The subject line refers to my story over in Surviving an Affair (see my signature for the thread).

I'm starting a thread here for several reasons. I'll try to be brief (not an easy task for me).

My track to the divorce court began on D-Day. I was so stunned by my wife's seeming change of heart and turnabout on our marriage, that at first I resigned myself to the inevitable. That she had violated every precept she seemed to hold and went outside of the marriage and had an affair with a married man just boggled my mind.

Then I found MarriageBuilders. I received a lot of good information, advice and support here. For a while hope rose that perhaps I could save the marriage. But it became apparent that while my wife exhibited all of the traits of a wayward spouse, she also had symptoms of major personality disorders and that she might be beyond marital recovery. Sadly, I had to accept this possibility and researched long and hard. While I am not qualified to diagnose, her very dysfunctional upbringing and past history strongly suggest this. Her recent behavior and the warnings I chose to ignore (multiple marriages, abandoning her children, financial irresponsibility) during our marriage support this, too.

Thus I have come to believe that not only is divorce inevitable, it is actually preferable in my case. I have been "hovering" on the SAA forum but now I'm finding that reading posts from the newcomers, as well as those struggling to save their marriages is becoming emotionally painful for me to read.

I'm having periods of "if only" thoughts: If only I'd worked a better Plan A. If only I'd said this. If only I'd exposed to X. If only...

This is pointless. As has been stated innumerable times, one can't educate a wayward, one can't change how another thinks or behaves, and one can't recover a marriage that the other doesn't want to recover.

MarriageBuilders has been a godsend and a sanity-saver for me. I have read all the articles here, have purchased three of Dr. Harley's books, and now I am working to make myself a better and more capable relationship partner. In an effort to "pay it forward," I have attempted to help others new to the SAA board. But I lack the skills or experience to do so, and I do not wish to offer advice I'm not equipped to give.

Consider this my attempt to wean myself off the SAA board and move into a newer, healthier venue. I know there is a lot of hurt and confusion surrounding divorce as well as when dealing with an affair. But I hope to find healing and hope moving ahead. My marriage will officially end in late April (unless some miracle on the order of Moses parting the Red Sea occurs). By then, my Plan B no contact (also strongly recommended by those dealing with personality disordered relationships) should have me at a point where the decree is just the "rubber stamp" on the fact that is already in place.

I wish everyone who is attempting to recover their marriages well. It wasn't destined for me, and if it doesn't pan out for you, there is still hope and healing. I'm on board this forum now, and I welcome anyone else who wants to survive it all.

Hi Fred,

Welcome! I read your thread the other day. I think you handled everything as well as anyone could have.

My 1st marriage ended in D, and it was the best thing that could have happened. I knew I gave it my best. My exH had big issues, too, so it was a dark plan B for me as well.

The year after my D was interesting. Lonely, scary, fun, exciting...

After about two years I met my current H. I was so happy not to have a psycho bully in my life that I overlooked other issues. I found myself deliberately looking for the exact opposite of my exH. Rebound can be a witch!

Take it slow, and make sure to have some fun. You'll find new stuff you never thought you'd like, so mix it up.

Try not to stress too much. I wish I had stressed less (it never helps anyway).

Please take care - Dru

Fred, I'm in the same boat. Every time I read the forums and find someone who is near or in recovery, I ask myself what I could have done differently. If they can do it, why can't I? But of course every situation is different and, as you said, so much of it relies on the WS. I guess some just never wake up. I don't think mine will either or if she does, I will never know about it cuz she won't say anything. So what other choice is there? We can't be slaves to our WWs. For our own sanity, we have to move on.

It's been 4 mos. since my D-Day and I'm feeling OK. Not great. Some days are better than others. I guess that's par for the course. WW will be gone soon and I'll be the king of the castle for a while. I think I'm OK with that. Just one day at a time, I guess.

Fred, you've already paid it forward. If it hadn't been for the guidance of yourself and a handful of other fine folks here, I'd probably still be hoping for R from my obviously unrecoverable WstbXH.

Seriously. Thanks to both you and everyone else who's coached me.

Hi Fred

I have watched your trajectory through the process of Divorce. I wished I did not but unfortunately I do understand what you are feeling. I too find it hard to read the SAA posts now. And I am migrating to this forum as well, although it is not as well traveled.

I am trying to figure out as well how to move on. I do not want to be lonely. It is hard to start over. I too am mid 50's and I sure did not expect to have to start over at this point in my life. I am not sure how one does it. I was married for 33 years and I don't think I know how to venture out into the dating scene. It seems a little daunting at this point in my life. How does a guy find a decent faithful woman? I know they must be out there as I assume there are as many shell shocked women as there are shell shocked men from being betrayed. Where does everyone go?

Any way Fred glad to see you are progressing through the stages of grief. It does seem to take time.

Take care
BCBoy

You know what, BCboy? I'm not going to look. Instead, I'm going to do things I enjoy, and not worry about finding a woman to share my life with. I am very fortunate: I have a good life! With the exception of my back (which can be addressed by surgery), I'm in remarkable good health (so confirmed once again today, in fact), earn good money, own my house, my car is paid off (and so will my stbxW's be once she returns it). My stbxW and I had no kids together, so our break is clean. The way I see it, I'm going to pursue the things that interest me, and if somewhere along the line there's a woman who enjoys them too, we'll meet.

One thing that I think becomes obvious on casual observation is how desperate some people get. I've watched guys make the rounds of a room and approach every single woman in an attempt to... what? (You know, this is what OM used to do, too. Go figure). I refuse to be desperate!!!

The reason I'm here is because I wanted so much to be in a permanent loving relationship that I allowed myself to be abused, gaslighted and blinded to reality. No more! I want to avoid rebound relationships. Life is too short to be handcuffed and narrowly-focused.

I believe what my old, dear departed friend Lynda Van DeVanter said, "God does not intend for us to be alone. There IS someone out there. She's just not ready for you, yet."

It will happen. In God's time, not mine.

Funny that you would mention this. Right after I posted to you I thought to myself "so what if you don't find someone?". I went down that thought process for a while and I came up with That's going to be OK.

So now the focus is to fill my life with meaning. I like to help others. I like to have the sense I am contributing. So I am going to get more involved in volunteering. Try to make a difference and try to help someone else. I talked to a friend of mine who works in a seniors home. They were telling me how few have family around and no one comes to visit them. That is something I can do. Let them know that someone is interested in them. I have been checking around and I am finding there are a lot of opportunities to volunteer. So I will be doing that.

It does take some adjustment. It takes time to get over the emotional trauma of a relationship breaking down. It has surprised me how long it has taken actually. But I am now feeling like I am in a better position to redefine what my new life will look like. I had spent most of my life trying to make sure others were looked after and tried to make them happy. I wanted to make sure I provided an opportunity for my children to get an education. I accomplished that and I am glad I did. However in the process I did not develop many interests of my own. I was either working or doing something for the family. Driving, attending events, and now that I am in an apartment it amazes me how much time I spent looking after a house and property.

So I think you are wise Fred. Not to rush into a relationship. I don't think I will either.

I would be curious to hear what sort of things you plan on doing with your time.

Blessings to you
BCBoy

Fred,

I don't post an awful lot anymore. But I do still read alot and I've followed your posts since your first day on MB. You did great, listened, asked intelligent questions, updated on the good news & the bad. But, as we always say, "Not all marraiges can be or should be saved." Your story isn't over yet but, regardless how it turns out, you can always know "you gave it your all".

"In an effort to "pay it forward," I have attempted to help others new to the SAA board. But I lack the skills or experience to do so, and I do not wish to offer advice I'm not equipped to give."

You don't lack the skills & experience. You have a wonderful talent for providing that shoulder all new posters need. Your responses to the new poster provide the compassion, understanding and hope we all initially come here to get. We all need to know someone heard us & cares. Don't stop helping. You're good at it and needed!!!

Thank you for the kind and encouraging words, Nerlycrzy. People like you continue to uplift me -- especially when my spirits are down. I am typically a pretty upbeat guy, but this experience has caused me to sink to some pretty low emotional depths, and I'm not always able to pull myself up without help.

Just an update to pass on my experience to others.

I had my first counseling session today with a therapist who specializes in personality disorders. The doctor admitted that it sounded like my stbxw is afflicted -- with the caveat that without extensive testing the opinion was just that: an opinion. However, it did lend some validation to my own belief, based on the research I've been doing.

However, the focus is and was supposed to be on me. I wished to understand better the behaviors that attracted her to me and vice-versa.

The good news is that according to the therapist, she does not feel that I am similarly disordered. The mere fact that I am grieving and looking into myself suggests that I am more "normal" than not. I'll make it plain that one session is not enough to close the books, but it's a good start.

My message to anyone who feels at an emotional dead-end, who is struggling to find peace and/or closure, I think counseling is a very good idea. I resisted it for a while, but when the frustration of not being able to move on became too great, I took the plunge.

Those of you who have read my story and subsequent posts will probably come to the conclusion that I'm a pretty easy-going guy. I also believe that my story isn't as emotionally brutal as most. Therefore, if I'm finding counseling beneficial, just imagine how much good it might do you!

See, you ARE able to give good advice!! lol!
Seriously, I'm a strong proponent of counseling myself, I've always felt that an annual mental check-up should be part of everyone's health strategy, although I haven't followed my own advice. IC is essential when going through things like we experience in these forums. Good therapists are hard to find however; I've developed a theory that many are simply making money by "making people feel good about making bad choices" (not sure if I picked that up somewhere or coined the phrase myself.) I don't let my therapist get away with that- I have no problem arguing a point with my personal therapist.

Fred, thanks so much for starting this post. I'll be checking in regularly. Your contributions to this entire board have been immeasurable.
You and others have hit on a bunch of important points above. I'd like to add but I have to go make pancakes for my babies. You know I'm aware of your sitch and I have to say the "I could have done...." syndrome is probably natural. I haven't had it yet because I'm very much in the process of trying to get through the legalities and finer points of a divorce with as much intact as possible (with the utmost attention being paid to the welfare of my kids). But I'm sure it will hit me at some point. And here I'll be.

One more thing. If people aren't comfortable with a therapist/psychologist (or perhaps don't have the right insurance, etc); find a priest. I've been amazed with how available my local priest has been for me. I always think how they have an entire congregation to deal with, but he can always find an hour for me in any given day (even on Thanksgiving day last year). Didn't even matter that I had fallen away from the church for years.

And quite frankly, he has been more helpful than all the counseling I've ever been to.

~opt.

Hi Fred,
I'm glad you have move over here and have come to some acceptance in your life.
I'm fairly new to the board and I have appreciated your advice and compassion when I was telling my story and my hurt over the whole situation.....
For me it somehow gave me comfort to know that what I was feeling and going through was very normal and that I wasn't the only one that it was happening to, that is how we all feel I think..... being able to totally express and tell our stories to someone/anyone helps with our healing......
I'm sorry for all you have gone through and none of us derserved to be treated in such a way.....
We that come out on the other side are strong and compassionate people and we should be proud of ourselves and somewhere when we least expect it someone out there will notice all the good in us and we will again feel like we matter to someone, in the meantime if you are like me you haven't had a lot of time to make my friends feel special because we have been so time consumed by my own life.....it's time to get back on the friendship train and just enjoy them for what and who they are, re-connect with our kids and their lives......and all that will bring the smiles back to our faces.....
I'm 53 and starting over, not sure how to go about it but willing to give it a go...
good luck fred.......I'll be looking for updates on your life for inspiration

Jessi, I am humbled that anyone would think my story inspiring. I did not save my marriage, I did not (and could not) work a Plan A that effectively set up my Plan B, and there are so many "could'a," "should'a" and "would'a"s that come to mind that make me sad and disappointed in myself whenever I think of them.

The one positive aspect to my story is that I refuse to let myself get "stuck" in the mourning/self-flagellation stage. I know I will get through this, and it will take time, help and support from others to accomplish. To do nothing, to stay mired in the misery is unthinkable to me. I'd rather commit suicide.

So my marriage fell apart. The dreams and future I looked forward to have been smashed. I need to build new ones. There was a saying that was popular in the 1970s, do you know it? "Today is the first day of the rest of your life."

If there is any success in my story, any inspiration, it's that I choose to pick up and move on. It's tough at times. One step at a time. But I will get through it.

Thanks for your support.

fred,
I to am trying to find a new life beyond all this turmoil we have felt through out our situations....I'm like you when I think of how I played a role in all this, it breaks my heart......it's so tough to let go of a life that we have imagined for so long.......
You could have hung on to the negatives in this but seem to have a good attitude about the rest of your life and taking the opportunities as they come.....
That's what I'm going to do as well, one day at a time, I do know that saying and it is true......"Today is the first day of the rest of our lives" I hope you keep positng about how your new life is going, you are ahead of me in the process and I will be able to get a better understanding of the process of healing after a divorce......

We might not have gotten everything right in our past, but we are armed with the knowledge and insight now......

Fred, whenever I start thinking this way I remind myself that I was willing to recover, but my WW was not. I did everything I could and reading through all your posts, you did too. Just like you, I did what I thought was right at the time. But at the end of the day, we could only go half-way on our own - the WW had to do her part. And in both our situations, she did not. And not because we failed, but because the Lord gave them the power to make their own decisions, and choose they did, despite what was clearly a better choice.

I really think that some people lack the capacity of introspection - I mean deep thought. Where you can look inward and deal with both the positive and the negative and then change what you don't like. I don't think my WW possesses this which is why any possibility for recovery is pretty much doomed. Recovery requires deep inner change - the WS doesn't have to say it outright, but it's a foremost requirement. And if they can't/won't do it, then, well, recovery just ain't gonna happen.

BUT, better days are ahead because we took the high road. Each morning we can look ourselves in the mirror and be proud of who we are and how we handled one of the most difficult situations people will ever have to face in this life. We will come out of this the better men.

Best of Luck.

Thanks, indarkness. I appreciate what you said, and I know there's a lot of truth in your words.

And to Pep, I can only say

Ma'am. YES, MA'AM!

indarkness,
thanks for posting above. Your words are encouraging to me as well. You may know I didn't even make it to Plan B. Most of the time I feel I've let MB down. I believe in the principles, but I just didn't have the strength to make them work for me. I suppose that says a lot about the situation I was in but I still feel like I let people down (so many who were encouraging me for weeks during Plan A).

Ultimately, I know MB saved me in a lot of ways. I may not have been able to save my M, but I literally would have gone off the deep end without the support I found here.

~opt

Rather than start a new thread or hijack someone else's (like I almost did to _Larry_), I thought I'd revive this one (it's been a month since the last post and it still shows up pretty high on the list. This forum is less active than the one I came from, that's for sure!

The question I'm about to pose has been asked here many times before, I'm sure. I guess I'm just too lazy to search for it right now. So, here goes:

How long does it take before just the sight of your ex (or, in my case, soon-to-be-ex) does not cause an emotional/physical reaction?

I know such reactions pass, for I experience nothing of the sort when I see my first XW. And I am fully aware that I am still in the very early stages of the dissolution of my marriage (Virginia law requires a minimum six month "waiting period" before a divorce can be filed, and there are still almost 45 days before that time is up).

However, I've been in Plan B/D without contact for a bit, and this evening I had a brush with her. I was going to a meeting and thought I saw my/her car in the lot as I entered to park. Suddenly, there she was, walking toward my car. I did a quick u-turn and drove away, and did not make eye contact with her. I know she saw me (there was no way she could not).

As I drove away I felt a rush of emotions, some anger (I don't like feeling like I can't attend a meeting I enjoy) and a bit of frustration. For, as my thread title states, I'm sleeping now. I'm sleeping well, in fact. I have been pursuing some new interests (cooking class!), traveling, and running (thank God the snow has melted!) and welcoming the onset of Spring. I felt that tonight could have been a setback, but I'm posting this in order to vent that away.

I'm not hoping for reconciliation. I'm not wishing that this is a bad dream and I'll soon wake up. I know that I'm better off without her. But I won't lie: I'm sad and disappointed that my dream of living a "happily ever after" have been dashed by the thoughtless, reckless and careless behavior of the one I thought was my truest friend, partner and lover. Not a day goes by that I don't have a moment or two of mourning and disbelief.

Knowing that I can see and speak with my first XW, I wait for the time I can do the same with the next XW. I had thought she was moving away to be closer to the other woman's husband, but apparently she still finds it comfortable and necessary to come to the "old haunts." So I will have to accept the possibility that our paths will cross.

Now that I'm not tied down to this area because of the need to be near her kids, I have the option to move. But until I can close the gap between what I can get for my house and what I owe (which is nearly $100K), I guess I am tied down - at least for a while.

So, now I've vented. Will I sleep tonight? I hope so. And some day I hope I will be able to see and meet The Leopard head on and not feel a thing.

Pretty profound words - I have to agree wholeheartedly. I am proud of how I have handled the situation and myself and will always be able to look back and say I did try and was not ugly about it. WH cannot and will always have to live with how he handled things and treated everyone around with disrespect.