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But you are a silly foreigner, what do you know?? :RollieEyes:
That is what Steve Harley told another client here to do the FIRST TIME the WS got through. The idea is to reiterate the main point of the PB with short, concise talking points. He needs to hear this same message over and over again from the OM. OK but she doesn't wanna make a habit of it - He gets a payoff and She doesn't get the peace she needs. I also THINK you meant to say IM not OM?? 
Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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shaddup, you silly foreigner! 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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You guys!!!! So I was out having a lovely Christmas lunch with my dad and a work colleague and my IM called me... WH called her and wants her to let me know he wants to work on the marriage. He has firmly told OW that he will no longer have a personal friendship with her. He would like me to meet him halfway with OW NC to work on the marriage. He suggested that I am encouraged and welcome to attend all rehearsals, gigs and overseas trips with their band. He will only associate with her on these occasions on a strictly professional manner. He will become an open book and I am able to have an insight into his life at all times. He chooses me and the marriage, not OW. IM said she believes he is genuine and really wants to work on us and is willing to do IC and MC too. She thinks I should consider the OW professionally as she believes it may work, but it is up to me. She asked what to tell him. I said tell him I'd consider what he said and suggested carefully. If I wanted to chat about it, I would contact him directly. WOW Should I be digging out my list of boundaries to give him something to commit to? I'm slightly annoyed that I got no peace and quiet and changed the locks for him to do a turn around in 4 days. That's shy I think it was just an EA with no chance for a PA (according to her and what we all thought). I just need some really clear boundaries so this does not happen again. I have not contacted him and I am hoping for some suggestions and advice from all - especially silly foreigners!!!!!!! -------edited to add---------- He went through my IM 
Last edited by 2much2lose; 12/04/08 10:49 PM.
BS 32 (1st marriage), WH 38 (2nd marriage), DD 3, DS 1
Married Aug 2002, EA/PA 2005, NC mid 2005
EA Jun 2008, Plan A, 1 Aug 2008, WH moved out 14 Sep 08, D-Day 14 Sep 08, Moved home 2 Nov 08, moved out 30 Nov 08
Plan B, 2 Dec 08, broken 5, 11, 15 & 17 Dec 08
Current Status: Contact for visitation, children and finances.
Embarking on a new plan to Let go and Let God and to not settle for less than I deserve!
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He will only associate with her on these occasions on a strictly professional manner. That is really cute! Sort of like the alcoholic changing the name of his drinks to "professional drinks!" Do you think he would ever sober up? 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Hmmmm - I know what you mean.
But, if it's not her then why not the next girl?
What actions can I take to prevent it from happening again?
It's not my preferred choice at all. I would love the NC option, but I know he'll latch on to another one if deeper things with him/us don't change.
BS 32 (1st marriage), WH 38 (2nd marriage), DD 3, DS 1
Married Aug 2002, EA/PA 2005, NC mid 2005
EA Jun 2008, Plan A, 1 Aug 2008, WH moved out 14 Sep 08, D-Day 14 Sep 08, Moved home 2 Nov 08, moved out 30 Nov 08
Plan B, 2 Dec 08, broken 5, 11, 15 & 17 Dec 08
Current Status: Contact for visitation, children and finances.
Embarking on a new plan to Let go and Let God and to not settle for less than I deserve!
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She asked what to tell him.
I said tell him I'd consider what he said and suggested carefully. If I wanted to chat about it, I would contact him directly. Her response should be something like this:
Dear WS, thank you for your communication, but nothing short of complete no contact for life will suffice. Please let me know at that time and I will discuss potential reconciliation with 2Much2Lose.Your WS DOES NOT HAVE ANY NEGOTIATING POWER HERE, 2MUCH!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Hmmmm - I know what you mean.
But, if it's not her then why not the next girl?
What actions can I take to prevent it from happening again?
It's not my preferred choice at all. I would love the NC option, but I know he'll latch on to another one if deeper things with him/us don't change. I see, then you might as well get a divorce.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Would you like me to list some of the BS's I know of on this site who did not insist on absolute and complete NC? and where their marriages are today?
To put this in the simplest possible terms, without absolute NC, your marriage is doomed and recovery is impossible.
Notice I didn't say DIFFICULT??? I said IMPOSSIBLE
Not to mention this isn't complete surrender - it's your WH wanting to negotiate the terms of surrender. The japs tried that in WW2 and the Americans didn't fall for it either.
Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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A WS will always try to get you to lower the BAR so he does not have to RAISE THE BAR. He is testing you and you PASSED THE TEST WITH FLYING COLORS. So, I guess you mean that if I let him stay professionally associated with her, I've lowered the bar and then he will think he can continue to lower the bar forever and I don't really mean what I say, you're not really hurt, it was just a coffee blah blah blah. I think you want me to stay firm on this and do nothing.
BS 32 (1st marriage), WH 38 (2nd marriage), DD 3, DS 1
Married Aug 2002, EA/PA 2005, NC mid 2005
EA Jun 2008, Plan A, 1 Aug 2008, WH moved out 14 Sep 08, D-Day 14 Sep 08, Moved home 2 Nov 08, moved out 30 Nov 08
Plan B, 2 Dec 08, broken 5, 11, 15 & 17 Dec 08
Current Status: Contact for visitation, children and finances.
Embarking on a new plan to Let go and Let God and to not settle for less than I deserve!
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2much, he has to end his affair and never have contact with her again. That is the first step in recovery.
The second is to NEVER GET INTO A POSITION WHERE THIS HAPPENS AGAIN. There should not ever be another one if you follow the MB program and remove the conditions that led to the affair. The conditions that allowed the affair [s] to happen in the past have to be CHANGED.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Hmmmm - I know what you mean.
But, if it's not her then why not the next girl?
What actions can I take to prevent it from happening again?
It's not my preferred choice at all. I would love the NC option, but I know he'll latch on to another one if deeper things with him/us don't change. Simply, you both will need to work on affair proofing your marriage. He IS a serial cheater. He probably will never change. Boundaries and affair proofing of your marriage have to be in place. Sounds to me like you don't believe he can change either.
Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985 Likes: 1
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A WS will always try to get you to lower the BAR so he does not have to RAISE THE BAR. He is testing you and you PASSED THE TEST WITH FLYING COLORS. So, I guess you mean that if I let him stay professionally associated with her, I've lowered the bar and then he will think he can continue to lower the bar forever and I don't really mean what I say, you're not really hurt, it was just a coffee blah blah blah. I think you want me to stay firm on this and do nothing. No, i don't want you to be "FIRM." I want you to be SANE. Can an alcoholic sober up and RECOVER if he changes the names of his drinks to "PROFESSIONAL?" Can I go to the bar right now, after 23 years of sobriety, and maintain my sobriety by simply ordering a "professional" drink? just answer me that, please.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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So, I guess you mean that if I let him stay professionally associated with her, I've lowered the bar and then he will think he can continue to lower the bar forever and I don't really mean what I say, you're not really hurt, it was just a coffee blah blah blah.
I think you want me to stay firm on this and do nothing. He will be bending his OW over the bar if you don't insist on NC for life.
Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985 Likes: 1
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YOU ARE BEING CONNED!!
This is a ruse designed to get you back while he continues his affair. A CON JOB!! Your Plan B is working and he trying to get you back in place so he can have TWO WOMEN MEETING HIS NEEDS.
YOU ARE BEING CONNED!!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Dear WS, thank you for your communication, but nothing short of complete no contact for life will suffice. Please let me know at that time and I will discuss potential reconciliation with 2Much2Lose.
Your WS DOES NOT HAVE ANY NEGOTIATING POWER HERE, 2MUCH! Done. Thank you for your suggestion. I just emailed this to the IM and asked her to send it to WH. I don't want to lower the bar.
BS 32 (1st marriage), WH 38 (2nd marriage), DD 3, DS 1
Married Aug 2002, EA/PA 2005, NC mid 2005
EA Jun 2008, Plan A, 1 Aug 2008, WH moved out 14 Sep 08, D-Day 14 Sep 08, Moved home 2 Nov 08, moved out 30 Nov 08
Plan B, 2 Dec 08, broken 5, 11, 15 & 17 Dec 08
Current Status: Contact for visitation, children and finances.
Embarking on a new plan to Let go and Let God and to not settle for less than I deserve!
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 7,464
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Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 862
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Good for you! You are showing great strenght. I feel that you have an excellent shot at recovery. Good luck
Plan D June 08
Me FBS 36
W 38
Married 13/1/09
The best is yet to come, with or without your WS
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Would you like me to list some of the BS's I know of on this site who did not insist on absolute and complete NC? and where their marriages are today?
To put this in the simplest possible terms, without absolute NC, your marriage is doomed and recovery is impossible.
Notice I didn't say DIFFICULT??? I said IMPOSSIBLE
Not to mention this isn't complete surrender - it's your WH wanting to negotiate the terms of surrender. The japs tried that in WW2 and the Americans didn't fall for it either. This is insanely scary, we've been here before and I lowered the bar then and I will never lower the bar again.
BS 32 (1st marriage), WH 38 (2nd marriage), DD 3, DS 1
Married Aug 2002, EA/PA 2005, NC mid 2005
EA Jun 2008, Plan A, 1 Aug 2008, WH moved out 14 Sep 08, D-Day 14 Sep 08, Moved home 2 Nov 08, moved out 30 Nov 08
Plan B, 2 Dec 08, broken 5, 11, 15 & 17 Dec 08
Current Status: Contact for visitation, children and finances.
Embarking on a new plan to Let go and Let God and to not settle for less than I deserve!
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985 Likes: 1
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2Much, it is imperative that you understand why absolute no contact for life is the only acceptable answer. Your H is having an affair with this woman. He is addicted to her so much that he has jeopardized his marriage and family over this so called "friendship." Ask yourself if men leave their families over "friendships" with men named JOE?? NO, they do not!!
It is because of this addictive quality that only complete and total no contact FOR LIFE will suffice.
In order for your marriage to recover, he must withdraw from his addiction. You must also be protected from this ****edit****. She has to be entirely out your lives in order to recover your marriage. It is the EXACT same principle as an alcholic who is recovering. He cannot change the name of his drinks to some silly cute new word like "professional" and possibly stay sober. It is impossible!!
Nor can your H continue to see the OW and hope to withdraw. He would be triggered every time he saw her no matter WHAT you called the interaction! You could call it a DOG FART, it is still going to trigger that addiction.
And it will still TRIGGER you every time he is around her, because you will live in a state of anxiety and die a death of a thousand cuts. Ignoring this ESSENTIAL WARNING is how affairs turn into 5, 10, 15 year affairs. just ask some of the other board members!
As far as future affairs, one of the CONDITIONS of your PBL was to participate in a program of recovery. That means removing the conditions that led to these affairs in the first place! If he is not willing to do that, then this will be hopeless! You shouldnt even consider taking him back unless he agrees to CHANGE THE CONDITIONS of his life that made him vulnerable to an affair.
Without those changes, I guarantee that you will be facing another affair.
Last edited by Dufresne; 12/04/08 11:23 PM. Reason: don't bypass the profanity filter please
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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