Talked with a long time friend last night. She jokingly said it is a good thing you are a long way away because I feel like jumping your bones. She said this in response to the last time W and I were intimate was 30 May 1999.<P>I was feeling a little low and needed someone to talk with. Getting on the computer is still a LB for her even though she says it is okay but she contradicts herself by bringing it up again. When she brings it up again, she has the facial expression and tone in her voice say differently.<P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net

Rob,<P>Is your W totally objecting to the computer time or maybe thinking you could be using some of the computer time to focus on her???<P>I know if I had a relationship again, I would spend far less time on the computer than I do right now.<P>Roll Me Away<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Desiree,<BR>She is objecting to the time spent on the computer. She has called it my second W from the moment we got our first computer. I did spend a lot of time on it then but don't now. I usually am doing financial analysis. She caught me playing solitaire to unwind one time when she wanted to spend time with me.<P>I plan on purchasing a laptop so that I can do what I need when I am away from home. She tells me she doesn't want to spend time with me but will immediately turn around and complain about me spending so much time on the computer.<P>I'm headed home and will post tomorrow when I get to work.<BR>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net <p>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 07, 2000).]

Desiree,<BR>She is sleep right now. I too would be spending more time with her if she would allow me to do so. I would be just elated to do that. It kills me not to say I love you as much as I would like to and as much as I used to say it.<P>She had a cow because I started crying on Sunday when I told her that I too wished that I were dead. No, I am not suicidal. I want to be dead because I would be with Jesus and away from the pain. I am not depressed enough to even remotely be suicidal. She is that depressed. She thinks about it because she knows that she caused this mess that we are in. Guilt is eating her alive.<P>Today she was told she would be taking the lead teacher position that she turned down earlier. She could only think of herself talking about all the other things that are going on in her life. She fails to remember that she caused the other crap to be going on by her actions. I bailed her checking account out again today to avoid an argument. The money is coing back out on her next payday.<P>If I were her boss, I would force her to get counselling as did the Air Force when they pulled me off line from missile duty. Her working around children is serious enough to warrant it. She is becoming unglued about the mess that she has created. There are times when I wish that God would take her so that the boys and I can have much happier lives right now. We are not as miserable as she is though. Thank the Lord for being so good to us. She even admitted, probably from the stress, that we were unequally yoked, insenuating that she is the unbeliever.<P>We would be having different problems if she were the Christian that she professes to be. I really welcome other problems that are much less painful than what I am experiencing right now. Yet, I count it all joy because He gets all the glory, honor, and praise.<P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net

Rob, Can I tell you something? I see that you are a man of God. My H has said the same.<P>Let me tell you a story. While we were getting over the strain of my affair last year, my H began attending a church alone. You may have read about it in my posts on the old MB board. He met a couple of women at the church that he was interested in, and told me so. In fact, the second woman ended up being a catalyst for his moving out. In the end, he ended up sleeping with that one (the subject of my old post "another church lady, another punch in the gut). He didn't tell me until after I let him move back home, when he had noplace else to go. They both are married, but were seperated, they prayed together and talked about the Lord within minutes of doing 'the act,' and used no protection.<P>My question, or maybe observation, is this. Does having Jesus in your life really help you? I'm not saying this to be mean at all, I"m just trying to understand. <P>I am a Christian, which means that I believe that Jesus died for my sins and that I will go to heaven when I die because He paid the price on the cross. I hardly ever go to church. My H goes to church, carries his Bible, listens to Bible tapes and Christian music... but... it seems fake.<P>When your W says that you are unequally yoked, is it possible that she means that you don't have the same enthusiasm for the things of God, or that the guilt makes her feel that she is such a bad Christian that she can never live up to your standards?<P>I don't want to turn this thread into a religious debate, but you speak so much of the Lord, and I wonder how that plays out in your marriage. Honestly.<P>By the way, I rarely post over here, but visit once a day to check up on old friends, whenever possible. I have always appreciated your fervor, although at times it has been a tiny bit strong, but I respect it.<P>~Sheryl<BR>

Sheryl,<BR>I understand where you are coming from about your H. However, your H is much like my W. Her very first affair was with a man who was a deacon in his church. Yet, they were the ones who were knowingly and willingly committing adultery. I know that according to the sermon on the mount, I too have done the same thing because I felt the need to be comforted as she has. Yet, in my heart I know that I could never really do it because the pain would be to great for her to deal with.<P>I don't want her to ever have to experience this pain. It is far more worse than what she is going through because I haven't truly gone against God's will. I was saved before I met my W. I have been this way for 25+ years now and nothing has changed except that I am wiser now. The reason I have survived this is because He has helped me through it. The reason I am still here for her is because He wants me to be here for her. My flesh is dying to leave her high and dry and get <B>my</B> revenge. Besides vengeance is mine saith the Lord. Yet, I stay because He keeps telling me that He wants me to stay. I stay because I love Him, her, our boys, a lastly myself, and yes in that order. I am not trying to be a martyr. It just looks that way because when defined by the world's standard, that is what I am. When defined by God's standard, I am His obedient child, much like I was when I was a child living in my parents home. I was not perfect, but I was not an extreme problem. <P><I>I truly do love her and will take care of her until the day that I die. She is not relinquished of her responsibility, as defined by God, until I die. They are His words, not mine. I know that I come across a little strong when I make my statements abouthow I am relating to Him and her. Yet, I know that I am doing what He wants me to do inspite of how bad it hurts. <B>I suffer because I don't want her to suufer.</B> It is exactly what Jesus did when He came to die on the cross for our sins. Yes, she believes but believing does not mean that you have a relationship with Him.<P>The real key to being a Christian is having a relationship. It is not whether we believe or not. Believing is the first step towards having the relationship with Him. Once you have the relationship with Him, then it is easy to understand. Read Hosea and see the similarities of this prohet and me.</I><P>Thanks for providing the input. I am continually evaluating whether Iam doing what He wants me to do. I read daily and listen to sermons because without reading His word, He can't speak to me directly. <P>Yes He is helping me immensely. I know that I would have cracked if it were not for HIm. I like everyone else become impatient and want things done in my time. I don't expect to divorce but I also don't expect to have the W I know He wants me to have. Yet, I am assured that she is going to be saved because He told me so. I am going to die before it happens though. I am not judging her. I am judging her fruit. Her fruit says that she is not saved. When she does develop her relationship with HIm, she will realize that we have to reconcile because we love Him. I am working on reconciliation. SHe is not. She blames me for what pain is in her life. Yet, she is where she is because of her decisions. She made her life the living hell that she perceives it to be. She could have said no to everything including marrying me. I did not hold a gun to her head to make her marry me. Nor was a gun held to her head to make her commit adultery.<BR>MONDO HUG SHERYL. I have said all this in His love which is the greatest.<P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net <P>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 08, 2000).]<p>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 08, 2000).]

Rob,<P>I'm just checking in on you. I would strongly suggest (once again) that you start counseling with someone schooled in Harley's principles---preferrably Steve himself. It appears that while you have your heart in the right place, you need some professional guidance in learning the "marital behaviors" that you need to get your marriage off the fence.<P>I'm going to give you a dressing down. You should not be in contact with any female friends. It's not good, and it's not helping you or your marriage. I don't care how much a "man of God" you are, you're exposing yourself to a dangerous situation. That's an across-the-board rule that shouldn't be violated. Not by you---not by Chris at the C&W bar---not by "lonelymom", who did succumb.<P>Second thing: if your spouse comes to you with a complaint---"you spend too much time on the computer"---don't argue. Don't defend. Listen, and respond in a way that solves the problem and builds love with your spouse. Don't worry about being right. Take advantage of opportunities to build love with your wife---they're not going to be frequent at this stage of your marriage.<P>Try to avoid overly emotional displays in front of your wife. What is she going to feel??? Love? Compassion?---not likely at this point. She's probably going to feel guilt, pain, and despair. And she's going to associate these feelings with you and your marriage. Sometimes we all lose it---but you should do your best to insulate her from these feelings. Dump on a close MALE friend, or to a trained counselor.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>I don't want her to ever have to experience this pain. It is far more worse than what she is going through because I haven't truly gone against God's will. I was saved before I met my W.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>This is a repeating issue with you. You are full of disrespectful judgements. It cannot be easy to live with a man like you, if you're coming across like this to your wife. You have NO IDEA how much pain your wife is in. You can't possibly. You also cannot say that you haven't gone against God's will---I believe that would make you "sin-free". The impression that I come away with is that of a suffering martyr---that's not an attractive model of a good husband. I know you're in pain, but it's equally likely that your wife is in more pain. <P>Rob, the bottom line is that I think you would see some progress if you started serious counseling with Steve Harley. He will be able to help you learn behavioral skills which fit into (and greatly enhance) your Christian framework of beliefs. You'll have the added benefit of giving your marriage it's best shot.<P>And finally:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>but I also don't expect to have the W I know He wants me to have<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>these low expectations are not helping you, and they're certainly not helping your wife. You should be treating her as if she is capable of being MORE than the wife you (or God) expects her to be. But you must demonstrate those high expectations with love, not with disrespectful judgements delivered through preaching and teaching.<P>It's going to be a tall order for you. It was for me. I found Steve's help critical, and I think you would see similar benefits. Please give it some thought.

Rob - You know, marriage is a two-way street. And you're really not the one who's done most of the love-busting in your marriage. I think you ought to stand up more for your rights in the relationship than, frankly, it sounds like you're doing. <P>I sympathize with your situation because I've been totally crazy about my W (more in love with her than anyone else in my entire life) ever since I met her. Like your W, she's also having an affair, the only one since she met me, I think. But she behaves exactly the way you describe your wife as behaving, by being irritated at me most of time and withholding affection and sex. <P>I've put up with this from her for the better part of three years, and decided it's just too much for me emotionally. There's no way I can FORCE her to quit her affair and come back to me. And I've decided that it's too frustrating and emotionally unhealthy to keep trying. So if she wants to go, I'm OK with letting her go, and I doing it for MY mental health. <P>Because nothing I've tried has worked. I've tried Plan A, I've tried being extra, extra nice and even apologizing for fights that SHE started, I've tried standing up for my rights, I've tried long conversations in which I described where I was coming from and let her describe where she's coming from, we've tried couples counseling for several years with two different sets of counselors. The bottom line is, as long as she continues to see the OM, this marriage isn't going to work. And it doesn't look like she means to give him up any time soon (just saw him yesterday). So I don't really see the point in waiting if all it's going to do is make me feel miserable. <P>Honestly, I'm not trying to focus on myself here so much as share my experinece with you, which I feel is, maybe, a good way to help you put yours in perspective. <P>Anyway, I hope this helps. I've kept up with your posts and do very much sympathize with your situation.<P>Regards and blessings,<P>--Wex

K,<BR> <BR>I am working my way to talking with Steve. I know that I am partially to blame for the mess that we are in. My comment on being in more pain that she is goes to my feeling her pain, our boys' pain, and my pain. She currently only thinks of herself most of the time. I empathize with her there. I want to alleviate her pain. I am willing to let her go if that is what is best.<P>The things I say here are mostly my venting but are true. I know that what I post is far short of what I am feeling in my soul. It has to do with my presentation. I am a bold person and it shows in the way I write and the way I come across in person. This is a problem I have dealt with for 37+ years (all my life.) Those who have known me the longest understand that I have a sincere heart. I have found that there is absolutely nothing that I can do that won't receive criticism. I stop doing one thing she complains from the other side.<P>I don't blame her for this pain in the since that I want to escape my part. I stay because I am meeting a need. If I were not meeting a need she would already be gone.<P>Wex,<BR>I am standing up for my rights in a weird way. I am getting us out of debt so that I can spend more time with our boys and fixing the things that she has complained about. <P>I am learning to keep my mouth shut when it is quite apparent that she wants me to listen. When I find myself doing something that I know is problematic for her, I apologize immediately. I am doing these LBs less but it takes time to work on getting rid of those things.<P>I understand you using yourself as an example. I just want her to make a decision. I'm okay with her leaving. I am better with her staying. I am prepared for any combination that she wants. I am standing up for my rights by not allowing her to utilize my entire check and thus get us further in debt than we already are. God willing we will be out of debt by Dec.<P><I>I am taking this one day at a time. I know I can't make her do anything. I know I can only change me. I am using our problem to educate our boys on how to be a man. I tell them not to be controlling as I am. Yes, I am controlling in that I seek to resolve issues rather than sweep them under the rug. I talk with them because she is hard on them. They need someone who is in the middle of this mess to console them. I am doing it. No, I am not saying that she doesn't do anything with them. She is only doing what was done to her.<P>My W has a great deal of unresolved anger that stems from her childhood that has bleed into our family. I got this from Gary Smalley author of 'Making Love Last Forever.' It is true, because I have some too. I am working on getting rid of mine from my childhood. She has to get a grip on hers. I am praying that her counselor will get to the root of this. She is suicidal. That is why she finally decided to go see a counselor. <P>I am doing everything that I can to not make her upset. I have actually been doing a good job. She saw me go to this site this morning. I know she took it the wrong way. I came here after I did something for her on the web. </I><P>I am sorry that I have come back with an immediate response, another habit I am trying to break myself from doing. It is hard when you think 24X7 which means that I usually have an immediate response for NEARLY every response to me. I am working on it. I come here to vent and get the pain out. I would much rather have this conversation with her because the tension is between us not you all and us. Thank you all for listening. It helps since I have gotten to the point wher I have to let it out.<P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net

Rob, you know I am one of those people that know the sincerity of your heart. I am sure your wife knows the sincerity of your heart as well, however - her "bad brain period" has her putting your sincerity of your heart at the bottom of the list of needs right now.<P>You are very fortunate that your wife is telling you what you are doing wrong. Yeah, I'm sure what you do wrong changes from day to day with your wife, but that is a real plus that she is telling you at all. She is obviously not in total withdrawal.<P>I think it is good that you are working towards giving Steve Harley a call. It sounds like you need a coach to help keep you focused. I could use a coach that can make sense to me sometimes too.<P>Remember FHL's story about love? Let your wife discover that her shoe is untied by herself. If she doesn't discover it until she trips, then you can offer her a hand to get up. But part of learning is failing. I am not suggesting you do this in regards to financial situations, jobs, or all of the consequences that are a result of her choices. But I am suggesting that you do this in the Spiritual side of her life.<P>Trust God to be the one to help her learn her lessons. Trust God to help her realize that the "shoe is untied" - in the Spiritual slice of her life. Don't point it out to her. <P>But, continue to work as a team concerning finances - and help her to develop a way of discerning - without judgemental thoughts or statements. <P>But, in the spiritual area, leave that up to God. I understand how you feel. God gives you the ability to help your wife in many ways, but, let God minister to her in a spiritual sense, and continue to keep praying for your wife. You minister to your wife in a physical sense.<P>God bless one of my favorite people here on this forum. Your incredible sense of spiritual knowledge is a real asset, and I would put that as high priority on my list of evaluating you if you were my husband. But I am at a different level than your wife is at, and it is her list.<P>tnt

Thanks Connie. Where I am right now is in need of encouragement. I never thought I would ever get to that point. I guess now is my time.<P>I am taking it one step at a time. He is directing my path. Yes, I vere (sp) off it from time to time. When I say things that can be interpreted as a disrepsectful judgement, I apologize immediately.<P>Letting her learn the hard way is hard. I have let that happen here lately by letting her checking account bounce checks. Yes, it is bad for me as well but it is a lesson that she must lean because I know that I am going to die before she does and I want her to be able to manage what little I will be leaving her.<P>I pray for her and thank Him daily for her coming into my life. I harbor few feelings of resentment. When I go there I reflect back on what she has endured her entire life and realize that though my pain is intense, she has endured pain for a longer period of time which probably puts her pain very close to where my pain is. I guess it equalizes when I realistically look at it from God's standpoint.<P>Thanks again for the encouragement.<P>K, I know that it is taboo to talk with another woman about my problems. This other woman is very much like me: her walk must match her talk. When she joked about jumping my bones, I wasn't thinking of her. I was actually thinking of my exgirlfriend who is in the smae state as my friend.<P>I only want to be with my W. I just printed something off the web for her. I am doing anything that she perceives to be a good thing. Yet, at the same time, I know she is saying that he is trying to get back in my good graces. Yes, I am but only because I want her to experience joy rather than me experiencing joy. I am selfish in a selfless manner. MY joy comes from knowing that I have done what is in her best interest rather than expecting her to return the jesture.<P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net <p>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 08, 2000).]

Rob,<P>You have gotten some good advice here. I will have to echo K's advice about calling Steve Harley. Don't work your way to it...just do it.<P>You mention your "presentation" and that you have had a problem with this your entire life. It seems to have spilt over when you were int he service, too. Rob, my friend, this is your OPPORTUNITY!!!!!!<P>As TNT points out, your W is telling you what she doesn't like. Is it possible that she thinks you come off as morally superior??? No one would find that attractive.<P>The best thing I learned from Steve was that I was not doing the great PlanA I <B>thought</B> I was doing. I, too, was delivering all kinds of disrespetful judgements to my H and thinking I was coming off good to him, and instead he was not thinking so at all. The benefit of an outsider with experience in these matters like Steve, is that he can pick up on your attitude and your presentation during your first session. <P>I agree with TNT...no one doubts your sincerity of heart and the hard work you have put into your marriage, including me. You are a really good and decent man. Yet, despite it all, your current method isn't working for you. Something needs to change, Rob.<P>If you don't want to call Steve, then spend less time on the computer starting now. OK, maybe she won't spend that time with you, but you have eliminated a complaint and are giving her the OPPORTUNITY to spend more time with you. Maybe after a little bit, she will take you up on that, if you make yourself more available to her.<P>Also, Steve dinged me big time on this...stop trying to give her all the answers. Stop trying to educate your W. Steve's direct quote: "Your S needs to learn something from all this, but NOT from you!" Steve says it costs us too much when we try to educate our S, because it syas to them that we think we have all the answers and we think we are superior to them, and that makes us go down in our S's opinions. Remember that the OP thinks our S's are just perfect!<P>Not trying to beat you up at all, Rob. I feel for you and know how tired, frustrated and lonely you are. Please try something different....<P>Praying for you and your family,<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Rob,<P>To reiterate what Desiree said:<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>The best thing I learned from Steve was that I was not doing the great PlanA I thought I was doing. I, too, was delivering all kinds of disrespetful judgements to my H [W] and thinking I was coming off good to him [her], and instead he [she] was not thinking so at all. The benefit of an outsider with experience in these matters like Steve, is that he can pick up on your attitude and your presentation during your first session. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I put the edits in brackets, because Steve took me through the exact same process (although SAA wasn't in print). No matter how well I was doing "Plan A", I could always improve. And that goes even today---no matter how great a husband I think I am---it's what my WIFE THINKS that really matters.<P>Ditto on educating your wife. Rob, you go by the moniker "professor"---if you're a professor in real life, than your life's work is to teach. I'm very similar. You've GOT to leave that at the door when you come home; there's nothing more annoying than a spouse who wants to educate and enlighten you all the time. Even when you're right and it's for their own good (I'd say "especially when...").<P>Do give Steve a call. If nothing else, you know from my experience and Desiree's that he's very consistant!

Desiree,<BR>Thanks. Our pastor said the same thing. I have backed way off from confronting and from spending a lot of time on the computer. I only get on to do the bills. I try to do it when she is not home. Sometime she comes in and catches me on it. Or I try to do what I have to do when she is asleep. That is why I plan on getting the laptop so that I don't have to use the computer at home at all.<P>Steve will be called as soon as I relieve the financial pressure that she is once again making become a problem. I paid her cell phone bill that OM ran up. This jesture put me behind since I must have the timing belt replaced in my car (her words.) I just put another $165 in her account yesterday to cover checks she has written out beyond what she has in her account. She owes money at her second job totaling abuot $300. She is still living beyond what she is bringing in. <P>I promise to call Steve when I work it into our budget (my portion.) I have to be able to cover some of her expenses because it might mean no food or the gas or water being turned off. Our reserves are almost nil.<P>K,<BR>I am with you. I have stopped for the most part except when I get caught up in her taking it to the next level. This occurred on Sunday. I asked why she asked me about how much I hurt when my exgirlfriend brole up with me the night before. She took it from talking about that to my having a holier than thou attitude. I fell prey to the temptation. I immediately paged and apology once I got to work.<P>The moniker is my nickname from high school. I am trying to get down from the pedestal that she has placed me on. I knew it would become a problem fro us down the road. I have not been very successful in getting her to put herself up on the pedestal with me. Right now I am being as quiet as I possibly can. She got me to come out of my shell more than any other person I have ever known. I like being out of my shell, it keeps me from thinking to much. When I was in my shell, I thought to much and read a lot which only made matters worse because I didn't learn to interact with others to make the relationship more meaningful for the other person. That is why I am here.<BR>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net <P>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 08, 2000).]<p>[This message has been edited by professorg (edited February 08, 2000).]

Rob,<P>You are making my day!!!!!<P>You have no idea how lucky you are and how much I envy people like you. I have no H anywhere around and no marriage at all. You have a W and a marriage, it just isn't as good as it could be. You two have so much to work with!!!! <P>Success can be yours with <B>efficacy</B> of efforts. <P>Please find that money soon! If nothing else, Steve will motivate you and you will definitely get your money's worth in advice and knowing that you are doing everything possible that YOU can do to save your marriage!<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Rob,<P>My H's nickname was "the Preacher" and boy can he preach. <P>Just a thought... reread what TNT, Desi, K and even I said about her feeling that she can't live up to your spiritual standards - I think that comes under the heading of "disrespectful judgements"...my H does the same, and it drives me totally nuts. <P>Again, you are a good man, and I believe a sincere one. But it isn't my opinion that matters; it's your W's!!! Listen to her Rob... and by the way... as a W who ran up too many bills myself, and who's H bailed me out over and over, let me tell you the thing that helped me most - when he stopped bailing me out. Use the money to call Steve. Then maybe you can talk to her in a way that won't make her feel inferior, and show that out of true love you are letting her fix her own money woes.<P>Best wishes, Rob!!

Sheryl,<P>What a great post!!! Your "rest" has done wonders for you!!! You sound fantastic!!! <P>Rob,<P>Everyone cares so much about you. Notice how everyone is leading you in the same direction???? Please re-read all these posts and pray on it. God always puts the resources we need in our lives, but it is up to us to avail ourselves of those resources. I think this thread is an answer for you to some of your prayers.....<P>Desiree<P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>

Desiree - Agree completely w/ you about not trying to educate our spouses, especially about emotional issues and character flaws. I've only recently realized that I've also been doing this to my W most of my marriage, and am trying to stop. I feel a lot of sympathy for Rob, because, in a lot of ways, I'm a lot like him in my marriage.<P>--Wex

Sheryl,<BR>She gave me the nickname Preacher. I do that as well. I guess both come from being the oldest of five. YOu tend to be more controlling and wanting to be the protector. She is also the oldest which makes our relationship significantly more difficult because the controlling behavior goes along with being theoldest. Oldest children learn to be controlling because they learn responsibility sooner than most, particularly when the parents put that burden on the child. I don't think we have done this to our oldest. At least I don't think we have because he is not very responsible right now. I think it has to do with him being 13 now.<P>Desiree,<BR>I am listening and trying to incorporate these things into mypersonality. The things you all suggest I got from the last therapist I saw. It is just more difficult to do when you are doing it one-sided. It would be much easier if she would work with me because she would know what I am trying to accomplish. I am getting better. She is calling before she leaves places to let me know that she is on her way home. She had stopped doing this.<P>Wex,<BR>It really is hard. It is part of me and she acts much like my siblings did. I just want to protect her. I guess I must stop being over-protective. The hardest thing to do is let those you love go through pain. The other thing about letting her go through stuff is that she overheard me telling someone that I was teaching her a lesson by letting her fall on her face. I know it was a LB but I knew it was the only way that she would learn.<P>I think she is here so I must go. Thanks again everyone.<P>MONDO HUG to you ALL!!!!!!<P><P>------------------<BR><B><I>God Bless,<BR>Rob</I></B><BR> regilmor@swbell.net

Rob,<P>In a way, she IS giving you feedback. granted, your W is NOT working with you, but whenever she lets you know something bothers her, then that is feedback. What she is givng right now is only the negative feedback. No positive feedback and no support to go along with the negative feedback. Well, you can still work with what you have got.<P>Believe me, if anyone can understand the frustration of doing it all by yourself...it is just about everyone of us here!!!<P>I am praying for you and the successful rebuilding of your marriage.....<P>Desiree <P>------------------<BR>"Life is made up, not of great sacrifices or duties, but of little things in which smiles and kindnesses and small obligations, given habitually, are what win and preserve the heart and secure comfort."<P>Sir Humphry Davy<BR>