We do share many common circumstances. Based on my lay opinion, though from lots of research, is that my W exhibits signs of narcissistic, histrionic and borderline personality disorder (mostly narcissistic). She also exhibits some form of dissociation, which in the extreme form is commonly known as split personalities. In her case, she appears to have at least two 'sides' to her personality, the bad girl side which comes out when she talks to or is with OM, and the good girl side for me. Indicative of some form of dissociation is that she often can't remember what happened when she was with or talked to OM. At the very least, she is able to 'emotionally compartmentalize', meaning that she can suppress certain emotions, feelings and memories in certain situations. Thus, when she's with OM, she doesn't think of me and doesn't feel any guilt or shame. It's like her world with me doesn't exist in her mind. Likewise, when she's with me, she doesn't think of OM, nor have any feelings of betrayal towards him.


You can't. Don't waste your time trying to rationalize it. (lord knows I have). Just attribute it to the influence of the addiction she is under. While I wouldn't call myself religous, W was brought up in a conservative christian background, so this has been totally out of character. Of course, with her narcissistic tendencies, she effectively self-rationalizes her behavior. Ironically, my W acknowledged to me that she had told OM (who professes to be a devote Catholic) that I had more morals than the two of them put together.

Hang in there, and take care of yourself.

Well the fur is really flying now. The OM called her after I confronted him about respecting our marriage and told her about the confrontation. She is steaming mad and has set up an appointment with the lawyer to formalize the separation. In some ways it is a bit of a relief no longer sitting in limbo. The emotional tension is a killer.

She wants to get the paperwork done so she can get me out of the house ASAP. She wants me to go away and let her live her life in peace. She says what I did was controlling and emotionally abusive and I need to apologize to OM because there is nothing going on. It is just a friendship. A friendship where they have movie nights together, sit around the fire together, go on a hike together, she picks up parcels for him when he has trouble going to the post office, he stops in regularly for "little things" OH NO NOTHING going on. What if the neighbours find out, this is a small neighbourhood. She says "Can't you just stuff it?" She tell me she stuffed it for years when she didn't like things I did. Hard to make corrections when you don't know the problem. Honesty is the best policy in my book. Keep things in the open and deal with them when they come up.

Oh well better get ready for the lawyer.

BC,

Your kids are grown?...

Here's a thought.

Throw her sorry @SS the "F" out!

File before she can.

Go to immediate Plan B...

(Maybe a bit harsh?)

Sorry, but I still believe if I'd done this prior to FWW's EA becoming a PA, it would have ended. Abruptly...

...you said a mouthful, brother.

Sorry for what you are going thru because it stinks. My wife also said just friends and yes she was having sex with him the whole time.

Now why don't you get a lawyer and play some hard ball. Get her butt out of the house instead of yours. Play some offense and stop playing defense.

She is not in any fog...she is choosing to abuse you. It is sad that not wanting your wife to boff another guy is controling behavior and in her view abusive.

You need a tough lawyer and stop being a doormat. Since she wants you out of the house get her out. If you have not told the kids please let them know what is going on. Don't just let her railroad you. You can always protect yourself and if she changes you can always still save your marriage.

Maybe when she sees what she will lose she will change her attitude. But stop sitting back. Play some offense. Good luck I am so sorry for what you are going thru.

Dont you mean for her to move out?? Shes the one who is in the A while M to you. She is in the wrong. Not YOU. YOU do not have to leave.


YOU have nothing to apologize for. She is suppose to do those things with you, her husband.

Call your lawyer tomorrow and get her first. I hope you have been getting your ducks in a row for this? She needs to pull her head out of her A$#. YOU need to get even a stronger backbone and start defending you, defending your M.

In BC Canada from what I understand the assets get split 50 - 50 so there is not much benefit in getting a tough lawyer. At this point I just want out and try to find a place to recover from this craziness. As far as I am concerned she can have the house as part of her 50% of the assets. She will soon learn that a house and property does not take care of itself.

I have to look after myself now and frankly I need a new start. We moved to this new place 2 years ago, I was trying to keep her happy and this was going to be a fresh start. Good luck with that one.

I wish her well, as I don't think this train wreck will recover after listening to her today. As some of the people close to me have said lately "this is getting too crazy, get out of there before it turns bizarre".

It is still very hard to deal with the sadness and grief and sense of loss.

Thanks for the support. I have really needed the sanity checks as once you get into this turmoil it is easy to loose perspective and objectivity. When the fog rolls in from WW it is hard to get ones bearings.

So thats it, you are going to throw in the towel? Something you wanted help with so bad you are going to let it go down the drain?

Answer this, regardless what your WW is saying do you deep down in your heart feel your M is fixable?

Do you want the M to work?

I do want to the M to work. If I do not participate in the separation then it will be forced upon me via the legal process.

Right now I wished I could answer your question about the marriage being fixable. I am very pessimisstic about it right now. I have had several chats with my wife today, as she is really really really upset that I confronted the OM- denials, nothing going on etc.. (whatever I know she is lying because of some of the things she has confided to others)

She has set up the lawyers appointment and she is proceeding with our without me - no question. She keeps repeating she has been hurt. She tells me that by me confronting the OM that is an example of controlling and emotional abuse. How dare I. She wants me to apologize. No way I say, I know what he is doing and I am confident in that. I no longer believe what she says and have lost trust in her.

I am not a quitter but she has made it abundantly clear that there is no M to work on at this time.

You can't force someone to stay when the are determined to go. At least not to my understanding, What would you suggest?

If you do not participate in your own demise it is less likely to happen. The affair has a much greater chance of crumbling than your marriage. Believe me, it is doomed. If you help her destroy your marriage, your marriage will be .........destroyed. Waywards are usually all smoke and mirrors and will back down as soon as they see you won't bend over and make it easy for them to destroy you.

You will be making it easy for her to kick you out of your own home and bring in your replacement. A replacement that is very temporary. Her affair will not last, bcboy. It will soon crumble. Do you want to give up your long marriage for a temporary affair? Why contribute to your own demise? If they want to destroy you, why would you make it EASY?

As the man of your family, it should be VERY HARD to destroy your family. Your family needs your most ARDENT DEFENSE right now, not for you to run!

Instead, tell her you WONT cooperate. If she wants to kick you out, make her work for it. She can't just kick you out of your own house. If she files, then you get the meanest junkyard dog lawyer and file to have her removed since she is having an affair. Have the OM subponaed to court to testify about his adultery with your wife.

Don't lie down in the face of evil, friend. Your family is under assault. Now is the time to get to work, not to RUN. Don't hand your wife and your home over to an adutlerous interloper. You have been married for a long time. Why just give up so easily when there is strong chance you can save your marriage?

Odds are in your favor of saving your marriage. And let me tell you why. Her affair is doomed. 95% of affairs FAIL because the very traits that make them possible: dishonesty, thoughtlessness, cruelty quickly find their way into the affair.

My point is that you should not make any decisions about your marriage based on a very TEMPORARY AFFAIR. Your wife can come back from the twilight zone. It happens all the time around here. We have many recovered marriages here.


Do you see how effective your confrontation with the OM was? It caused huge conflict and upset in the affair. This is why you should continue to yank his chain every time you are aware that he contacts your wife. Continue to confront him and ask him to leave your marriage alone. He could never have a future with your wife because he would be eternally hated by your children for his part in ruining your family. <-----tell him this. Tell him you will fight for your marriage and he had better be prepared for the fight of his life.

Most OM are nothing more than weasels and cowards, so this can scare the heck out them. It is discouraging at the very least.


blah,blah,blah,blah.... so she set up an "appointment" in order to SCARE YOU from interfering in her affair. SO WHAT? SHE IS JUST TRYING TO SHUT YOU UP! Half the time they never follow through. Talk is CHEAP.

You can also "set up an appointment" with lawyers to talk about her adulterous affair with scumbum. And you can also get an attorney who DRAGS THINGS OUT as long as possible until her affair crumbles.

Don't let her scare you, my friend. You have the truth on your side. And more importantly, GUESS WHOSE SIDE GOD IS ON??


And there will be no marriage FOR SURE if you hand this over to the OM and ALLOW HIM TO WIN. Your wife is clear about NOTHING because she is intoxicated by an adulterous affair. She is DRUNK on adultery the same as a drunk gets falling down drunk on vodka. Your job is to disrupt this affair to the point that she gives up the VODKA and sobers up. Once the vodka [OM] is gone, she will most likely be open to working on the marriage.

Your job is to do your best in the meantime to ruin her affair and make it as hard as possible for her to destroy your marriage. Remember, her affair is TEMPORARY, so your job is to PREVENT any permanent damage.

Now, you may end up separated in the long term, but there is much you can do to set the stage so that a) it is not easy for her to replace you with OM and b) you are positioned to rebuild your marriage once her affair crumbles.

And please continue to expose the affair to everyone. It has very effective and is causing great conflict in their affair. Tell your close friends and neighbors and ask their advice. When you do that, they tend to want to help.

And most of all, don't despair. Don't let the SMOKE AND MIRRORS of the infidels scare you. It is just empty noise designed to scare you.

This is going to be HARD, I won't lie to you. But it can never be easy when your marriage is under assault. And you are under assault. But you CAN WIN, because you have a PLAN, and they have nothing. They have nothing but very temporary feelings in a relationship that is DOOMED. DOOMED. They are doomed.

bcboy, do you have the book Surviving an Affair by Willard Harley? If not, please get it and read it so you will understand what you are dealing with here. The things we are telling you will make much more sense if you read that.

Plan A is the plan that Dr Harley recommends before separation in order to achieve the best possible outcome. There are no guarantees, but often this will effectively kill an affair and bring a marriage to recovery. Here is an outline:

The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A by Pepperband


The carrot of Plan A

Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.

Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.

Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.

Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.

Stop lovebusting behaviors.

Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.

Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.

Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.

Offering forgiveness and understanding.


The stick of Plan A

Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.

situation: bcboy moves out and gets himself an apartment. OM moves in, because your WW is now "separated" and under the odd notion that adultery is therefore justified.

Guess who pays the mortgage for WW and OM?

Guess who has to get a court order to come in the house and get his shoes? In the house he pays the mortgage on?

Guess who has to ASK the OM if he can come in and get his drill out of the basement? In the basement in the house on which you make the mortgage payment...

Do you really want to facilitate the affair by moving out? Because that is all you will be doing. You will be handing your life over to the OM.

You will be surrendering without a SHOT FIRED. Are you French?

bc,

Melody is right. Listen and re read her posts she just posted to you.

You can gain trust back so thats a small issue right now. What is to work on getting is the M back her out of the fog.

I hear what you are saying Melody and I am trying to do plan A and drag things out. I am remaining non confrontational by being non-commital. WW "Are you going to be moving out in August, This is not working with you being here" BS (me) " I don't know yet"

WW " I am not working on this marriage, what you did by yelling at the OM was controlling emotional abuse, you crossed the line, you are trying to isolate me from having friends, this is abusive behaviour."

BS " I did not yell at him - I asked him to respect our marriage and to stay away"

WW " You need to work on yourself and I will work on myself, we are separated"

BS "You may be separated but WE are still married, you should be flattered that I value you so much that I want to protect the marriage"

WW " There is no marriage, we are separated, I have set up an appoinment with the Lawyer to formalize the separation".

WW " You being here is not working for me. You need to move out. I have called several apartments for you here they are"

BS " We still have several things to resolve"

WW "If you don't move out I will, I need you to be gone"

Here are the factors I am dealing with"
1)She is relentless in her persistance to separate. Not willing to work on marriage.
2)There is also some very strong evidence she has Borderline Personality Disorder.
3)I can see where she is working hard to make me mad (which is not going to happen) so she can get me out of the house with a restraining order (this is my suspicion anyway).
4)It is very stressful living under these conditions, I am getting emotionally exhauted. My doctor is concerned about my health and how this situation is impacting me.
5) Initially she was suggesting there my be opportunity of reconcilling, she has now confided in a friend of ours that there is no way she will consider that after me talking to the OM about staying away. "He crossed the line"
6) She can pursue a separation without cooperation
7) My impression is the legal battle can be long, messy and stressful.
8) She has expressed she has been unhappy for years and I just don't get what she needs. She was willing but no longer.

I seems the philosophy here seems to be reconcilliation at all costs, but you can't push a string. She wants out and that is it.

All I know is Plan B can't be too far off.

Next time she tells you if you don't move out, she will, tell her to start packing. Don't leave your home. Let her leave.

At what point does one go into plan B?

I am very reluctant to ever trust her again since I have discovered she has been sneaky, lied to me, deceptive, manipulative etc.

What do you do about a personality disorder?

At what point do you say enough?

WW "Are you going to be moving out in August, This is not working with you being here"

BCBOY: No thank you

WW " I am not working on this marriage, what you did by yelling at the OM was controlling emotional abuse, you crossed the line, you are trying to isolate me from having friends, this is abusive behaviour."

BCB: ok

WW " You need to work on yourself and I will work on myself, we are separated"

BCB: if we are "separated" then there is no need to move, right?


WW " There is no marriage, we are separated, I have set up an appoinment with the Lawyer to formalize the separation".

BCB: ok. i think i will just stay here in that case.

WW " You being here is not working for me. You need to move out. I have called several apartments for you here they are"

BCB: thanks but there is no need for me to move if we are already separated. i have no plans on going anywhere.

WW "If you don't move out I will, I need you to be gone"

BCB: ok, i would hate to see you go, but I surely cannot stop you


Expected. And will stay that way until her affair crumbles. As her affair crumbles she will be up and down and down and up. Her mood will change from day to day


Then she should get psychiatric care. That doesn't mean you should abandon her to her adulterous affair. If she is BPD, then she needs you there even more.


This is a very good awareness. I would have a plan in place when you feel your ire raising. Once she realizes she can't bait you into fights, she will give up.


We know all about that. I would suggest getting on AD's, working out, going to church. It is stressful. But it is also stressful to be tossed out of your home and to watch the OM take your place while you pay the mortgage. You can't save your marriage if you aren't there, bcboy.


All the drunken ramblings of a falling down drunk who had her booze supply threatened. Would you take the words of a falling down drunk seriously? Her talk means nothing. This is angry crap talk of an addict.


Right. So make her work for it. If she is going to destroy your marriage, MAKE HER WORK FOR EVERY THING.

And the next time she says "I want a separation!!!" tell her: "but I thought we were already separated?"


So will be divorce. But you are giving up before one shot is fired. You aren't even on the field of battle and you are anxious to surrender. So far, your wife is ALL TALK. And TALK IS CHEAP.

You have seen no papers, no nothing. just alot of blah, blah, blah, blah.. blown by a fogged out adulterer. We have seem 10x worse than this come back from the dead. Most of them threaten legal action and never follow through.


No, she is not willing TODAY because she is addicted to the OM. ALL waywards say that they have been "unhappy for years. " It is a CLASSIC TRAIT called REWRITING HISTORY. They are rewriting history in order to justify the affair.


Why do you think we have that philosphy and you don't? Ask yourself why the people who been here for years - most of whom have recovered marriages - have hope and you don't? Do you think we are all gullible fools who live on false hope? Or could it be that we are experienced at this and you are not?

No, we don't believe in reconcilation at all costs. Sometimes divorce is success. sometimes reconciliation should never be tried. But to just throw away a 30 yr marriage wihtout trying? ummm no Your wife is saying the EXACT SAME THINGS THAT ALL WAYWARDS SAY. Your wife is no different from the many waywards who are in fully recovered marriages today. What she is saying is the RULE, not the EXCEPTION. Read these other threads!

We believe in trying FIRST. We have seen many miracles here. And you are surrendering before you have even arrived at the battle field because the infidels are blowing smoke!! She no more knows what she wants than any other falling down drunk.

your situation is far from hopeless, bcboy. And i would never give someone false hope. Just ask the others here.

Are you french?

you try and get her the help she needs.

BCBOY, for the love of all that is holy, DO NOT MOVE OUT OF YOUR HOME!! (Yes, Im shouting, trying to get your attention.)

Do you not realize you would be REWARDING your wife's adultery? Can you live with your conscience if you do that? Even if you end up divorced (which you have every right to choose) surely you don't want to encourage and condone this sin?

If someone must go, make HER move out. Do feel free to sell your home later of course, if this all goes down the drain, and move for a fresh start, but at this point, your job as a good husband is to make this adultery as painful for her as possible. Help her learn consequences.

If she has been unhappy with you, wouldn't the logical solution be to turn that around? Why do you think that isn't her answer? Why isn't she trying to FIX THAT?

I will tell you why...

She doesn't want to work on it because....

THAT IS NOT THE REAL REASON SHE WANTS YOU OUT...

want to guess the real reason??

I will give you 3 guesses:

1. OM
2. OM
3. OM