And right now, it's really not about what you like. Who cares about how you feel regarding getting hit on in a bar.

How does your wife feel about it? After all, you just told us the OW invited you to join in a relationship with her. Now you are getting hit on in a bar.

Isn't that just more invitations?

Do you think your wife will be pleased with this? Will it give her warm and fuzzies? Will it increase her perception of how much you love and cherish her?

If not, why are you doing such things?
See above, it's not about you. I don't see where you thought this through and said, hey maybe this is not such a good idea.
What good is resentment doing for you? Nada. Drop the resentment. It only indicates you are still thinking of yourself before you think of others.

Today, I'd advise your wife if you've not dropped the resentment about this in 90 days, she should consider plan B, and kick your bottom to the curb.
It's still about you and only you...
You've admitted you've made mistakes. I don't see evidence that you've owned them and understand the impact they have.

Your resentment of checking in demonstrates that you really don't own the impact and consequences at this time.

I hope you do, but I have not yet seen you doing this.

Look hu. I have absolutely no reason to keep arguing with you about this. You posted that post, because that is how you feel. Not because of some "trap"...everyone can see that you are full of it. You have been exposed...get over it. Put your guard down, take the advice of EVERYONE here, and help recover your marriage. I started a thread for your W for God's sake, and you still question my intentions? Are you blind?

I have no reason to argue with you...I don't know you. From what I do know of you (from your behavior here) I wouldn't even p!ss on you if you were on fire, so what would I gain from arguing?

Put the guard down dude...it's going to ruin you.

You may want to reconsider the places/people who believe this is an okay way to communicate.

You don't HAVE to interact at all with people you don't like. A man who acts and treats others with respect (even if he doesn't like them) often gains respect for himself.

Is the goal in your life to be superior to others and put them in their "place" or would you like to be an admireable man who does not feel the need to attack others so that he can step on them to build himself up?

Your actions don't need to be based on how others treat you. You can treat others as you would like to be treated - often times, it comes back to you.

Fox

Hu, I started a thread for you which has now gone to page whatever.

You haven't responded to anything I've said yet but I'd be interested to see you respond.

To everyone who wasn't here when I was first on the board and then when I recontacted the OM after 2 years of NC, you haven't seen defensive until you read those posts from me.

Defensive, sarcastic and rude. That's what I was. You know what, at the time I was very, very pissed off with everyone telling me what they thought and they told me what they thought in no uncertain terms. Looking back at those posts and reading them again just recently, I just shuddered with shame at my reaction.

Hu, I recognise every word coming out your mouth (fingers). I asked people to stop posting to me, too. Luckily, they didn't.

My H told me that my A was worse than when his parents died and he was absolutely grief stricken when they died. He told me he looked at the sweet girl he'd married and saw nothing but a horrible [censored].

I didn't know if I wanted my marriage either, at the beginning. I stayed because the OM dumped me and I couldn't see being on my own. I also stayed because I knew I'd been very happy with my H and hoped I could get that back.

I was a foggy, withdrawing mess. My H had to hold me while I cried and said "I miss him, I miss him."

So, they don't get much worse than I was as a WS.

Yet, here we are. 6 years from the original A, 2 years from the reoccurence. We are very, very, very happy. I love my H and he loves me. We are coming up for 34 years of marriage next month.

Hu, aside from what anyone else thinks of you, what do YOU think of yourself?

Do you find yourself to be an admireable person?

Are your actions admireable?

Are you someone YOU would like to be around?

Are you someone that you would respect?

If you were someone looking from the outside, trying to figure out who Hu really is, what would you think?

Are you someone that you would want a daughter of yours to date/marry?

Fox

HU,

You asked about withdrawal......well here ya go.

The quickest way to deal with any withdrawal is to make a conscious decision to be committed 100%. Commit to your marriage and to start working earnestly to follow up that commitment with actions and the withdrawals will dissipate. Acting even when you are down or depressed with 100% commitment no matter what.

It is a decision you must make!

You are approching this marriage with one foot in and one foot out. A better marriage can never begin this way. A better marriage can only begin with both feet in.
You have had one foot in, one foot out for how long now??? (that's rhetorical) And you expected things to go well in your marriage during all that time??? (that's sarcastic, with me banging my head on my keyboard)

The right actions will gradually lead to recovery, but without a commitment to the marriage they are useless.

Make a decision to committ or not, but please stop toying with your wife. She deserves oh so much better. (this is me telling you to man up - like many here told me)

You know what your right, I am half in and half out. I do need to decide.

tst, this is an awesome post. Where the heck were you when my WH was home with one foot in on foot out (that's a rhetorical question, too)?

Hu, this is a must. You must make this decision, else your wife will make it for you, in time.

If you decide to stay and give it your all, contact the Harleys and go all in. They are NOT about blaming, they are about taking responsibility for what is YOURS to deal with. They can help your wife become a better wife; they can help you atone for what you have done and become a better husband. They have the map and a compass.

I seem to type in invisible font but I'll try again.

Hu, I didn't know what I wanted. I thought our case was hopeless, I thought I'd never feel anything for my H again. But, I wanted to give it my best shot. It took a long time and many hours here on MB, but I knew it would be worth it.

Your last post seems to me to be saying that you're not going to bother. That it's too hard. You have NOT given it your best shot. Nothing like it yet.

I just posed in your BW's thread that you guys should book a phone session with the harley's. It is a lot better if the WS takes the initiative in booking counselling (shows thw BS you are involved in the recovery). It would very much help you in deciding which side of the fence you feel you want to end up on. Really, what do you have to lose with a phone session? You say you don't really know what your EN's are...the harley's will help you with that, and give you a plan in your recovery. All arguing aside...you should check it out.

"Coaching Center" at the top of the page for info on it.

Hu:

About this:


I was this EVEN before my A. Flamingo sensed this for A LONG time.

Had I acted this way for THREE DAYS after Dday, I would have been divorced.

You have been that way for six months.

That's a great big "OUCH" for Mrs Hu.

If you want OUT, go. Otherwise, go ALL IN. Tonight.

Because your new A started when you decided to ride the fence.

ANd that is a horrible place to be.

For you.
For Mrs Hu.
For your Daughter.

Nobody gets ALL of Hu. So they are all shortchanged.

Tonight. Just listen. Let Mrs Hu talk. If she asks you a question Just give her an answer. Make it the truth. Even if you think it might "hurt" her. It death by a thousand cuts that way. This way, she has whatever she might need.

Today may have been the turning point for you.

You my not realize it tonight, but in a week you will notice something different. In a month, you will notice a REAL difference.

Trust me on that.

LG

PS: "getting hit on in the bars" and then telling your BW about it. OUCH. Maybe this HAS been the first time in 8 years that you have gone out. And I can respect your honesty with your BW about what happened there. We all want to get "hit upon" It helps our admiration need. However, in your fragile state NOW, it can go the wrong way fast. Next time, sit in a booth with your friend. Reduces the opportunity for those interactions that way.

LG

I don't know what I am going to do. That is part of my problem. That has lead to me not giving it my "best shot".

Because you know what I don't know what I want other then to be a dad to my daughter. I have given more thought to leaving then staying. The effects of divorce on children have kept me from going that route so far. I don't know your story KiwiJ but I do feel dead towards my wife, if you recovered from it then maybe it is possible.

Don't know a lot to think about.

The link is to my first post here.

My first post

After 2 years of NC and after being a very active (and respected) poster on MB, I accidentally bumped into the OM again and for two weeks kept up contact. I confessed to everyone here but not to my H. I ended that contact but didn't tell my H that I'd seen the OM again. Someone here who knew my real name and details, exposed to my H. It was the best thing they could have done. There was a lot of debate on the board at the time whether they should have done it or not, but for me, personally, it was the right thing and I'll always be grateful.

It led me and my H into a true recovery.

Just in case you missed it.

Great trust building activity after you cheated on her!

I really hope she sees through you and leaves!

Then make the decision.

Considering the 4 of us have been betrayed I guess you don't want to hear how your wife feels!

Unlke your wife, I'll do what I want. You ignore me? Go ahead! I'll say my piece.

Hu,

When my WH decided to recommit to our marriage, he was angry. He said he was only doing it for our son and because, ultimately, it was the best chance at happiness.

See, ask yourself, "Would your ideal be to be in love with the mother of your daughter?" If the answer is yes, then you recommit. You can remain skeptical, do the actions, stick to NC, even in your thoughts...doing your personal and marital recovery.

You will open your love bank to your BW again...what happened pre-A was exaggerated, distorted, and remains so in your head...please understand your truth separate from the truth.

Btw, her verifying and you choosing to act transparently can greatly enhance both of your recoveries. See, taking it as being controlled like a child, instead of respecting yourself and your equal partner, makes a big difference. When you practice transparency, you are acting from radical honesty...not to make someone else trusting of you...to rebuild trust in yourself, your choices...I think what other posters are reacting to in you is you not seeing how you lied and deceived yourself for nearly four years straight.

That's what it took to live a lie for every moment of nearly 1500 days. Trusting yourself to decide anything right now would be tough...I understand the distrust. I fear to this day duping myself through justifications and resentment again. Cloaks everything like a smoke...it is the fog.

And part of your decision is also your criterion for choosing...based on if you'll be happy or not. It truly is the best shot you will have at full happiness...in your intact, in love, loving family. It's not finding the right partner, it's being one.

You may have met her ENs...you didn't share, lied by omission for not telling her your stuff...you were half of the marriage. You still are. Both of you are limited to half at all times in your one union. No one else really completes you--you are complete, whole and marvelously made...before a word was spoken or an action taken. Self-image can sure mess up the works...you can tell when you're reacting to it--you'll hear words like blame, deserving, not getting, being punished--and you'll feel resentment, entitlement, lack of respect, frustration, emptiness and rejection.

When you act from self, you hear words like acceptance (not approval), ownership, understanding, gratitude, gift of self, doing and not doing, choosing--and you'll feel accepted, understood, aware, admired, connected and honorable.

One way has a wide-open love bank to your BW...has the stages of mourning...which you aren't in yet...you are mourning the loss of the great feelings from the A; then you will get gut-punched, once you're through that, with the loss of your marriage and so much more you cannot undue. That's when you may feel flooded with feelings for your BW. That's your stuff and she can't get through it. I don't think Harley even advises BS's to meet ENs during withdrawal...it's blocked.

I know I dated my Wh during his withdrawal; we played together again, tons of RC time...hardest three months, I swear...because on top of the infidelity, I had to watch my WH mourn the loss of another woman...think about that in six months and feel the crushing feeling in your chest...because the consequences of infidelity keep on coming...and they knock a person flat, seem to wipe out their existence...for they looked at you like half of them, not the marriage.

And what you haven't come close to experiencing is the intense and awesome grace within your BW...for choosing to not divorce you...to give recovery a shot...to fall in love with you again...the real you...because she hasn't seen her real H in nearly four years.

She has her own personal recovery to do as well as half of the marital recovery. Reach into your compassionate self and know you can't comprehend what your choices have done, are doing...for withdrawal is a beast in and of itself.

I believe huspouse is as stubborn, amazing, strong and indecisive as you are...she could choose the day after the blow hits you in its totality to leave you, anyway. I don't believe she will...unless that day takes longer than a human can suffer.

And it might. Train your thoughts, get clear on where you are right now...don't be the man peeing on today, 'k? Don't have one leg in the past and one leg in the future while you think you're standing for your marriage. You only have right now, this moment...look at your BW as the whole, complete and marvelously made human being she is...also made from love, the woman you vowed to, your equal in every way.

Her responsibility is to verify the truth of your actions in regard to contact...which can help you in your weak moments of wanting to take a hit of that drug again...and you know drugs are fantasy.

She had no intention to harm you pre-A by not meeting your ENs...she had her own stuff, no more knowledge or insight than you did in the ways we fall in love and stay in love. Now you both know more...she could not earn your infidelity no matter what she did or didn't do. Dr. Harley would have advised you to cut off all contact with OW before she was OW...to go to a Plan B to protect your loving feelings for her...and you really wouldn't be where you are right now.

The importance in reviewing the past is to allay our fears of the future...you aren't "all-in" without steps, boundary enforcements...what you didn't know before. And you won't have a shot at redemption, recovery, to truly be a hero in your daughter's eyes when she's 16 and cheated on by her BF...if you don't go all-in on recovery.

LA

hu,

You've stated a few times that you are still in the wayward mindset - that you still think of leaving your wife at times, and that you are still in withdrawal.


I wonder, then, how much you would consider yourself as fully invested in your marriage? Because to really recover the marriage, you would need to be fully invested. You can't expect a return on your investment in a marriage unless you put all of your money in the love bank.

Otherwise, there is NO return on this investment.

If you are putting anything away for the OW "rainy day fund", then anything you are doing right now doesn't even count. Sorry to tell you this, but you are not on the road to recovering your marriage and the clock hasn't even started ticking until your investment is 100% IN THE MARRIAGE.


I asked my husband once if he thought he would have had the affair if he had spent the time invested seducing the OW, thinking about the OW, and working on ways to improve his relationship with the OW, on doing those things with and for ME INSTEAD.

He said, "No."

Certainly he wouldn't have!!!! Because logic only tells you that you get the best return on your investment where you place your best efforts.


SB

***WARNING***BRACE FOR IT HU...MRS. W POSTING WITHOUT KID GLOVES***


HU, right now *I* want to smack you! Are you really this heartless? Are you missing the empathy gene? Seriously, you are sounding more and more narcissitic as this thread goes on...sigh...



Wow...read your first sentence in that quote again...Selfish much?

Ahem, EASY? You think an affair was EASY? *thud* The affair was the WORST thing that I've ever done in my life...I hurt Mr. W, our dd and myself...Affairs are a lot of things, easy is NOT one of them...


"ME...ME...ME...But seriously, enough about ME, what would you like to know about ME???" C'mon man!!!

Can you really look at your child and say, "Well I'm here now, but if I'm ever unhappy, then I'm outty!" You shouldn't be able to look at your wife and say that either...How about you honor the vows you took when you got married? What a concept!!!

Life is full of ups and downs HU - No guarantee things are always gonna be sunny and fun...Happiness comes from DOING GOOD...


Listen HU, no one here OWES you anything...People are posting to you out of the goodness of their hearts because they want to HELP you...How dare you ask any of them to stop just because their "style" may not suit you! You are a grown man and shouldn't need to be handled with kid gloves...Really, not much will suit you right now BECAUSE of your mindset...Like I told you before, examine yourself FIRST! Egads! If you keep telling people not to post to you, pretty soon you will get your wish and no one will post to you...Surely that isn't your goal is it?


As others have already pointed out, you cannot blame YOUR ACTIONS and YOUR CHOICES on anyone but YOU...You are in control of you...As I told you earlier, ACT, don't REACT...


You should be GLADLY offering up anything and everything about yourself...Why aren't you GRATEFUL that your wife is even giving you a chance?

HU, my advice to your wife would be to divorce YOU right now if the word "never" from the above quote isn't removed in double time...*shaking my head in amazement*

HU, it's time to get serious...Re-read this thread...Ask yourself if that is the man that you set out to be...Come back and let me know...

Mrs. W