I am sorry I know you have been through this and are recovered for a while...but this is just happening to me

I am trying to ask every questions I know of.

Bigfatredhead-

I understand. You're scared, nervous -- never been through this.

You feel as if you're in a mine field and the slightest wrong step might end in disaster.

But you need to trust the advice you're getting from folks like MelodyLane, PepperBand and others -- they not only know what worked for them but also have the benefit of the positive results other people have related here regarding exposure and No Contact.

So, you're afraid to tell the OMW what that they were / are having an emotional / phone affair.

OK, tell her what you DO know:

-Your wife and her husband have been exchanging flirty, racy text messages loaded with sexual meaning and language (your wife's admission to you)

-Your wife had / has developed strong feelings for her husband (your wife's admission to you)

-You don't know if he reciprocates but you do know he has been an active participant in the texting (you have phone records)

-You have strong suspicions the messaging involved nude or racy photographs (give her whatever evidence you have)

-Your wife admitted it had reached the level of an affair in her mind


If this isn't enough information for any normal wife to place her husband's cell phone where the sun don't shine, then I'm not sure what would do it.

You are clearly calling out what you do know. If you don't feel safe or comfortable speculating, don't.

BUT, by your own thread here you outlined that you KNOW enough to make it clear to the OMW that your wife is a threat to their marriage and she better deal with her husband on this.

Period.

If you don't do this, you are risking potential relapse on your wife's part or at least leaving the OM unchecked to pursue your wife through other channels.

You need someone watching and guarding both ends of this affair -- you watch your wife, she watches her husband.

Step up to the plate...

I think you misunderstood, and you are thinking once your WW tells you, "OK, I agree to NC" that you are home-free. The truth is...most WSs lie about contact, especially in the beginning. (I was shocked to learn how much my WH lied about after he agreed to NC...)

You said this just happened today. This is a big red flag that she isn't ready to give up her EA yet.

Exposure is the best shot you have of breaking the fantasy bubble of the affair. I would be willing to bet money if you don't expose the EA will continue.

As far as what to tell OMW...I think this is great:

People are trying to help you here. I really hope you will listen to the advice you have been given. Good luck!

BigRed,

I've seen BS's get 2x4's before, but you my man need a brick to the head.....


You say that your WW is not willing to give you access to her cell phone, but yet you are very sure that there is no contact with OM?.........WAKE THE F@CK UP MAN !!!!!!!!

I'm a BH....heard every lie in the book, been through everything you are going through, and you should listen up, because you are going to get f@cked around tenfold by our cheating WW and her new boyfriend if you don't.

Expose her now. It isn't about humiliating your WW...it's about her having to own her [censored], which she has yet to do, and you are enabling her to continue to talk to OM on her cell phone...WHICH SHE IS OBVIOUSLY STILL DOING!!!!! She has NOT gone NC with OM....I repeat NOT gone NC with OM!!!!

Do yourself a favor and ask your WW one more time if she will give you access to her cell phone and past records (since she claimed NC started). If she refuses...ask her why. You want to know what she will say?... because I already know..."it's an invasion of privacy" and "I'm a grown woman, I don't need you looking over my shoulder". I got $100.00 that says she uses 1 of these answers. You know what these answers are short for?..."I'm still in my affair, and as long as you don't see the proof in black and white, and I have you convinced that exposure is wrong, and you are too chickensh!t to do anything about it....I'm going to continue my affair".

C'mon, BigRed...take advice from someone who knows......expose the cheater already.

Go back and read Intro's post to you.

Now read it again.

Any of this getting through to you?

Read it again if it is not...

If she can't won't prove to you that she is no longer in contact with OM it is because she is still in contact with OM.

End of logical testing, soul searching and seeking enlightenment.

She's still deepening the relationship with OM.

She wants her own phone account? Shut her phone off and let her get one on her own.

Tell her no contact means NO contact...

NONE...
ZILCH...
ZIP...ZERO...NADA...

You aren't going to whine her back, you have to WIN her back and you can only win if you are willing to fight...

Go read Intro's post again...

Mark

Thanks for the replies. What I am mostly waiting for is WW to commit to NC. That hasnt happened yet. And I am watching her like a hawk tracking everything she is doing.

If she commits to NC and total honesty then I will call OM and tell him to tell his wife or I will.

If she doesnt not commit to NC soon then I will tell OMW.

To me it would be better for my wife to chose NC then to be forced into it.

Hi BFR,

I have read your thread and seen how everyone is trying to get through to you. What's the deal, Dude?

If your wife wants to separate your phone accounts, what is that telling you?

What are you doing to watch her "like a hawk?"

You need to follow the advice you've been given here if you want to have a snowball's chance in h*ll of saving your marriage.

Let me tell you a little story:

I tried to expose to OWH on D-day. I hadn't found MB yet, it was just an instinctual thing.

My messages were diverted by OW, his wife.

She and my WH then proceeded to make ME look like some nut job because I was upset by their EA. I was off my rocker, a few bricks short of a load, losing my marbles...pick your poison, they used it.

I installed a keylogger on WH-Gray's pc. Then of course I was privy to all of the disgusting details of their A. I stopped monitoring before it hit a PA but I could pretty much tell when it happened.

You need to wake up and smell the river, Dude. I can see how you are viewing exposure as some sort of revenge. That AIN'T it!! Think of it this way: OMW has a right to save her marriage if she so chooses. Well, she doesn't have a choice now because she doesn't know what the heck is going on! (Though she may suspect it.)

Don't leave this poor woman suffering like this!!

The affair is going to go deeper underground, they are going to get closer and closer and that will make it harder on everyone and you will have less chance of saving your marriage. Think about it.

Are you even reading anything here?

You don't wait for NC to start...
You call OMW, not OM, his wife, and tell her about the affair...

If you tell him to tell her, he will tell her to be ready because there is an insane, crazed jealous husband that has been stalking him because he thinks he's having an affair with his wife...That this guy is abusive and that is why he has been helping this poor girl in an effort to try to get her away from this nut case she is married to. (Sets you up for am order pf protection and getting you removed from your home by the cops too)


So then when you call, she'll know he is right and stand behind him all the way, because unless she already knows about the affair, she will not believe he's boinking your wife any more than you wanted to believe it...

So you call his wife first...

Then you tell your wife's family, his family, friends of the marriage, anyone else who might have influence over either of them and pressure them to end the affair. You don't even care why the affair ends, just so that it does.

You don't wait for the affair to burn out and then see what she thinks, you take action to end the affair.

You might have problems in the relationship, but right now the problem IS the affair.

Do you understand Plan A?

Discover her ENs and do what you can to meet them.
Identify your own love busters and kill them dead.
Have no expectations of your wife even noticing what you are doing. Expect NO reaction of any kind from her and no matter what her reaction is you keep meeting her ENs as best you can and avoid love busters.

And keep exposing...

And that's it. That is really all there is to Plan A. You do it as a PLAN, one step at a time and over and over again.

Meeting her ENs and avoiding love busters tries to bring her back because you are filling her LB$ back up.

The exposure tries to bring her home by giving her no other choice because no one else is supporting her actions.

It takes both to make it work.

Mark

Okay, so IF :RollieEyes: WW commits :RollieEyes: to NC :RollieEyes: and total honesty :RollieEyes:...you are going to tell OM to tell his wife :RollieEyes: ???????

If you play this thing out the way you state...every place I put Mr. RollieEyes :RollieEyes: in my reply is NOT going to happen!!!!!

You mean to tell me that a POSOM is going to tell his wife anything? Sorry, bigred, but he's simply going to tell you that he told her...then continue phone sex (and probably more) with your wife.

She will NEVER commit to NC without pressure from other people (people you should be exposing to). If you were correct, and she'd commit to NC without the pressure of friends and family, and only pressure from yourself...SHE'D HAVE DONE IT ALREADY!!!!!

Would it be better if your WW chose NC by herself, without being forced to?...sure. Ask around around this forum and find out just how many WS's agreed, instituted and maintained NC without pressure from their BS, family and friends....ZILCH. What makes you think your WW will do it? You seem to have a lot of faith in a woman who is texting pictures of her naked body to a strange man...don't you think?

Look, you don't have to take anyone's advice, even though we have all BTDT. But, I gotta ask...if you think we are all wrong and your WW is more sincere than any of us...why are you even here?

And it's not going to happen until you expose.
Why would she quit contacting him when her affair is so lovely and exciting, so much fun?
Bring it out into the light of day and see how fun she finds it then.

YOU are not doing anything wrong.
SHE is.

Do you know how to expose? It's not saying "Oh, she's so mean and so bad, make her behave!" It's not about revenge or control. It's about saving your M.

Call OM's wife NOW and tell her what you know.
Then call WW's parents, siblings, best friend, your parents. Tell them that WW is involved in an affair with OM. You don't know if it's gone physical but you do know that inappropriate photographs have been exchanged and phone sex has already taken place. Ask them for their support of you and WW. <-- this is key! It means they don't have to pick sides.

Some folks say you should ask "Do you have any advice?" when you expose. Personally I think this is a mixed bag. Some folks may have good advice, others may feel like they have to pick sides or decide to stay out of things.

When you expose, your WW will be hopping mad. She'll tell you she was ready to end contact but now you've ruined any chance of reconciliation. She'll tell you she can't trust you any more. She'll tell you it's her business, not yours. She'll tell you she hates you.

Those are all the same as a two year old having a temper tantrum when you take away their secret shiny playtoy. They don't like it AT ALL. It has nothing to do with right and wrong. It has everything to do with YOU getting in the way of her endorphin rush. Period.

Bottom line - every hour that you fail to expose, your wife is getting more involved with OM.

I dont think you are all wrong. I am scared to death to do anything. I am scared to death to make one wrong move. Its my whole freaking world we are talking about I am sorry its not easy for me to make a decision.

I talked to her last night she said she will not stop contact. I have hacked her email, key logged her computer, and can watch all her cell activity. Since I found out about the EA she has contacted him but he has not replied to her. I dont know if she told him I knew.

I am ready to contact OMW. Ive got all the ammo.

I talked to the Marriage counselor we are seeing tomorrow. He wants me to wait for our 1st session before I expose.

No. I didnt have much time with him on the phone.

Edit: He prob just wanted more details before he gave that advice.

But I have come to the realization that its the thing I need to do. But I dont see harm in waiting until after our 1st session.

I understand that you are scared and have many, many, many BIG decisions to make...but waiting until you have your session tomorrow to expose is just buying time for your WW to continue contact until that time.

Sounds like your MC is going to be similar to mine and my WW's (forgive, forget, give WW space, can't control her life, etc....). It's a waste of time for someone in your position to have a MC like that...he's now an enabler IMO.

Call OMW today !!!!!!

A lot of so called MC's out there do not know how effective exposure is. Do so now before he tells you in front of WW not to expose.

I am sorry we are all so hard on you, BFR. It's just that we have been where you are so we know what's coming.

I remember well being EXACTLY where you are: afraid to make a move. Isn't the term for that "going tharn" as in Watership Down?

We are all just trying to help you. It might help if you look at it this way...I was told this a LOT, and it's so true: "You are afraid of losing your wife but guess what? You have ALREADY LOST HER. So you really have nothing more to lose."

After I tried to expose the first time and failed, I let the whole thing drag on for months before I finally was able to expose again. And that was thanks to the folks here at MB.

You can wait around. I was stuck, too, and prayed every day for one of the affairees to have an epiphany or for OWH to finally wake up and smell the river. I did the "carrot" of Plan A, no stick at all.

Well, that was the wrong thing to do but what did I know? Then I found MB and after lurking for a while I posted. It was less than a week later that I exposed and it was for the better.

I was at the point where I found myself asking myself why in the SAM HILL was I keeping THEIR dirty little secret? And I felt SO much better after I finally gave OWH the evidence. It was a giant weight lifted from my shoulders.

That's when things started to change for the better, when I finally had the encouragement and found the courage to take ACTION.

Charlotte

Each day that you are allowing contact to continue without exposing to OMW your WW slips further into her EA and your chances at a good R get slimmer and slimmer.

Most MCers don't know the first thing about how to deal with As.

This is exactly what will happen too.

MC will bring up the subject of exposure...WW will leave the session, call everyone she knows, and tell them all how paranoid BigRed is...make him look like the fool, then carry on with her affair.

BTDT.

If he plans on talking about it in front of your wife, you will have been effectively dispossessed of your greatest weapon against the affair. You will have been disarmed.

Marriage counselors have the highest failure rate of any of the counseling disciplines at 84% failure, because they do not understand the dynamics of adultery and haven't the slightest idea how to save a marriage. They are little more than divorce faciliators and can't help you save this. Most are not PRO-marriage.

Dr. Harley,on the other hand is a clinical psychologist with 35 years experience specializing in adultery. He knows how to save marriages from adultery. He is a leading expert in this area with 21 books under his belt.

In all the years I have been here, I have NEVER heard anyone say they were sorry they exposed. But I have heard numerous people say they were sorry they DIDN'T when they lost their marriage.

See, affairs thrive on secrecy, so what you are doing is ENABLING the affair by obstinately refusing to help yourself. it is a strategic mistake that I suspect you will come to regret dearly.

p.s. also, marriage counseling is a complete waste of time when one of the partners is in an active affair. Any honest MC will tell you this and not take your money. That is because recovery is impossible in an ongoing affair. It is a waste of time and money.