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Originally Posted by Scotland
Well ML I would love to try to stop them from seeing her but I don't think that is really possible right now. WH lives with OW and he has nowhere else to take them. I either let him come in here or go to her house.

Scotland, you can tell him he is not to take the kids around the OW no matter what. He can take them to the park, a restaurant, or whereever. He can figure that out. But I would make him get a court order if he wants to take your children in situations that are unfit for little children. Otherwise, he shouldn't be allowed to see them. He should not be allowed to corrupt them without putting up a fight.

Many parents here in Plan B have made this stipulation. Your Plan B is likely to outlast his affair, anyway. I wouldn't make this easy on him at your childrens expense. IF he wants to abandon his family for an affair, then he should be forced to go to the trouble of finding a decent place for their visitation.

Putting your foot down about this sends a strong message to him and the OW that their relationship is UNFIT for children. And it is. He needs to keep his kids away from his affair. Allowing this exposure sends the message of endorsment. If your kids see you put your foot down they will know you are serious about the inappropriateness of their dad's adultery.

Many folks here have prevented their kids from contact with the OP and even had this stipulated in their court papers. If he is going to corrupt your children, i would make him have to FIGHT for the opportunity.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by Vittoria
Our court system, from what I've heard from others in adulterous situations, treats both parties of separation/divorce the same, regardless of one person having an A.

oh ok, I was not aware there was a court order that he could expose the children to his affair. This has been to court?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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I strongly agree with Melodylane.
I would find out if you can do this legally, if you can that's great, if you can't then I'd go with a verbal stipulation via the IM's.
Your kids can be fully aware that you do not condone WH exposing them to OW, for the stated facts that it is cruel and abusive.

You maybe can't force WH to follow your stipulation, but he and your kids will know that you strongly disapprove of this.
Make it as difficult as possible.

It makes me sick that your boys are exposed to POSOW.


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If there is no court order, I would be tellng him that if she wants to continue to see the kids, he will have to protect them from his affair and not take them around his fellow adulterer. EVER. That is an indecent situation for kids. He can ride around, take them to the movies, or maybe visit them at your MIL.

But please don't let him corrupt your kids without a fight, Scotland. His affair is too indecent and will very likely not last beyond any potential legal proceedings. Disallowing him to take the kids around this skank will make his affair very inconvenient and it will send a strong message to everyone concerned that this situation is unfit for kids.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by Vittoria
Our court system, from what I've heard from others in adulterous situations, treats both parties of separation/divorce the same, regardless of one person having an A.

oh ok, I was not aware there was a court order that he could expose the children to his affair. This has been to court?
no,no,no ...... omg I don't know if we are that backwards here, I'm saying that I've not ever heard that a BS is able to make that stipulation in legal agreements.
Our courts do not recognize adultery as grounds for anything, as far as I know.
I think Scotland just answered some of your questions in her last post.

We really need a Canadian lawyer around here!

Last edited by Vittoria; 12/25/09 08:36 PM.

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Originally Posted by Vittoria
I would find out if you can do this legally, if you can that's great, if you can't then I'd go with a verbal stipulation via the IM's.

It is not illegal to prevent your kids from being introduced to corrupt situations. The ONUS should be on him to get legal relief, NOT HER. All she has to do is say that she won't let the kids go with him if they are going to be introduced to his filthy affair. And in order to let them go, he has to assure her of this.

Otherwise, he can have supervised visitation at her mothers. [or other relative] If he doesn't like it, he can get a court order. Most WSs wouldn't DARE pull such a sleazy stunt in Plan B. BS' do this all the time here. This is usually stipulated in the Plan B letter, but it can be communicated via the IM.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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In other words, until there IS a legal separation in place, SCOTLAND is the law of the land. And will be so until her H has a court order and a SHERIFF to execute such order.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Otherwise, he can have supervised visitation at her mothers. [or other relative] If he doesn't like it, he can get a court order. Most WSs wouldn't DARE pull such a sleazy stunt in Plan B. BS' do this all the time here.
okay, I see what you are saying ..... let WH get a court order to see his kids if the BS won't allow visitation if the WS won't guarantee the children's safety ie. NC with OP.
That makes perfect sense and a good route to go.



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I would be asking the IMs to send him this:

The kids have told Scotland that they have been introduced to your adultery partner, which is inappropriate for kids. She has has asked me to tell you that the kids are not to be in the OW's home or in her presence under any circumstances. In order to continue visitations, she would need your assurance that they won't be in the OW's home or exposed to her in any way.

She wants you to have as much contact as possible with the boys, but not if it means they are exposed to your affair.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Vittoria, it is often a huge wake up call to the WS to realize that their "relationship" is unfit for children. They will USE children to try and give their affair a false air of respectibility. But when kids are not allowed to be dragged into their affair, the reality of the sleaziness of their affair takes some of the gloss off the shiny pig pen.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Vittoria, it is often a huge wake up call to the WS to realize that their "relationship" is unfit for children. They will USE children to try and give their affair a false air of respectibility. But when kids are not allowed to be dragged into their affair, the reality of the sleaziness of their affair takes some of the gloss off the shiny pig pen.
ITA, the part that I couldn't get was how to enforce this if not legally.
I do now, thanks.


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Okay I will try to do what you are suggesting as soon as I get him to sign my child custody agreement. After that WH will not be able to take the kids away from me. Right now, he could actually take the kids for a visit and not bring them back. If I tried to tell him he couldn't visit with the children until he finds somewhere else to take them he may retaliate with keeping them until I get a court order. It may be a week before I can get this figured out with all of the holidays and stuff.

I am definitely going to talk to a lawyer and do some more research. I know I need to get the custody agreement signed FIRST and then I will have the right to have them with me and WH will have no recourse.

Thank you for your recommendations. It truly did hurt me to have them be with OW and she even sent home some cake. That went in the GARBAGE. Good thing the garbage goes out tomorrow, I can't get it out of my house fast enough.


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Scotland, what's your feeling on WH signing a custody order??
What is your recourse if he won't sign such an agreement?


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Scotland, most waywards will comply because they know deep down what they are doing is wrong. They know it is bad for the kids. What he is doing is outrageous and I would put a stop to it ASAP.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Scotland, most waywards will comply because they know deep down what they are doing is wrong. They know it is bad for the kids. What he is doing is outrageous and I would put a stop to it ASAP.

This is true Scotland. I got my WH (now X) to sign a separation agreement that says ds was not to be exposed to ANY woman of a romantic nature while we were still married and our divorce agreement says he can't have over night guests while ds is with him. I probably could not have got a judge to order that, but as Melody says most won't dare challenge such a basic requirement of decent parental behavior.

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I am writing the custody agreement exactly as we had discussed the night I went into Plan B. He told me then that it was fair and it is. I am relatively sure he will sign it.

As long as he does sign it then I would have legal recourse if he was to try to keep the kids when he is supposed to return them. He even wrote them an email saying that he would bring them there for a sleepover after christmas.


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Praying for walls and doors. Thanx MM

“Surviving is important. Thriving is elegant.”
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Originally Posted by Scotland
He even wrote them an email saying that he would bring them there for a sleepover after christmas.

faint OMG, my father corrupted me in the same way when I was little but he would have never DARED take me for an overnight with one his mistresses. He actually took me to his hotel room to meet his OW when I was FOUR and that was bad enough. But, I did go to counseling for YEARS and was able to overcome being so screwed up by the moral confusion.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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WH had a childhood where his parents cheated and actually brought those people in to their house. He always said he wouldn't have an A because of how much he suffered as a child. Guess he didn't stick to that one. That's why I am telling my boys everything about the affair and how wrong it is. My Dad was abusive and I broke the cycle and I hope to teach my children to break the cycle of adultery that has been passed down for generations.

Last edited by Scotland; 12/25/09 09:36 PM.

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Plan B Dec18/09
Personal R in works
Scotty's THING laugh
Newly Betrayed click here


Praying for walls and doors. Thanx MM

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Scotland, most waywards will comply because they know deep down what they are doing is wrong. They know it is bad for the kids. What he is doing is outrageous and I would put a stop to it ASAP.

I agree with Mel and the other posters here that you still have the authority to decide what is right for the boys.

Its so common that OW will listen to the WH spin the tales of what a good Family man he was and so on and want to have that with the Man they steal from their families. Part of the desparate fantasy crap they both buy into. They don't even think of what the children go through, its all about the fantasy.

WH had a wholesome home where he could be with his children and chose to leave. If he could see that he has run off to join the circus in his mind then maybe he would not try to raise his children with the yak lady and feed them carnival food. (No offense to any Yaklady who has a wholesome marriage BTW)

Poor Scotland, You do so well, and another boundary needs to be set that causes you pain and frustration. Thank God and I mean God for these people here that are like angels. They come here everyday tirelessly for years defending Love. They are so on the money with the advice and support.

As I read here a line in a song by Pete Townsend keeps coming to mind. One of my favorite songs BTW. "You better you bet"

"When I say 'I love you' you SCREAM you better, you better you bet.
You better bet your life,.. or it will cut you...cut you like a knife..."


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
DD-29 with DGDs 5 and 1yr
DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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Sorting- I so agree with you about thanking God and the universe for MB and the people here. If it weren't for all of you I would be living in my own personal H3ll with NO CHANCE to save my M. As it is now I have a slight chance but slight is better than none. I just want to get the custody agreement signed and then I can play hardball with no worries. My IM will be home on Saturday night, I will contact them and get them to ask him to come to their house to sign the paperwork. Then after that they can write him the email about not letting OW near them. I will have to endure it until then. He is picking them up tomorrow and Sunday.

Thank you so much all for your support and advice. I sometimes need a good kick in the pants. My sister told me that I shouldn't try to do this because it will just cost me money. Well, guess what WH has no money either.


BW(Me)aka Scotty:37
DSx2: 10,12
DDAY2(PA)Nov27/09
Plan B Dec18/09
Personal R in works
Scotty's THING laugh
Newly Betrayed click here


Praying for walls and doors. Thanx MM

“Surviving is important. Thriving is elegant.”
? Maya Angelou

PROGRESS NOT PERFECTION

THANK YOU
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