I don't have wishful thinking right now. It's just nice to see that he finally sees what he's done and the consequences of his actions. And it feels damn good to see him hurting for once.

I honestly don't know what I'm thinking right now. I was wrong about the love/hate - I think I'm on the line of love/indifferent. Part of me still loves him and part of me has been hurt beyond repair. Or so it seems at the moment. I really don't feel anything right now.

The only thing I do know is I deserve a whole lot better than this and if he can't get his stuff together and be the man I deserve, he better get to packing.

drgnfly be careful. You thought WH was not in contact because you wanted to believe him. Now he's shed some tears so you think he's believable again. He might feel bad but that doesn't mean he understands what he has done. You were kicking yourself yesterday and today WH has you thinking he's seen the light.

drgnfly,

I'd say hold back on any trust at all until you have had a good stretch of NC, that you can verify. He never makes it very far, so it's unlikely he's even faced the challenge of withdrawal. Needs the drug every few days. Still addicted, for sure, regardless of his remorse.

I'll stick my neck out and say he shouldn't be given any trust until he's gone through withdrawal, but that hasn't even really begun yet.

So protect your heart!

RHW

Drgnfly,


I could be wrong, but here is what I think. No doubt he feels bad for hurting you, but someone so close to the A, who just broke NC and obviously in more withdrawal than he chooses to believe is still thinking about himself. He's probably more mad and upset with himself than he is with how you are feeling. Right now he feels weak and stupid for not controlling his actions. My guess is, although some of the tears are for your hurt, most are because he is feeling a lot of self-pity right now.

I would also be willing to bet he will completely disagree with me because he probably isn't ready to admit this to himself.

ETA: My thoughts are not along the lines of explaining why he did what he did, they are to let you know not to put too much stock in the tears is all.

LC

You are not wrong. 100% correct.

I don't trust him. He doesn't deserve my trust. He doesn't deserve me. If he wants to make this work, he has a lot of work to do. I don't believe any words that are spewed out of his mouth. He's too good at lying for me to believe anything.

That being said, how do we go about this? How do we Plan A now? How do I go on with meeting ENs and no LBs when I feel this way? I've ordered four of Dr. Harley's books - waiting for them to get here. Hopefully today. That would be good timing. I ordered "Surviving the Affair", "Falling in Love, Staying in Love", "His Needs/Her Needs" and "His Needs/Her Needs for parents". It's a good thing we both like to read because we have a lot of reading to do. I guess from checking out other threads we should try to read them together and make that part of our time. We'll see.

You don't.

Don't LB - but tread water

Skald needs to do the heavy lifting - YOU have been trying to save the marriage and he's been pulling against your efforts - it's HIS turn now

Give him the Harley # and tell him to make an appointment for himself

let HIM make the appointment

The purpose of Plan A is to show the WS that the BS is ready willing and able to meet the (reasonable) ENs of the WS.

You ALREADY did that !

Plan A for the next 5 years will not fix Skald's character defects.

read this post

Set the bar HIGH - he needs to "man up"

This just makes me think more and more that IF (thats a big IF)MY WH ever wants to reconcile he will have to be on his knees begging. THen I will still say no. Until he tries more and more to prove to me that he is truly remorseful.

I mean I have waited {and am still waiting} over a year and he is still not shown any interest in M recovery. If I can wait this long for a person that lied and betrayed me. I just now feel that he should try at least that long to win me back.

I know that is unrealistic so i will probabley never recover my marriage. but i just feel like us BS have been through so much
pain that WS should being working on their end to make it up to us. I just dont know if i can take anymore of their sneaky lies and false recoveries just when i start to feel a tiny bit better.

Call BS 20 times a day, text BS 500 times a month, take BS to lunch everyday, Send BS flowers, check on what BS is doing. Even after BS says she wants nothing to do w you. At least put in the same effort that WS put into OW for so long. Then maybe Id take you back.


Sorry just vented a little

Awesome link, Pep.

Drgnfly, your world is whirling again because you've had another D-day. Pep is right. Do not settle for crumbs. Set the bar high. Do you know what that means?

Yes, Pep, that is an awesome link. In fact, I just printed it out to show my FWH. We've been recovering for 2 1/2 years, and there are still times that I struggle. I have known why but couldn't convey it in the simple way Steve did. He made it so clear.

Many thanks.

Right Here Waiting

The books did come today. Gonna get to reading.

When SMB & I counseled with the Harley's, we were told to begin with HNHN first and work through the questionaires ASAP.

At the same time we worked through SAA and some of the principles outlined in the book.

It was explained to us that NC letter must come first followed by extra-ordinary precautions list by WH. If Scald will continue to stay on his thread myself and others will help him with this.

Pleeeease post Scalds NC letter before mailing it for feedback!

Pleeeease consider calling the Harley's and scheduling an appointment with them.

LINK to schelule appointment

Our NC letter:

"I'm writing this letter to you to terminate our relationship. What we did was selfish and wrong. I wish I could go back and erase it all. I realize now that our whole relationship was an illusion based on lies that we made to ourselves and to each other. My marriage with drgnfly is real and I can't believe I hurt the only woman I've ever loved. She and DD are everything to me and I am 100% committed to making my marriage work and making it better than ever before. My wife deserves the best and I want to be that for her.

I am issuing this letter to state that there will be NO CONTACT for the rest of my life. To enforce this I have deleted all my personal emails, permanently blocked you on my work email, asked my co-workers to screen the calls coming in and so on. I do NOT want to see or talk to you EVER again."

Any suggestions or advice for changes?

We were thinking it would be better for skald to hand-write this so she is certain that he sent the letter and not me. What do you think? Is it good or bad to be more personal like that?

Absolutely handwritten.

I commented on his thread. I think the letter's good.

I think this letter is awesome. It says what most BS's want to hear...and want OW to hear. I noted in red a few changes I suggest. I will also post those changes on your WS's thread.




I don't know if I would include this. I think it has more impact when the OW tries to call the cell and finds the number has been changed. I dream of what that must have been like for OW. If OW tries the cell and can't get through, then tries the email and it bounces and tries the work number and is screened out, I think it has more impact on HER that NC is in place and he is serious about it.

I understand where you are coming from completely, but the last time we did NC, we waited until the first time she called then changed his number so she would KNOW it was because she contacted him. It seemed as soon as she learned this, she doubled her efforts to contact him. She called him at work a couple times per day on a "private number", but his co-workers intercepted the calls. She tried to email him, but they didn't get through. She already knows that he's changed some things and I'm wondering if it's good to just get it out there that the changes have been made.

And yes, I would have LOVED to have seen the look on her face when she found that he had changed his number!

Oh yeah! That is ONE thing I would have loved to see too!!! I know just WHEN she realized his number was changed because she immediately tried to call MY cell phone. MANY times.

I LOVED it !!!! I LOVED knowing how desperate she was to get hold of him and that she COULDN'T. Even now, 18 months later, it still gives me GREAT satisfaction.

Sorry for the TJ. I agree. Great NC letter, especially with SMB's changes.

drgnfly,

please read this link today.

I posted this to your H to also read.

I pray your day goes well.

LINK