Yes I wrote the NC letter as soon as I walked into the house and wife posted it. Actually I didn't really write it, I just copied the one out of the "surviving an affair" book. It does seem like an easy option and if I were doing it today i would write my own, but all the same it is done and done seriously.

Yes we are looking for a councillor.


Thanks
Fatty

I HAVE ALREADY SAID " I AM STAYING "

Thanks
Fatty

If you were serious about recovering your marriage, wouldn't it be wise for you and your wife to get your information from a common source?

I doubt philanderers.com will be of much use to your marriage, but go ahead and try.

Oh, and nice job on the fresh start, Fatty. There are many wise people here, once you get past the pushiest few members.


When I read "Fatty", my first thought was a less-than legal cigarette-like object....but that's just me.

I see your point Medc, but one moment (OK 7 months) of weakness does not make that my "normal" character. I slipped up big time, I know that but I will climb out of this hole and being strong willed will help me to overcome the things that may try to get in the way. I do not agree with the phillosophy of "once bad, always bad" or any other re-wording of that that you might like.

Do you see my point?

Fatty

Taking the wrong meds, freaking out and shooting someone is one thing.

7 months? That's a whole lot of pre-planning, ducking, dodging, and lying.

Obviously, if it wasn't part of your character to begin with, it sure became a part of it during that time.

Hitler was strong-willed.

Being a good person and being strong willed do not go hand-in-hand.

Just be a good person.

Fatty,
What will you do when you have the same feelings that came up for you after the 1st relapse - 4 or so weeks ago? What is your action plan?

Have you considered writing a Personal Recovery Plan that includes how you will recover your M too? I think it's important to fix the man and then the marriage.

That way you can secure your future and put all this behind you at some point.

Good luck!

I would never question advice...I just hope you don't take this statement as an excuse to have an affair while "fixing the man before fixing the marriage", fatty...like my WW did.

That is not a term that we use in NZ for that type of cigarette-like object. It is a slang term for a gentlemans "parts" but that had nothing to do with choosing it.

Any way must run, things to get done before the rain comes.

Fatty

Hey now, I resent that being a strong willed person and all. If I didn't know better I'd think you were saying us strong willed people are bad

Fatty, i see your point...but as you can note that was directed at HU7668...not you.

Always note the RE: on the reply heading.

Hitler, strong-willed? I would rather put him in the "mentally Ill" box.
We could debate that for hours, but that is not what we are here for.
Anyway I have already admitted that I was not myself for the period of the A. Well obviously I was myself but I was out of character. Now I am rebuilding my marriage, my life and myself. My strong-will and my commitment to my wife/marriage will help me to do that.

Fatty (back in character)

Oh dear, a slight goof there, sorry.

Definately not like Hu...it's official.

I've posted to your BW off and on through the months you've been wayward.

She is a strong woman.

She is right to ask you to work on your issues.

Three forms of recovery:

Your personal recovery
Your BS's personal recovery
The marital recovery


Your BW has been working and growing while you were off with OW. She has made incredible progress. She understands many of the basic concepts here, and has learned some of the things that the marriage will need to undergo in order to make it more affair-proof.

You CAN have a better marriage, but there are some things you need to consider.

What were the problems in the marriage at the point of the affair? You need to be really un-emotional when you consider them. You cannot blame the state of the marriage on your wife, or on you - it belongs to both of you. So evaluate that "state of the marriage" back then. What contributions were you making? Were you meeting her needs then? If you were meeting some, what were you doing right and why? What were you not meeting, and why not? Think about those things, Fatty. I don't mean for you to just pass this one over lightly.

The EN's you DID meet are just as important as those you didn't. And to be honest about them - don't say "I was terrible at everything", or "I was perfect at everything".

Then, take a look at her EN's for right now. Think about meeting them today. They have changed - and the job now is to meet them.

The other thing to understand is that the EN's will CHANGE as time goes by. This isn't a one-time deal - the job from today and forward is to look at these EN's, and understand that you need to look regularly at them. To see how they evolve, and to see if you are meeting them. And to be sure that you are communicating on what YOURS are also, so she can meet yours, too. It's a two way street, and the street CHANGES. Be sure that you understand that concept, because it is now a lifelong change in your marriage.

But you also have another job, which is making restitution for your affair. That will be tough. Meeting her needs is one thing. Making changes in yourself is another. But you will have to ask your wife what her expectations are, what she thinks she will need to see for "restitution". She may not even know at this point. And you may have to accept that answer for now. Be ready to accept that answer, Fatty. Her pain right now might leave her not knowing what restitution could fulfill her.

But I do know this - she has not wavered, not once, in her desire to restore your marriage. Not one time has she said she would be better off without you. Not one time has she said she has lost her love for you. Not one time has she said she wanted to give up on you.

You DO have a chance with her. You are one LUCKY SOB.


SB

Hi onlyUcan

Great question! I have been thinking about it on and off today and I don't really have an answer for it. You can be sure that I will be talking with wife about it tonight. It is possible that those feelings will not surface this time, my reason for saying that is that there are some very different curcumstances involved this time. The first time I came back to my wife I did so for a bunch of wrong reasons. I was deeply depressed following the death of my father and I returned home for the comfort of familiar surroundings and familiar people. I was seeking comfort, not a looking to fix anything. Also the A was still bubbling away in the background.
This time I have completely seperated from the OW. There are many many reasons for leaving her and at least as many for not going back. There is only one reson for coming home - that is to fix my marriage/life/self (OK so maybe that is 3 reasons).
So why do I feel a little bit protected from the possibility of being hit by withdrawl, simple I have come to a point where I have a strong dislike for the OW. The A died. The A was over before I returned home, yes only just over but over all the same.
Now I expect you all to tell me how silly I'm being with this train of thought, and I am open to that suggestion, but please don't forget that just a few lines ago I did say that this is going to be discussed with wife tonight and together we will make a plan - we have always come up with the best plans when we work together and share ideas.

I have not yet written a personal recovery plan, but I do intend to. A writen plan is the only sort worth having IMO.

Thanks
Fatty

I don't think it's a silly train of thought at all. It was easy for my FWH to do the NC letter(s) when he relapsed because he truly wanted to be with me. He truly loved me and OUR family.

But what he failed to safeguard against, until this time around was what he would do in the face of stress. I think it's terrific that you are talking to lil about this and working these things out together.

Just remember that it takes committed action and it's long term. When you feel stress, find other outlets that can release it.

Another thing that I have noticed my FWH do is even when we fail, for example, both of us get back into our habits of disagreeing, he has picked himself back up and changed his behavior and actions, even right in the moment in front of me. It's really been an eye opener for me and caused me to focus on how I can react differently too.

You 2 could truly be a great inspiration down the road for people who recovered after a Dark Plan B. I'm very happy for you.

Fatty,
If I may, I'd like to address this from another angle. Yes, I'm so proud of you for sticking through this and getting the help you need. But, I'd like to see you grow through the good that you are doing for your wife. I am a victim of my H's Ea. This, I believe was his single most foolish choice he ever made in his 43 years alive!

So, what are you doing for Mrs. Fatty? When is the last time you told her she was beautiful? When is the last time you complimented her on her outfit or the dinner she cooked. I dont' mean a general thought, I mean a true-blue compliment. Because we, the BW, feel so inferior after our H's A, we are totally unsure about everything we used to feel secure about. Your wife may seem on the outside to be the most secure and strong person you know, but inside she's probably a mess.
So, my advice is this. Pay special attention to her. Look her in the eye and simply smile. Touch her when you walk past her. Kiss her on the lips...not the cheek. Heck, make out with her -- whatever happened to that after marriage??? You will start to heal if you see her start to heal. Make her feel special. In the end, her recovery will be the key to your recovery. The longer the time goes by with no contact from OW, the easier it will be to love your wife all over again.

Maybe this is too simplistic, but I know from my point of view it's what I need. Good luck

I felt the same way when I was invited back into my W's life. It's not a silly train of thought. But actions need to follow. I would suggest you begin putting together a list of actions/precautions you can take to provide a deeper level of protection for you and your wife.

Dr. Harley calls these actions "Extra-Ordinary Precautions" or "EP's" for short.

You see your inability to protect your W is what led to the door opening that allowed the affair to begin.
1)You allowed yourself to be alone with another woman.
2)You allowed yourself to listen to her problems.
3)You shared your own problems.
You made the choice, for whatever reason, to NOT protect your wife and your marriage.

Hence, the need for EP's in your life.

I copied over my list to give you an idea of what I'm talking about. I hope it helps you.

Putting this in writing and following through will re-establish protecting your wife. Protecting your wife MUST be your number one job if you want to restore your M.

This is AWESOME.

While I'm sure your wife felt gut-punched to know you were thinking of OW, the confidence and trust gained by that one action of yours were phenomenal. I don't think it's possible for anyone to explain just how vital those volunteered bits of painful honesty are to a BW.

It would have been so easy for you to keep your thoughts to yourself. So easy for you to tell yourself you didn't want to bring it up because it would only hurt your BW.

Yet you confided in her.

That is so very big!! Your W is no dummy. She knows you're going to think of OW. She has fears so deep and dark that you can't begin to comprehend them yet. When you volunteer information like this, and ask for her help in dealing with the situation, you shine a great big floodlight on her fears. They scamper way back into the corners to hide for a little while, and your W gains a bit of strength, and trust, and comfort as a result.

You are so very much on the right track.