>Back to the battle...

Knowing that you have He who is Good and Just out there with you...

Believe it, ID.

I've seen His work first hand. Justice will happen, if you offer yourself to be His tool.

I'll keep you in my thoughts and prayers tonight, indarkness. I know it isn't easy, but you're doing the right thing.

Yep. Glad to see you're calling in the Big guns. That's the kind of help you'll need here. Truly the devil you are against right now. Your very family is under attack. Know that, and you'll do the right thing.

BTW...

Don't be discouraged by reading the RunnerBoy thread as I am of the belief it was a fake thread.

Everything just went to perfectly for him...

It wasn't reality. It was a story.

Your situation IS reality.

Mr. Wondering

p.s. - I don't know this for certain.

>Your very family is under attack.

This is so true.

It would be difficult to NOT feel like one was in darkness when these things are happening. However, as light has a way of replacing darkness, lets talk about light for a while.

If you Know God is real, and if you know why we are here, then you know why these things happen. I believe the quote goes something like "It must needs be that there is opposition in all things."

You are getting lots of good advice here. You can make sure you do the right thing, in the right way, if you spend some time in prayer as you think about the course you will follow.

It doesn't look like there is any thing that the church can do at this point, as WW and OM don't seem to be taking advice from anywhere but the dark side, but they can pray for you. If WW has friends in your ward, you can ask for that kind of help, and tell them you are still fighting for your marriage. It may be that if they are praying for you (and your family including WW) that they will think of ways to help.

No matter what happens.......... you can still be happy. Your happiness does not depend on what your W does. Most of us know that on some level, but we have a hard time believing it, and feeling it.

There are many things you can't do right now. You can't make your W have the right attitude. You can't make her repent, and you can't make her love you. However, you can do things that will increase the chances of these things happening.

Do make sure you see a lawyer and that you increase your chances of keeping your children. Try to make sure that if she leaves, she can't take the children with her. I am guessing from what you have related, that she may just up and leave with little or no plan. Don't let your children go with her if she does.

Do let her experience the consequences of her actions. It is past the point where we can say that she made a mistake in a moment of weakness, and is trying to recover.
Notice that when we jump off a cliff, God does not catch us. He lets us experience the result of our decisions.

The stick of plan A doesn't mean that you are beating her, but it means you do let her experience the results of her choices. That includes telling the kids, making sure she can't take them and run, not funding her affair, and what ever else you need to do to protect the rest of your family from her bad decisions.

Do make the changes in yourself that you need to make. I have gotten a great deal from the materials found on this web site, and in Dr Harley's books. If you make the changes, and improve yourself, you get to keep them, no matter what she does.

It may help to think about this from another POV.
If she died, you would go on. You would make a happy life for yourself, and your children.
You could, and you would.

Sure you want to do all you can to make it work, but don't just hope, because hope all by itself is not a plan.

Keep in mind that God really is there. If it was best that he intervene directly, he would. Often it is best that we go through these experiences though, and he lets us. However, he helps us too. I hope you feel the help.

Make a plan, and run the plan daily. Be a light house. Be the port in a storm. Tell her that she can join you, or not, but that you are going to do the right things, in the right way no matter what she does. Then do them. Someday your children will thank you. Your W may also.

SS

I would pass OM's email along to the bishop, OMW's attorney, and OM's parents. I would get some contact info and start exposing some more to their families. Make your WW not worth the hassle.

Also, get your legal ducks in a row. Meet with a lawyer discuss your options. At some point your WW is going to move out. Well, when she does, you have an order drawn up with your lawyer FORBIDDING her to do so. Then if she still moves, you can file for abandonment and be in a good custody position. WW's only understand consequences, and you need to be prepared to subject her some tough consequences. Sure, if she comes back it will only be because the alternative is worse, but if she comes back and ends her affair, you will have a chance to build things back again.

So, indarkness, how did it go last night?

I talked to a very good lawyer I know yesterday and he referred me to another lawyer I know very well but didn't know he was a divorce lawyer. Very upstanding man. Exactly the kind of person I want handling this. Waiting for him to call back.

I went on a daddy-daughter date with my DD and we talked about marriage, what it meant, particularly in the context of a temple marriage. We talked about the importance of vows and covenants and why we don't break them. However, I couldn't bring myself to tell her about the A.

I talked to the marriage counselor about it later and she said "trust your parental instincts." But she also pointed out that in young children, the frontal cortex (logic center of the brain) is still developing. Their emotional core (temporal lobe??? i forget) is fully developed. So, young children will hear this and will act to it emotionally but without really understanding what's going on. She then asked "what will they get out of this, how will it help them?" So, I need to think on it some more.

If I had teenagers, that would be one thing, but an 8-year old little girl??? I don't know. And don't give me the "kids are resilient" line because that's the BS my WW keeps giving me to justify divorce.

I am having dinner with my 11-year old DS tonight. He saw WW writing an e-mail and saw line that said "[BS] is not helping me with divorce." We talked about it a bit but I plan on discussing it more with him tonight. Even when he saw this, he wasn't freaked out or anything. Just kind of talked to me and moved on. So, yes, kids are resilient, i guess.


Back in the mud, I'm really getting a view into the thinking of OM and WW now that their only communication line is through e-mail that I have. They are looking to set up a rendezvous. No time or place yet but I'll make sure it gets shut down.

OM seems very addicted to sex. Constantly, constantly makes references, etc. WW doesn't always respond to his gestures and sometimes does so hesitantly. But, at other times, goes along with it.

One cool thing, I blocked him from calling my home #!!! It surprised him and now they are all paranoid about phone calls. Yes!!! I think it's time to completely shut down the land line. No one of importance calls on it...

OM is also REALLY agitated by the fact that I have not responded to his e-mail. He keeps pressuring my wife to get info and I just give her one word clips: "Did you see it. yeah. What do you think? Interesting." I forwarded it to Bishop. Man it feels good to just know I've got OMs prissy panties in a wad.

I'm sure the joy will be short lived as something else comes up and implodes. But in the meantime, I'll enjoy my small victories.

Ok think on this: here emotional core is fully developed but she's not mature enough to figure out the logic. So her mom suddenly stops loving her dad - how long before her mom stops loving her too? Maybe her mom will get a new DD! Maybe it was because she misbehaved and she's being punished. She must be pretty lousy to make her mom hate both her and her dad. THIS IS WHAT YOU ARE TEACHING HER BY NOT TELLING HER!!! IF YOU DON'T TELL HER THE TRUTH, HER SELF-ESTEEM FROM HERE ON OUT FOR THE REST OF HER LIFE WILL LOOK LIKE THIS!!!!!!

The WHOLE reason you need to tell your children is EXACTLY because they are not fully able to reason it out for themselves.

I understand you don't want to tell your kids, but I believe you are making a mistake here. It seems as though, if your WW continues this A and does move toward D and being with the OM, they are going to find out anyway. If you don't tell them, they will find out from her, and she will do everything in her power to convince them that her relationship with the OM is right. After all, she wants OM to be their new daddy. She's going to twist everything around and use any tactic she can to present the relationship in a positive light.

You have a very narrow window of opportunity here for your kids to hear this first from you, presented in a way that lets them know that A's are not okay and that what your WW is doing is wrong.

I know talking to an 8 year old sounds scary, but do you really want your WW to bring OM into your house and tell your kids he's their new daddy and that they're all going to be a big, happy family now? How much scarier would that sort of scenario be?

OK, I am now about to go ballistic...

I just read an e-mail exchange between OM and WW that said they were having sex in my car when my 20 month old was in there with them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

##!!$$????##@@

This marriage is over. My wife is psychotic.

I am going to bring that [censored] down.

And all kids will know tonight!! Well, i guess not my precious 20-month old.

Be careful what you do. Don't drag your self down with them.

You need to be cold and calculating. Not acting on emotion.

SS

ITA with Writer.

I would never ever give you the kids are resiliant line. fWh AND the OW both tried to hand that one to me all dressed up on a silver platter - but it was still horse hockey.

If kids are so resiliant how come my 9 year old (then 3 year old) STILL has anger issues? How come it took 2 extra years to potty train him? How come my littles still are afraid to sleep alone (OW would leave them and go out partying after they went to bed - they would often wake up to NO adult being there)?

Kids are NOT silly putty.

And they WILL look to YOUR behavior to guide them through this. If you are not open and honest with them from the get go, they will take that into account and kids ALWAYS "live what they learn."

Are YOU going to be open and honest or closed off and shut up?

Be very, VERY watchful of your littlest little. I cannot stress enough how much you need to make sure his schedule is constant, and that you are there for him at all times.

I cratered during the beginning of the nightmare. I could barely function. As a result, my DS9 (then 3ish) internalized A LOT of fear he felt eminating from me and the tension in the house.

He still has some problems, but compare him to the kid he was 2 years ago and you'd be amazed at how he's growing.

(now I have a lump...I have so much guilt for not being supermom during that time...I should've let the waynerds rot and sucked it all up, but instead I cratered...ungh!)

indarkness: Don't do anything that you may later regret. Acting impulsively out of anger is never a good idea. You need to calm down, sit down and come up with a plan, and then stick to that plan.

Do tell the kids tonight. Obviously, they are already being exposed to your WW's behavior, so not telling them makes no sense at all.

By the way, keep the emails. Print them out. They could come in very handy if this goes to Plan D in helping you to get custody of the kids. You do not want WW and OM raising your kids in your house on your dime.

ID - ***edit***

Please keep an eye out - your 20 month old may in fact "remember".

Print out the email. DO NOT TELL ANYONE. Go straight to your attorney's office. Do not talk to friends, do not talk to family. It will be expensive but $200 spent in a session with your attorney will do a lot to calm your emotions and see things how the law looks at it than having your friends egg you on to do something dumb. The OM may be a [censored] but unless she was raped, your WW allowed it to happen.

If I were you, I would file an order of protection against your WW. In it, stipulate that you get the home, primary residency of the children, and supervised visition for your WW. It clearly shows she does not have the children's best interest in mind with her shagging the OM in front of the kids.

ID,
If they don't know you're reading their emails, don't tip them off!! THis is all stuff that will go in front of the judge, so let them dig their graves.
Regarding the kids--DD is about to find out that SHE IS BEING REPLACED WITH ANOTHER DD (or DS). This OC is not her sibling. It's the baby her mommy made during an affair with POS-OM. Not discounting the fact that the baby will be born innocent, its very existence is a threat to YOUR children's well being.
You NEED to let them know ALL of this. Including the OC growing in mommy's tummy. Seriously.
And save the email about the SF with the child in the car. That's child abuse. How can this woman claim to be at all Christian. She and the POS-OM are amoral. There's a special place in hell for people like this.