Well WH responded to my motion just as noon hit.

I asked for 1/2 his income in spousal and maintenance support (spprox. 750.00 for each of us). Here is what he responded with..

I happen to have a piece of paper that came in the mail this weekend that he isn't paying on any of his snap on. I think I'll show the lawyer.

He didn't respond to paying the legal fees or OW having NO contact with my children.

What questions should I be asking the A.

Queenie,

I'm sorry I don't have much that I can add to how to handle the legal stuff,,,,,I didn't have to deal with spousal support and in my state, the child support is done with a strict, set calculation. It's a form that just plugs in both parents financial data and then calculates it automatically.

I would think it matters not if he is supporting another person by choice, that is irrelevant when it comes to his responsibilities to you and the kids.

The best advice I can give is to stick to your guns and keep the demands HIGH. Let you A do their job, which is to protect YOU and your Kids!!

Also, spend time in the Word - - it is really a time to make sure you have your armor on for your own protection. The responses through the legal stuff is going to expose you to WH and it's not going to be pleasant or easy. Keep your eyes on G-d and He will see you through.

{{{Queenie}}}

Hi Bugs,

Our state has strict calculations as well. I'm not sure what that will be, but I'm sure the A and I will discuss today.

I would also agree that what he chooses to do with her is his choice and has nothing to do to his responsibilities to this family.

You say it over and over again to new people and all of you remind me as well, that this isn't my H anymore. It's a monster. I think in the end I just get caught off guard being his enemy. And it makes me wonder why can't I simply stop standing and caring for my M and trying to protect our family.

Over and over all I hear is how I could do better. I never realized that there are men that would want me, WH had me believing I would NEVER find anyone as good as him.

Last night I did the scariest thing I have done in a long time. Go to a bar when I am very low emotionally and very vulnerable to not feeling. I don't know if I ever noticed it before, but the people around me were getting particularly drunk last night and I wanted to just have one drink. I wanted to just drink into oblivion.

I'm sticking to my guns and I am keeping my demands HIGH. I'm not going to let her have anything that could be mine. I'm just not clear about what could be legally mine.

I have been talking to G-d all day yesterday and night. I came home from the bar and immediately got Torah out and started reading it. I'm scared Bugs. I'm just scared I haven't built up enough strength to walk through this without becoming bitter and calous and losing all love for my H.

I just have to keep remembering and mean it, THY WILL BE DONE.

Hi Queenie,


I hear you, Queenie.... I am hitting a rough patch myself....

...I am also experiencing some 'fear'.... and wonder what's up, too!

...I think we need to put some LIGHT on the FEAR .... focusing too much on the future? ...not giving ourselves enough credit? ...let's be VERY VERY specific about what situation we don't want to find ourselves in and what can we DO....TODAY...to prepare ourselves to NOT be in that situation...

....what's the healtiest course of action to take for you/me/BSs, given what we have on our plates, to get from a place of 'heaviness' to the 'lightness' of being?


I found this text that 'spoke' to me and want to share it with you:

Courageous is the soul who adventures into time and space to learn of their divinity... for while they cannot lose, they can think they have, and the loss will seem intolerable, and while they cannot fail, they can think they have, and the pain will seem unbearable, and while they cannot be less than they truly are, powerful, eternal and loved, they can think they are, and hope will seem lost. And therein lies their test. A test of perceptions... of what to focus on, of what to believe in... in spite of appearances. Very courageous indeed.

For sure I am going to have to print this out.

I am off to the A, Thy will be done...

Queenie,

I've been worried about you today? How are you? I saw this earlier and have been anxious to find time to post -


I am no expert when it comes to addictions, but when was the last time you went to a meeting? You mentioned the other day trying to find a ride to one, but it didn't work out. Have you been lately? This statement is a bit frightening.


Knowing what is 'legally' yours is the responsibility of your attorney. What YOU do is ask for EVERYTHING! And I DO mean EVERYTHING. This way you start at the top and THEN, work your way down from there.


First, it is OK to be scared. It's good to acknowledge when we are scared, so that we can find a way to deal with it.

Second, YOU don't have to have enough strength. That is why we have G-d with us. It's our place to rely on HIM for the strength we need, and He will never fail to give it.

Third, it is HARD, HARD to find the tight rope between the fight and the love. Between what is right and what still lives in our hearts with love for the POS WS Monsters they have become.

For me, I switched back and forth so many, many, times between feeling like I was bitter & callus to still feeling the love - - I can't count the times.

It comes down to a choice. It comes down to letting G-d help us to walk the path HE has for us. Letting go and letting G-d. And that, too, will wax and wane. And that's OK. Keep on the path. Lean not on your own understanding,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Love ya Queenie! Please check in with an update!

Queenie:

Why are you going any where near a bar?

I'm thankful that you shared that with us.

I totally missed that.

Thanks for pointing it out, Bugsy.

Let us HEAR about this.

Queenie, you know the NC theory? A WS shouldn't have contact with the person who has disrupted the marriage. So, it's not a good idea for you to be hanging out at the bar.

You need to have a talk with your sponsor.

Queenie,

Isaiah 40:27-31 (The Message)

Why would you ever complain, O Jacob,
or, whine, Israel, saying,
"God has lost track of me.
He doesn't care what happens to me"?
Don't you know anything? Haven't you been listening?
God doesn't come and go. God lasts.
He's Creator of all you can see or imagine.
He doesn't get tired out, doesn't pause to catch his breath.
And he knows everything, inside and out.
He energizes those who get tired,
gives fresh strength to dropouts.
For even young people tire and drop out,
young folk in their prime stumble and fall.
But those who wait upon God get fresh strength.
They spread their wings and soar like eagles,
They run and don't get tired,
they walk and don't lag behind.

Shabbat Shalom, Queenie.

Mark

Shabbat Shalom Mark,

What in the world are you doing up this late?

It's late, I'm exhausted but it's been an interesting day.

be right back

Hi Bugs,

My meetings have been more sparce because of graduation, end of school year stuff etc. I went to a meeting on Tuesday night and I went tonight to both my Alanon and AA.

The meeting I was trying to get to on Wednesday is a larger Alanon meeting. I did see my sponsor tonight, but there seemed to be bigger things going on than what I did last night, or honestly, I forgot about it.

The bar last night was a girls night out for teachers and classified. It's a dueling piano bar and normally it's not a problem. I just didn't realize how I was so low inside and struggling, and when I sat there and looked around at all the people drinking, well, it just looked so good. I got out of there quick. I can assure you, it frightened me. 21 years of sobriety, but just the notion of making the sadness go away. I just need to take extrodinary precautions right now.

So we got the response to the motion yesterday which I posted. I saw the letter today when I walked into the A office. Basically he is complaining that I am making the allegations of his neglect or substantial nonperformance of parenting functions and the absence or substantial impairment of emotional ties between the parent and child without any facts to support the allegations.

I could give a dissertation on this, but it will just get me riled up and no point. He says he will give me 899 for CS, but no money for SM because it is not possible for him to continue to pay his wife half his paycheck. He has been going into serious debt and it has created a substantial financial hardship. He complains that my financial outlook is better than his even with just child support. Oh he says again that my wife's financial circumstance is superior to his. DUH.. He doesn't get it that I could live in a totally different place, food, everything would be cheaper if I wasn't taking care of his children all by myself. But....

Of course I went south as strong as I was wanting to sound yesterday and it scared me that I am just going to lose everything. But I put together a list of questions for my A and brought them with me.

A had drawn up papers that basically say, he financial disclosure is incomplete in the sense that most of his accounting is done by cash, large amounts and their is basically no paper trail to determine that he is in fact paying bills and not partying so to speak. Therefore we continue to ask for the full amount. Oh, he said that since WH lists the girlfriend as dependent on him, he can assume that she is adding money to the household and he didn't disclose that. I don't remember the wording but it nails him.

WH is basically giving me the parenting plan I have created, the contention is he wants the part where he is neglectful etc stricken, and if it is he will agree. My A feels that I have won this point, so let's take it out. Personally I think it should stay, but compared to others, WH just comes across as a flake, not the monster in the larger societal sense.

I asked about the no contact with the OW. My A understands this is important to me, and believes that WH is agreeing to MY plan which leaves her out in the cold. I'm not so sure if you read through it the way I did, by striking the two parts, I am striking the reason why I want her or it might appear that way. So I have a call into the attorney.

In the end, I am having to pray to G-d for his will, but seriously look at what is most important. The spousal maintenance that will help me maintain this family financially or keeping my kids away from crack ho.

He has run up a credit card of almost 10,000. He isn't paying on his tool account and I believe he is struggling accept he makes these large cash withdrawals and he is just creating the same financial mess there that he did at home. Funny how I always thought it was me, and I totally had a hand in it.

I feel like my A has a good handle on getting him in court. But it's G-ds will not mine. I don't have to be there when he goes to court which is very cool. A couple of things that I have noticed and what it means, I really haven't looked at. In all my paperwork, I refer to WH as respondent. WH's paperwork refers to me as his wife or by my name, my long name which is what I asked him to call me.

The other thing, in HIS parenting plan he is asking in various situation to create opportunities where I have to interact with him. Like keeping him informed of the children's schedule, sports, etc. Of their grades, things of that nature. If it's one thing I have learned it's not my responsibility to keep him informed. That was what a wife did. I feel like he needs to figure out how to learn about his children by wow a novel approach - asking them? I feel like he's trying to draw me in to his web, not because he wants me but to keep me hanging. I'm not pulling....

So, I'm looking for suggestions here.

Hi Mimi and Cinders,

It's late, but I am not getting this at all.

I guess the bottom line for me in all this is that I just didn't think about what I was doing. I was going out with a group of mostly married woman, for a girls night out and what caught me off guard was the desire to just down a few and not feel.

So, no bars for me, for a LONG time.

Hi Queenie,

...a follow up from my post to you on my thread...


....this is what I mean by 'taking the means to protect yourself'

...and if WS does not choose N/C with OP to protect himself and family....

...then PLan B (N/C with WS who can be very toxic to your health and no different from alcohol) is a 'means of protection' for a BS....

...it's Queenie making 'healthy' 'protective' choices for...Queenie!

((((((((((((((((QUEENIE))))))))))))))

Queenie,

Glad you have been getting the support you need, and that you recognized your weakness! Outstanding!

Now, about the legal 'stuff'. First, let me say that I know how hard it all is. I know for me, it just felt so UGLY; so much so it seems impossible to have to face. I just wanted to turn away from it all because it felt so cold, so impersonal, that the person who promised to love, honor, and cherish me would turn into the cold monster that was reflected in the words on the paper.

Most of what you list in your post are 'standard' type things, such as the reference to your name or to you as "wife". Legalese is all that is.

Also, it sounds like your A is on top of things with his points about WH's transactions being all in cash and impossible to track. Remember, he is going to try to HIDE as much as he can to avoid doing what is RIGHT. Let your A keep you protected and keep digging to get to full disclosure. He ABSOLUTELY needs to list OPs income if he is intending to claim 'costs' associated with supporting her in any way - - I gotta tell you THAT part just INFURIATES me for you! Talk about an A$$!!


Drac did the SAME thing! Here's the deal with that. He can be asked to produce the statements from his credit card to show WHAT this was spent on,,,,,,,,,,,,,He's NOT going to want to do that. Then, he can be asked to show PROOF of how he has paid for the support of you and the kids. Can he produce much of anything there? NOPE.

So don't sweat it. It will take some game playing (again, the job of your A), so be prepared for some back & forth on that. When I went to my A with my financial information, I had copies of canceled checks and credit card statements showing EVERYTHING I'd paid for - - from thousands of dollars for Drac's cars, to house payments, ALL childcare, ALL medical bills, etc. The total was HUGE, and it was great leverage when he tried to act as though HE took care of everything in the M from the financial standpoint.

The stuff about keeping him informed - that's some standard boxes on the parenting plan as to who is responsible for what. All you need to do is to tell the A that you want it to be that you are EACH responsible for doing all of that. You are totally right in that is the job of a WIFE, and as he has chosen to change your status in his life, he no longer gets ANY of those benefits. Drac thought *I* should pretty much take care of all of that for him and it totally pi$$ed him off when I refused.

Too bad. So Sad. That's THEIR choice. No matter how many times they stand there with the fingers pointed at you saying 'YOU did this! YOU are making this HARD. YOU need to do it MY WAY and if you don't it means there is something wrong with YOU.", Don't you DARE buy into the crapola they are selling!

At this point, I don't know that it's about keeping you hanging (I went through the same thoughts about Drac during our negotiations) - but it's more about what is EASIEST for them, as well as the fact that they soooo don't want to have to "look bad" on paper. You see, deep down they know that someday their kids could read all of this stuff, and if the TRUTH is on paper, then how can they continue spinning their lies. How can they continue to Justify their A??

YOU have the Power in this my dear. Rely on G-d for the strength and He will see this through to a place that is BEST for you.


{{{{{Queenie}}}}}

Thanks Bugs I was wondering if I was off the mark on this one. Unbelievable, but thats a WW for you.


I dont' have the power as much as I might if I lived in other states. But I have G-d and I have the FAITH in him to get me through this.

How are you today?

Just a little peeve of mind, Queenie...

Why do you call your WH a WW..it confuses me..but that's not difficult to do these days...

Wayward Wicked-man?

I think you are saying WAYWARD WIFE....

I know. I can stop.... I'm easy

I don't need to confuse anyone else. I have a hard enough time with myself.

Hi Queenie-

How are things down in your valley? I've been keeping up with your thread but haven't been on MB that much lately.

You got some great advice from Bugs about the financial stuff. Let your A handle the details. That's his job.

As far as keeping you informed about your YS, since he is under 18, your WH can be put on his school information and get anything that is sent to you, sent to him without you having to contact him. Since most schools do progress reporting on the computer, your WH can have the password and code for that and not even have to bother you for that information.

Your YS or his coach can send your WH any games schedules.

Beyond that, since your son is going to be a sophomore in high school, he can probably let his dad know anything else he chooses to share. They can do it by email.

Hope this helps.