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Well I may extend then for a bit more if I can handle it. I'll see how it goes.

Should I be working out all the details of my Plan B while I'm in Plan A or just wait til I hit that moment when I can't stand it any longer. I just didn't want to get caught off guard.

I kinda figure the normal things to cover in the B are visitation and financial anything else that I should consider so I can stay dark? I have not filed anything legal as he has still somewhat been meeting the financial needs. He got a demotion during all this since his performance dropped, of course he blamed me for not being able to pay the bills. If you can think of anything besides visitation and financial let me know.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
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It's good to have the PB details worked out... but it's more important to be prepared to be an AWESOME WIFE and a WONDERFUL, CONFIDENT YOU and a GREAT PLAN-A-er by the next time you interact with him.

What do you think of sending him emails or texting him with Admirations?


me - 47 tired
H - 39 cool
married 2001
DS 8a think
DS 8b :crosseyedcrazy:
(Why is DS7b now a blockhead???)
(Ack! Now he's not even a blockhead, just a word! That's no fun!)
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By all means extend Plan A if you're up for it. You want him to have the most positive image of you possible, and you want to do it long enough that he believes the improvements are permanent and not just a smokescreen to trick him into coming back.

OTOH *don't* stay in Plan A when your love for him begins to fade, and don't stay in Plan A forever, letting him cake-eat. With you guys living apart and interacting so infrequently, I'd say to try for about a month IF you can stand it.

When you go to Plan B, you must be prepared to go TOTALLY dark. A bad Plan B is about the worst thing you can do. For Plan B you'll want to draft your letter, post it here, revise until you're happy with it. You'll need a mediator that understands their role is to filter out all the emotions and relay only pertinent facts between the two of you. You'll need to arrange finances and a visitation schedule. Hopefully pickup/dropoff will be at someone else's home. Your daughter is old enough to have a key and be responsible but you don't want to put her in the position of telling Dad no, he can't come in.

Disclaimer: I've never done Plan B but I've read a lot of posts from those who have done them well and those who have done them poorly.

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So funny I used to do all these things. Leave cards, send him texts, call him and tell him he's the only one for me. Thank him for things.
But late last year through just before I found out I took in 3 foster kids and with my 2 kids and all there emotional issues, i think he took a back seat just a bit and that's when he started really hook in I'm guessing with girl at the office. It was only 6 months but I guess 6 months too much.

I can send him admiration, do you think it will be odd? We haven't said much to each other in the last 5 months.

For conversational purposes I did however give him an invitation to view the family website I have been building in my spare time. He said it was very nice and he can't wait to see it finished. I guess I'm just nervous he may either 1 think I'm up to something, or 2 weak or just plain stupid or reject it.

He's made statements to others not verbatim but kinda hinting around that I'm weak and stupid and when he revealed he kept telling my D17 and I that she is so strong and she loves me so much she is willing to support what ever decision I make. He's just always viewed my grace and kindness to him and to others as weak, stupid and naive. I'm tired of him viewing me this way. A week ago my daughter 17 says I don't know dad mom is just trying to live her life and move forward and he says how is she going to move forward when I pay for everything? Although he never outright said to me your stupid, many times I would say to my H, ya know I'm not stupid I happen to be intelligent.

He tells daughter I am annoying but I have no clue what he is talking about. I have many friends and many friendships that are 15 to 20 years or more. He has none really. He at times almost seems like he has attachment issues(stuff I learned through fostering). He in general is a huge pessimist. I am an Optimist. He thinks most people should be reamed and I think maybe they should have grace or be forgiven. He thinks I am naive because of my views.

Anyways I have no problem at all giving him admiration's I always enjoyed doing that and planning things and leaving cards in the car at night. I guess just nervous he may read in to it.

But the answer to your question is basically yes I can do that. Just don't want it to be corny I guess.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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I can send him admiration, do you think it will be odd? We haven't said much to each other in the last 5 months.

yeah he'll think its a bit odd the first couple of times, but will get used to it fast. When I was struggling to find things to thank or apprieciate about him, Neak suggested I look to past events, as waywards dont notice much whether the Ad is historical or current. I sat down one night and wrote a list and on the days I could'nt find anything new, I took something off the history list.

As far as conversation, it depends on what he wants out of a C. Even though C is #4 for Flick, he hates waffling. I ahve to make my point in 3 sentances or less. Anyone who glances at my thread will know how hard this is for me laugh Some advice that was goven to me was slightly raise my pitch/tone, agree alot, slightly widen my eyes and keep a tiny little smile arouind the edges of my lips. This looks kind of adoring/amzed/wonderment...or so I was told. I practised in the mirror a few times, and I still reckon I look kinda moronic, LOL. Maybe just focus and concentrate on what he's saying and nod and u-huh a bit.

Whether or not he thinks your stupid is irrelevant, and thinking his thoughts for him is a DJ.
What he reads into your actions is also irrelevant. Just do it.


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Ok I did it. I know I move fast. smile Just sent an email to H, updating him on bills and Halloween costumes etc. At the end of the email i said, "By the way, I know it's been financially hard lately for everyone, just wanted to thank you for all you have provided for us financially so far. You always took great care of us that way and worked very hard. Just wanted to say thank you."

We have no legal separation agreement just been relying on him to put the money in and he has although not as much as what is needed but I think if I file I'll actually get less and have to move and the kids do not want to move.

So I need to create a list tonight gonna work on that. Thanks again everyone I really really appreciate you stopping in and helping me. hug
I know I ask a lot of questions, I'm one of those funny ones who thinks there are no stupid questions. But really all the help and tips I get I will take. I am willing to work hard on myself and put into practice all you give me if I can.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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In all probability you will need Plan B. I figure you've got maybe 2 weeks of strong Plan A left - perhaps longer, but please don't delay Plan B to the point where you'd sooner spit on WH than reconcile with him.

I think you should begin to prepare Plan B - just don't launch.
Plan B , my suggestions

Plan B can be very traumatic & painful for the WH around the holiday period .... and remember - this needs to be painful for WH if it's going to be an effective Plan B.

The better your Plan A is - the more pain you inflict with Plan B - so spread the sweetness on thick.


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I am going to look at your Plan B suggestions. Going to start writing towards the PBL.

I am hoping to make it 3-4 weeks. Halloween I think would be the final for me, because I know my H and he will most definitely eat and entire cake. Plus he wants to go out with the kids that night.

I know the holidays are going to be hard for all of us but I'm ready and I know I can do this. I cut him off 90% for the last 5 months so I can do it again. It was hard but now I know I can do it. My 19 year anniversary is Dec 9th. SOOOO not looking forward to going through that.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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I;ve been thinking about C, and what sort of things you could say to break the ice, or fill in the gaps when your not listening to him. A suggestion often given on MB is treat the WS like you have just met them, or just dating. I have loads of stuff filed on my computer, but I won't send it all wink This is one I used while we were in rarotonga and as like most people he likes talking about himself, it seemed to be recieved well.
I was very motivated to do my best plan A and I can see that in you. I think its great the way you are willing to push yourself for this. I moaned and b*tched my way thru for ages.

Quote
10 Creative Questions To Break The Ice And Get Them Talking
1. If money were no object, what kind of car would you drive?
Very nearly everyone drives... and very nearly everyone has thought about what their "dream car" would be. This question lets you find out a little bit about them (what kind of car they like) and gets them talking. You can continue by asking why, or possibly going to what kind of car they would never buy.

Alternatives: Almost anything works here, just start with "If money were no object, what kind of blank would you get?"

2. What's the strangest thing you've seen?
Here's a chance to get them talking and laughing... and getting someone laughing is an easy way to lower their walls. This question works particularly well if you have a truly bizarre story of your own to tell.

Alternatives: Replace strangest with any other - est... it could be biggest, loudest, etc.

3. What's the best restaurant you've ever been to?
This is a good way to find out what kind of food they like, if you're thinking about asking them out at some point. It also might give you an idea of a good place to eat, whether or not it's with the person you're talking to at the moment.

Alternatives: You can substitute other things for restaurant, but most things have less general appeal, and the ones that don't are usually asked all the time. This is one where if you want to change it, you'll have to base it on the particular person you're talking to at the moment.

4. Where is the most exotic place you've ever been?
This is a chance for them to open up and tell a story... and that lowers their walls. If you've been to the same place, you've got huge bonus points... shared experiences are the fastest way to get closer to someone.

Alternatives: Most exotic can be replaced with farthest, most dangerous, etc.

5. What is the biggest event, by number of people, that you have seen in person?
Another chance for them to tell a story, and another chance for you to have similar experiences. One warning, though... don't ask questions like this and always have a bigger, better story to tell... even if you really do, it will make them feel small.

Alternatives: Replace biggest with something like most expensive.

6. What is the dumbest thing you've ever seen someone do?
People almost invariably like to tell stories aboutthe dumb things they've seen, particularly when it was someone else that did it. If you're really lucky, the person might tell you about the dumbest thing they have done... you can lead the conversation in this direction by telling them the dumbest thing you've done after they tell their story about someone else.

Alternatives: Really you can replace dumbest with nearly anything... nicest, weirdest, most spectacular, most dangerous, etc. Very little gets someone to really go off like dumbest, though.

7. What is the most expensive single item you've ever bought?
You might want to add words to exclude houses and cars, it's up to you... this question gives you an idea of what the person thinks is worth paying extra for, what is important to them. That can be amazingly valuable both to continue the conversation right then, and in any future times you meet.

Alternatives: What purchase did you regret the most is a related question that can be interesting... but it may bring up bad memories, and that's not really what you want when you're breaking the ice. You might go for the most fun purchase.

8. What is worst tasting thing you've ever eaten?
This is another thing that people usually remember quite clearly and don't mind sharing. It can even be another shared experience, if you've eaten the same thing... particularly if you also didn't like it.

Alternatives: Most delicious, hottest, most sour... any of the major factors in taste can be used.

9. What is the most vivid/realistic dream you've ever had?
This is one that can also tell you a lot, but it's also more dangerous than most on this list... not everyone is comfortable sharing their dreams If they are, though, this can get you past a lot of walls they might have, moving you pretty much straight to the "friends" level of relationship (and not in the bad way, for those seeking romantic relationships).

Alternatives: You could also ask what movie (or movie character) they most identified with... it's basically probing for a deeper opening up. If you get it, great... if you don't, they may push you farther away than when you started.

10. If you could make all of one kind of thing go away, what would it be?
What would you make go away? It can make you think of a lot of things, and things can come up and be laughed about (think mullets)... this question is very open-ended. If you get together more in the future, it can even be something that you bring up regularly, on the spur of the moment... "Okay, THAT is what I would get rid of".

Alternatives: You can do the positive (and more common) side - If you could only have one kind of blank, what would it be?

Ten examples, with alternatives... there are more than twenty questions listed above that you can use to get someone to open up and start talking. And, since they are unusual, they will make that person far more likely to remember you. After all, how many people have you told the worst food you've eaten?
Being remarkable, in the dictionary sense of being worthy of being talked about, is just about the best thing way to establish a new relationship, whether it's business, friendship, or romantic. It also helps spread your "network" as they tell the people they know about the interesting conversation they had the other day... if you happen to meet those people, they will already know who you are, which means the ice is already half-broken right from the start.
By the way, the worst food I've ever had, that I can remember, is beer cheese. Yes, I should have known... I tasted it anyway, and it was just as bad as it sounds. Maybe worse.


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Funny thing was told to me tonight I have to share. So DD17 says that her and my son 9 talked to Dad tonight on the phone.

She asks him what he was doing he says laundry and that he is tired of doing laundry. YESSSSS!

I know it sounds probably silly, but for me it wasn't. I have been a stay at home wife and mom our entire relationship straight out of high school. So I know that one of his highest needs was domestic. He literally cannot rest in an messy home so I made sure everyday that the house was spotless and all his laundry and things were done. Even including his clothes shopping. I had dinner the minute he walked in the door and lunches packed everyday and packed his vitamin case weekly.

Doing the domestic thing for me was a way to be able to give because I didn't work outside the home so I took seriously my domestic and parenting duties. I felt at times that no one cared or even noticed but I loved giving in that way to my family.

Such sweet payback to hear him say that he tired of doing laundry, guess maybe the OW isn't meeting those needs?? I sure hope so because he won't last too long with that. He'll start to get really irritated if she is not cleaning up or doing domestic stuff. Well at least that's how he was here.

Anyways, good stuff, gonna sleep even better tonight... after my celebration dance dance2


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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Well bummer he just told DD17 that it's not a good idea for him to sleep on the couch. I think OW is whispering in his ear.

He sounded so very surprised at the offer when DD17 mentioned it to him.

Trying not to be bummed but I guess it's good that I at least put the offer out there. DD17 is Plan A'ing by trying to talk to dad nightly and getting him to come out to visit.

The kids were upset for a while and did not want to talk to him but someone posted on here that OW hate when they spend family time so I told DD17 that. So now she's on a mission. Funny stuff. Can't believe she's so excited about this. Usually nothing excites her and she pushed me to just leave her dad and divorce him.
She thinks it may be a chance but I am mentioning to her that there are no guarantees, but that at least we know we tried tofight for the family even if he doesn't.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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Well bummer he just told DD17 that it's not a good idea for him to sleep on the couch. I think OW is whispering in his ear.

I will tell you about when Flick did something similar.

Lil


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Originally Posted by Trying2live
Trying not to be bummed but I guess it's good that I at least put the offer out there.

He will run so hot and cold it will make your head spin. Whatever you do, DON'T gauge the impact of your actions by his responses. DON'T give what he says much weight at all. Just keep your Plan A close and stick to it. It is making an impression on him, even if he doesn't show that or even realize it himself yet.

It *is* good that you put it out there. Who cares if he took you up on it or not?

It will be the same at Disney - just keep on doing your Plan A without depending AT ALL on his responses for encouragement. Don't try a few things and then give up in despair because of his lack of response.

I'm kind of giggling to myself, thinking about how he considered your sofa invitation and how that must be eating up OW. She'll be beside herself while he's at Disney with the fam.

She *may* talk him into backing out of the Disney trip. Be prepared for that possibility and if it happens, accept it happily and graciously. "Oh, that's such a shame, the kids were REALLY looking forward to you going. It won't be the same without you at all." then change the subject like it's no big deal.

You are really good at this Plan A stuff. Just don't get your "Plan A Self Esteem" wrapped up in his reactions.

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Thanks for that Disneyland heads up. Now I'll be prepared in case he does back out.

I know I'm learning to not wear my emotions on my sleeve. It's a good thing and a chance for me to grow and to not be moved by my circumstance.

Need to think of more reasons to have him come to the house. He hasn't visited the kids since July. Maybe I should get him to come do visits at the house again. I noticed on the cell phone bill in July that OW would call him on his cell during the visits and they were only 2 hours long.

I want nothing more than to drive this woman nuts! I know it shouldn't be my motive but why not have fun while I'm at it. Just burns me when I think she has seen me and the kids in passing when I would go the corporate office to pick up paycheck. She had no regard for me and my kids. EWE, what kind of woman is she?? puke

Did ya'll see he was tired of doing his laundry-ha ha. I used to do it all since he has a VERY high domestic need. can't stand a dirty house.


Last edited by Trying2live; 10/02/08 09:25 AM.

Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
Filed for D Dec 2009 Recovering well!
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Sounds like you are doing very well. Sometimes it helps to think of it as planting a garden. You prepare the soil, pull the weeds, plant the seeds and then water them. Then you just have faith that they will grow.

You don't run out an hour later to see if they have sprouted, you just continue caring for the garden.

It's good if one of his needs is domestic acts. And especially if you were a SAHM and did well in that department. Keep your home warm and welcoming in case he does come over. Try to always have some of his favorite food, and invite him to eat.

Do some fun things with your kids and take pictures and display them. My son got a cheap frame for 4 pictures, printed some pictures of us fishing and put it on the wall. It looked like much more fun than it really was!!!!

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Oh you make a good point about the garden.

So I found out all this stuff on April 23, he was out of the house by May 8th. I let him spend the day with us on July 4th BUT Ok i hadn't found the SAA book yet.

I took down all the pictures of us down. He was so bothered by it. He told a few close friends that were here: So what everyone is going ot forget about me? All my pictures are down. This all happened in July.

I know probably not the best thing but I couldn't stand staring at all the pictures of us-wedding pics, vacation pics etc. It was painful. But the kids did have lots of pictures of dad in their rooms.

Should I put them all up again and add some more?? I'm not ever sure he'd notice at this point since it's been so long.

I'm hoping he's still going to come and do the chores, he told DD17 that he was trying to get things scheduled(probably around OW) we'll see.


Me-39 H-38/Married 19years/DD18 & DS10
Dday EA/PA 4/23/08 Left home 5/08/08
Moved in w/Sea Hag 08/01/08
Read SAA Sept 08 Plan A 10/03/08 thru 11/15/08
Plan B 11/15/08-currently
01/18/09 Plan B crack w/phone call restating PBL
01/31/09 Planned brief contact
02/15/09 Delivery of Planned 2nd PBL
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Time is probably your best friend, especially since they are living together. Just be sure you don't LB. Be cheerful and pleasant and fun.

I would put up new pictures of you and the kids doing things he used to like to do.

You can put fresh flowers around, always have some good food, have your home sparkling clean.

And change anything that he complained about before the affair.

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Originally Posted by Trying2live
I know I'm learning to not wear my emotions on my sleeve. It's a good thing and a chance for me to grow and to not be moved by my circumstance.

give this thread a look see


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Originally Posted by believer
I would put up new pictures of you and the kids doing things he used to like to do.

The only thing wrong with this suggestion is that I did not think of it ! rotflmao

IT IS PERFECTION

I'd only add the following;

build a "family site" on the web
fill it with beautiful wonderful family memories
put the link to the site in your email signature
give WH (and OW) every opportunity to view how lovely you all were together as a family

include wedding photos
kids as infants
HIS parents
etc
etc
etc

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I know you talked about sending OW a letter and I have been thinking about that. I think it would be a bad idea to send her a letter, she obviously doesn't care about you or your kids and sending her a letter is not going to change that. But, if you send her a letter telling her that you are fighting for your family that will only give her a heads up and she will also fight for WH.

If you don't send her a letter she will just self destruct. She will call him and complain about him spending time with you and the kids. She will probably just act like a bratty little kid who is not getting her way. While you can shine and be the sweet woman who does not give him grief about anything. If he cancels you just smile and say that you will miss him. You will show him that you are not annoyed by his action while at the same time OW will be complaining constantly.


BW 38 (me)
FWH 42
Married 7 years
DD 6
SD 15
11-2006 H said he wanted a divorce and walked out
3-2007 I told H I wanted him back
3-2007 to 4-2007 D-day's
4-2007 H moved back in for good
Today-In recovery, but a long way to recovered
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