maybe it's related somehow to daylight savings time. Must be a Commie plot!

Yanno, like fluoride in the water supply.

Who

Hey Who!

Not much time to check the boards, but I see it's been busy. Nothing new to report this week...I'm away at sea doing the "fun stuff"...

It's always a thrill to be working with the men and women who make this big "machine" work...they are its heart.

We're all part of something bigger than ourselves...narcissists and self-centered SOBs need not apply.

In this business we have a constant stream of "distinguished visitors"...all of whom are impressed by the commitment and drive of those who serve.

I've come across many "famous" people who are military "groupies", as I'm sure you have over the years, and it's funny to see them be in awe of US.

I DO love my job, and it's a part of ME. WW can't take THAT away.

I'll be back at the end of the week.

Thanks for stopping by <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

L2F

L2F,


I really understand this. I spent nearly a decade planning special and events and ceremonies for WWII and Korean War veterans and coordinating military support for things like the National Memorial Day concert and have met loads of celebrities and famous folks.

For the most part, they have always approached me and thanked me for my service. As I near retirement, I do so with a great deal of pride and sense of fullfillment.

I am certain that when I take my uniform off for good in just 4 1/2 months, there are many aspects of this life that I will miss.

You are right in your thinking, there are just so many things that our FWS and our WS can never take away from us. For me too the pride in military service is near the top of that list.

Have a safe journey home.

Who

...as well you should!



<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

...yup! Specifically self-respect, which grows each and every day as I grow stronger--in large part as a result of coming here and meeting you great folks...thanks!!

L2F

Hey folks...coming back after a short haitus.

Some of it driven by the boards going dark, some of it due to wanting to take a break, some of it b/c I've been out to sea...

What was said about my being unable to do a pure Plan B is so true. For those of you able to do so, let me add my vote to the "do it before it's too late" crowd.

A week ago WW told me on the phone about how her female boss had "bald faced lied" to her about some insignificant thing. She went on and on with great indignation for about 5 min before she realized I'd been silent the whole time.

She asked "BS, you still there?"

Me: (with calm and even tone) "Yes WS, I'm still here. How did it make you feel when you found out she'd lied to you?"

Her: (with great indignation and venom) "I'm not even going there with you!"

She started to bluster and I firmly told her I was not interested in being spoken to in that tone and the conversation is over. I hung up.

I'd characterize my communications w/ my WS since then as being concise and businesslike. Not rude, but not friendly.

Have regained so much of my self respect...some of it regained by finally acknowledging and directing the anger in the right place...at my WW...thanks, MEDC .

Watched tonight's "In Treatment" episode w/ Jake and Amy... Amy IS my WS. Her physical similarity combined with her emotional detachment and broken psyche was incredible to watch.

...interesting show...

Spent Easter Sunday w/ kids and dyed eggs...something I hadn't been able to do w/ them for 2 years due to deployments. Those are the moments that count.

Anyway, heading back to the kids this weekend and I truly don't care what's on WW's agenda. What I do with MY time is significant, healthy and loving.

Hope you all have a great weekend!

L2F

Got home...welcomed eagerly by our fantastic black lab...

Picked up DS at school and spent a great afternoon doing "guy stuff". DD gone for the w/e w/ friends so it's just the two of us.

Didn't look for "traces" of WS in the house...that need is waning.

Went over to friend's house for dinner, and while DS played w/ his friend, enjoyed relaxed adult companionship and conversation for the first time in awhile.

Some of our friends have appeared less available lately due to the awkwardness of the situation. That was gone tonight and it was as though a switch had been flipped in ME.

In past convos w/ friends I've been more "needy". I've moved to a place where I don't need to focus on the situation...instead I can just be ME and let them make their own judgments.

The same holds true for my kids. There's nothing more I need to say to them, other than to demonstrate through my actions that I'm honest, loving and present.

The "need" to write WS letters comes and goes, however, and I've been off and on working on one resulting from my realizations about the nature of dishonesty in her life. I guess I truly know that the letter is more for me than for her, and my writing it is a way of coming to terms w/ who and what she IS.

This is as close to plan B as I can get due to my sitch.

NOW, the last hurdle to get over is to move past my HUGE sense of righteousnes and dismay at the injustice of it all...

HI L2F!!!!!!!!

Glad to see you and hear that you are doing better! I am very happy for you and the fact that you have a reached a place of peace and happiness within yourself. Good for you!!

Take care and God Bless, my friend!!

Hey LaLa!

Thanks for checking up.

Went in and fixed my sig line to fit w/ the new standards, and when it showed up I actually looked at the dates...

OMG, it will be 2 YEARS from D-Day in a couple of days...

...time flys when you're having fun...

I spent some time looking back at where I was, the pain I felt, the desolation, the fundamentally life-altering nature of betrayal.

...the tears just welled up as I typed that...wow, triggers...

yet they are tears of acknowledgement, not desperation.

I'm laughing as I cry...

triggers...

I'm sitting at the computer where OM has sat to check his email while I was gone.

I'm sitting next to the shredder where WW routinely disposes of her phone bills, etc., so as not to be "discovered". How long had she been doing so before D-Day?

Behind me is the bed where WW had given me the cold shoulder for so long...where she explored her new-found sexuality w/ another man...

On the walls hang pictures of our life together...what kind of person could engage in such betrayal...in front of their children??

What kind of man could come into another man's house and do what he did while pictures of his children gaze upon the deed??

I just can't fathom that degree of ignorance...selfishness...evil.

hmmmm....amazing what life can throw at you...what you can survive.

I've come so far.

I've come to rediscover my own strength, my purpose...ME!

In the last 2 years I have strengthened my relationships w/ my DS and DD to a level I'd not thought possible.

I brought my "A game" to support every man and woman of my unit while deployed in a combat zone...putting their well-being in front of my own...even as my WW rooted in the gutter...

Before the A, I'd always thought of my WW as the generous one, the selfless one...talk about role-reversal.

I understand her unhappiness...yet I no longer take responsibility for it.

I no longer beat myself up

I no longer wonder "what if"...

I no longer wonder "why"...

It just is.

It was raining lightly this morning..

The sun just poked through and lit up the raindrops clinging to each leaf and new bud on the trees outside...announcing the coming Spring, and the rebirth it will bring...

iTunes is playing in the background...Joni Mitchell's "Tea Leaf Prophecy"...

...she plants her garden in the Spring...

No matter how deep and dark the Winter, Spring will always come

...life is good...

What I would give at this moment for the peace you have.

Jim...the peace comes and goes, it's just that it hangs around for longer periods these days...

Have just read your sitch and am responding over there.

One thing I'll say for you is that you need to count your blessings...you WW is not even suggesting D...

L2F

You're gonna love this one...

Background: WW gets a PO box for the whole family about a year and a half ago citing mail and identity theft along our rural road...yeah, right.

So I did the logical thing and got a key to it as well. Clearly this rankled her, as she had to continue to be sneaky.

So...I go to check the mail today...(WW's out of town, no doubt saying she's "sick"), and find out the mailbox has been "closed"!

Of course she did this without asking/telling me.

Sat down and had a long chat w/ the postmaster about it. Interesting conversation...seems she's committed fraud by claiming to be acting as my agent.

It appears that after I came across the letter from OM last weekend she felt entitled to do so. She's got her mail fwd'd to another box, along w/ kid's mail, and my mail, or at least that addressed only to me, is now being sent to my deployed address...

I'm just astounded...

If you knew my WW, you would be too.

WW's M thinks WW must have a brain tumor...

...continued...

So when WW texts to ask when I'm leaving (something that's gotten REALLY old, btw), I call her back and let her have it w/ both barrels.

I'm tired of being stomped on and taking it, so I directed my energy and anger where it was needed...at the offender.

I tell her in no uncertain terms how angry I am with her actions and that I know exactly why she did and it's a load of cr@p.

She calls back no fewer than 4 times after I hang up and I don't answer. Her first voicemail was an apology, her second gave "reasons" why she had done it.

In her third message she accused me of opening a random business letter addressed to her (2+ weeks earlier - an honest mistake), but then claims to have thought she was "doing the right thing" by having my mail forwarded to the ship...as in a favor to me...it made me dizzy to try to keep track of the rationalizations.

It was amazing to see how her brain was working to process the fact that she'd been busted doing something really underhanded.

I didn't answer...I'd said my piece.

This was Monday.

So, today, she drives DS to where I work to "job shadow" me for the day - something that was in the works for some time. Her trip was much longer than it should have been due to an unscheduled ferry breakdown.

When she arrived she was somewhat discombobulated from the unfamiliar drive and perhaps her anticipated reception.

I was as nice as I could be...naturally, because I'd said my piece already. I offered to give her a tour as well, since she was there...surprisingly, she accepted.

So, we marched onto the ship as a "family"... I introduce her to my coworkers as my "wife"...have to wonder what they thought, not having seen or heard of a Mrs L2F since I'd arrived over 7 months ago!

I have to admit that it was hard not to notice that WW is HOT...I've always been proud to be her husband.

A good tour, and WW seemed to genuinely enjoy it. Perhaps it was because she was back in a familiar environment...the "comfort zone" of the well-oiled military machine...who knows.

It's times like this, when she sees me in my element, calm, confident, appreciated by my peers and respected by my subordinates, that she must see how wide a gulf there is between me and OM...in almost every way that matters.

I'm a good, honest, loving and reliable man...and always have been.

She leaves DS w/ me and I have a wonderful day w/ him. He makes me SO proud!!!

WW calls a number of times more throughout the course of the day and is quite chatty...I'm pleasant as well.

I do wonder what's going through her mind...yet not dwelling on it.

My curiousity is just that.

I'm not waiting for her actions, and mine do not depend on hers...quite liberating.

All in all a good day.

L2F

***Forgiveness, Love, Anger***

SB, you said...


While I never considered myself and angry person, I too have had problems understanding the source of my anger, then directing and controlling it appropriately.

Strangely enough, the level of turmoil in my life has never been higher, yet because of the amount of self-discovery I've achieved as a result, I'm less likely to fly off the handle about little things because I know the source of my anger...I understand it.

I deal with incredibly stressful issues at work, yet have never been calmer in the face of raging storms all around me...kinda nice!


Yes!

I have been self-righteous in the past that, in the words of Colin Powell, I allowed my ego to get to close to my position, and so I would fight to the death not to be "wrong"

Not so anymore...at least about anything other than WW's A.


Yes, I've gotten much better at this too...I've taken the "ego" out of the anger, and used it not to conduct personal attacks, but to speak clearly and forcefully cut through the bs of the A justifications, etc.

It's allowed me to break through my natural tendency to avoid conflict...God I wish I'd allowed myself to feel this at the beginning, but I was just so afraid my anger would "push" her away...typical JV move.


Me too...and I thought I was nuts...Glad I'm not alone.

Thanks SB,

L2F

Great day...tomorrow's my B'day!

Spent some time at the bookstore browsing and listening to music.

I didn't even pick up a single "relationship" book...a first!

Can't wait to see my kids!