What difference does it make if I buy it? Isn't it more effective if HE buys it?

And, to answer your question....YES! I totally agree. The only part of MB that confuses me is the snooping part. I understand that it's necessary, it just feels wrong.

IMO, if you "bought" it, if you fully accepted that the A is an addiction and that it affects your H's thought process (fog), your mindset regarding contact would be different...you would know that you must snoop in order to protect yourself and your family, the same way that you would if your H was addicted to crack.

If you fully buy into the addiction theory, your mindset would be: While there is any contact your H is either still involved in the EA...or he is still being triggered daily by knowing she is close by which makes him basically powerless to the fog he is still under(as evidenced IMO by the insensitive things he has said and done).

My fear for you, Fiori, is that unless you make a boundary for yourself and make it clear (without lovebusting) that NC must happen...that your H will continue dragging his heels. And further I think if you fully believed that he is addicted to the way OW makes him feel, you would realize that he likely won't make a huge effort to leave his job.

My fear for you is, even if he is not still involved in the A, if he continues at his job much longer that you two will slowly love-bust and whittle your love and respect for each other away and in the meantime, your emotional well-being continues to take a beating.

I will keep my fingers crossed that things change soon and you are able to finally experience the fruits of Recovery that you deserve.

Take care.

Quick question....
If or when I call OW names like dumpy, schemer, slut...and a host of others, is this considered an LB? Or, is this particular thought process exempt from this?

I can do alot of things to help heal my marriage, but I cannot stop this. To this, I am addicted. Stupid, stupid man.

I agree completely with you on this! Is there anything that is open and honest about snooping?

No, it's not honest or open. And, it goes against everything in my person to do it. However, I would not have to if I was not compromised by my husband. Today I was cleaning out his sock drawer. My heart was racing as I got to the bottom of the drawer. I was so AFRAID that I would find some little momento or note that he 'forgot' about. I just wish he'd try harder to 'remember' and remove this things from my house and my life.

Fiori,
A while back I came across my H's old cell phone and decided to read his old text messages. All it did was make me feel horrible. They were old messages from when we were separated. At that point I told my H that if he had anything else like that that I might find to get rid of it. Fortunately that and his old calander were all I ever found.

Have you asked your H to get rid of anything that has anything to with OW?

Yes, several times. But, keep in mind, I don't really think there is anything here. He's not that dumb. Well, maybe he is...
In the very beginning I found a card she gave him that he stashed in our 'family important documents' case. Whew...I was irrate. That's gone. Then, there was the sweet collection of love notes that she gave to him the day after d-day. She was 'saving' them for a special occassion so decided to give them to him then.

Then, a few months ago there was the sweet ornament she gave him for Christmas. Hmmmm....I still wonder what came along with that! That was stashed in his trunk. He swears he had NO IDEA it was there and it meant nothing to him so he simply forgot about it. My H has very selective memory. Most recently it was teh check marks on his daytimer. This just occurred this weekend. Sunday was a crappy day for us after he midlead me on where he'd be running. Apparently I jumped the gun on that one and need to cut him slack because he called when he got there and let me know he changed venues. So, ok. But, that night he transferred the info from my calendar to his. That's the shocking part --- it was just a couple of days ago!!! Too fresh for me. He swears it was for my benefit. Last night I asked that if he had any future beneficial plans to put them on the family calendar and let me know before I find out by accident.

So, now I either believe him or wait for the next offense. Please, please pray he gets a new job soon. I fear I will lose my mind if he continues to work there. You'd think the piece of crap OW would scurry back under her rock and get a new job herself. See, she's still a selfish nothing. Oooh, there's that anger again. I really need for her to disappear.

I think tonight I'll have H read this thread so he gets some insight as to what I think and how others respond. I think he'll do it, but not sure.

One more time I ask this question...

Is calling OW names and wishing her to evaporate an LB?

This is what makes me think you don't understand or buy the ADDICTION CONCEPT, Fiori.

You would know that this is UNHELPFUL.

What do you think that this would ACCOMPLISH to help your marriage?

I am not sure if it a LB, but I would think yes.

Look at it this way, do you have a family member that is trash and you know it and you can say anything you want about them, but as soon as someone else does you jump to defend the person that you know is trash?

So your WH may think all the same things you do about OW, but then you say them and he feels defensive (even if he doesn't tell you). So basically you calling OW names may leave your H feeling protective of OW and viewing you as spiteful. I don't think that is what you want. So vent and call OW anything you want to your IC or best friend, but don't do it in front of your WH.

This is EXACTLY what happens.

Another indication of not understanding the AFFAIR ADDICTION.

IF he continues to be wayward, having him to read this will do NOTHING.

My WH said that the ENTIRE book, SURVIVING AN AFFAIR, did not "apply" to him. :RollieEyes:

This is about YOU, Fiori.

YOU taking charge of YOURSELF..not having your husband to do anything.

YOU CAN ONLY HAVE CONTROL OVER YOURSELF.

Understand?

YOUR JOB..is PLAN A.

Ok! I see what you mean. I'm not trying to educate him by having him read this...I just thought he would gain some perspective.

As of two days ago I have not called her any names. I will refrain from this day forward no matter how hard it will be.

Ok, here it goes...
H has EA. H continually lies about the end of EA. H finally retreats but I still have my doubts. But, in the interest of preserving my marriage and the love I have for him, H gets a free pass to simply be himself and I June Cleaver him up one side and down the other with a smile masking my disappointment and anger? This is how it works?

I know I sound very sarcastic, but maybe I feel that way. This is angering. He did this to me!!! I realize the intent is that if I provide him with a loving all encompassing environment than the OW will not be necessary. REALLY, I DO GET THAT!! I just don't like it.

But, what happens if I find out something and it makes me sad or mad? I'm not allowed to bring it up? I'm not allowed to discuss it? Or can I but sweetly? Very confusing and it makes me feel like a fool.

Have you read Surviving an Affair?

I'm sorry. I don't know your whole story. Has he written a NC LETTER? This is ESSENTIAL.

NO. This is NOT the way that it works..is why I asked you if you've read SURVIVING AN AFFAIR.

PLAN A involves NEGOTIATING the END OF THE AFFAIR as well as meeting his EMOTIONAL NEEDS. You have to do BOTH. Negotiation involves requesting the NC LETTER and PROOF to you that he has ended it by taking EXTRAORDINARY PRECAUTIONS to never see or communicate with her EVER again in his life. If he still works ANYWHERE near her he has not meet a CRUCIAL CONDITION of ending his affair. ANY CONTACT WHATSOEVER..starts the process all over again..of WITHDRAWAL..which lasts 3 to 6 months..which is necessary BEFORE REAL RECOVERY can begin...

THE BIGGEST MISTAKE that I made and UTTERLY REGRET to this day is ENABLING my HUSBAND'S AFFAIR. As long as I ENABLED it, he got CLOSER and CLOSER to her, feeling more and more COMFORTABLE with what he was doing.

The ENABLEMENT came from my fear of facing the TRUTH of it all...the truth that he had gone and given his heart away to another woman.

But once I FACED THE TRUTH, I began to FIGHT for HIM.

IMO, you can't really FIGHT this until you FACE THE TRUTH and do what YOU can do to FIGHT THE AFFAIR.

If I understand correctly, the "open and honest" applies to a marriage where the WS is no longer wayward... in thinking or otherwise. Waywards lie. The only way to stop an active affair (and it IS still active if there is ANY contact) is with exposure. How will you know if there is contact if you don't snoop? Trust your WS to tell you the truth?

A truly repentent wayward, will bend over backwards to make his/her life an open book. They become a (F)WS and the need for "snooping" goes away, after a period of time. But as long as there is contact, all bets are off.

Not snooping is equivalent to burying your head in the sand and "hoping" that it all turns out well. :RollieEyes: