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 Originally Posted By: holdingontoit
I do not see how her losing weight harms me or affects my self-worth. I would feel better about myself is my wife were thinner.


Contradictory statement alert. You had it right the first time in that your value (self-worth) does not change based upon her weight. You would only feel better about yourself if she was thinner if you're relying on external validation to determine your value. This of course contradicts what you said in your first sentence. I know that you and I have the same book that talks about self-validation as a requirement of becoming a whole person. I strongly suggest you work on self-validation as it will ameliorate at lot of your wife's insecure behaviors.


Me: 48 XW: 44 DD: 15
Lived Together: 7 Married: 18 Total: 25 years
W announced divorce 11-3-2006, I moved out 11-7-2006, served papers 11-8-2006. Divorce final 12-19-2006. Life gets better every day.
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That is not what I meant.

If/when Mrs. Hold loses her weight, becomes svelte, starts looking good and attractive again, her stock will go way, way up.
She will have guys hitting on her, she will have more opportunities that are available to a good looking woman as compared to a frumpy one.

She will become more enthralled with her own victory and less
so about the issues in the marriage.

Hold has always mentioned his concern in a divorce would be that
Mrs. Hold would lose weight, find some other rich guy, and have a wild time on vacations in the Bahamas. It is a rational thought.

"She treated me like crap, let herself go, and now some other guy is going to walk right in and get the wild, sexy person."

My only point is, this can be a factor in her losing massive amounts of weight.

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Maybe so, but assuming that all happens, I hope HOTI recognizes that she only treated a symptom (and likely temporarily at that), and that she still hasn't cured the deeper issues of what made her put on the weight and withdraw into her own selfishness in the first place. If she does walk out of the marriage and into a new R with someone else still carrying all of her old baggage, God help that poor b****ard.

I hope HOTI does a victory dance.

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 Originally Posted By: EasyE
Hold has always mentioned his concern in a divorce would be that Mrs. Hold would lose weight, find some other rich guy, and have a wild time on vacations in the Bahamas. It is a rational thought.


Not my concern, my prediction. Although perhaps in prior years it would have been more of a concern.

At this point, I am with Seabird. If she loses weight, finds another guy, and leaves me, I am happy for her. I only hope that they get married so I don't have to worry about alimony.

I am not concerned if other guys want her. Why should I begrudge her happiness if I am free to seek it for myself? And as long as she gets to be the "bad guy" with the kids, well, that cuts down on the pain of divorce considerably. Let's face it, "Dad stuck by you all those years while you were heavy and then as soon as you lost weight you dumped him" is not going to endear her to the kids. Plus, if she takes an eligible guy off the market, that improves my odds with the available women!


When you can see it coming, duck!
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Major transformations can be devastating to a relationship in
unexpected ways.

My ex was/is a very attractive blonde. Her looks were not an issue. It was her behavior--she treated me like dirt, like a human wallet, and after awhile rarely wanted sexual contact. I was going nuts, because I was very attracted to her. But all she cared about was "getting things done". We lived on a ten acre property in the San Dieog area with horses, etc, and a huge house. She never wanted to go to the beach, or go out and have fun, just work, work, work.

I was her workhorse and provider of all monetary means. We would work until dark on a Saturday night, and then she would fall into bed exhausted, always tired, always brooding that things aren't getting done. And on top of that, she volunteered
constantly, taking on other people's challenges and requiring my help and again, moneary support to do so. But there was nothing left for me, as far as she went.

After having enough of being her stooge, we separated and headed for divorce. And what diod she do? She moved to the beach!
Became a beach girl with a bunch of new friends and parties and fun! Something I had wanted for us from the very beginning.

She got pregnant by some guy off the cuff.

Last time she called me, about five years ago, I told her never to call again.

It hurt, and still does to think about it.

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Hold, you are sounding healthy and good.
Glad to hear it, buddy!

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 Originally Posted By: EasyE
Major transformations can be devastating to a relationship in
unexpected ways.

My ex was/is a very attractive blonde. Her looks were not an issue. It was her behavior--she treated me like dirt, like a human wallet, and after awhile rarely wanted sexual contact. I was going nuts, because I was very attracted to her. But all she cared about was "getting things done". We lived on a ten acre property in the San Dieog area with horses, etc, and a huge house. She never wanted to go to the beach, or go out and have fun, just work, work, work.

I was her workhorse and provider of all monetary means. We would work until dark on a Saturday night, and then she would fall into bed exhausted, always tired, always brooding that things aren't getting done. And on top of that, she volunteered
constantly, taking on other people's challenges and requiring my help and again, moneary support to do so. But there was nothing left for me, as far as she went.

After having enough of being her stooge, we separated and headed for divorce. And what diod she do? She moved to the beach!
Became a beach girl with a bunch of new friends and parties and fun! Something I had wanted for us from the very beginning.

She got pregnant by some guy off the cuff.

Last time she called me, about five years ago, I told her never to call again.

It hurt, and still does to think about it.


Yours is a somewhat similar story to mine. It tend to reinforce my theory that the person that we are most attracted to is inevitably our worst choice and that we must work against our natural attractions to find someone who is actually good for us. I'll also add that another of my theories is that while opposites attract, they make lousy partners.

EasyE, the past is dead and cannot be made-up for. The debts of the past cannot be repaid. Your best revenge will be your personal success. This same advice applies to Hold.


Me: 48 XW: 44 DD: 15
Lived Together: 7 Married: 18 Total: 25 years
W announced divorce 11-3-2006, I moved out 11-7-2006, served papers 11-8-2006. Divorce final 12-19-2006. Life gets better every day.
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 Originally Posted By: booka
EasyE, the past is dead and cannot be made-up for. The debts of the past cannot be repaid. Your best revenge will be your personal success. This same advice applies to Hold.


Better yet, let go of the grudge for there is no need for revenge.

Know that you made a choice to move on with your life, and the past can no longer hurt your future. Sure the memories can hurt, but you can choose not to recall them every time.


-- Still JM --

Met `82, Steady May`86, Married Jul`95. D12, S9, D3. MB`ing since Apr`02 to fall back "in love."

05.20.06: "If you live each day as if it was your last, someday you'll most certainly be right."
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Oh, no no no...

my life is amazing, I have an awesome relationship now with
a very beautiful woman.

My sole point is, things can hurt when people you love change on a dime.

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 Originally Posted By: EasyE
Last time she called me, about five years ago, I told her never to call again.

It hurt, and still does to think about it.


Do as I say and not as I do. Let it go. If she found happiness, that is the best you can hope for.

A few weeks ago I called the only guy I still keep in touch with from growing up. He lives a thousand miles away, and I had not heard from him in a while. He is divorced. As soon as the divorce was finalized, his ex married a wealthy doctor. They live it up in a big house, and take his kids on fancy vacations, etc.

He is not wealthy, but he lives in a modest apartment with his girlfriend, who I understand is retired military. They have plenty of sex. She cooks for him. He claims to like her very much.

But all he could do was focus on his ex. How little sex they had while they were married. How she slept with other guys as soon as they separated. How she remarried as soon as they divorced. How she went for a guy with big money.

I told him to let it go. Why should he care how she lives now? If the step-Dad can provide material items to his kids, good for the kids. At least the doc married the ex so my friend is off the hook for alimony.

And most of all, my friend has a dream woman of his own. Treats him well. Not stuck up and materialistic. Has plenty of sex with him. Isn't his life now a whole lot better than back when he was married to someone who belittled him and refused to have sex with him? I told him he is living my dream for what life would be like if I ever got divorced. I wanted to reach through the phone wires and slap him silly for not seeing the obvious. Or for not appreciating it.

As I said, wholeheatedly support Mrs. Hold in this endeavor. I hope she is successful. I hope she loses weight and adopts a healthy lifestyle. I hope she can continue to make better choices long after the competition ends. And if that ends up triggering our divorce, I hope I will wish her well.


When you can see it coming, duck!
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I should have worded my posts better. I felt I had been taken advantage of. Like I had been duped. I don't wish her well, but I am ecstatically happy with my life now.

Back to the point, though. Change, even GOOD change, can wreak havoc in unexpected ways.

I used to advise my friends when we were all dating about the "25 year rule", in that if you date someone under 25 years of age, watch out! Because they change so quickly and don't know what they want, you will surely be in a pain if you fall in love with a girl under 25 years of age.

Anyway...carry on. It was a weak point.

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 Originally Posted By: EasyE
Anyway...carry on. It was a weak point.


No, it was a valid point. Thank for the warning. It is exactly how my friend feels. And I think in the past the way I would have felt. I would have focused on the unfairness of her behavior.

Today I am more focused on my own role in this. And on my own personal growth. Which is not going well. And needs my effort. More than worrying about Mrs. Hold. Which accomplishes nothing.

I came here to share good news. I thank everyone for their warm wishes for Mrs. Hold.

I also thank everyone for their words of warning. I think they are valid predictors of a reasonably likely outcome.

And frankly I am proud of myself for my reaction. Which I think is a relatively mature and healthy one. I wish the best for Mrs. Hold. Even if that brings major changes to our lives.


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Heheh... For most of my M, my XW bounced between being just a little overweight to being very overweight. She'd diet or exercise for a little while and take a few pounds off, but they'd eventually find her again. When we first got together, she didn't maintain much of an appearance. She could wear scrubs to work (she used to be a therapist) or even just really, really casual attire ( stretch pants and oversized shirts). Some weeks she'd wear the same thing two or three times.

Over the last couple of years she moved into hospital administration as the marketing director and started dressing nicer. Then about 6 months before she announced she was leaving me, she started hitting the gym hard and the weight began coming off fast. She also started dressing a bit more provocatively; lower necklines, tighter pants and skirts, and more makeup. She enjoyed the compliments from coworkers and she acknowledged that I was diligent in my compliments and encouragement.

Then she left me. I was bitter that she was taking so much effort in looking good after she left me. I loved her before she was thin. Before she paid attention to her appearance.

Then about 6 months ago I noticed that she has been looking really, really tired. Really heavy lines in her face, dark circles under her eyes, and the makeup is getting caked on. She's smells like she's bathing in perfume. We had a parent teacher conference a few weeks ago, and we were enclosed in the same small office. I was struggling to breathe.

She's been having some health related issues and I just figured that was part of it. The other day, my mom saw her for the first time since the summer I believe. I asked my mom, "I really don't mean to be tacky, but does she look old to you?".

Now please understand, my mom has no animosity toward her and they still communicate. Mom answered me kind of sheepishly, "I wasn't going to say anything, but the word I was thinking was 'harsh'. It's like the years have hit her in a sudden rush.

Then one of my best friends ran into her at their temple. He called me later and said the same thing. He described her as looking VERY middle aged.

I would be lying if I said I didn't get some satisfaction in that. I don't wish it on her, and I'd still be fine if she looked like Ms. America, but I do kind of relish the notion that she's might be disappointed by the reactions she going to get from other men now that she's single.

Not to mention that after two c-sections, and breast feeding two kids, the inside of the book isn't quite as promising as the cover, if you know what I mean.

Imagine a couple of sweatsocks filled with sand.

I know. I'm a terrible man. I sleep just fine at night thank you very much. \:\)

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Hold,

Congrats to msHold for taking a step, ANY step, to improve her appearance and confidence....goodness knows you've been punished long enough for her poor opinion of herself. I DO think your reaction was mature and healthy...no small feat given your usual reaction....so feel good about that too. I also think Easy shouldn't apologize for his warning....it IS, as you've acknowledged, a likely and reasonable expectation that she'll use whatever improvements she makes for a future relationship and not for you. People who lose mass quantities of weight, often go just a little bit crazy with the added attention and become very self absorbed. But I get the feeling, and it almost makes me smile, to think you might actually meet that expectation with a little bit of hope, since you wouldn't have to bear the burden/loss of standing with the kids, to end the marriage yourself and seek your own happiness. I think you see this as a way to "get off the hook"...and I can't really blame you for that. I'm not sure how healthy that is....but it sure is handy if you want "out" and are too scared to do it.

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Hold, you are showing some growth and I congratulate you. Keep working on yourself and someday you'll be the kind of person that you want to be. But, you will need to work on it every day and be like the shark, constantly moving forward. Okay, I'll let someone else let loose the the lawyer/shark comparisons!

D. Seabird, I am curious now as to why you were attracted to your XW at the beginning?

I have very little feelings of any kind left for my XW. In fact, I'm close to forgiveness. She is still extremely difficult to deal with, but I have some strategies for doing so now and have learned hot to deal with her abundant passive-aggressive tendencies. To this day I feel her continued diagnosis is BPD. Her family elevates dysfunction to a new level. Her backside looked very wide last year the last time I saw her. Her hair has always been thin and takes an extraordinary amount of work and product to produce an acceptable result. She will no doubt be bald before me. I do not miss the bathroom door covered in a thick layer of hairspray and dust. My house is nicer, cleaner, and far more organized.

Think about what I said earlier about my personal success being the best revenge. Just what kind of revenge is my personal success? My idea is the motivation to live better without her than I ever did with her. Our circles don't currently cross but if she heard somehow that I was doing very well in my life without her, would I pause to gloat? Maybe.


Me: 48 XW: 44 DD: 15
Lived Together: 7 Married: 18 Total: 25 years
W announced divorce 11-3-2006, I moved out 11-7-2006, served papers 11-8-2006. Divorce final 12-19-2006. Life gets better every day.
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Dutch - Don't get me wrong. I still found her very pretty, but I always wanted her to take more care in her appearance. And until a few years ago, I had my own battles with weight. I still have to maintain a regular exercise regime, because anytime I stop, the pounds manage to find me right quick.

I also found her fun, and funny, and generally very, very "cool" and nonjudgmental. I fell in love with her because she once told me while in conversation (while we were still just dating), "I'm not going anywhere. If this ends, it's because you decided to end it."

For a guy who was accustomed to being dumped, this made me feel "safe".

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Dr. Seabird,

Thanks for sharing. One of the books that I have says that we are attracted to people who can fill our unfulfilled needs from childhood. Being slightly privy to yours (and in the midst of a huge thread-jack), I can readily understand why you were attracted to you. If you'd like some amplification of my thoughts, email me. But this does point out that in looking to have out childhood needs fulfilled by a partner, we neglect to consider their personal and psychological defects, as well as they unfulfilled childhood needs, which are often different from our own and often different from what we can provide.

I know now that the women I am innately attracted to are the worst for me and I try hard to address my attractions from a logical, rational, and reasonable to get the big picture.


Me: 48 XW: 44 DD: 15
Lived Together: 7 Married: 18 Total: 25 years
W announced divorce 11-3-2006, I moved out 11-7-2006, served papers 11-8-2006. Divorce final 12-19-2006. Life gets better every day.
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Wow, you guys are making me feel emotionally mature for the first time ever!

I have 2 kids with Mrs. Hold. So in some ways we are spending the rest of our lives together no matter what happens (God forbid it turns out otherwise). I don't want her to be miserable the entire time. That is not good for my kids. And no fun for me.

Maybe I am being overly optimistic. Maybe I will be jealous of her new life. Maybe I will worry that my kids will like their rich step-dad more than they like me.

But for today, that is not the case. I think my kids love me and always will (especially if Mrs. Hold leaves me for another guy - I only hope he tries to buy his way into their good graces, more for my kids). I think my life will be easier if my ex-wife is happy.

And I think I have the same work to do on myself regardless of how she fares.


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Maybe we should pare down the speculation--Mrs. Hold just started the program, and there's no telling what the outcome will be. And Hold isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

I've got another point to make, though:

Hold, with your education and career, your ability to pull in a tidy income, your proven ability to go the distance with a woman (ie, marriage), you are to women what a Sports Illustrated swimsuit model is to men.

And funny enough, the "going the distance" part is crucial. Women are totally tuned in to what other women find desirable.
The fact that a woman saw fit to marry you proves you have been pre-tested, and thus desirable. Even if you get a divorce this will always be the case.

Add all of that to your trophy case!

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 Quote:
And frankly I am proud of myself for my reaction. Which I think is a relatively mature and healthy one. I wish the best for Mrs. Hold. Even if that brings major changes to our lives.


And I am very very proud of you as well!

And also of Mrs. H. Good for her for taking the risk and publicly declaring the goal of losing weight; and major major kudos to you for being supportive! You, my friend, are a good and faithful husband.

And this too:

 Quote:
Wow, you guys are making me feel emotionally mature for the first time ever!


LOL!!! Yep, you are certainly doing good.

Seabird: inside of the book not as nice as the cover? sweatsocks filled with sand? for shame!


me - 47 tired
H - 39 cool
married 2001
DS 8a think
DS 8b :crosseyedcrazy:
(Why is DS7b now a blockhead???)
(Ack! Now he's not even a blockhead, just a word! That's no fun!)
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