Very uneventful V'Day. I didn't get anything for WW and never even mentioned what day it was. I did get her a card for our kids to sign and give to her, but nothing from me.

Last night I said to her "you seem stressed tonight". She said she was because she had to give the condo owner an answer on whether she wanted it. She needs to make a decision on it pretty quickly. I told her that nothing I could say would make much difference but I would say one thing. I said "I'm not interested in being your helper/assistant, I want to be your husband, lover and best friend. And if you're not interested in working towards that then you should get the condo." That was all that was said about it. I felt pretty good that I was able to gently push her to a decision, but in a loving way.

She was on the phone to her parents when she got home from work. I know they must have been talking about it as well. I had seen an email exchange between WW and her mom the other day. Her mom was kind of upset the WW never calls or returns MIL's calls, and that they worry about her. In WW's reply she talked about the possibility of moving out and that us seperating might be our only chance, but that she is concerned about the kids. She never mentions the OM and that she continues to talk with him and that he is still in the picture, and that (IMO) a big part of the reason she is thinking of moving out is so she can continue her conversations with him. This had me kind of upset so I called WW's sister yesterday and talked to her about it. She said the in-laws are aware of the ongoing conversations with OM and know what is up. That may have been part of WW's conversation with them last night, I don't know. But I was at least relieved that WW isn't able to put some spin on her reasons for moving out without her family knowing the truth. None of her family wants her to ever be around the OM again, so hopefully they can have a little influence on that.

Sorry about the rambling, sometimes it helps to just talk about the things that are happening and kind of let it out. While I don't really have a question in there, I would welcome any thoughts, encouragements or suggestions.

WW has made the decision to move out. She was supposed to pick up the key yesterday. I don't know for sure if she did. My parents came in town to visit yesterday so WW left to stay with a friend. She hasn't faced or spoken to my parents since D'Day, or even months before that.

Handled it real well yesterday, my parents just left a little while ago and now I'm a bit down. Though I do believe this is for the best right now. I will help her with the move and plan A for a week or two and then make the move to a Dark plan B. Right now I don't have much hope for reconciliation. I'm just going to be patient for a little while after going dark and then see where I want to go with this.

I do have the plan B letter waiting and ready. I need to work out the nights of visitation with WW before I can really go Plan B. Finances are already worked out and have been for a long time now.

Protect your kids however you can. Don't rely on your wife to protect them. She can't even seem to protect herself.

The OM sounds like he is out of control. He can't control himself enough to keep his marriage, his job, or keep the police from intervening.

Get ready for a DARK Plan B. I hope you have an intermediary. Sounds like things will be going badly for your wife.

I also would INSIST that she get some medical help the next time OM tries to knock her through the wall. Don't let her come waltzing back home to "save" her from him. Insist she get an order of protection and some psychological help.

I've taken all the steps I can to protect my kids. I have many people besides myself looking out for them, including WW's family and friends as well as my friends. WW has signed an agreement not to let OM around them at any time. To be honest I have never worried too much about OM physically harming the kids, more concerned with them witnessing something between OM and WW. But as of now I've done everything legally possible to keep that from happening.

I am ready for a total black out in the Plan B. I have two intermediary's ready.

I don't know how badly things will go for WW. Of course I am totally aware of the fog and babble, but she is talking like these next 6 months will be spent to herself and working on herself. Do I totally believe her? Of course not, but there is a chance it's true, however small. But even if that is the case she will still be going through some pretty deep loneliness and depression. She said she spent the entire session with the counselor crying on friday.

I'm not sure the OM will have another opportunity to get physical with WW in the near future. Not because they won't be in contact, but because I think he will be on his best behavior trying to convince her he's changed, and she won't see his true character again until she moves in with him again, if that happens. Whatever the case I won't be "saving" her again unless she does a full 180 and agrees to going through the steps outlined here on MB.com.

If anything does happen again with OM the RO will be taken care of for myself and kids. WW is getting some psychological help now and hopefully will continue to do so during the next 6 months. She needs to realize that she is worth more than being with a man who is abusive, even if there are good times.

Overall I actually feel pretty good about this development. I have been gently pushing WW to commit to something for the past few weeks. Now she has. And I didn't want her here the way she's been. I only want her with me if she is ready to fully commit. She hasn't been so this is for the best. I have most everything lined up and will be ready to enjoy the future, no matter what it brings.

Thanks for the advice believer, I appreciate it very much.

"I don't know how badly things will go for WW. Of course I am totally aware of the fog and babble, but she is talking like these next 6 months will be spent to herself and working on herself. Do I totally believe her? Of course not, but there is a chance it's true, however small."

The chance is exceedingly small. If she wanted to work on herself, the best place is with her husband and kids.

What she wants is a chance to continue her sick affair. I'm sure the OM will be on his good behavior for a bit. But, come one, a guy who can't even straighten up to save his job? Even an alcoholic can usually save his job - otherwise how would he have drinking money?

Melody has suggested Plan A'ing for another couple of weeks, and she is the expert. Glad you have your ducks in a row for a dark Plan B.

I do agree is exceedingly small. And while I agree she should be working on herself with her husband and kids, she has too many others telling her she can't think straight while living at my house. The good thing is all these other people are also telling her she can never go back to OM. Time with will tell, but I of course skeptical myself.

The really sad thing about the other guy and not being able to save his job, is he has now found another with a substantial raise. The guy is the typical used car salesman type, he can put on the good face. But has pretty deep issues. I've often thought over the last four months that I stepped in too soon and should not have saved WW so quickly. But I can't look back now.

Part of the reason I'm a bit down today is because this is our anniversary. Happy Anniversary I'm moving out!

Happy Anniversary! Are you doing anything with your wife?

So sorry, FPF. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

To be quite honest, I think her moving out will eventually lead to your reconciliation. I think part of the reason she has been able to hang onto to SCRAPS of the fantasy is because she has had you to prop her up. Without that PROP, I think it will crumble very quickly because her affair is absolutely doomed. She is living only on EXHAUST as it is.

So, I am sorry for you in one way, but glad for you in the other because I think this is the only way this is really going to end.

Believer, no didn't do anything with wife for anniversary.

Melody, I am in complete agreement about propping her up. That's kind of what I mean about me stepping in and rescuing her too soon. I talked to WW's parents for a short time last night, thay called to wish me happy birthday. Yes our anniversary is also my birthday, don't know what I was thinking there. Anyway MIL is very supportive in my efforts to keep kids from OM, she will be encouraging WW away from OM. Of course there's only so much she, or anyone, can say and do and ultimately it is up to WW to make the decision to completely end relationship with OM. But there are enough people telling her that she can't go back to OM and if she does her time with the kids will be severely compromised that maybe she'll actually hear it and listen.

Helped move WW out over the weekend. She is renting a condo about three minutes from my house. I helped her get settled in and hung some pictures and curtains for her as well as some other stuff.

Some might think this is weak (I just read the "where is the anger" thread), I believe being angry and letting it rule you is a sign of weakness. I can live without WW, I already have and I will again. She wasn't the first person I loved and looks like she won't be the last. In my opinion it takes a stronger man to say I'm not letting what you do affect me, if I can help you move out to push things along great. I'm not kissing her a$$, I'm helping to set up a nice environment where my kids will be spending time. There, just had to get that out.

IMO, it really doesn't matter how you choose to rationalize your actions - to your WW, they very likely suggested "doormat".

MIM


Big freaking ditto from me. Why not buy here a house warming present too. Maybe foot the bills for a few months while your at it. Good grief.....

Don't have to rationalize my actions to you, though I guess I will anyway <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I told her a number of times if she wasn't committed 100% to working on the marriage right now to move out. When she decided that maybe she needed to, I helped her do so to speed it along and make it as smooth a transition as possible for my young kids. I'm not a doormat. A doormat would sit there sulking "Oh, poor me how will I ever go on without WW?", or respond with "You F#**ing B:itch if your moving out I'm not lifting a finger to help." Rather than sit and cry about it I chose to show just how fine I was with her moving out by saying "Okay, here I'll help you".

At the end of the day I want be someone that my kids can be proud of when they are old enough to know the truth. And come judgement day I want to walk right up to Jesus and have him say "you've done well". That's how I gage my actions.

The OM in my situation let's his anger rule him. If he hadn't had such anger issues and been so controlling I'd already be divorced. I might be soon anyway, if so I can live with that. But I wonder how this guy will react knowing how much I helped WW and how much time we spent together this weekend getting her on her own.

But I do appreciate the feedback and will take it into account.

FormerPF,
Have been off board long time but your posts bring back my frame of mind. I was "nicer" than was good for me. It sounds like you are hoping for the best and will do what-ever it takes. It is probably time to back off and let her feel life without you. Make yourself busy doing something with you and the kids. It will help keep them busy now that mom is moved out again and make you less available to her. She may also feel she is missing out on "her" family and finally realise where this is taking her.

used 2 b Daniel

I see hanging curtains, and family photo's a great intro if you shortly after, give her the Plan B letter and truly go dark.

ok, you guys, FPF is not a doormat. He did the RIGHT THING in helping her hang those curtains, because that is what she will remember in 10 days when he **SLAMS** the door shut in a dark PLAN B. The contrast to the OM will be HUGE and that is what we WANT.

He and I discussed doing a GREAT Plan A for 2 weeks after she moves out and slamming the door shut. He is not doing this because he is a wuss, but because he is STRATEGIC.

There is a huge difference between facilitating an affair and setting the stage for an impactful PLAN B. I have been posting to FPF since he has been here and he has NOT facilitated her affair at all. He is just sticking to his plan, which is a well thought out, intelligent one driven by logic, not emotions. There is no pansy in this woodpile, boys! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thank you so much ML. I do have a very specific plan and strategy in mind, and you helped me come up with it. I have one more week of this great Plan A, which includes the kids and I taking WW out to dinner to celebrate her Birthday this weekend. Then it's lights out.

She will remember how I didn't totally fold and crumble when she moved out. The OM will get a chance to show his true character again and we'll sit back and see what happens. Actually I have a time frame in mind to see what happens. I won't stay in Plan B forever and will move to Plan D sometime mid summer.

In the meantime to used2bDaniel:

I appreciate your advice. I have a very full life away from my WW. I lead worship on Sunday mornings, I regularly play in the men's soccer leagues, I have bible study Saturday mornings, I have home groups on Sunday nights, I get together and play poker with friends often, I can't wait for the weather to turn and Golf season to start again, I just bought a new iMac with recording software and a new keyboard(I recently bought a new guitar) to write music, I spend lots of time with my kids. Fact is I don't have enough time to do everything I want.

My life and happiness doesn't revolve around my WW. I had already moved on and planned a future, then I saw a little crack in the A and now want to make sure I have done everything I can to give my marriage and my kids family one last chance. This quick Plan A and then Plan B is that chance, if it doesn't work I'll know I've done everything I can.

FPF, we may have discussed this before, but I would get a strict visitation schedule all ironed out before you go dark, and stipulate to her that the kids are never to be around the OM. [you may have already done this] Eliminate anything could possibly cause contact after you go dark.

Another thing to consider will be her reaction when you go dark. Most WS try their best to break through. The #1 tactic is to come barging into the house at will. I would have a plan in place to prevent this, such as changing the locks the day before you go dark. In your letter, ask her to drop the kids outside and to honk in the driveway for pick ups.

Other tactics will be to ask one of your children to hand you the phone. They believe you will take the call rather than say anything in front of the kids. I would tell the kids beforehand that you are not in contact with your wife and why. Tell them not to hand you the phone, that you won't be taking the call. Usually if you say no once, they don't try it again.

Just be prepared for any eventuality and you will be successful. It is important because if they break through once, they will be emboldened.

We have a visitation schedule worked out. The weekdays will be easy as the nights when one of us has the kids we will pick them up at daycare in the afternoon, and then drop them off the next morning. So during the week there won't be any exchanging of the kids. The weekend will be a bit tougher, but I will get that worked out.

WW has agreed to not allow kids around OM, in fact she has signed an agreement to this, not necessarily a legal document but doesn't hurt either. On top of that all friends and family are on top of it and don't want kids around OM, they are going so far as to tell WW not to even answer the phone if OM calls while she has kids.

Locks are easy as WW doesn't even have a key, I just need to get garage door opener and change entry code.

My children are too young to worry about the phone thing (they're 3 and 4), and all I use is my cell phone anyway and they can't answer that.

I think I have everything lined up pretty well and will be prepared for any attempts at communication.

One reason Plan A for a couple weeks after the move was such a idea is because it has taken a few days to completely get WW stuff out. Like even tonight I am dropping off the last of her clothes that were in the laundry. It has also given me a good opportunity to do a really good Plan A, by helping her with so much. I think it has gone pretty well and this will give Plan B the chance to really hit home.