Yes, PM, I do know that there is danger.

Thank God for MB, otherwise I am sure that I'd be smack dab in the middle of meeting ENs for him with no clue of the Drac-infested waters I was swimming in.

Although I am glad to know that others are somewhat benefitting from my honesty, it really is self serving. I know that if I don't lay it all out there
#1. I won't LEARN anything
#2. I won't DEAL with those feelings the way I need to
#3. The advice I get won't help me as much if I were being less than honest

Just the other day I was talking to 2 of Drac's Aunts - - both brought up the question of if I'd take him back. (while I was tempted to wonder why they would both ask me the same question, I didn't ask or ponder too long on that thought)

I gave them the same answers I've always given. In a nutshell, IF he were the man that I married, and he were truly remorseful and willing to build a new marriage with me, then yes, I would. However, he isn't that man right now.

BC, I'm with Fox, your Ex certainly is a fool.


Confuse me? Oh yeah, I am confused. I totally own up to that for sure!

I can't imagine being able to deal with Drac coming in my house, let alone making inuendos like that! I don't know what I'd do, but I know I wouldn't be amused!

I really am trying to listen and hear the good advice I'm getting.

Heh.. the kids ate it all over the weekend!

Sorry I haven't been around much to enjoy the entertainment of seeing the back end of the Wayward Handbook. I took Monday and Tuesday off with DD and DS as it's one of my extended parenting time weeks.

Still trying to catch up, but wanted to look in on ya Bugsy.. you seem to be doing very well and certainly are articulating some of those 'just under the surface' feelings much better than I think I could.

I really don't know exactly what I'd do were I in those Goddess shoes of yours.. but I do know that Drac KNOWS the path back, you've told him.. My personal instinct is that these are boundaries that you've set.. if you let him bypass them now, what's to stop him from feeling like marriage/relationship boundaries are any less obscure.

This from a guy headed towards a messy D with WW.. so take it with some butter and salt.

Lexxxy,



Yes,,,,and do you have any idea how much I appreciate that?


My doubts about that have done nothing be steadily decline with every passing day! Lexxxy gotta love being right??!!


I'll agree that this may be possible,,,,but this below is the rub now isn't it?

And the million dollar question is about this
Because getting to the MB way is a must.


The key here being is that he won't start from there - - I know that you are right on the mark with that.


This question has haunted me for days.

I hope I don't sound totally off the deep end here - but yesterday I was spending time in prayer & study. The question came to mind - would I knowingly suffer through some type of physical trama/hardship IF it would restore my marriage/family, but in a new/better situation?

And my answer was Yes, yes I would.

So, is this question you pose, Lexxxy, all that different? I think not.

Am I willing to take a very dangerous, potentially harmful, personally excruciating path on the chance of getting this new/better life?

Answer



I'm not 100% saying yes, but I am honestly considering it.

There's lots of things to consider - and I'm seriously thinking about them all.

James - your point (along with others that have already been made) about boundaries is just one of those.

This would have to be something carefully executed. It would be something I would have to be able to turn around on a dime, so to speak. Carefully, slowly opening the door, but at the same time not hesitating to close & lock it to protect myself.

I'm not yet able to articulate the complete thoughts on this, so for now I'm going to leave it at "just considering".

I know you all probably think I'm nuts for even thinking about it,,,,,,,,,,,and I expect to hear from each and every one of you with your cautions and warnings.

I welcome them all! As I said, nothing here is 100% (other than I am 'considering' things)

Bugsy, I can hear in your posts how much you want your husband and family back, and I want it for you, too. But I want it to happen in the right way, so that you and LadyBugs and DSS all get what you deserve.

I'm afraid you might jump at an opportunity before the time is right. I don't mean to take anything away from the advice you're getting here--I think it's all good. I would really like to see you consult with the professionals, though, and get a plan for how to proceed.

Have you thought about a consult with the Harleys?

Hey SD,


Thanks so much,,,and that is what I want, as well.


Exactly. Rest assured, there will be no Jumping into Drac-infested waters right now. I am only considering the cautious consideration of things right now.

Yes,,,I have thought about a consult with the Harleys. It is in the front of my mind and should things progress, I will likely do that.

I am still working on how to articulate what this "consideration" really looks like. Part of it is a 'watch and see' on what comes from the Drac camp. Part of it is also, the question of how do I want to respond - - IF I choose to respond at all in any way except a strict Plan B.

LG made the point - and it is EXCELLENT - that I don't too easily throw myself out there. It would be a setup for disaster is soo many ways! That's not the kind of thing I'm considering.

I'll keep thinking about how to explain it better...........

I don't know how come Drac's path is seen as any different.

IMO, he's following the script.

The problem in your situation, as I see it, was the ability for him to obtain a PROMPT divorce.

I would suspect that the OW wanted to get married and he did not.

After living with her in PLAN B, the FANTASY BUBBLE BURST BIG TIME and he had NO PLANS to marry her...BECAUSE (DRUM ROLL) he still has FEELINGS for you....DUH...

IMO, the KEY THING for you to do is to remain in a DARK PLAN B...

DO NOT GIVE INTO HIS ATTEMPTS TO CONTACT YOU...

HE HAS TO SUFFER!!

He has to YEARN for you.

I BELIEVE THAT WILL HAPPEN!!

Just like MM told me..any MOMENT that you meet ANY NEED will lessen his SUFFERING and YEARNING!!

I've ALWAYS identified with your MANAGEMENT of your FAMILY'S LIVES and that's one of the major things that my H missed about ME..he WILL be SEEKING out YOUR HELP with this and has SORELY MISSED IT...

He will want your HELP without making the necessary changes and commitment to YOU...DON'T ALLOW THIS...

What I am saying is..MAKE HIM COME CRAWLING and I think he will...

IF YOU REMAIN DARK AS NIGHT..with SHADES and BATMAN CAPE!!

If that path is the only option open to you and Ladybugs, I say in all honesty, forget about him.

YOU can get a new and better life without that kind of drama filled crap.

Honestly Bugs, you did not come this far to walk a path like that.

What has changed about Drac? He lost his HO a couple weeks ago and now he is scrambling around for EN's to be filled? And guess which specific EN that would be.

Has he even gotten close to rock bottom?

If you stay in a completely dark Plan B for another six weeks and in that time he finds HO2 what would that tell you?

These are just my opinions Bugs but I really feel you should just stay the Plan B course. He has a long way to go before he even resembles a man worthy of you.

AND IF HE DOESN'T COME CRAWLING..

OH WELL, you and the LADY will continue to LIVE YOUR LIVES!!

learned that from Michael Moore

Welcome back James

Thanks BC... I think.

THIS is what I'm saying. YES YES YES. Mimi has it, girlie. I made the decision to go the DANGEROUS route, Bugsy, and PWC did exactly what he wanted. He got the home, the kid, the financial freedom and ignored the heck out of me.

IMO, the dangerous route is not worth it.

I would rather die the death of a thousand cuts, while submerged in rubbing alcohol, than to go that dangerous route.

Wait for him to come to you. He MUST yearn for you, and really WANT you, not just NEED you, but WANT you. Wait for that.

I agree with Guy. If Drac shows POSITIVE signs of giving in to the recovery process, consult the Harleys first.

Have you consulted with the Harleys before? I can't remember.

If you can afford it, I would do it now.

The Harleys do this for a living. They will be able to tell you what positive signs of recovery look like. They will be able to tell you what withdrawal looks like. They will be able to tell you how to react, what to say, all of that stuff. They will understand his motivations and actions and statements better than he does and can help you figure them out, too.

Thanks everyone for your posts!

My mind is a whirl with so much after reading some great posts. Excellent points all around.

I think I'm going to grab a bucket of popcorn,,,extra on the butter,,,,and sit back.

As Chris points out, what has changed?

HappyHoHouse is now HappyNoHoHouse.
Drac is opening up and playing Nice Drac.
Still Drac.

Yet,,,,,,,,,,the subtle (or not so subtle) changes in Drac's communications have me wondering/thinking/hoping.

Yes, I want him to WANT me, not just need me. Yes, I want the whole package.

So, while sitting back with my greasy bucket of popcorn and a huge slushy drink, I will be ever watchful and hopeful.

No changes are immediately imminent - but they are still running around in my head.


SD- you make some good points about talking with the Harleys. I just wasn't sure if there was enough activity on Drac's part to proceed with that call just yet.

As Chris pointed out, there could very easily be Ho2 already in the works, so why spend the $$ on what was only my hopeful imagination?

Your point about their being able to give me the signs, as well as some of the behind the scenes wayward thinking makes a lot of sense.



Thanks again.

You don't need subtle changes in Drac. You need PROFOUND changes in Drac.

Subtle is building a sand castle on the beach. Profound is the breakup of Pangaea.

When he is willing to try to move continents for you.... well.....maybe.

Hi Bugs,

Your getting great advice... and I think you are doing great in taking it all in, digesting it, evaluating it, getting prepared and being alert....should the right 'signs' come up... I believe you will be ready to handle it whichever way it needs to be!

....and yes, I do believe Drac's 'attempts' will escalate... and you will be prepared...

...in my case, WS has attempted numerous times to 'charm' his way into getting me to do friendly co-parenting and maintain R with OP....it's hard to resist, unless you recognize the tactics for what they are!

Good luck.

I didn't really either until Lexxy and LG started hammering it, but I don't have any reason to doubt them. I just want you to be as prepared as possible.

Bugs,

I consulted with Jennifer a few times last year when we were trying to recover. WH did not talk with her - thought it was hogwash.

Anyway, she and I decided that if my WH ever decided to really recover that one of my conditions was that he had to call her first and she would assess whether or not he was serious. That was before he fled the state for good... Oh well....

Anyway, I'm sitting back with my tofu chips and green tea waiting for the show to begin. Just kidding. I have a sh1t-load of candy here that I can't wait to get started on. Let's finish with the previews and get on with it now.

I almost spit out my Chardonnay on that one! Glad you followed up with the big bag of candy admission! I don't know that tofu is Goddess fare??

I am not sure what (if any) real showthere is going to be around here. It might turn out to be a whole lot of hype for nothing more than what turns out to be a total Flop! The critics are still out as the trailers aren't even complete yet!

Chris - there wasa time that Drac would have moved continents for me,,,,,,,,,,,,

But I'm not going down the days of what WAS. Gotta deal with what IS.

Really, SD, I so appreciate the fact that everyone here is interested in my welfare and making sure I am "prepared".

Chai, I also consulted, but with Steve last year. In fact, Drac did one session with Steve, but was too far gone to believe that the path back was possible with all of the fog that was in his view. He followed along, and even agreed with a specific line of logic that Steve set out on how our M could be recovered. He just had gone so far that he couldn't/wouldn't make a change in his direction.

I do have a tiny hope that there were tiny seeds planted from that one session that may be slowing growing despite Drac's lack of care/attention/feeding of those seeds.

Ladybugs lost her game tonight, but did have a couple of good hits. I hadn't even noticed that Drac had arrived at the game, DSS wasn't with him again. He sat behind and over from me (away from my sight line to the game), so that I didn't see him until Ladybugs ran over to him and I looked to see where she was going.

I didn't look at him or catch his eye in any way the entire time. I did look like the 'Coaching' Goddess tonight in shorts (a tad short, too) and t-shirt.

I almost laughed out loud when my cell phone rang during the game and it was Drac's Dad,,,,,,,,,,just calling to see how I am doing??!! We haven't talked in a while, but I was surprised to get his call. I have always been the one to call him. We chatted for a couple of mintues, but he said we could talk later since I was at Ladybugs game. I am sure Drac would not like it if he knew that Dad was calling me.

Ladybugs is spending the night at a friend's house. Her friend played right after her, so she just stayed there after her game.

MCD called tonight to let me know that Ladybugs favorite singer (Kenny Chesney) is going to be on one of the morning shows tomorrow. He asked AGAIN if I'd gotten any grief from Drac about his attendance at the game the other night. He continues his disbelief that there has been none - - - He said he got a look at Drac and that he looked 'mad'.

Whatever. I haven't gotten any grief. No emails today. All is quiet.

I intend to go take a nice bubble bath with my next glass of wine and then off to bed!

Don't be fooled either about the reason for MCD's calls..but that's another whole CONVERSATION....

I'm sure MCD is a pretty genuine dude. He is obviously very thoughtful. I know I'm not a single gal and all, but nobody's callin me about cool stuff my KID might like. That takes effort, Bugsy. Real effort.

If you aren't gettin his vibe, you ARE deaf, dumb, and blind.

Much love. Have a good soak.