Yes I have known about his major self esteem but if look at him outwardly you would never know it. But Gos allowed me to see it many years ago. He does not feel confident inside and living with me "Mrs Happy go luck and miss positive" per his words, probably didn't make things any better. Imagine you are jacked up inside and your wife is happy positive gives everyone benefit of doubt sees good before bad. I am sure he hated it. But what was I too do?

I am interested in what you have to say.

He said I got your letter. That's it. She said oh okay thats good.

The brainstormers need your input:


How can you touch his fears?

Not help - touch.

You know him, we don't.

He's not a talker - what touches him?

What are WH's favorite 3 movies?

What are WH's favorite 3 songs?

What was WH's favorite trip you took together?

Where has WH always said he wants to go on vacation someday?

ITA. You don't have to justify *your* actions to HIM.

I like Pep's suggestions to change strategy and the things she is suggesting.

I would like to see what he says if you used exactly his phrase - He doesn't have to answer to anyone, is that it? - by saying "You don't have to answer to anyone, it's your choice whether to come home or not" or "ME NEITHER." But not in a way that you are defending YOUR choices about YOU to HIM.

Oh, and I bet God knows who I'm talking about when I say "T2L's WH"

His favorite movies are: If I would have to try to narrow it down, it would be Tommy boy, Wedding singer, Apollo 16 and Happy Gilmore

His 3 favorite songs are Apologize by Timberland, Stunt 101 by G-unit, possibly in the air tonight by Phil Collins. Its hard to narrow. But Apologize he loved. Our family dog of 13 years died November 2007, he took it so hard and wept for days. That song Apologize came on and he thinks fondly of it even now.

Favorite trip, hard question he was always so weird and couldn't fully relax. Um family trip would be our 7 day cruise to Caribbean, but the best part about it wasn't as much the cruise but I had planned for us to stay an additional day so we could take him to Kennedy Space Center. He was amazed and we were all bored to death. He could have been an astronaut, he is fascinated with space. LOL guess he liked it so much he let spce in his brain...Ok sorry LOL I wish I had enjoyed the Space Center more now. He loved it. As far as trip for us as a couple it was our 1st trip to Bahamas on 4 day cruise for our 15 year anniversary.

He loves travel, he wants to see the whole world really. Hmm I would have to say its between New York and the whole ground Zero area or Washington DC. He is a conservative and very political guess that's why he likes both of those places they are political.

Any more questions? Do I need to narrow down more?

This is helpful to get a picture of what he's like -

any other likes or dislikes you add may be helpful

Does he read books or magazines? Which ones?

Has he ever written you a love letter?

Things he likes and I mean from when he wasn't a WS as he has changed a bit so this is what he was like then:
Italian food especially pesto, salads and home made olive oil dressing, he loves sunflower seeds, he played the drums at church he loved playing the drums, he likes red wines and tasting new beers from different countries and makers, he loves to travel, he wants to be an inventor he loves creating ideas because he really is an entrepreneur at heart, He hates Pie and pie crust, he LOVES ice cream, he can appreciate a beautiful clear so cal day, he likes hiking and taking in nature, the appreciates music, appreciates the ocean, loved chasing kids down the streets and try to catch them, loved tickling kids and me


Things he dislikes very much:

He was always worried where ever we went that people are staring at him, He hates being looked at, he hated going to the movies because someone will kick his chair(now he goes and I guess its okay) He hated going shopping but now he likes its, he hates going to places like Disneyland because of the crowds, he despises getting drunk completely drunk he cannot handle it tho his drinking did increase but seems to have died down he said initially he did it to kill the guilt, he dislikes country music, hates talking and fears looking stupid and failing, has a fear he will never be an inventor or not wealthy, hates apologizing or being wrong( i know we all do but i always apologized just to kill fight)


Hmm I can think more do you need more?

He wrote me the nicest Valentines note inside of the Card he gave me last year, i kept it on the counter until late summer. H never really wrote me things. He would just get a card that he felt said what he wanted to say. Its like he couldn't even open up to write me anything. I always longed for it but knew he was uncomfortable with it. He said sorry I didn't write much it says how i felt. But last year he wrote in it and I cried because he never did that, but then it went from EA to PA 2 weeks later, now i know why it was a cover up.

He said thanks for being there through all my ups and downs i know its been hard but i love you.

He doesn't read much, never has really but loves KFI talk radio. Hes more into TV than reading. He enjoy history very much and if he had to read a book it would be more of a pictorial with minor side notes maybe on space or all history, romans, american history he loves it all.

REALLY helpful stuff.

* thanks *

Does he listen to Dr Laura on KFI?

Okay he thinks Dr. Laura is wise and has good things to say but that she is a biatch. I say true but the people wont listen.

oh he hates Dr. Phil too and he used to hate loud boisterous people who attract attention to themselves, he hates if he thinks you are psychoanalyzing him or that there is anything wrong with him, he was that way Pre-A.

He loves his country and is a complete patriot and dislikes very much terrorism. Funny the dude is my personal terrorist LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL Just kidding. He hates being late to events and he hates having no money but to him it hits him in his self esteem, guy thing maybe.

I am getting a picture of his core values ... no wonder he's in such a bad mood! He can't stand what he currently stands for, a rule breaker.

Yes he would have looked at someone like himself and called him self a loser. He would have a called the OW a loser. He had major values but they just disappeared. He used to be intensely loyal but if you crossed his family you would basically die. Odd huh. Most people knew don't mess with MR. T2L's family.

HP, first you said this...





then you said this...



You said your husband was foggy and babbling, then you want T2L to think that anything he said is valuable insight?

Your WS is still gaslighting you and justifying is horrid actions.




We show our HUSBANDS love, NOT WH.




HP, it sounds as if you are confused and think that appeasing the WAYWARD is the path to recovery.

Loving unconditionally is not the same thing as appeasement.



I think you are suggesting she show him he can have his cake and she will not expect him to behave as a GODLY HUSBAND should.




This is how I got into a false recovery, HP.

Sin is black and white.

She HAS REPEATEDLY SHOWN him that the door is open, when he is ready to BE A GODLY HUSBAND.

Settling for anything less would be a threat to her and her children's souls.



Do you suggest she welcome her rapist into her home?

In his present state of mind he is NOT SAFE.




She is saying, "I am a PRINCESS OF THE KING and I know that the KING will care and protect me."




Love conquers all. Yes, it does. Enabling conquers nothing.

She IS loving her husband. She loves him so much that she knows he must become sweetly broken and wholly surrendered. She knows that HIS SOUL depends on it.

You are suggesting she let the wayward continue to possess her husband until her husband is finally gone forever.





Jesus turned the tables in the Temple because of his righteous anger.

Jesus told us when a sinner refuses to turn away from his evil, have nothing to do with him.

Jesus said, Go and SIN NO MORE. He never said, Come and keep sinning.



T2L is fighting to save her husband and you are telling her to quit and let the wayward take her husband over.


Scripture says:

each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full grown, gives birth to death. James 1:14-17

T2L's husband was tempted, dragged away and enticed. His sin is growing and will soon be full grown. The path his is on leads to death.

T2L must protect herself and her children from the path that leads to death.

It's fog babble pure and simple.

Quit thinking that anything he says has any truth to it.

I could tell a very similar story, almost word for word, except the drinking part.

I second this, T2L, do not lose hope.

I Cor. 5:5
Hand this man over to satan so that the sinful nature may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord.

I Cor. 5:9-13
I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people--not at all--meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case, you would have to leave this world. But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man, do not even eat.

What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."