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Originally Posted by GloveOil
Lisa, if you want, give it another few days to allow the people to chime in who've successfully recovered their marriages despite their spouses' continuing to work with or otherwise have regular contact with their affair-partners. Maybe some of them exist.

HUH? Maybe Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy exist too! crazy

Like Mel, I've not seen one couple recover when contact continues - WHY? Because it is IMPOSSIBLE!!!

GloveOil, with all due respect, it is HARMFUL & IRRESPONSIBLE for you to contradict one of the things that Dr. Harley is most adamant about regarding marital recovery from an affair. I am very surprised that you would do this.

As FWSs, you and I both know how powerful the addiction of an affair is...This woman's husband is no different in his level of addiction...Affairs are very cookie cutter like that - and you KNOW this...

Mrs. W



FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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Originally Posted by MrsWondering
[quote=GloveOil]Lisa, if you want, give it another few days to allow the people to chime in who've successfully recovered their marriages despite their spouses' continuing to work with or otherwise have regular contact with their affair-partners. Maybe some of them exist.

This is why I think GloveOil is actually in agreement, maybe using sarcasm to try to make the point that the marriage will not recover while they continue to work together.

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Quote
Lisa, if you want, give it another few days to allow the people to chime in who've successfully recovered their marriages despite their spouses' continuing to work with or otherwise have regular contact with their affair-partners. Maybe some of them exist.

I also took this to be a bit of sarcasm. I hope that's what it was.


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Originally Posted by Cameo
Originally Posted by MrsWondering
[quote=GloveOil]Lisa, if you want, give it another few days to allow the people to chime in who've successfully recovered their marriages despite their spouses' continuing to work with or otherwise have regular contact with their affair-partners. Maybe some of them exist.

This is why I thing GloveOil is actually in agreement, maybe using sarcasm to try to make the point that the marriage will not recover while they continue to work together.

I got the same impression. I don't want lisa to get any false hope based on a post that might not have worded correctly, though.


D-Day 2-10-2009
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Thank you Marriage Builders!

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As an impartial reader, I did not hear any sarcasm, and I doubt someone who is desperately looking for cover did either. If I can mistake such a comment, so can others. So it needs to be said that in my NINE years here, that NO ONE HAS EVER COME along who recovered their marriage while the lovers were still in contact.

Originally Posted by Dr Willard Harley in Requirements for Recovery
The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide.
here

This poster needs to accept NOW that this is not a corner she can cut and expect to save her marriage. It is impossible.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Whoa, whoa... I can put this one to rest easily enough.

I was being 100% tongue-in-cheek when I wrote "Maybe some of them exist." No one who has tried a "remain-in-daily-contact-with OP" approach to recovery has appeared here in this thread to testify that such an approach can succeed, and I don't believe any will appear, because I think that if there are such folks, there must be mighty few of them. I think Lisa seems to be hoping some such folks will appear, so I suggested she take a couple of days to test her theory/wishful thinking, because some folks only see the wisdom of advice with hard experience. Of course, she could save time by taking everyone's word for it who has spoken here, including mine.

t/j: Mel & MrsW, what's goin' on in our nation's midesction today? doh2C'mon, you two are usually way better at getting a positive ID on target before you start blastin' away. [Jeez, I need an emoticon here for ducking for cover amid a hail of friendly fire... ;)]



Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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Kiss & make up, y'all.

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Lisa, you are getting pretty banged up here. However, you need to understand there is nothing but experience and compassion being offered to you. The words become more harsh the more you resist, but all that's being done here is to give you advice TO SAVE YOU MORE PAIN AND DECEPTION.

Maybe your H is one in a thousand, or ten thousand, or a hundred thousand, but for each of the posts any of us long term members have here, we have read hundreds, if not thousands more. Wayward spouses truly act as addicts, and simply cannot give up the affair that easily. Let alone when there is still contact.

If this comes down to whether you'd rather save his job, or your marriage, which would you pick? Because if you pick his job, you may very well lose both.

Think about it!


BH - me 53, ONS 1979
FWW - 51, 2 EA's, 1 PA
Last D-Day, Sep. 30, 2003
Last Contact/recovery began 2-26-04

***You can do anything with time and money...but remember...money won't buy you time!***
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Originally Posted by GloveOil
t/j: Mel & MrsW, what's goin' on in our nation's midesction today? doh2C'mon, you two are usually way better at getting a positive ID on target before you start blastin' away. [Jeez, I need an emoticon here for ducking for cover amid a hail of friendly fire... ;)]

GO, being tongue in cheek with a desperate person who is looking for cover is not a wise tactic, IMO. I didn't get the joke and I am sure others didn't either.

There is nothing to be gained by telling her to wait a few days for something we know does not exist.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by GloveOil
t/j: Mel & MrsW, what's goin' on in our nation's midesction today? doh2C'mon, you two are usually way better at getting a positive ID on target before you start blastin' away. [Jeez, I need an emoticon here for ducking for cover amid a hail of friendly fire... ;)]

GO, being tongue in cheek with a desperate person who is looking for cover is not a wise tactic, IMO. I didn't get the joke and I am sure others didn't either.

There is nothing to be gained by telling her to wait a few days for something we know does not exist.
Mel, see me on "livingtolove"'s thread from a few days back. That thread seems dead (possible because some wiseacre scared off the foggy initator), so I don't mind t/j'ing it.


Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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Lisa, let me chime in for someone who did not recover my M.

I came to this site a little too late in the game in Dec. The A started in June. The OW was my XWH direct report and I worked there also.

I was scared to expose. I did not want to be embarrassed (Was I in my own fog?), I did not want him to lose his job that he worked so hard for, I was worried financially about losing our house and everything that went with it.

I thought if I ignored it that it would stop.

I exposed in January and it was too late. XH moved out the October before and was totally addicted to this bimbo.

So he loses his job, would you rather have your M? I have my house and big deal it is a house and he is gone. My D16 has not talked to her father for almost a year.

Worried about finances? Do you know how much a D costs?

What is your favorite vice? Say it is chocolate and you know it is not good for you. So you say no first day, the first week, but when that chocolate is sitting in front of you every day -- guess what one day you will pick it up and eat it.

Think about that OW and your H in that cubicle. She was nervous because "she was caught".

Call her OWH, write to the HR department. Your H has crossed the line and what he has done is illegal.

Do you want to save your M or do you want to be like me as we speak my XWH is in Vegas with OW and maybe a wedding is happening as we speak.

Stop it now.



Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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Originally Posted by hope3343
Lisa, let me chime in for someone who did not recover my M.

I came to this site a little too late in the game in Dec. The A started in June. The OW was my XWH direct report and I worked there also.

I was scared to expose. I did not want to be embarrassed (Was I in my own fog?), I did not want him to lose his job that he worked so hard for, I was worried financially about losing our house and everything that went with it.

I thought if I ignored it that it would stop.

I exposed in January and it was too late. XH moved out the October before and was totally addicted to this bimbo.

So he loses his job, would you rather have your M? I have my house and big deal it is a house and he is gone. My D16 has not talked to her father for almost a year.

Worried about finances? Do you know how much a D costs?

What is your favorite vice? Say it is chocolate and you know it is not good for you. So you say no first day, the first week, but when that chocolate is sitting in front of you every day -- guess what one day you will pick it up and eat it.

Think about that OW and your H in that cubicle. She was nervous because "she was caught".

Call her OWH, write to the HR department. Your H has crossed the line and what he has done is illegal.

Do you want to save your M or do you want to be like me as we speak my XWH is in Vegas with OW and maybe a wedding is happening as we speak.

Stop it now.


Staying totally open - it wasn't illegal, but immoral.(In most states - yours may be the exception.) But I have yet to hear about a company so callous that it will ignore the threat of a sexual harassment lawsuit. Thst'd hitting them in the wallet, dontchaknow

Last edited by maritalbliss; 03/14/10 05:30 PM.

D-Day 2-10-2009
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Thank you Marriage Builders!

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Originally Posted by GloveOil
Mel, see me on "livingtolove"'s thread from a few days back. That thread seems dead (possible because some wiseacre scared off the foggy initator), so I don't mind t/j'ing it.

GO, there is no reason whatsoever to take this to someone else's thread when the issue needs to be discussed HERE on this thread where it was brought up. It doesn't matter if I am "sarcastic" on 100% of my posts, it has no bearing on the issue HERE on this thread. [besides, the mods kicked us off that thread and I don�t blame them - this has nothing to do with that thread]

What it appears you are missing, to the detriment of this poster, is that she is desperately looking for cover anywhere, anyhow. I don�t think you understand this poster�s desperation or you wouldn�t have posted that. And that is understandable. You have never been a betrayed spouse who was desperately find to a way to hang onto the STATUS QUO in the search for an easier softer way.

So, when you tell a desperate person that someone might come along who has cut this corner, you give her false hope to cling to. That gives her something false to hang onto. If even for 2 days, it just delays her acceptance. And even if someone did come along, it wouldn�t help her because she will never recover her marriage this way, period. So it doesn�t matter if this elusive person comes along.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by GloveOil
Whoa, whoa... I can put this one to rest easily enough.

I was being 100% tongue-in-cheek when I wrote "Maybe some of them exist." No one who has tried a "remain-in-daily-contact-with OP" approach to recovery has appeared here in this thread to testify that such an approach can succeed, and I don't believe any will appear, because I think that if there are such folks, there must be mighty few of them. I think Lisa seems to be hoping some such folks will appear, so I suggested she take a couple of days to test her theory/wishful thinking, because some folks only see the wisdom of advice with hard experience. Of course, she could save time by taking everyone's word for it who has spoken here, including mine.

t/j: Mel & MrsW, what's goin' on in our nation's midesction today? doh2C'mon, you two are usually way better at getting a positive ID on target before you start blastin' away. [Jeez, I need an emoticon here for ducking for cover amid a hail of friendly fire... ;)]

GO,

This is such a serious situation - a WS continuing to work with the OP - with such huge ramifications to Lisa and the marriage as long as it continues, that it is my opinion that we can't be too careful - that even subtle sarcasm/tongue-in-cheek posts can be misconstrued and glommed onto by a fearful newly BS as justification for inaction...

To be clear though, *I* didn't get your tongue-in-cheekness - and if I didn't then it is certainly possible that Lisa or other new and lurking BSs wouldn't either - and that is DANGEROUS, imo...

Your saying that you were being tongue-in-cheek over something this serious tells me that you may not quite get how dire this situation is - or how under duress that new BSs that arrive here are - That is something I think you should give careful consideration to.

I know that your intentions are good, so I know that you will...smile

Mrs. W


FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
Originally Posted by hope3343
\
Call her OWH, write to the HR department. Your H has crossed the line and what he has done is illegal.

Do you want to save your M or do you want to be like me as we speak my XWH is in Vegas with OW and maybe a wedding is happening as we speak.

Stop it now.


Staying totally open - it wasn't illegal, but immoral.(In most states - yours may be the exception.) But I have yet to hear about a company so callous that it will ignore the threat of a sexual harassment lawsuit. Thst'd hitting them in the wallet, dontchaknow

Every year we have to sign an ethics agreement which includes manager/employee relationships. It is not illegal per se but against company policy. The sad part is someone did not do their job and it was never "proven". XH was removed from his position and they signed papers saying that they were not having an affair. Wonder how that will play out that they are getting M?


Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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