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One last post before I go permanently.
I have read many posts here. Some are amazingly supportive and I applaud those posters. Others are in attack mode and that is not good. People who come here have searched out a forum like this because they are hurting. They don't need to be slapped, too. No doubt they are slapping themselves.
I worked very hard at my 27 year marriage, and sacrificed much. In the end I realized I had sacrificed most of myself, too. And, so, when the opportunity arose I left the marriage. I spent much time alone with my kids on nothing, and I survived. And for the first time in a long time I smiled again.
I see so much of what happened in my M in the postings of continuous. He just was not there ...ever. And he is still not there for the girls. We have just learned to move on.
I used to think everything was black and white, too. But in reality it is not. We are all human. And humans make mistakes. And humans make decisions for the wrong reasons.
I know at the end of my life I must face my Maker and atone for my sins. That day does not scare me. He has seen the sacrifices made in my life for the good of others. And he has seen what has transpired with MM from day one, back when I was 12.
I believe there are two types of laws, Man's Law and God's Law. Man's Law is about papers and ownership. God's Law is about love. Accepting. Helping others, even at your own expense. In Man's Law I was married to one man. In God's Law I was married to another. I have hurt no one and I have endured much pain to help a man who is dying. And dying for protecting our country. And sadly, he did not carry a gun. He carried a Bible.
In some posts I have read here it almost seems as if the Bible is used as a weapon, and I find that incredibly sad. That is not what God wants. We are to help each other. Love one another.
There is another site that I post on, one where I can post freely about the heartbreak of caring for one who is endstage. One where I receive the support needed to face another day when it seems impossible. This journey is not about me. This journey is not about breaking something that is already broken. This journey is about a man who is dying and a woman who is willing to be there so that man does not die alone. The true honest love of two friends.
And if that makes any of you mad, perhaps you need to look inside yourselves and ask if you would be willing to step in my shoes and help someone when there is absolutely no reward for you at the end of journey.
That, to me, is the definition of a true Christian.
And with that I shall leave you all. May you all find true happiness and love.
Flood City
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"There is another site that I post on, one where I can post freely about the heartbreak of caring for one who is endstage. One where I receive the support needed to face another day when it seems impossible. This journey is not about me. This journey is not about breaking something that is already broken. This journey is about a man who is dying and a woman who is willing to be there so that man does not die alone. The true honest love of two friends.
And if that makes any of you mad, perhaps you need to look inside yourselves and ask if you would be willing to step in my shoes and help someone when there is absolutely no reward for you at the end of journey."
As someone who cared for her dying parents, when there was abosolutely no reward to me at the end of the journey, except the incredible loss of my parents---
you are so full of chit it makes my stomach hurl.
Carry on wayward girl, and keep talking about God's laws. Maybe in the end, you'll convince someone. But not me.
By the way, does this MM who is dying, have children?
My dad, was a war veteran, and suffered like all the Vietnam veterans from the affects of Agent Orange. But let me tell you what, had you come near my father after my mother died...well it wouldn't have been pretty.
Give this man back to the woman he is married to and the children they have bore together.
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One last post before I go permanently.
I have read many posts here. Some are amazingly supportive and I applaud those posters. Others are in attack mode and that is not good. People who come here have searched out a forum like this because they are hurting. They don't need to be slapped, too. No doubt they are slapping themselves.
I worked very hard at my 27 year marriage, and sacrificed much. In the end I realized I had sacrificed most of myself, too. And, so, when the opportunity arose I left the marriage. I spent much time alone with my kids on nothing, and I survived. And for the first time in a long time I smiled again.
I see so much of what happened in my M in the postings of continuous. He just was not there ...ever. And he is still not there for the girls. We have just learned to move on.
I used to think everything was black and white, too. But in reality it is not. We are all human. And humans make mistakes. And humans make decisions for the wrong reasons.
I know at the end of my life I must face my Maker and atone for my sins. That day does not scare me. He has seen the sacrifices made in my life for the good of others. And he has seen what has transpired with MM from day one, back when I was 12.
I believe there are two types of laws, Man's Law and God's Law. Man's Law is about papers and ownership. God's Law is about love. Accepting. Helping others, even at your own expense. In Man's Law I was married to one man. In God's Law I was married to another. I have hurt no one and I have endured much pain to help a man who is dying. And dying for protecting our country. And sadly, he did not carry a gun. He carried a Bible.
In some posts I have read here it almost seems as if the Bible is used as a weapon, and I find that incredibly sad. That is not what God wants. We are to help each other. Love one another.
There is another site that I post on, one where I can post freely about the heartbreak of caring for one who is endstage. One where I receive the support needed to face another day when it seems impossible. This journey is not about me. This journey is not about breaking something that is already broken. This journey is about a man who is dying and a woman who is willing to be there so that man does not die alone. The true honest love of two friends.
And if that makes any of you mad, perhaps you need to look inside yourselves and ask if you would be willing to step in my shoes and help someone when there is absolutely no reward for you at the end of journey.
That, to me, is the definition of a true Christian.
And with that I shall leave you all. May you all find true happiness and love.
Flood City Flood City, As much as you want us to believe so, your sitiuation is not special or unique in any way. Its the same typical predictable sad adulterous story. Repeated here thousands upon thousands of times over the 8+ years I've been reading here. And it will have the same typical predictable devistating results to ALL those involved, unfortunately. Only because the two participating in the selfish adultery INSIST in believing they're SPECIAL and above any moral code. A "We were meant to Be" mentality. Its very sad that you have placed YOUR needs and FEELINGS above that of marriage and family. Very sad indeed. God Bless, Jo
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The true honest love of two friends. There is no HONESTY in adultery. Its preverse to claim so. By defnition adultery is at its core a "DISHONEST" act. Prayers for you. Jo
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49% divorce rate
80% started by women
Those stats and posts like this is why, if my wife breaks her WORD, I will never, ever trust getting married again.
Forever, thick and thin, for better or worse.....those were just words. This whole marriage thing is one big card trick.
Read those stats again. Read this post again. We agrue that marriage is the very foundation of society and can't be available for same sex marriage. Oh really? . Our FAIRY TALE of marriage is what is so special in our mind. Blame whatever social programs, or societal progress (or regress) you wish. What we have today IS NOT that special anymore. It stopped being special when SACRIFICE became a dirty word.
I used to say I would always vote against gay marriage if given the opportunity. I don't say that anymore. Our vows contain NO LINES about what we expect to RECEIVE, just nice sounding "promises" of what we expect to GIVE. Its all words, really, words and pomp and circumstances. Another way of trying to present an IMAGE to society. But the very soul is gone. Its just not that special anymore.
And if your involved with someone who you have treated miserably and they are still around, trying, fighting, and ultimately improving ....................hold them tight, drop down on your knees, and thank God and THEM, because you have the last of a dying breed. ANd I envy you.
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FloodCity -
ALL adulterers falsely believe their adultery to be 'special'.
It's not.
Also, adulterers lie.
I don't believe what you claim to be true about the BS's.
Adulterers typically pretend that the marriages they're destroying were already 'dead', that the BS's are horrible, that the BS's won't let the adulterers get a divorce...
blah-blah-blah
You don't really believe we are so naive as to believe you do you? Most of us here have heard the same sort of lies from our own WS's. Your story is nothing new...
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This whole marriage thing is one big card trick. Gabagool, no it isn't. Marriage and family are the truth we can hang our hats on. Family is the one most important endeavor we can ever engage in. There is NOTHING more important than family. It is not a card trick. In relationship, whether it be marital, family or in service...is where we will find eternity. And you can take that to the bank. Gabagool, hang on. You'll find peace again. Just keep on being a family guy. You are needed there.
Last edited by JosieJones; 08/30/08 07:23 PM.
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In Man's Law I was married to one man. In God's Law I was married to another. Not only a sickening train of thought, but blasphemous as well. Don't drag God into your dirty adulterous delusions.
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He has seen the sacrifices made in my life for the good of others. And what, pray tell, might this sacrifice for the good of others be?
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Fascinating ....the manner in which Denial of personal Responsibility of one's own culpability manifests itself. The road to hell is paved with good intentions...
Last edited by SoulDragoN; 08/30/08 11:21 PM. Reason: was not trying to be rude
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You are so full of it. This is Marriage Builders. Not a place to put fourth what in your eyes you find is right by being M to one yet loving another.
If the OM loves you so much why wont he D his current W to be with you since shes only in it for money??? He proves it then he D's her. Oh I dont support you one bit.
Mans laws and Gods laws pfft. You dont abide by either of them. Many have sought out G-d to help heal themselves and there loved ones.And have faith that he will do right for them.
As for Cont post ... withdrawal is a hard process to go thru for some more so then others.
You are now D. Yet you continue to be in an A with OM who is M and they need to work out there issues. If you and him were meant to be then you two would have prevailed LONG before you both M another person.
Married 1996 4 wonderful children 16, 13 *OC*, 10, 7 FWW 30's FWH 30's My dday 1-2007 he came clean to me My story New beginings
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Edited by SoulDragoN (08/30/08 11:21 PM)
Edit Reason: was not trying to be rude So it just happens without any effort?
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****edit****
Last edited by Maverick_mb; 08/31/08 05:14 PM. Reason: personal attack
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Wow ...
There are no children in this marriage. If there were I would place the needs of the children ahead even of a dying man.
There is no divorce or moving out because he is dying. What would it prove? More bickering over money until he is dead? He will be long gone before the 2 years is over anyway.
She is married to him, the stuff is hers. I neither want nor need any of it. Stuff to her is important. Stuff is not important to me.
I am only here to help him during his last days. She won't. She is far too busy with her family, church, bowling, work, anything you can list to keep her away from helping him. If she wanted or loved him I would walk away. She has told me she does not want him, she only wants the money.
There is no reward at the end of this journey for me. I am not looking for one. I am merely easing the suffering of a dying man. One who I have cared about for most of my life. And I guess in many eyes here that makes me a bad person. Then so be it.
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Wow...You'd think you would be the most concerned with this man's eternal soul as he knocks at death's door...
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death. Revelation 21:8
God is very clear on adultery/sexual immorality...There is no wiggle room Flood City...
Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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Wow...You'd think you would be the most concerned with this man's eternal soul as he knocks at death's door...
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death. Revelation 21:8
God is very clear on adultery/sexual immorality...There is no wiggle room Flood City...
Mrs. W Thanks for keeping it real, Mrs. W.
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Wow...You'd think you would be the most concerned with this man's eternal soul as he knocks at death's door...
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death. Revelation 21:8
God is very clear on adultery/sexual immorality...There is no wiggle room Flood City...
Mrs. W Romans 8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, ..... Jesus is also clear - Everyone is accepted and welcome. Grace is grace! All will be judged according to their acts but the kingdom of God is open to EVERY one of us as we are ALL sinners.
If we are consumed with highlighting our spouses falling short, we will miss the divine mysteries of marriage and the lessons that it has to teach us. As long as a couple is married they continue to display “however imperfectly” the ongoing commitment between Christ and his church. Thus, simply “sticking it out” becomes vitally important. Just sticking it out is victory in and of itself and creates a certain glory. Sacred Marriage
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Wow ...
There are no children in this marriage. If there were I would place the needs of the children ahead even of a dying man.
There is no divorce or moving out because he is dying. What would it prove? More bickering over money until he is dead? He will be long gone before the 2 years is over anyway.
She is married to him, the stuff is hers. I neither want nor need any of it. Stuff to her is important. Stuff is not important to me.
I am only here to help him during his last days. She won't. She is far too busy with her family, church, bowling, work, anything you can list to keep her away from helping him. If she wanted or loved him I would walk away. She has told me she does not want him, she only wants the money.
There is no reward at the end of this journey for me. I am not looking for one. I am merely easing the suffering of a dying man. One who I have cared about for most of my life. And I guess in many eyes here that makes me a bad person. Then so be it. Adultery is adultery. Regardless if someone is dying, there is still no justification for participating in adultery. If one is looking for Sainthood, I would think there are hundreds if not thousands of causes in this world a person can volunteer where they don't have to participate in adultery to help their fellow human being(s). There's a saying I'm quite fond of when I hear an adulteror try and justify their adulterous actions: You can polish a turd until your arms fall off, but at the end of the day ITS STILL A TURD.
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I think this thread is a posterchild post (if I could make up such a thing right now) of what resentment will get you in life...
it will get you wayward.
Dr. Harley's rule of NOT sacrificing is the way to affair-proof your marriage; fall in love with your spouse, again and again, and not create a fog in your mind, to mislead you so far from your soul.
Gimble's quote...if you want to affair-proof your marriage, memorize it and pass it on:
"An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect."
Sacrifice creates resentment--we create, build and maintain it within ourselves...no one ASKED us to sacrifice--we weren't honest and said, "I'm giving up this so you can be happy; and if I don't get the exact response I want, I'll resent you"--so the others we sacrificed for didn't have the opportunity to say, "No way! Don't do it...whatever it is, I hurt from your resentment the most...no convenience or pain...and sacrifice does NOT make me feel loved...makes me feel bought, controlled and lied to."
Radical honesty prohibts sacrifice. See where this takes you? You become that which you abhorred before...and you can't even see it. Everything becomes upside down, entitlement, deserving, a comparison...and the destruction continues on and on--and the resentment blocks the reality view completely.
Equality and mutuality, radical honesty, follow the four rules of marriage, and make a boundary around yourself to not do that which you will resent...so you can have a marriage experienced in freedom, respect and two people who thrive.
God make us with inherent choice...we choose, not sacrifice, to have a relationship with him...those he calls to serve him only don't consider what they leave behind a sacrifice. It's a joy.
LA
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Wow...You'd think you would be the most concerned with this man's eternal soul as he knocks at death's door...
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death. Revelation 21:8
God is very clear on adultery/sexual immorality...There is no wiggle room Flood City...
Mrs. W Romans 8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, ..... Jesus is also clear - Everyone is accepted and welcome. Grace is grace! All will be judged according to their acts but the kingdom of God is open to EVERY one of us as we are ALL sinners. I would argue that those truly walking with Christ, especially those who have a terminal illness, would be laying themselves prostrate before the Lord REPENTING MoDaisy...Jesus preached REPENTANCE... "From that time on Jesus began to preach, Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near." Matthew 4:17 Jesus also said, "If you love me, you will obey what I command." John 14:15Jesus did not ever add to that "unless it's inconvenient for you"... Walking with or being in Christ means that you WANT to obey His commands because you love Him with all of your heart and mind. Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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Thanks for keeping it real, Mrs. W. LOL! You bet KIR, and thank you too...I am a great admirer of your posts!  Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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There's a saying I'm quite fond of when I hear an adulteror try and justify their adulterous actions:
You can polish a turd until your arms fall off, but at the end of the day ITS STILL A TURD. *sigh* John 8
1But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. 2At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. 3The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group 4and said to Jesus, "Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. 5In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?" 6They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.
But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. 7When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, "If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." 8Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.
9At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. 10Jesus straightened up and asked her, "Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?"
11"No one, sir," she said.
"Then neither do I condemn you," Jesus declared. "Go now and leave your life of sin." Floodcity: You can and have justified your actions. That's the way humans live with themselves when held under the microscope by all the other 'sinless'. CAST THE FIRST STONE:
o Pharisees brought a woman caught in adultery, saying Moses' law said to kill her by throwing stones at her: what do You say? Jesus answer: "...If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her."(John 8:7) And, the woman was not harmed. Don't ask my what it is about 'Christians' tossing rocks...when they are throwing them at themselves. Conquer the angry man by love.
Conquer the ill-natured man by goodness.
Conquer the miser with generosity.
Conquer the liar with truth.
The Dhammapada Immoral actions do not mutate into Moral actions through personal justification. They only exist through wrong choices. The essence remains unchanged, your point of view has shifted. Nothing more. ...you know in your heart...it's wrong.
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Just to level set some misinformed NEW members. Marriage Builders is NOT a Christian based site. Meaning, not all members are Christians.
Stay, read, learn.
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CAST THE FIRST STONE:
o Pharisees brought a woman caught in adultery, saying Moses' law said to kill her by throwing stones at her: what do You say? Jesus answer: "...If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her."(John 8:7) And, the woman was not harmed. Then this ... ... you know in your heart...it's wrong. 
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Jo...I know...  I know it's wrong for me. Floodcity would not have been here if she did not have something prickling the edge of her awareness. We all die alone. It is ok to walk away....even when it hurts. God or whatever each person's faith. will sort out the mess in the afterlife...till then...She is in this existence and must deal with what she can change. To choose the correct Action is not always the easiest Path. However, the harder you slam someone over the head with the obvious, the greater the resistance...Humans are such messy beings...  when we dig deep enough, not one is better than another.
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***edit***
9 out of 10 things wrong with this world is a direct result of people UNWILLING to put their needs behind someone elses.
Now if Dr. H meant UNCEASING, NEVERENDING, ALWAYS GIVING SACRIFICE was a sign of some psychological need....well, maybe he's got a point, unless youre the son of God.
If sacrifice creates resentment in others, is FAKE sacrifice NOT real. Sacrifice is based in unselfishness and giving. If you do it so you seem the martyr, it ain't sacrifice, its manipulation.
Last edited by Maverick_mb; 09/04/08 02:30 PM. Reason: personal attack
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#2117899 - 08/28/08 06:46 P floodcity Offline Junior Member Registered: 08/28/08 Posts: 5 I am a BS. My H has had multiple As, some produced children. I tried to be forgiving. I tried to take the high road. In the end I kicked his butt to the curb. *ouch* I am now the OW to a MM whose M was long ago over. His W and I know each other, she has a MM of her own. Apparently his wife doesn't give a rat's as*...so why should anyone else? And if that makes any of you mad, perhaps you need to look inside yourselves and ask if you would be willing to step in my shoes and help someone when there is absolutely no reward for you at the end of journey. Nope. Not willing. Run screaming in the opposite direction. If sacrifice creates resentment in others, is FAKE sacrifice NOT real. Sacrifice is based in unselfishness and giving. If you do it so you seem the martyr, it ain't sacrifice, its manipulation. Well said. She has told me she does not want him, she only wants the money. Hmmmmm *nice*... I am merely easing the suffering of a dying man. *sigh* Were it me ,[the dying man with no kids]...and my husband wanted nothing to do with me in my last days, only to pick over my corpse for goodies?....I'd let GOD do the judging. Empathy...compassion. Dead in this day and age? Tse-kung asked, 'Is there one word that can serve as a principle of conduct for life?' Confucius replied, 'It is the word 'shu' -- reciprocity. Do not impose on others what you yourself do not desire.'" Doctrine of the Mean 13.3 ... And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise." Luke 6:31, King James Wife doesn't want him. Man is dying. Other woman loves him. Crucify her...for what? She is not the Adulterer...HE is...by a sad twist of fate... Floodcity...you are divorced by now I take it?Humans...messy, messy creatures. Absolute Morality will forever elude us. There is a reason for that.
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I am a BS. My H has had multiple As, some produced children. I tried to be forgiving. I tried to take the high road. In the end I kicked his butt to the curb. Her past victimization does not in any way, shape or form give her the right to go and victimize others. Empathy and compassion indeed. I am now the OW to a MM whose M was long ago over. His W and I know each other, she has a MM of her own. Apparently his wife doesn't give a rat's as*...so why should anyone else? Riiiiight. The words of an active OW cannot be trusted, SoulDragoN. She is an INTERLOPER in this marriage. This man is NOT free to be with her. He is MARRIED. Justification and Rationalization. If her lips are moving she is lying. She has told me she does not want him, she only wants the money. EVEN IF THIS WERE TRUE (highly doubt it - words from an active OW and all)...It does NOT matter...The man is MARRIED...He belongs to ANOTHER until either DIVORCE or DEATH. I am merely easing the suffering of a dying man. Oh Puhlease...Helping a man bust open the gates of He!! is NOT something to be proud of...Sick, twisted and sad... Were it me ,[the dying man with no kids]...and my husband wanted nothing to do with me in my last days, only to pick over my corpse for goodies?....I'd let GOD do the judging. He will... Empathy...compassion. Dead in this day and age? I will reserve my empathy and compassion for the real victim in this situation...The BW...The BW who you can BET has a MUCH different story than this OW is telling... Man is dying.
Other woman loves him.
Crucify her...for what? Again, you cannot believe the words of an active OW!!! Nor those of an active WS...The man may very well not even be dying!!! He just doesn't wish to divorce BW, and he knows that a gullible OW will believe anything...sheesh... She is not the Adulterer...HE is...by a sad twist of fate... If you are looking for a name for her sin, it is called fornication...Again, this man she is with is NOT free to be hers...He is MARRIED to someone else...The BEST thing OW could do for this "dying" man would be to walk away from him...Tell him to reconcile with his wife and give him the opportunity to get right with God...If she were truly unselfish and altruistic and genuinely cared about him THAT is what she would do...I'll not hold my breath... Humans...messy, messy creatures. Absolute Morality will forever elude us. There is a reason for that. A proponent of moral relativity? I should have guessed...Ugh... As my mom used to say (and I wish I'd have listened all those years ago - but I get it NOW...phew)..."Times may change, but morals NEVER do!" Yes, there ARE moral absolutes in this world. Just because some people choose not to abide by them doesn't make them less true or absolute... Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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SoulDragoN quoted FloodCity in defense of her: I am a BS. My H has had multiple As, some produced children. I tried to be forgiving. I tried to take the high road. In the end I kicked his butt to the curb. Whats your point SoulDragonN? Do you think FloodCity should get a pass because her H was a Serial Adulterer and procreated outside the marriage making illegitimate children? I didn't become an OW and my H did the exact same thing. He also left me a little gift that resulted in stage 3 cervical cancer. So do you think I'm owed an adulterous affair of my own because I've been thru so much and was mistreated? What I find the MOST concerning about your posts SoulDragoN is you're spending your time here as a NEWBIE defending folks who STEAL from others. Why have you decided or find it necessary to assign yourself the thieves' champion??? Jo
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Crucify her...for what?
She is not the Adulterer...HE is...by a sad twist of fate...
Floodcity...you are divorced by now I take it?
Humans...messy, messy creatures. Absolute Morality will forever elude us. There is a reason for that. "Absolute morality" might elude YOU and the world's population of criminals, but it doesn't "elude" most thinking people. Our prisons are full of people with "flexible" morality, who can't judge right from wrong, and that is right where they belong. Having an affair with a married man is sin, no matter how you rationalize it. It is to climb into the pig pen and waller around like a pig. [my apologies to pigs for the insulting comparison] It doesn't matter if his wife condones it or even if she is jumping up and down, sin is sin and if flood city really cared about this man, she would leave him alone instead of helping him be an adulterer. That is no act of love, that is an act of gross selfishness at this married man's expense. When you "love" someone, you don't help them be BAD, you help them be GOOD. She is about as "loving" as the sicko who hands a gun to the suicidal person to "be nice." :RollieEyes: I will never understand why any thinking woman would waste her time on someone elses man. Why be a cockroach eating crumbs from some other woman's TABLE OF LIFE?  Why choose to be a cockroach? I don't get that.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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If you are looking for a name for her sin, it is called fornication...Again, this man she is with is NOT free to be hers...He is MARRIED to someone else...The BEST thing OW could do for this "dying" man would be to walk away from him...Tell him to reconcile with his wife and give him the opportunity to get right with God...If she were truly unselfish and altruistic and genuinely cared about him THAT is what she would do...I'll not hold my breath... You are correct. What I find the MOST concerning about your posts SoulDragoN is you're spending your time here as a NEWBIE defending folks who STEAL from others. Why have you decided or find it necessary to assign yourself the thieves' champion??? Am not defending her. Not from the start, and not now. Only following the path of her rationalizations...sorry if that isn't clear. "Absolute morality" might elude YOU and the world's population of criminals, but it doesn't "elude" most thinking people. Our prisons are full of people with "flexible" morality, who can't judge right from wrong, and that is right where they belong. No..it doesn't. As none is GOD on this existence...it will ELUDE all...and even those on this thread who are the most vehemently attacking this woman. Having an affair with a married man is sin, no matter how you rationalize it. It is to climb into the pig pen and waller around like a pig. [my apologies to pigs for the insulting comparison] It doesn't matter if his wife condones it or even if she is jumping up and down, sin is sin and if flood city really cared about this man, she would leave him alone instead of helping him be an adulterer. Correct...and if you read my post in it's entirety and the preceding ones as well, you will note I said the same thing. I will never understand why any thinking woman would waste her time on someone elses man. Why be a cockroach eating crumbs from some other woman's TABLE OF LIFE? Why choose to be a cockroach? I don't get that. People do the most damnable things each and every day...two wrongs don't make a right. What I find the MOST concerning about your posts SoulDragoN is you're spending your time here as a NEWBIE defending folks who STEAL from others. Why have you decided or find it necessary to assign yourself the thieves' champion??? Newbie...*shrug* been reading this forum for several years. Reading articles and applying the principles as best I can. I am not perfect. No one is. You did not understand my post. I do NOT condone her actions [ I am not God so who gives a crap what I think...] I followed her train of rationalizations. When she wants to add more, IF she comes back here after getting run off and demonized...it would be better to hear her out, and help her to GET OUT of that situation. Instead...she came here KNOWING deep down that this was a BS position...and was further punched and kicked while she was down...*nice* Romans 8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, .....
Jesus is also clear - Everyone is accepted and welcome. Grace is grace! All will be judged according to their acts but the kingdom of God is open to EVERY one of us as we are ALL sinners. SHOOT EM ALL, LET GOD SORT EM OUT. ....in the mean time...it would behoove those that have strayed and have learned from that experience to gently LEAD another walking down that path to a better path. Is it really that hard? If you are looking for a name for her sin, it is called fornication... Welcome to the American way of life. EVERYBODY is fornicating with anyone and anything over there. Heck...people over there *********edit*********!!!!!...???? Who am I to judge? Strange sick world...but it seems to be all the rage. That is not only immoral but downright disgusting. just an aside to how screwed up the world isA proponent of moral relativity? I should have guessed...Ugh... Dead wrong on that. YOU strayed in your marriage. I "strayed" in mine...I left HIM long before due to Abuse...marriage was only on paper...he had his honey ..and I later got mine. *oh well* Absolutely WRONG. Who is better? YOU / ME/ FLOODCITY? NEITHER....we were ALL FOS justifying our actions. In the end we ALL pay...be it in H*ll or the living one we create in our current existence. Is it possible that YOU are NOT wrong, and I am NOT Right...somewhere in the middle someone needs to see the light... Our prisons are full of people with "flexible" morality, who can't judge right from wrong, and that is right where they belong. Nahhh...they deserve to be DEAD. Eye for an EYE...tooth for a tooth. God can sort the quagmire out after the fact. HE/SHE who is without SIN tossing rocks...is living in a GLASS HOUSE
Last edited by JustUss; 09/05/08 01:41 PM. Reason: tos nasty
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I know I posted I was not coming back, but perhaps there are lessons to be learned here ....
Does "I hate you." "I wish you were dead." and "Why don't you die already?" coming from her to him qualify as she does not want him? How about "I don't love you, I haven't loved you for a long time." How about a punch to the back of the head near the location of a tumor? Is that the words and actions of someone who loves their husband?
I heard the words but did not see the action. I also asked his best friend, his brother, a person I know that did work for them that did not know there is any connection between the two of us. All came back with the same story. If the story had been different I would have walked away. If they had children I would have walked away. They have none.
Many times I have told him he needs to go to counseling, work on his marriage, work to fix it. She is not interested in that. She wants the money. That is fine, it is hers. I have no interest in it.
So I love this man. There is no sex, there is no financial benefit to me, there is nothing expected by me. Why is it so wrong to help him? Would God want me to just leave him there alone with no one to take him to his medical appointments? No one to just sit and listen to him? No one to hold him when he cries because the pain is so intense he can't stand it?
Maybe some will think that is wrong, but I was taught to help those who were in need. I am not looking for crumbs from anyone's table. There is no need for that.
I am not looking to be a martyr. There is no gain in that. There is no gain in any of this for me. No, that would be a lie. I will know that at the end of his life I was there for him. Life didn't end up the way either of us wanted to, but it it what it is.
I believe there is a reason everything happens in life. There is a reason we met in the first place, one why we stumbled upon each other again. And still another why he is so ill.
I am not afraid to meet my maker at the end of my life. I was raised that God sees what you do, the good and the bad. And I do not fear a life review at all.
I guess each person has to decide for themselves how to live their life.
But, I am reading. Some of the posts have made me stop and think. Obviously there are many wonderful posters here who are passionate about helping people save marriages. Sadly, some just cannot be saved. It takes two to make a marriage work. I tried to make mine work. He tried to make his work. Neither my xH nor his W are interested in repairing or rebuilding.
Those who are attacking, that is ok, too. You are passionate about your beliefs, and that comes through. If your thoughts do not match mine in this situation, perhaps they match someone else or someone who is reading is helped by them. And perhaps in a different situation I might agree with you on some points, also.
FloodCity
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"Absolute morality" might elude YOU and the world's population of criminals, but it doesn't "elude" most thinking people. Our prisons are full of people with "flexible" morality, who can't judge right from wrong, and that is right where they belong. No..it doesn't. As none is GOD on this existence...it will ELUDE all...and even those on this thread who are the most vehemently attacking this woman. But you cannot speak for ALL, you can only speak for yourself. Are you admitting that you cannot DISCERN right from wrong? If you do not have the intelligence to discern right from wrong we need to know this so we can understand your mindset and your limitations. EVERYBODY is fornicating with anyone and anything over there. Heck...people over there are using the Butts as the new sexual organ!!!!!...???? Who am I to judge? Strange sick world...but it seems to be all the rage. That is not only immoral but downright disgusting. just an aside to how screwed up the world is hmmmm but didn't you just say above that you are NOT GOD and therefore not qualified to judge right from wrong? People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones, blah, blah, blah, blah..? Did you forget your own "principles" in the very same post? Is it possible that YOU are NOT wrong, and I am NOT Right...somewhere in the middle someone needs to see the light... Is that right? Or is that wrong? I am sooo confused!! Oh wait, we know dis trick in Texas! "if ya can't dazzle em with brilliance, befuddle em with bullsh**!" 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Floodcity: Nice to hear back from you. hmmmm but didn't you just say above that you are NOT GOD and therefore not qualified to judge right from wrong? People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones, blah, blah, blah, blah..? Did you forget your own "principles" in the very same post? ....so you admit ****edit******? Whatever floats yer boat....  Did you forget your own "principles" in the very same post? Nope. Is that right? Or is that wrong? I am sooo confused!! Oh wait, we know dis trick in Texas! "if ya can't dazzle em with brilliance, befuddle em with bullsh**!" ....sure must flush out some interesting specimens...but you would know more about that... As such...any "claims" to knowledge of Absolute Morality....are entirely suspect. ...prove me wrong. 
Last edited by JustUss; 09/05/08 01:42 PM. Reason: nasty
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As such...any "claims" to knowledge of Absolute Morality....are entirely suspect. ...prove me wrong. Thanks for being so honest about your inability to discern right from wrong; I will keep your handicap in mind when reading your posts. I hope in the future, though, you will remember your own professed limitations when casting judgment on posters here, lest you end up with all that YUCKY egg on your face. You might want to wipe that off before it dries, dear. 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Dragon, do you have low IQ? Your reading comprehension is horrid, not to mention you are childishly vulgar.
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keepitreal, I think the girl is just a little cranky with all that egg on her face. Maybe she needs some bacon to go with those eggs? 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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keepitreal, I think the girl is just a little cranky with all that egg on her face. Maybe she needs some bacon to go with those eggs? I bet you're right!
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not to mention you are childishly vulgar. LOL....yeah... guiltyReading comprehension...??? That is not my problem. You TWO OWN that one....hands down. Since you're all so 'proud' of yourselves, jiggling about with your new found IQ's....Give ABSOLUTE MORALITY a spin....YOUR definitions would be most "illuminating"... Try NOT to choke yourselves in relativity or anything... 
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How about we focus on the subject of HYPOCRISY? A much more appropriate subject after reading your posts, dear. Listen up Snapdragon, it's not a good idea to contradict yourself in the SAME POST because even a half wit Texan with big hair can see it. If you are a hypocrite, it is much more clever to contradict yourself in OTHER POSTS so it won't be so noticable. Don't advertise your hypocrisy or people will snicker at you! For example, you said: "EVERYBODY is fornicating with anyone and anything over there. Heck...people over there are using the Butts as the new sexual organ!!!!!...???? Who am I to judge? Strange sick world...but it seems to be all the rage. That is not only immoral but downright disgusting. just an aside to how screwed up the world is" But you said earlier that: "Absolute Morality will forever elude us." And here you say something is "immoral" after you already told us that morality "will forever elude" you! Then you condemn judging and go onto make a judgment in the VERY NEXT SENTENCE. Some peoples notice DAT!  [and they giggle ] But it gets even more amusing when you end that very post, where you did judge and you did throw stones with: "HE/SHE who is without SIN tossing rocks...is living in a GLASS HOUSE" OOPS!! :teef: OH MY! My suggestion would be to be a little more SUBTLE if you are going to hoist yourself on your own petard! Hope this helps......
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Oh wait, please forgive me! Perhaps I should I have clarified something FIRST before I went and shot off my big ole Texas MOUTH: HE/SHE who is without SIN tossing rocks...is living in a GLASS HOUSE Perhaps you ARE without sin which is why you feel entitled to CAST STONES? Is that the case, Snappy?
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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...soooo...you DO...**** EDIT *****...that is what you have clarified...nothing more.
Last edited by Choctaw; 09/05/08 02:07 PM. Reason: TOS Violation - Vulgar Language
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...soooo...you DO... **** EDIT **** ...that is what you have clarified...nothing more. Real mature..."butt humor"...What are you, 13? Personally, I might have gained a shard of respect for you if you would just have admitted and owned the very clearly pointed out contradictions in your posts... Oh well, I guess we got to see the real you...classy... Mrs. W
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Oh and "Saint Flood"...No one here CARES!!!!!! There is NOTHING that you can say or do that will change that ADULTERY IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE...Sheesh!
Let's try this in a simpler manner...
It will not matter if you do it in a box...
It will not matter if you do it wearing socks...
Even if you are eating lox...
We just don't really care ma'am...
Adultery is a great big sham...
I must go now and eat some green eggs and ham...
Mrs. W Sam I am...
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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This journey is about a man who is dying and a woman who is willing to be there so that man does not die alone. Everybody dies alone. -ol' 2long
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Personally, I might have gained a shard of respect for you if you would just have admitted and owned the very clearly pointed out contradictions in your posts... LOL...could care less. You've missed the point. You DO recognize a RED HERRING or not? ....IS it an Absolute?....or dependent on circumstances/ preferences /cultural background/ religion of the day? THAT is the BUTT of the point... Chew on that thought for a bit. I'll just wait for the SAINTS to come stomping through offering more on ABSOLUTES and what not...LOL...some here...really should not be tossing rocks...don't you think?
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"Does "I hate you." "I wish you were dead." and "Why don't you die already?" coming from her to him qualify as she does not want him? How about "I don't love you, I haven't loved you for a long time." How about a punch to the back of the head near the location of a tumor? Is that the words and actions of someone who loves their husband?"
So IF what you are saying is even true (adulterers LIE - let's not forget that folks), then why not report the abuse?
IF he is being abused then he certainly has the right to seek assistance, get a restraining order, divorce her, etc.
IF he really was being abuse then why wouldn't his relatives, friends, doctor, etc. step up to help him?
It's still not a valid excuse for you getting involved with him.
My WXH got abusive with me.
I got a restraining order to make him stay away from me.
I did NOT develop an inappropriate relationship with an OP using the abuse as an excuse.
Adultery is not exactly a recommended treatment for abuse.
Adulterers lie.
My WXH made up a lie that he had cancer and that the OW was the only one who supposedly cared about him...
It was all a lie.
(and now the OW is trying to redeem her reputation by saying she only got involved with him because she felt sorry for him because he said he had cancer... wonder if she offered her adulterous services to all the cancer patients in the area hospices too?)
Adulteyr is also not a recommended treatment for terminal illness.
Adulterers lie.
They claim the marriages they're messing with are 'dead', the BS's are horrible and/or they know and don't care...
Adulterers lie.
Your story sounds incredible even if the fact that adulterers lie is totally ignored. It's simply amazing IMHO that anybody here believes your claims.
Apparently you believe you've come up with a watertight excuse for adultery, right?
Nope - even IF what you claim is true it's still not justified.
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Personally, I might have gained a shard of respect for you if you would just have admitted and owned the very clearly pointed out contradictions in your posts... LOL...could care less. You've missed the point. You DO recognize a RED HERRING or not? ....IS it an Absolute?....or dependent on circumstances/ preferences /cultural background/ religion of the day? THAT is the BUTT of the point... Chew on that thought for a bit. I'll just wait for the SAINTS to come stomping through offering more on ABSOLUTES and what not...LOL...some here...really should not be tossing rocks...don't you think? Why don't you go find the wayward forum? With your rationalizations, your obviously unhealthy obsession with butts, and your fear of those who can discern right from wrong, you would fit right in.
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Oh and "Saint Flood"...No one here CARES!!!!!! There is NOTHING that you can say or do that will change that ADULTERY IS ABSOLUTELY WRONG UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE...Sheesh!
Let's try this in a simpler manner...
It will not matter if you do it in a box...
It will not matter if you do it wearing socks...
Even if you are eating lox...
We just don't really care ma'am...
Adultery is a great big sham...
I must go now and eat some green eggs and ham...
Mrs. W Sam I am... I like it!
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Enough! This thread is LOCKED.
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