I wish it was that easy too. I did have an independent ready but she was/is too busy at work. I hope that he will just calm down and accept my IM. Fingers crossed.

Boy am I thankful that you posted this. I am waiting for WH's mother to call me and I am so happy to have a response for her now. I like your idea for a PBL for the family, LOL. It will be great, hope I don't need to use it, but I'm ready.

Thank you T2L. You have beautiful words and I know you are suffering too. I love your determination and I am rooting for you.

I have very young kids but I will try not to talk when he is on the phone to them. My parents answered my phone last night which was great. I actually had 2 hang ups yesterday so I'm only answering the calls I can screen from now on.

Sigh - this sucks.

The worse thing is that we know our WH's and we know what we are potentially subjecting the IM too. I had no idea that his family would attack my IM too. It's great to have the voice of experience behind us - it sounds like you've had some tough ones, but no one has ever said that it was easy. You've all been open, honest and supportive! Hope it rubs off on my WH. LOL

Mother-in-law rang.

Well, she thinks I am driving a wedge into the marriage and ruining all chances of reconciliation.

I told her the wedge was a 19 year old girl. Until she was removed from the relationship, we don't have a marriage to work on.

She told me I had to use her and my parents as go betweens and not someone interstate. I told her we can all arrange who drops off and picks up ourselves, IM is to arrange the visits at arms length only etc.

She told me IM has not contacted WH and has not been helpful. I told her WH is lying and I had phone records to prove it from IM.

I told her I would not negotiate at all. This was for me and he has told me what to do and what to accept for long enough and I am asking for one thing and have put a lot of thought into it and I would not waiver. If he doesn't go through her he does not see the kids. I want to be flexible but he has to go through her because ...

Anyway, I told her if she did not respect my wishes and support me that our relationship would be over and she would have to arrange visits with the kids through IM too. She was annoyed but I think maybe she finally got it after about 15 minutes.

Why is it so hard?

I told her it was the best thing, please try it on and she will see there is no problem. WH is just being a child because I demanded he put his toy away (OW)

Anyway, who knows. WH has tried really hard to get to me but I am sticking with my PBL terms 100%. He will not mess with me this time. I deserve for my wishes to be respected. I didn't ask him to hang the moon whilst balancing on his elbow. I asked him to call a third party, Sheesh.

I am going with my sister and the kids to Christmas carols on Friday night so that should be great. Tomorrow night is the work Christmas party and tonight I might treat myself to the spa and an early night. I am tired.

I'm actually a little bit proud of me for not being bullied by his family. I usually try to please everyone else

I stood up for myself and I'm ok. I have had the discussions with them now so it's over. Darkness. If they want to argue, call WH. I'm relaxing and having a great time.

Your H is supposed to contact the IM, that is how this works. Your IM does nothing other than screen messages and pass them on.

And your MIL will not dictate who your IM is. You do not even want your WS's MOTHER as an IM, 2Much. She is trying to muscle in and take over. That cannot stand!!


Who is "ourselves??"

Ooh, sorry, Ourselves is me and WH.

So, if he sees the kids tonight, I arrange how I get them there and pick them up.

If he arranges a pick up, he can arrange who.

IM facilitates the time and place.

WH's mother was definately trying to bully me and I am so happy that I stood up to her. I know where her sons got their narcissistic personalities from!

I think I also said to her that I am doing nothing wrong. We are here in this place because WH made a choice to involve a third person in his side of the marriage. He now has to live with the consequences.

You did good!!

I am sitting with the kids at home waiting for WH to try to breach the PBL.

He wanted to see the kids tonight about this time, but refused to go through IM and has had his family members call me yesterday and today to arrange it.

I made it very clear to them that he would not see them unless he goes through the IM as per my request (that he agreed to fleetingly yesterday).

However, I'm pretty sure he'll turn up here. He doesn't know I've changed the locks and it's going to be really hard to not let him see me or the kids. Lots of windows, no blinds.

When the kids see him all xxx will break loose.

What should I do?

I'm planning for this to happen...

--edited to add--

I guess I should say what I think I should do. I would call IM and have her call him immediately and say he is going against my wishes. Please arrange contact through her. However, you are there so take the kids to the park but don't do this again?

Hi 2M2L


I used my MIL as IM for my PB and it has nearly destroyed our previously close relationship. 4.5 months down the track we still don't really talk.
I had no chioce in IM because of my sitch and the time it all happened but I would never never never recommend an in law. Ever.

I suggest dinner and a movie out somewhere.

I couldn't agree more!

I just got a call from Senior Constable Paul from the city police station where WH is making a harrasment complaint about IM.

Unbelieveable.

I told the kind officer my side of the story and explained that WH has had an affair and I get to choose my IM, not him. Problem was that I chose IM.

Officer said WH wants someone else. I told him I had been abused by his brother and mother and it would not be family. If I did choose someone else it would be from church and he would be unhappy with that too.

I explained I was trying to keep out of detail so I wouldn't be hurt and that I wanted WH to have as much contact with kids as possible and that he agreed to the arrangement.

AAAAAARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH

Hi BK. I'd have to go to my parents cos the kids are too young and need to be in bed at 7.

This sucks!

If you have grounds for an AVO against him maybe you should consider that.

Where does a cop get off telling you to get another intermediary????

I'd go if you think he could show up.

Much better than a scene at home.

I agree with BK. You need people around you!

These replies are never as good when you need to write them the second time - crazy internet!

So, Snr Cons Paul also called the IM after me. She told him her position was to act as a spam filter for his abuse for me and pass the relevant information through to me. All messages from her to WH were to help and were as requested by me.

He saw all the messages and agreed that their nature was good, but said harrassment is unique to the individual complaining.

She also asked him if he worked for state police. He said Yes. She politely informed him that he had no jurasduction to call her in NSW and that unless he was federal police, there was nothing he could do. (yay for having an ex-lawyer as the IM)

She said she was not intimidated by him calling or by WH and was acting on my behalf and in the best interests of the children and our marriage and would keep acting on my behalf.

I had also told the officer that WH had chosen the affair and these were the consequences. He asked me how WH could get a message through to me to say he wanted a new IM. I told him he could only pass messages through my IM. No other channel was available. I also said he was free to go through the courts but I was offering a flexible arrangement which suits his career in entertainment and the courts would offer a fixed one. His choice.



WH called the kids. He was recording their phone call so I hope it was because he misses them. He also asked DD if she wanted to see daddy.

DD hung up and I threw the kids in the car and raced around to my sisters house. Mum and dad and my sister and her hubby are less than 5 minutes away. We hid out at my sisters for over an hour and came home to a lovely peaceful home. I felt great leaving here though, just in case Thanks for the advice guys.

WH sent me a text message and I opened it - it's a darn hard habit to break.

It said "I have had an appointment with the family relationship centre today and the family court. They will contact you if they haven't already. If you do not agree to mediation they will issue me with family court notice for a court hearing re visitation. It is not for you to decide how and when I see my children. It is for the court to decide and you using our children to gain control over me is unacceptable".

I forwarded it to IM who sent one back to him which said "WH please respect 2M2L's wishes and do not contact her anymore. I will pass your message on. Thanks for your communication".

Neither of us have heard anything since.

So, he's tried to contact and manipulate me directly, also through his brothers and his mum, both my parents and now the police and the courts. Sheesh! Lucky you all have made me so much stronger. He must have forgotten that I am the rock and OW is the marshmallow! I just ate 3 marshmallows and they were good!

I will do mediation when they call, but it's the same advice I got from them on the phone yesterday and waiting lists for appointments this close to Christmas are impossible and court dates will definatley not be before Christmas. I am sure I will be a little busy too... Maybe WH will have to suck in his pride (or stupidity) and use the IM if he wants to see the kids before Christmas. I don't even think he would have had an appointment today. It's just another scare tactic for me to ring him. He will be on the waiting list.

I won't back down. I'm going to have a shower and jump into bed for an early night. I'm exhausted. Going dark was meant to be easier than this, I think?

Looking forward to a wonderful dark and peaceful day tomorrow.

All I can say is WOW - you are so on purpose!

I'll be away from the computer for a few days, but want to wish you the best!

This is amazing! Thank goodness you chose a reliable IM who can withstand this assault. See how bad this can get when a WS loses control?

In case anyone questions why you are doing this, refer them to the words of world reknowned clinical psychologist, Dr. Willard Harley. Here are the comments of another board member whose WW was screaming to the moon about Plan B: [it worked and the WS dropped her screaming]:

Plaintiffs' adulterous affair has been traumatic to the entire family, most especially the defendant. Reknowned psychologist and leading US expert on adultery and families, Dr. Willard Harley, author and founder of Marriage Builders, likens the trauma of an affair to rape. It is Dr. Harley, among other experts, who recommend ceasing direct communication with the adulterous spouse to lessen the emotional pain of witnessing the affair first hand.

Dr. Willard F. Harley, Jr:

Quote: "The problem with a continuation of contact is that it usually leads to severe emotional symptoms, including years of post-traumatic stress disorder, even when the [wayward spouse] eventually returns. Many women that I've counseled actually have nervous breakdowns in their effort to draw their wayward spouse back to them."



Dr. Deena Stacer, Ph.D, Founder and Director of the San Diego County High Conflict Intervention Program, recommends ceasing contact for a minimum of two years in order to protect the children:

Quote:In a breakup or divorce, with children, there may be high emotion and tension between the parents. This tension creates anxiety for the children as well as the parents. The children sense their parents anxiety in their voice, body language and in their parents behavior. To significantly reduce the amount of tension for all the family, the parents should follow two simple rules for the first two years, in order to control the communication and contact between the parents.

Number One: Eliminate all face-to-face communication between the parents, {including telephone contact} for a minimum of two years.

Number Two: all communication should be done in writing, using a memo format.

Research shows that constant and chronic conflict between the parents negatively impacts the children.

Coparenting often fails, because it assumes that the parents can eventually get along. Our program assumes that with every interaction between the parents more anixety results creating less ability to agree of child sharing issues. If parents couldn't coparent while together, the gap now is wider between them since separatation and their anxiety level is increasing due to the ongoing court conflit.

Our program focuses the parents away from their feelings of failure to communicate and redirects their anger at each other to bonding more closely with their children instead. www.highconflictintervention.com/files/16990712.pdf

Just make sure that you and the IM save all your communication offering to allow him to visit the kids. I would also strongly suggest that you retain an attorney. I am appalled that your H got the police to call you about such nonsense.

Maybe have the IM send him a calendar and say something like: 2Much wants to make sure you see the kids often so she made up this visitation schedule. Please review it and give me any changes you need. She will make sure the kids are available at those times. [I have emailed you a calendar]

This way, you will have documentation that you were eager to give him liberal visitation. He is trying to make it look like you are keeping his kids from him.

A good way to avoid seeing him would be to drop your kids at your parents house and have him pick them up there and return them there. You wouldn't need to be there at all this way.

Thanks KA. I get worried that I am giving him too much info through his other recruited parties, but...as they say, a bad plan B is worse than no plan B at all.

I agree. She's been a Godsend.

In case anyone questions why you are doing this, refer them to the words of world reknowned clinical psychologist, Dr. Willard Harley. Here are the comments of another board member whose WW was screaming to the moon about Plan B: [it worked and the WS dropped her screaming]: [/quote]Thanks ML. I have forwarded it to my IM for the next time!