Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 32 of 34 1 2 30 31 32 33 34
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 464
A
Member
Offline
Member
A
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 464
Reading that lengthy post just brought back images of identical conversations I had with my WW months ago.

One point I always think back on...YES, not only did I want her to beg for forgiveness (on her knees if necessary)m but I also DESERVED that she do that.

SWW, don't let her justify her sins by pointing out your shortcomings. We all fall short in many areas, but you did NOT cause the divide in your marriage. You did NOT step outside the morals of your vows. You did NOT do ANY of this!

Plan B will be your best friend. The time removed from the drama will clear your thoughts. Who knows, it COULD cause WW to see how serious you are about doing things right; but, most of all, it will be for you and your own sanity.

I know you don't mean to imply you are waiting on a visible "sign" from God as to what to do...but, realize that sometimes the doors God opens are really escape hatches. Mine sure was, you just have to have a clear mind (Plan B) to recognize it!

God Bless, still praying for you!

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
Originally Posted by abandonedwith3
Reading that lengthy post just brought back images of identical conversations I had with my WW months ago.

One point I always think back on...YES, not only did I want her to beg for forgiveness (on her knees if necessary)m but I also DESERVED that she do that.

SWW, don't let her justify her sins by pointing out your shortcomings. We all fall short in many areas, but you did NOT cause the divide in your marriage. You did NOT step outside the morals of your vows. You did NOT do ANY of this!

Plan B will be your best friend. The time removed from the drama will clear your thoughts. Who knows, it COULD cause WW to see how serious you are about doing things right; but, most of all, it will be for you and your own sanity.

I know you don't mean to imply you are waiting on a visible "sign" from God as to what to do...but, realize that sometimes the doors God opens are really escape hatches. Mine sure was, you just have to have a clear mind (Plan B) to recognize it!

God Bless, still praying for you!


You are all so right! I really started thinking last night, and I apologize to all about my flailing back and forth. To now objective people it must be frustrating since you all have been thru this and have the knowledge I don't yet.

I am and have been willing for a long time to be treated like a piece of crap, largely due to my desire for something that I can't control.

What kind of whimp begs his wife for validation after she cheats with a friend and is willing to accept a non-committal "well, we'll see, I'm not sure right now, but YOU keep trying to win me back."

I am going to write a Plan B letter that basically says, if/when you want to get serious about talking/working on our M then we can talk. In the meantime I will call the kids directly and don't wish to speak or correspond in any way with you, and while not setting a timeframe imply that this won't be forever.

All of a sudden the job front back home is really opening. I have an interview Monday. Apparently my clearance and experience are worth a ton of $. God is so good!

I can see now how He has sheltered and protected me thru this whole thing. Maybe God doesn't believe in "marriage at all costs" either.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
I agree, quit talking yourself out of plan B. When you waiver again, replay the wimp pep rally "Not in public of course", I'd hate to see you lose your clearance grin

Congrat's on the job obtions. What's that status on your orders?

Once your hired, I'll send you my resume. cool

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
Originally Posted by Justkeeptrying
I agree, quit talking yourself out of plan B. When you waiver again, replay the wimp pep rally "Not in public of course", I'd hate to see you lose your clearance grin

Congrat's on the job obtions. What's that status on your orders?

Once your hired, I'll send you my resume. cool

I take over unit in November, but can cut my orders short. The Agency knows I am looking for full time civilian employment again and seem happy to have me for as long as they can. I would never leave them in the lurch though and would have to negotitate for 4-6 weeks for turnover, caretaking etc.

I will let you know if i get hired where to send your resume as i aint going anywhere. Do you still have a clearance?

I will keep hanging around here. This place is kind of like church in a way. When we come staggering in in pieces and are offered help, advice, sanity etc. I think we have an obligation to try to help others thru their confusion anxiety and pain. I won't be the best to do that as I am still working thru my issues, but I have a day or two longer in the barrel than the poor new folks who can barely breathe...

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
Originally Posted by sickwithworry
I will let you know if i get hired where to send your resume as i aint going anywhere. Do you still have a clearance?

Yep, speaking of which, I should be in the 5 YEAR window for a periodic.

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
Yep, speaking of which, I should be in the 5 YEAR window for a periodic.

Get it done while "daddy DOD" is paying...

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,780
O
Member
Offline
Member
O
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,780
SWW,
You don't have to apologize for waivering. You have been through something that has been compared to death, the loss of a child, rape...

Just remember that as she withholds her love, affection, attention, SF, etc. from you, she continues to rape and murder your emotions.

The whole reason for having this support group is to be safe in your ups and downs and to have others to lean on when it's good and when it's bad.

Stay the course...


BS(me) - 40
FWH - 36

6 years of discovery.
Now - one day at a time....
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 323
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 323
I have read a lot of your thread but may have missed some details but isn't Plan B exactly what your wife would want?

I mean she just wants your money and she wants sex with other men and if you go to Plan B do you plan on cutting her off financially? In her mind Plan B means you are abandoning her.

For your entire marriage and even before you were married she has had the same behavior. You have described situation when dating where she was sleeping with other guys and she has never changed.

Why shouldn't she treat you the way she does? She has been able to do so without any consequences. If you go to Plan B can she screw as many guys as she wants until you tell her that you have had enough? Now when you tell her that and say you are going to file then she may say I want you and you will say "Great"! We both know you would so I guess my question is why should she care about your Plan B?

You have a need to have a "Hot" wife at any cost. I had a hot wife also but it was not at any cost. I have 2 friends that had the same problem.

1 friend was told his wife was cheating. He finally had enough when his neighbor called and let him know 2 of his neighbors were doing his wife (he was also but did not tell him that). He was a good decent guy like you but she needed other men to make her life worth living (just like your wife).

I have a dear friend who is not married who I am trying to break up from his girlfriend. He goes thru verbal and physical abuse with her. She was married before for 6 months when her husband left and she was 37 at the time. The guy left because she is a psyco... I am not going into all details but I have seen first hand what she is like. But my buddy is thinking of moving in with her. Why...because she is HOT. I fear for his safety. I could see setting him up for an abuse charge or killing him since she calls him and tells him she is going to kill herself.

But despite all of that...She is HOT, so it does not matter.

It just seems to me that your wife has done this her whole life. She knows she can do whatever she wants and she can at anytime get you back.

It seems to me you have a choice to make. Just accept that she is like this and let her sleep with other men and make sure she has enough money to keep her lifestyle. Maybe she will throw you some crumbs but at least you will have a "HOT" wife.

You two have the same pattern for years. You do something that she feels is abandonment so she gets to sleep with other men. And after she goes with these other guys she gets to come back with you and you are just thankful that she is still with you.

I was you for a lot of years. The day I told her enough I am out of here was the day she changed but it was too late. My biggest fault is not standing up for myself and letting her do what she did without consequences. My XW is very sorry for what she did now.

If you think going to Plan B will work then go ahead. But since she has been able to discard you whenever she feels like it and get you back whenever she feels like it I am sure she will have no problem with it. Now the day you stand up and expect she will either be a good wife or an ex-wife is the day you will make progress. Either way I wish you well. I know you don't deserve such treatment.

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
IHadEnough,

WOW! You read me like a book. I was just composing my plan B letter and was having trouble so I was going to post here and ask the vets for some help.

Plan B I don't think will do any good either. Plan B is for my emotional protection right? To keep any feelings of love I still have, AND, it has to be strictly adhered to.

My WW has my children at our home. She drives carpool. She has no job or money. How can I completely cut off communication? I understand the intermediary when finances are involved, but what about when I go home on weekends and want to see the kids? What's to stop her from telling my intermediary "no." Nothing. She would still have all the control and would prob be happier being able to complain to her group of friends even more and justifying screwing around more because I am such a jerk.

No, I think I need to take the weekend and really decide if Plan D is not the best option.

I really struggle with trying to reconcile God's commandment to bear all burdens until we can bear no more, and when is that? I feel a calling to show her love and compassion and try to show her the path to Him, but I am getting nothing in return, and then I ask myself "is that what it's all about, what "I" want?"

Seems every time I am ready to pull the trigger I'll hear a sermon on the radio station I listen to in the mornings, like this morning, and the topic will be on Forgiveness, or Love Never Fails, or about Bearing Burdens as Christ did, or What Would Jesus Do or something like that and I start feeling guilty, like I haven't given it my all.

I hope Ab3 takes a look at this today. Thanks for your thoughts.

SWW

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
Originally Posted by sickwithworry
Yep, speaking of which, I should be in the 5 YEAR window for a periodic.

Get it done while "daddy DOD" is paying...

I've been retired 5 years, but Daddy's still DOD.
I still work N3.


Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,780
O
Member
Offline
Member
O
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,780
SWW,

I think most of us want you to go to Plan D, but with your teetering back and forth, Plan B seemed like a step that would "protect" YOU and help you get your head clear.

I totally agree with IHE and I don't believe she will ever change.

As for forgiveness....my 2 cents. We are required to Forgive, but we do not have to tolerate sin.

Here's a few quotes that I like:

Quote
Your gracious tolerance for an individual does not grant him or her license to do wrong, nor does your tolerance obligate you to tolerate his or her misdeed.

Quote
We need not be tolerant of sin, but we must become tolerant and forgiving of the sinner.


Don't feel guilty that you are taking a stand for your life. People who are abused tend to blame themselves. You have been in an abusive marriage for so long, it is all that you know.

If you think you are strong enough to go straight to Plan D, then put those steps in motion.


BS(me) - 40
FWH - 36

6 years of discovery.
Now - one day at a time....
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
Originally Posted by Justkeeptrying
Originally Posted by sickwithworry
Yep, speaking of which, I should be in the 5 YEAR window for a periodic.

Get it done while "daddy DOD" is paying...

I've been retired 5 years, but Daddy's still DOD.
I still work N3.

Too Funny,

Small World. My Big Boss is N2. Stick close to Daddy in these troubling economic times if u can.

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
Plan D might be the best option, but Plan B would just be the last ditch effort before filing. It would also give you time to solidify matters in your mind, if you still have doubt, and I sense you do.

I'd say 60-90 days of Plan B. See how it goes. If it's not effective, you;ve got your answer. If it is effective, you got much work to do. If you still have it in you.

How are you going to plan visits (see the kids, not the W) while on Plan B? Other family in the area, etc.

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 5,860
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 5,860
You stayed in plan A six months longer than you should of.

Now you want to skip plan B. You get good advice here. Advice that works but you let yourself logic it away so you can keep on doing what you want to do.

Your way has not worked. You let yourself think that you have done it the MB way.

Now you come up with reasons to not do a plan B.

"My WW has my children at our home. She drives carpool."

Day care, get your mom to help, you do not have to do a car pool.

"She has no job or money"

This is her problem. Let WW see how her OM fail to step up and financially support her.

"How can I completely cut off communication?"

DUH!!!

Even if you do not have caller ID, the answering machine with the volume down you will not hear her message. When you check the machine soon as you hear her voice hit delete.
Cell phones show number so you don't pick up.

Delete her emails without reading them. I never have IM'd but I know you can block them.

"I understand the intermediary when finances are involved, but what about when I go home on weekends and want to see the kids?"

Have your WW drop them off at your parents house. Or your siblings house. Unless there is a medical emergency there is no need for direct contact. Custody problems see a lawyer.

"What's to stop her from telling my intermediary "no." Nothing."

She doesn't have to talk to your third party. That is the beauty of plan B. WW will then be left in the dark. This makes the WW start to realize that she won't be able to keep stringing you along. She will have to realize that if you are meeting most of her needs then she will have the most to lose if she does not dump the OM.

"She would still have all the control and would prob be happier being able to complain to her group of friends even more and justifying screwing around more because I am such a jerk."

Your WW is banging the OM and you are worrying that she will be bad mouthing you to her friends. Your unbelievable.

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
TheRoad,

No, I am not making myself clear I guess. If there were no children or the children were with me I can easily envision a plan B.

With me in DC travelling home on weekends how do I maintain NC and still arrange to see the kids?

On the finances, sure I could cut her off, but as she has the kids at home I can't cut them off too. She is the one that goes to the grocery store. My mother died in January, my dad lives in Idaho and my sister lives 2.5 hours away.

On the talking to her friends, I couldn't give a rats behind about that. I was saying that to agree that Plan B would be great for her as it would make her more a martyr and center of attention.

No, I would like to do a plan B, I just don't know under the circumstances how that would work. I tried to write the letter this AM but got bogged down in the details of how it would work.

I am not trying to whine here, make excuses, or give up too soon, it's just that logistically I can't see how it would work unless I decided to plan B for a couple of months which would prob include not seeing my kids as well.

I am not afraid of offending her either and I have no idea if she is banging OM charlie or not.

Under these circumstances I would welcome any ideas about how to make a Plan B work. I was leaning at D because I couldn't envision how to make it effective as if I communicate with her about seeing the kids when i am home it won't work.

Last edited by sickwithworry; 10/17/08 02:37 PM.
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 274
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 274
Just brainstorming for what it's worth...

If you are divorced and it's nasty...how would you orchestrate seeing the kids? You might use a friend as a go-between, right? So could you do that for when you are home on the weekends?

Or could you set up in the letter that you would like to see the kids every other weekend (share custody) and have her drop them off at a mutual friend's house?

Could the kids come live with you? OR You have a possible job in your hometown, when that happens, could you share custody on a weekly basis?

Financially...you could send gift cards for the grocery store as an allowance. You could make sure the bills at the house are paid for (just like you would if you paid alimony). OR If you decide on a monthly amount that you are willing to give her in support of the children and she doesn't feel its enough, you can offer to take the kids for her and have them live with you.

Could you hire a mediator? A lawyer as a go-between? Could you make it a legal separation and still consider it a Plan B? With a legal separation you might be able to make the custody things work better.

Just some ideas...sometimes I come up with things best when I write out all of the options, no matter how out there they seem to be. Maybe someone here will see something that might work and can piggyback on it.

I will pray for strength and clarity for you!
MogiSola


BW (me)
FWH (him - he's earning the F)
3 boys (4, 5, and 7)
M 1997
LT EA/PA 2004-2007
D-Day #1 Feb 2006
Joined MB.
D-Day #2 Feb 2008
D-Day #3 Aug 2008
Began REAL recovery Sept 2008.


Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
MogiSola,

I suppose I could:

1. inform her I will put money in her acct every 2 weeks. If more neded to email my friend.

2. Tell her my schedule and ask that she leave the kids at a friends. If she refuses to do this though I don't know what I would do. I would anticipate her using the kids as a weapon.

3. I have a job interview monday, if it comes thru, I would get my own place.

I guess it's the kids thing that is the real sticking point. They are in the middle of a tough time as it is and I don't want to uproot them from school/friends this far into the school year. If WW uses them as a weapon and won't agree to give them to me on the weekends without a fight I guess I would have to explain to them what's going on which they would then tell WW what I am doing.

The last thing in the world I want to do is go into a plan b and then have to cave.

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 5,860
T
Member
Offline
Member
T
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 5,860
Have you tried getting advice from the Harley's?
I think you should ask them how in your situation you could do a plan B.

I think after contacting Harley's then you may have to get a lawyer and do a legal separation to get a plan B in place.

It's still best to do a plan B before you move to do a plan D.

Not every marriage can be saved, should be saved. I don't think you should call it quits without moving mountains for your kids to get a plan B up and running.

Lawyer orchestrated plan B separation will put in place many things that would have to be done for a divorce any way. You are not looking to get married, no rush, or working to a deadline. Use all of the tools that you can.

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
S
Member
OP Offline
Member
S
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 642
Originally Posted by TheRoad
Have you tried getting advice from the Harley's?
I think you should ask them how in your situation you could do a plan B.

I think after contacting Harley's then you may have to get a lawyer and do a legal separation to get a plan B in place.

It's still best to do a plan B before you move to do a plan D.

Not every marriage can be saved, should be saved. I don't think you should call it quits without moving mountains for your kids to get a plan B up and running.

Lawyer orchestrated plan B separation will put in place many things that would have to be done for a divorce any way. You are not looking to get married, no rush, or working to a deadline. Use all of the tools that you can.

Ok on Harley's, good idea. How's this for a start? Anyone?

E,

I apologize to you for my part in creating an environment that helped make your affair with Charlie possible. I foolishly pursued my career without understanding my responsibility to meet your most important emotional needs. I was not there for you when you needed me the most. We are now both suffering for my mistakes. I am willing to avoid the mistakes I made in the past, I have asked for your forgiveness for them, and I want to create a new life for the both of us. But I cannot do that alone with you refusing to even broach the subject of our future together and what it would look like.

Until then, I need to avoid seeing you or talking to you. I will deposit money in your account every 2 weeks for you and the children and if more is needed please email “friend.” I will call the kids directly on their cell phones. When I come home to visit I will find my own place to stay and only then will I email or text you to ask you to drop the kids off where I ask. I cannot control the situation should you decide to use them as a weapon by denying me visitation, but it will hasten what may be the inevitable if you do.

I ask you to respect my decision to separate from you this way. You must know about the suffering I endured because of your relationship with Charlie, and your making me feel as though I need to compete with others for affection and love, including intimate love. Because of all the deception I simply cannot trust you at all at this time that you are not still seeing him, especially as you seem to be unwilling to discuss any efforts on your part at reconciliation.

As soon as you are willing to permanently separate from Charlie and any situations that might put you two in contact and are willing to make a commitment to our family and our relationship I will be willing to discuss our future together. If you cannot, then that will tell me what is most important and least important to you.

I want us to be able to rebuild our marriage someday. I want us to be able to meet each other's needs and to avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We need to build a new lifestyle in which everything we do makes us both happy. Then there will never again be a reason for us to separate. I want to be your best friend, someone who is always there for you when you need me. And I want you as my best friend.

I loved you when we married, and I continue to love you right up to this day. I just cannot be with you or help you as long as you are unwilling to participate in our marriage.

With All My Love,

SWW

Joined: May 2005
Posts: 323
I
Member
Offline
Member
I
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 323
I will let others comment on your Plan B because I think it is a huge mistake on your part with the type of woman you have. Her whole life has been to treat you this way so she will be glad to have you gone and get your money. Big mistake but it is your life and you have to live it so I wish you the best.

I will comment on your letter. When I read it the first thing I got out of it is that it was you who caused the affair and now you are sorry. She will think that she is justified and now just like always you are crawling back on your knees. No worry for her it is just like always.

Your wife has the mindset that she is always entitled to sleep with other guys if she is upset at you. In your letter you are admitting this as far as I can tell.

I am sorry but I feel sorry for you. You remind me of my dear friend who is with a real nightmare. I wish you would go get some help and find out why you have put up with this and why you want to keep sending her money and letting her sleep with other guys.

It is kind of ironic when you think about it. Your wife won't have SF with you and she cheats on you but she won't appologize for it. You on the other hand have been faithful and have supported her financially and funded her cheating and you are the one who is appologizing.

You have a unhealthy need for an attractive spouse. I am sorry I sound angry with you. I just hate it when guys put up with this crap. I have had my say and i will bow out of your thread. Good luck because like I said you are far to nice a guy and you don't deserve this.


Page 32 of 34 1 2 30 31 32 33 34

Moderated by  Fordude 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 1,116 guests, and 67 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Mike69, petercgeelan, Zorya, Reyna98, Nofoguy
71,829 Registered Users
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 1995-2019, Marriage Builders®. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5