Hi all, this is my first post but I have been following the website to see if I felt it could help me. I wanted to see if the users were all victims helping each other or whether perpertrators were offerind advice to. I say this as one year ago to the month I cheated on my wife of 9 years with a coworker.

I will post honestly as I need genuinely helpful feedback to aid the recovery process.

History:
My wife and I have been married for 9 years and have 4 wonderful children under the age of 9. I grew up with very unemotional parents and although my upbringing was simple it was very empty to. They never fought, argued, shouted anything. They cared for me and I never wanted for anything but physcial contact was a rarity (hugs, kisses etc...). I grew up being scared of contact even with family members and have therefore always been shy around people and women in particular. I met my now wife when I was 19, she was my second relationship. We hit it off right away and didnt spend a day apart for over a year!! She is opposite of me, she is VERY emotional and I loved this, actually knowing where I stood, I was either being kissed or slapped lol

She brought me out of my shell and I became slightly more emotional and we learned to adapt to each other. For 8 years of marriage I never went near another woman or so much as looked in the wrong direction. To be honest I did have a couple of incidents on the net where I had befriended people who were suffering and tried to support and offer advice and they ended up wanting more. I have disclosed this to you as my problem is im very nieve. I always try to see the best in people and dont see why people bother to lie so tend to trust alot more than I should.

Incident:
I have always been a hard worker and work is my sanctuary. Dont misunderstand I love spending time with my wife but because I find the emotional side of relationships extremely difficult (I dont understand the majority of the time)I found I could lose myself in work and my troubles faded away.
Last summer an incident at work (which I was found innocent) led to me being suspended and my integrity ripped apart. This crushed me and I became very withdrawn from my family. A work colleague I had barely spoken to in the year I had been at my store started to befriend me. I welcomed this as I felt I needed a friend who could understand my situation and I guess I was trying to find a replacement safe place considering my work was now spoilt.
She seemed genuine and sweet and we started spending time together. Im so ashamed to say that it led to a full blown affair and lasted 2 months. My wife found out and I instantly knew I didnt want to lose her and ended it with the other woman. My wife hit rock bottom and was struggling to cope with life and my inability to understand her emotional needs was exposed more than ever. She needed me and I failed her. She demanded many things of me, some of the darker things being to confront the OW which I was unable to do.

I took responsibilty for the A as I thought the OW was a victim to. Again I am ashamed to say that it was my wife who put in the hard work to exposing the ***edit*** I had chosen. It turns out that she had played me like a pro (she appears to make a habit of going after what she cant have). Do not think for a second im blaming only her, oh yes I certainly had my part to play in all this but my nievity hadnt seen the bigger picture.

She has turned out to be the store ***edit*** and a real manipulative ***edit***. I want NOTHING to do with her and she truly means nothing to me. The trouble is and Im aware of the response ill get - I still work with her. On a selfish level this doesnt affect me as I dont care enough to notice her. I can see her and GENUINELY feel nothing. But obviously for my wife everyday is a nightmare. We always update each other on her behavour that day and any contact (of which there has been a couple of occasions within the last year but all professional and in front of either customers or management).

I tried to leave the store, secured myself a move but due to lack of management the general store manager sabotaged it and now im stuck here. When the affair became known to my wife she was very emotional and some days I was unable to attend work and due to this my sick record went from 6 years immaculate and final written warning. This means no store will touch me till Jan 2010.

I could try to find another job and admitly I havent done enough in this department (chatted with wife last night and I want to start searching). This is because with a family of 6,my wife and I both working, a couple of permanent weekly appointments and other commitments (we both go gym together) my work hours are critcial to be perfect. I can only work very early or very late (currently work 4pm-1am) and also I control my own rota which is essential. I genuinely dont believe I could walk into ANY job get control over my rotas and have the perfect wokring hours and the money im currently on.

Still I am now prepared to look

Now the real problem is that in the recovery process since I havent been able to meet my wifes needs. Im the sort of person who lives my life one day at a time and concentrates only on what im doing in that particular moment. Ive read on these forums people who have husbands who arent caring etc.... I do care and I do love my wife but I just cant identify with her pain and to be honest life doesnt seem bad. We enjoy each others company and still get on well, we have a active life and participate in each others activites (gym etc). We are comfortable money wise and the kids are doing well. So I guess my issue and ive taken this from a post by another user here, my life is much more enjoyable than my wifes hence I dont see the need to spend all day everyday refering to the A.

My wife is amazing and has come along way (on her own) and coped with sooo much ***edit*** from me but she cant move any further.

I work so hard at work and in every other aspect of our lives that I just want our time together to be relaxing and comfortable, I just cant work 100% ALL DAY EVERYDAY its not humanly possible.

We're now stuck and shes very close to ending the marriage which is the last thing I want but my actions dont ressemble my intentions.

I guess im trying to ask for help/advice both to help my marriage and also for me to unlock/grow as a person and meet my wifes needs.

Obviously theres more details that ive probably missed and im happy to talk about anything to help my situation so please ask.

Many thanks

Welcome to MB.

First of all, you seem to know what you need to do. You state as much several times. You also seem to be searching for every excuse in the book not to do what is right.

Your M won't recover as long as you are in contact with the OW. Pure and simple. If you want your M to succeed, quit your job, NOW! You state that your BW is about ready to end the M and you don't want that. So, do something about it. Show her you are serious about making this work. Let her know that she means more to you than nice comfy hours and the ability to go to the gym when you want to. Geez, those are some pretty petty reasons for throwing away a 9 year M that resulted in 4 young children.

Second, unfortunately, when you decided to have an A, you gave up the right to not have to work at your M. Sorry you can't work 100% of the time and want to just come home and relax and pretend that everything is fine, but it doesn't work like that. A M takes work. R a M after an A takes even more work. You've made your bed, now you are going to have to lie in it. Sure your life is more enjoyable than your W's. She didn't do anything to rip your heart out. She is suffering immeasurable pain right now. She has to deal with a H who goes to work everyday and sees the OW and then comes home and doesn't want to talk about anything that has happened or how she feels about it.

You are not in the R process, by the way. You won't be until you establish NC and commit yourself to this M 100%.

I know this may sound harsh. You're probably going to get some harsh words on here. But the advice is sound. If you want your M to succeed, listen to the people on here.

ED, can you send your wife here? In order for your marriage to recover you must a) completely end all contact with your OW and b) take seriously the magnitude of what you have done to her and thereby, commit to a plan of recovery. If that doesn't happen, she needs to make plans to separate to protect herself. The fact that you would make her endure your daily contact with the OW is very troubling and tells me you don't understand what you have done to this woman.

I would start looking very hard for another job NOW, and even consider leaving now. What you are doing by going there is destroying your marriage and if it goes on much longer, you may not have a marriage left.

Get the book, Surviving an Affair, if you want to understand what has happened to your marriage. A good article that outlines the steps it will take to recover is Requirements for Recovery, which I will link.


I would ask her to take the emotional needs questionaire and the lovebusters questionaire and learn to be a PRO at meeting her needs. Start doing this today. In order to create romantic love in your marriage, you need to schedule 15 hours a week meeting each others needs. Living "one day at a time" and doing only what you FEEL like is not going to bring you a happy marriage. That is a freeloaders mentality that will ruin your marriage. Marriage is supposed to be enjoyable, but it can't be enjoyable if you refuse to do things that effect that. If you get into the habit of meeting her needs while eliminating lovebusters, you will have a great marriage.

entire article here

WHY haven't you been able to meet your wife's emotional needs? And what are her top 5 emotional needs, do you know?

I agree with Writer 1

The reason your W is interested in leaving the M is because of your W attitude, you are STILL in the W thinking.
My H working with this W would be a deal breaker for me, there is no way anything can be fixed with you still seeing her, and Im sure that your still talking to her on some level.
Im glad you are here, you obviously want to help and heal your M, and it seems you know the right things to do, but if your looking for someone here to tell you that its ok for you to keep working with the Ow It's just not going to happen, and that you don't have to give 100% to your M because thats not going to happen either. Like Writer said, you made your bed, you just can't pick and choose what is comfortable for YOU. You choose to put your M on edge with an A that YOU knew was wrong, it would be nice to have an easy breezy M, but you choose to make it stormy and unpredictable.

Dead,

There are plenty of "perpetrators" here as well as "victims." However, it's the victims (i.e., the betrayed spouses) who are able to do a better job of filling you in on how your wife is likely to be feeling; and that needs to be a top concern of yours.

I was a wayward, and my wife & I are still working my way through this mess I caused. A few thoughts for ya:

-- If you haven't read "Surviving An Affair", do it. Preferably with your wife, but anyways, do it. The parts about emotional needs (also on this website -- see the yellow box to the right) are very important to healing your marriage.

-- Also, you need to make sure that in your own mind, as well as in your interaction with your wife, you're fully "owning" what you did, and taking full responsibility. Look at something you just said:


Dead, y'know, when you say stuff like this -- that you're too willing to be friendly to people (women, eh?) who're hurting, and you're too trusting, it almost comes off sounding like, deep down, you see yourself as a victim in all this. I'm gonna give it to you straight, because that's how you asked for it: When you say stuff in this way, it suggests that you're not fully "owning" it. I got stuck in that rut, too -- I convinced myself that I'd gotten led into my affair because I was a nice guy who lent a comforting ear to a female acquaintance who was having a bad time in her marriage & came to me for advice, and whom I felt sorry for. Well, as someone on this site once pointed out to me, I was a grown-up who made my own conscious decisions to have an affair -- No one had a gun to my head, and I damn well wasn't doing social work or marriage counseling when I made the decisions to let her into my car, or to meet her at hotels. The people I should've been feeling sorry for were my other woman's husband, and most of all, my own wife.

If you're not fullly owning up to it, chances are that your wife perceives this, and is bothered by it. Own it. And make sure your wife knows -- by your words & actions -- that you're owning it. Then you'll be in a lot better position to start getting better & help your wife get better.

And, yeah, you need to put your marriage above the job. If in a year from now, you could have one or the other (the marriage or the job), but not both, which would you choose? There is No Friggin' Way you can work with this woman & not have it mess with your wife's mind as well as your own.

Hi ED,

You know where to start - you've been given all the pointers. Like they said you KNOW what you have to do, you just have to do it.

If you continue as you are your wife will resent you more and more and it will become impossible for you to meet any of her needs because she will shut down from you.

Really listen to what she is saying- try to put yourself in her shoes- (I'm FWW) but to think of you going into work every day really makes me feel ill, I can feel my heart rate increase and my palms getting sweaty.

Stop making excuses and get out of there. If she decides she can no longer take it (this will not go away without you taking action) then the financial implications will be serious anyway.

Relationships between you 2 are clearly strained. Those 4 boys are very impressionable- will be picking up on their mothers sadness and anxiety - and that is down to you. You have to work hard to make sure you help her recover quickly and ensure your boys don't suffer any long term effects.


And this brings me on to extraordinary precautions.

You need to come up with a list of things that you will do to ensure that your behaviour will not be repeated and this includes your online shennanigans.

Mine include:
No 1:1 conversations with any men
No online converation with men without a chaperone

They seem extreme - but I am so wary of how these things start - as surely you must be now too.

But before anything else you have to stop contact; no matter how indifferently you feel towards OW at the mo.

Recovery can start once you end contact.

Good Luck!

ST

Emo,

You have both an unpleasant screen name and unfortunate initials. Would you consider changing your name? If your identification of yourself is that you are "emotionally dead", it suggests that you have no feelings for your wife and your marriage, and are not capable of having a conscience about what you have done. I think your name sends out a signal and I am put off by it. Your wife might be too.

You said

I think you need to take this problem back to management and at a higher level than store manager. Apparently they know about your affair, and are of the opinion that OW's affairs have caused them to lose 3 managers in the recent past. Apparently she has received some kind of warning about her behaviour, and if they hear of her involvement with you again, she will be sacked.

This shows that the company IS willing to step in when they think that company efficiency is being harmed by inappropriate personal relationships. They do not sit back and say that affairs are none of their business when their interests are at risk.

You have to present your move as being in their best interest. You must point out that it is better for them to avoid further contact altogether than to have it happen and then have to sack someone. You could suggest that they might become embroiled in a harassment suit or a claim for constructive dismissal if they do not transfer one of you. You could point out that by scuppering the last transfer, they kept the affair partners in close proximity and are not allowing one of them - you - to restore his marriage. That is appalling management (and it is hardly going to win them their "Investor in People" award). You must have this conversation NOW. Make an appointment first thing on Monday with HR at higher than branch level.

You may feel that you have done a huge amount by staying home when your wife has been ill, and putting up with her grief, but you have not pulled out many stops to end the source of her daily, grinding anxiety by getting away from OW at work. You have not really put in much effort there at all.

This is seen by your wife as a lack of care for what you are making her go through, and soon, as you say, she might end the marriage because of it. How have you been able to look at her in pieces FOR A YEAR and not do anything to stop it?

You say that your actions do not match your intentions but I am sorry to tell you that actions always do. You have not gone flat out to get away from the work situation because, deep down, you do not see the need for that; your own words show this. You put having a good income and working compatible hours above ending your wife's pain. No wonder she wants to walk away.

I don't know that you need to "unlock" emotionally as a person - at least not if this involves looking at your childhood and focusing on your undemonstrative parents. What you do need is to end all contact and meet your wife's most important emotional needs. If they include conversation, then you must have conversations with her. If her needs include affection then you must hug, kiss and cuddle in the way she would like, as often as she would like. You do not have to make any reference to your parents and their ways in order to do this; you just do it.

When you do not show compassion for your wife, and respond to her grief, she feels that this is because you do not actually have compassion for her and you do not see your affair as the trauma that it is for her. Indeed, when you say that your life is much more enjoyable than your wife's you prove that you are not thinking very deeply about what she is going through. She knows that you feel this, and she interprets your lack of trauma as a lack of basic humanity on your part. You have to change this impression or marital recovery will never begin.

There is no magic to doing this. You must go all out to make her happy (first and foremost, by changing jobs), talk and listen to her, and show affection and compassion, (if she wants those things).

You should book a sessions with the Harley coaching centre right away. YOU should do this and not wait for your wife to suggest it or make the booking. The more active you become, the more your wife will see that you are working on recovery and her own feelings will start to change.

Another British poster says this about telephone coaching from the UK:

If you have problem putting your intentions into practice, then Steve Harley would be good for you because he tells you what to do and what to say in various scenarios.

First of all I would like to say thanks to everyone whos taken time to reply to my thread, im reading everything carefully as this means a lot to me....

So.....

Writer 1 - Thanks for your views, I was expecting the reoccuring theme of NC as ive read other threads on here. I do understand and as stated I WILL make it my main objective to job hunt starting ASAP.

I will make a critism of a few users at this point - While I understand I MUST leave my job and the OW behind me 'QUITING instantly' is not an option for ANYONE living in the real world. Ive already devestated my family once so losing our family home and ability to feed the kids isnt an option. I dont know what job hunting is like in the US now the econamy is 'alledgyly on the up' after the stimulus plan, but here its still shocking. Companies falling into administration daily etc..... Anyway im getting distracted. I fully understand that I must leave ASAP but it will be when a full plan is in place

I need to hear the harsh reality of the situation from someone other than my wife. People who are in similar situations, have priceless advice to offer etc, and as I said im buying into MB fully. My wife and I have just ordered the 'Surviving the affair' book from amazon.


MelodyLane - I have sat down and introduced my W to this site and she has a thread of her own, her username is brutallyhonest28 and the thread is called 'one year on, when will it get better'.

Your right, I've been struggling identifying and understanding her pain. This is a big issue for us and as you say allows me to make ther situation worse by not making allowances towards her in everyday life.

I have already sourced the two questionaires in question and we will sit down and spend some quality time together.


Doingfine - as stated in my first post, i have disclosed ALL contact with OW. Always in the presence of management or customers and strictly professional (3 times in last year) - three times to many I ACCEPT!


Gloveoil - Ordered book today, couple of days delivery, will definately be making time with wife to read it

In terms of the affair im definately owning it, in fact my wife wants me to blame OW more :-s

In terms of your direct reference to the internet, im considering the truth in what you've said, I have felt more victim than perp, I offered support and they got attached but I guess helping someone at weak time for them and helping them, being their support could lead to problems but if everyone thought like this the world would be an even darker place. But still Ive learnt that lesson the hard way and they are someone elses problem now. Im all busy with the one that matters - my amazing wife

Back to the A, In fact I was the person who was low and wanted support and friendship.

Job wise, fair play and im going to sort this see above responses


Staytogether - Your spot on she has already begun shutting down, not because of the A but my actions or lack off, since.

Internet wise Im already ahead on that one, ive deleted facebook, dont use chat rooms AT ALL, never used MSN and so basically interent is for info and MB only and im glad for that


Sugarcane - I actually wanted Emotionally_Stunted but its too long I dont like emotionally dead either but that was the last issue on my mind this morning while posting for the first time, but of course id be happy to rethink

Ok my Store - management didnt give a ***edit*** about A as long as it didnt effect running of store. It did as explained and that pissed them off no end. I became unrealiable and as I was the only member of management in my department (nights) at the time, covering wasnt easy as everyone else worked days. Also sickness was obvisouly very short notice for them depending on day at home and sometimes I just didnt turn up. I got sat down repeatidly and slowly my record became offical. She carried on her work without issue as she wasnt bothered so of course came accross like little miss innocent. Difference was when I was at work I was professional while she was using her friends at work to make my life difficult. I would complain to management and they would just accuse me of making a mountain from a mole hill. I sourced a transfer, really looking forward to it, and then the store manager pulled plug on it as I was only manager. Now I have support my record is too poor and NO one will take me.

The main issue with your suggestion is that everything at the store is quiet now and has been for months so if I try to raise A either within store or higher - ***edit*** will hit fan to say least. Think I should job hunt ASAP and if no luck transfer first opportunity in January when record clears.

She has no warning but my wife write a letter to GSM (store manager), he refused to act on it but has put it into her file incase of future issues with her.

Right emotions - Your right about me not seeing the immediate need to get away from the work situation - I have always tried to be transparent with it, we speak and text alot while im working, my phone is always available for her to look through, I update her on OW movements/rotas etc.... I can appreciate upon reflection that this hasnt been enough, and as stated previsouly i'll take care of this.

When I talk about 'unlocking' im not talking about childhood but I do not feel normal, and am certainly told im not normal for my feelings/reactions etc.. Im refering to my lack of apparent understanding/identifying/empathising......

I want to be with my wife and that I know and why im here. Its taken a lot of sieving through ***edit*** to find this site but im glad im finally here.

I hate the fact that I would be able to carry on like nothing has happened if my wife allowed this to drift away. She has to remind me and drag me away from everyday life to pull me back into the situation. Im just being honest here and I hope it'll help.

I have no issue with contact wife my wife its the convosations and not due to content I'll talk to her about anything and everything but she is such a deep person and im such an emotional retard. We start talking and shes just gets to deep for me and I just sit there dumbstruck with no answer which leads to understandable rage on her behalf - THIS IS PERMANENT REOCCURING ISSUE, but one I cannot get closer to her on. I've sort therapy/counciling and even tried hypnotherapy so believe me I've TRIED - for once.

I know you have come over from my wifes thread and I thank you for your support/advice to her I really appreciate it


All - Now i've almost finished this huge reply im off to discuss phone coaching with my princess.

With such a large reply im sure I've missed bits or mis read things but bear with me and ask anything you need to.

Thanks all and goodnight x

Okay, be that then.

Have you read Brightlion's thread in the Recovery Forum. He also is a WS trying to recover M. There's some good advice and links in that thread you may find helpful.

Gg

I think everyone is aware of the state of the economy. Jobs are scarce and difficult to come by. It's a scary time. It's easy to give the advice that someone should quit their job, but probably quite difficult for anyone to actually do it.

That being said, you've been at this job for a YEAR after the end of your A. For the past year, you have been putting your job before your BW and your family. You have hindered the R of your M. I honestly don't think you and your BW will ever be able to move on from this as long as you keep working with the OW. You made the decision to sleep with a co-worker. When you pick up one end of the stick, you pick up the other. All actions have consequences. You can choose your actions; you can't choose your consequences. Maybe you can't just quit your job today, but the longer you put it off, the less chance you have of saving your M. I guess only you can decide where your priorities lie.

By the way, a D isn't cheap. Your finances may be tight if you have to quit your job and go on unemployment and live off one income for awhile. But what's going to happen to your finances if you and your BW end up in D? That's going to affect your finances for the rest of your life.

I'll take a look thanks for direction

Absolutely right and I dont intend to waste a second longer, im going to see what jobs are around right now.

Just printed off questionaires so thats another thing to look forward too

Rough night, after all the hope we had from finding MB, ordering book, questionaires, advice from users, we had a harsh convosation.

Altough MB gives us a fighting chance theres also the darkside of this site - users that have seen couples fail telling new users when they see similar traits in their situations.

MY BIGGEST ISSUE IS MY LACK OF EMOTIONS!!
Its driving us BOTH mad.

I will post more but right now im falling asleep on the pc as I havent slept yet. Sorry i'll be back as soon as I can.

Thanks again

You are both trying.
Neither of you has quit.
Therefore, there is hope.
That being said, now there is work for you to do.

with this you are expecting your W to beleive you, after the ultimate of lies. You can honestly say that this person, when you see her, does NOT provoke some kind of emotional response from you? whether it be a sadness, excitement etc....no matter what there is something, whether you speak 10 words or none.
The economy is tough, theres no doubt, and if you listen to the news, world news, you know its bad in the U.S. also, just saying that my H would NOT stay married to me and see the women he got naked with at the same time, period.
How many applications have you put in? What other "careers" have you thought about, friends that have companies that you have begged for a job, working two jobs to make up for one?



This is a quote that tells me your still in the W thinking, not everyone thinks like this, not everyone slips onto the internet and offers support to OW without their S knowing, this is not making the world a brighter place. Your support should go to your W, your sympathy, empathy, intimacy should STAY with your W, leave support, sympathy, empathy, intimacy for OW up to someone else, you obviously are not intended for this job. You are still making excuses for yourself. Your not getting "it" and because your not getting it, your more likely to be in this situation again.

ok, not trying to be difficult here but, WHAT?? you have emotions, trust me, you just got done saying how sad the world would be without this, what is it exactly when your offering an ear, sympathy, empathy to these people that get attached to you? Your emotionless to your W because you want to be, because it hurts to bad to admitt what you've done to her, your poor W sees all this emotion that you give to everyone else but her.

That is not a darkside, yll. You need to know what to do to save your marriage and you need to know what will not work. What you are doing will not lead to recovery. Going to work with the OW every day is wrecking your marriage and posters would be remiss if they didn't tell you that.

Your marriage is not going to get better doing questionaires and ordering a book. It will only get better by you leaving your job. Until you leave the job, things will continue to desinigrate. Telling your wife about contact with the OW does not erase the damage that was caused by the contact.

My feelings for my H were muted and difficult and inconsistent while I was still in contact with the OM. The A was over, but we remained in contact for another year and a half because of our OC. I thought I had no choice, that I had to stay in contact and try to keep OM involved in our OC's life. Our contact was all long-distance, since he lives 3000 miles away. We spoke on the phone twice and I would email him about doctor's appointments and such. Even this little bit of contact affected my feelings for my BH.

I can't imagine how working with the OM and having to see him everyday would have affected the way I felt. I can guarantee that your feelings will be much more stable when you establish complete NC. Things will be so much clearer then. It doesn't matter if you don't have any feelings for the OW. Seeing her day in and day out is still affecting the way you feel about your W and your ability to fully move on.