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Larry, I've always been a person who believes in what I feel and what I can live with within my own right from wrong.....I don't think we truly trust anyone totally......I just want to set some respectful boundries between us so that we understand what will hurt the other and make the effort to not go to any of those places again......I am a very observant type of person, I'm always watching and learning. I must admit that before all this happened I think I did trust to much, I never dreamed my husband was capable of breaking our marriage vows. I guess I believed that his way of thinking was like mine, but it wasn't so.....
I don't think I will ever trust like that again, but I do want to get to a peaceful place for both of us, already we have become better friends than we were a year ago.......I can see that we can get to a better place, but no fear that I'm a fool and can't see that humans make mistakes and screw up from time to time.......
BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
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melodylane,
I guess I'm wording things wrong, setting boundries is the key to our recovery. I agree you need to stay on your toes with the trust issues and for sure I think I did trust to much before my hubby's affair, that's is my fault in this whole thing, if I had paid a little more attention and set a few boundries back then who knows if things would have turned out like they did.
My husband has given me complete transparency now and he has agreed to never putting himself in any kind of position to be around any other female except me......he is away with his father and brother to watch the Master's golf tournament, I think he is in safe company this time....I'm not worried.....
BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
Working on Recovery
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Jess, Dr Harley is a clinical psychologist who has saved thousands of marriages using these concepts and here is what he says about recovery from an affair below. I will attest to his words as someone who has saved her own marriage from an affair. The ones who follow these words to the letter are the ones who make it: The plan I recommend for recovery after an affair is very specific. That's because I've found that even small deviations from that plan are usually disastrous. But when it's followed, it always works. The plan has two parts that must be implemented sequentially. The first part of the plan is for the unfaithful spouse to completely separate from the lover and eliminate the conditions that made the affair possible. The second part is for the couple to create a romantic relationship, using my Basic Concepts as a guide. I'll describe these two parts to you in a little more detail. The first step, complete separation from the lover and eliminating the conditions that made the affair possible, requires a complete understanding of the affair. All information regarding the affair must be revealed to the betrayed spouse, including the name of the lover, the conditions that made the affair possible (travel, internet, etc.), the details of what took place during the affair, all correspondence, and anything else that would shed light on the tragedy. This information is important for two reasons: (1) it creates accountability and transparency, making it essentially impossible for the unfaithful spouse to continue the affair or begin a new one unnoticed, and (2) it creates trust for the betrayed spouse, providing evidence that the affair is over and a new one is unlikely to take its place. The nightmares you experience are likely to continue until you have the facts that will lead to your assurance that your husband can be trusted. An analysis of the betrayed spouse's childhood or emotional state of mind in an effort to discover why he or she would have an affair is distracting and unnecessary. It takes precious time away from finding the real solutions. I know why people have affairs: We are all wired for it. Given certain conditions, we would all do it. Given other conditions, however, none of us would do it. So the goal of the first step is to discover the conditions that made the affair possible and eliminate them. After the first step is completed, the second step is to create a romantic relationship between you and your husband using my 10 Basic Concepts here as your guide. While your relationship may be improving, it won't lead to a romantic relationship because you are not being transparent toward each other. Unspoken issues in a marital relationship lead to a superficiality that ruins romance.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Melody Lane,
I believe he is serious about recovery, he has come to this decision on his own, he is being completely transparent now, he has ended the affair with the NC letter.......We plan on going to marriage therapy together and he is no longer going to be apart from me for any reasons, we will always go together never on our own again.......we are working on our communication skills and filling each others needs.....we are discussion how to handle our conflicts and are working on a plan so things don't build up......he is away with his father and brother now and I feel he is safe with them........he says he realizes how much he has hurt me and he says he going to prove to me I can believe in him and our marriage again.......but don't fear I always sleep with one eye open
BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
Working on Recovery
Grateful for finding Marriage Builders
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And yet, he is out of town and you are still separated. Those are not the actions of someone who is involved in recovery. If I say I am going to fix my car, which is in the garage, but I go to Cleveland, am I serious about recovery or are my actions defying my words?
There is not a plan of recovery in place.
Working on "communication skills" and conflict management is cute and trendy to say, but is not a plan of recovery from an affair. A plan of recovery would involve a) affair proofing your marriage and b) having an effective plan that will create romantic love.
I am not trying to throw a wet blanket on your hopes, but I am ALARMED, and so are others, at your lack of a plan here. We are trying to help you avoid one of the most painful things of all: a false recovery.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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that's is my fault in this whole thing, Not in this lifetime. Let me bring up the counseling thing again, even more forcefully. If you MUST have a Christian Counselor, your ONLY option is Family Dynamics to the best of my knowledge. Otherwise, go directly to Dr. Harley's coaching center. They do coaching over the phone and it works great. I have seen (And Mel has seen many more) inept marriage counselor stories on here to the point where I want to puke.  One more thing. I see bits and pieces of MB concepts from you, but not the detailed knowledge I would hope you would acquire and use. You need it for your PLAN! Larry
Last edited by _Larry_; 04/06/10 08:02 PM.
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Jess, has your husband moved home?
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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that's is my fault in this whole thing, Not in this lifetime. Let me bring up the counseling thing again, even more forcefully. If you MUST have a Christian Counselor, your ONLY option is Family Dynamics to the best of my knowledge. Otherwise, go directly to Dr. Harley's coaching center. They do coaching over the phone and it works great. The Harleys are ALL CHRISTIANS and MB is a Christian program.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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I have not had the benefit of taking the MB course or weekend, so I will simply bow to Mel's greater knowledge. I wouldn't think of recommending anyone other than the Harley's in primary position. I was told that Dr. Harley had authorized FDI to certify coaches in his concepts. So I did a knee jerk reflex answer I cannot take back, but wish I could.
Sorry.
Larry
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Larry, I think the confusion lies in the fact that he doesn't present MB as a Christian program, per se, although he is a Christian and his program is Christian based. My old church back in East Texas, used his program exclusively and that is how I ended up here. We have several people on this forum who teach MB in their own churches.
I did not know that he had authorized FDI to certify coaches in his concepts but that is good to know!
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Mel:
I ran smack into some garbage about Harley being a cult, which I forcefully rejected. So I sought more information. I was told by someone I trust that the good Dr. had authorized FDI and found his stuff all over their site, but I do not have first hand knowledge.
If you find out for sure, let me know. That would help me to talk to a couple of local pastors who are currently eat up with ignorance. One MB forum person told me about it and I double checked with a pastor here who HAS used MB concepts and was told that he got it from FDI. That is somewhat of a confirmation, but not really. I should have kept my mouth shut.
Thanks
Larry
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Larry, that sounds perfectly in line with what I have heard around here. He has authorized many churches to teach and use his program. He gave special permission to several around here, Mark, BigKahuna, BobPure to just name a few.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Ok, but the key difference is that FDI is not an individual. They are a long time and well respected source for Christian teachings.
Thanks
Larry
end thread jack...
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MelodyLane,
This is my story, I found out in Nov that my husband had an affair, he has never moved out, at the time I said if she is what you want and need then I would set him free, we signed a separation agreement and I went to the bank changed all the accounts we told our families and our kids we were going to separate, everything was set and all he had to do was move out and get on with his life with the OW. I booked a trip to Florida just to r-group my thoughts for my future, he had every excuse as to why he couldn't find a place, but I was patient and just said that while I was away he could move out with a family member while he continued to look......
He ask if he could join me in Florida so we could talk things through, I wasn't sure why but I said yes, we had a great time together and came out better friends then we have been in years......
He was only there for 2 weeks and then he went back home, before he left he told me that he was wrong and that he didn't want the marriage to end and that he loved me and that he was going to tell the OW that he was going to work at his marriage instead of continuing his relationship with her......and that is what he has done, when I returned he agreed to all my requests about therapy, no contact and he gave me all his passwords and gave me his word he would never go anywhere without me again, he would never put himself in a position again with any other female.......we have met each others needs since I found out about the affair, he stopped going out at night, we ate all our meals together. we have talked about what was missing for each of us it's almost like he realized right from the get go and just waited for me to calm down and more open to listening to his feelings, he now says he made a mistake and wants to fix things between us, it's me who has doubts about putting myself out there again.......I don't mind the wet blanket, I haven't been to a therapy session yet, so what would the plan be if you were me.
BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
Working on Recovery
Grateful for finding Marriage Builders
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t/j Okay. I know that DrH is Christian. He is also a GENIUS. He knows that he isn't going to go around "preaching" to everyone about religion. That would alienate many people. This way it is about MARRIAGE and not religion(most times they are mutually exclusive however). t/j over
BW(Me)aka Scotty:37 DSx2: 10,12 DDAY2(PA)Nov27/09 Plan B Dec18/09 Personal R in works Scotty's THING  Newly Betrayed click herePraying for walls and doors. Thanx MM “Surviving is important. Thriving is elegant.” ? Maya Angelou PROGRESS NOT PERFECTION THANK YOU
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Larry,
My understanding is that FDI is certified to train facilitators for marriage ministry including weekend seminars designed to save troubled marriages, 8 week courses designed to teach MB (and other material) methods to couples and they offer a home study course similar to Dr Harley's.
From what I have ascertained, they do not offer training to counselors as a matter of course, but many counselors do attend their training sessions.
The weekend training for their certification to run the eight week course is 600 dollars plus room and board. (this is for couples to learn to lead a marriage ministry in their home church). They do use Dr Harley's materials for this course and for the eight week class that the couple is certified to teach.
At least that is the way I understand it since I have been trying to raise the money to attend their training since I first heard about it. I do have a contact at FDI that I communicate with periodically. Thus far all I have for sure is what I have been given and what I have read on their website.
I found out about them through someone who attended my class last fall. They attended Dr Harley's MB weekend last March and checked with Dr Harley and or MB staff to find a source of training and certification to offer to me to help me in establishing our marriage ministry. They told me about FDI being certified by Dr Harley. From communications with my liaison there, I am given the same information though they make no claim to be the only certified group as I was told by my contact who contacted MB staff.
My understanding is that this couple at least reads here and may be posters, one or both of them. I had at least three couples from MB at that first class and only know the posting names of one couple.
And I ain't saying...
Mark
[/tj]
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Ok, lets move this to my posting thread.
Sorry Jessi, we all think this is important.
Larry
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not a problem, interesting topic
BW 56
WH 57
Married 25 years, live together for 2, dated 2 years before that.....
DS 23, DS 25
D-Day Nov 23/09
NC Mar 1/10
Working on Recovery
Grateful for finding Marriage Builders
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that's is my fault in this whole thing, Not in this lifetime. Let me bring up the counseling thing again, even more forcefully. If you MUST have a Christian Counselor, your ONLY option is Family Dynamics to the best of my knowledge. Otherwise, go directly to Dr. Harley's coaching center. They do coaching over the phone and it works great. I've been to three Christian marriage counselors. None of them worked. The fact that they were Christians did not give them the ability to save our marriage. I am aware of Family Dynamics and from what I know I think I can highly recommend them. But I have personally counseled with Steve Harley, and he has talked to us about church, the Bible, and lessons about love from Jesus in the book of Revelation. Sounds like Christian counseling to me. Christian, anyway. He's more of a coach than a counselor. I might not go to Steve for all my theology questions, but he's certainly aligned enough to my beliefs of right and wrong that we've never had any problem with his coaching. Steve's grandfather was a minister who counseled couples in the 1940's. He saved marriages counseling from the Bible with a message of unconditional commitment and sacrifice. Steve's father Dr. Willard Harley tried the same approach with friends 20 years later ... and discovered that things seemed to be failing. Even his own pastor's marriage was wrecked by an affair as Willard Harley tried to counsel them. He was mystified as to what was wrong ... and dedicated his life to finding out. He did find out, and the result is this program. He did not compromise his religious beliefs in any way I know in finding out what had changed and how he needed to counsel differently. His son and daughter have followed in his footsteps and counsel using the same principles. All of this story is told in more detail in Dr. Willard Harley's book, Effective Marriage Counseling, in the introduction. You can actually go to Amazon.com, enter "Effective Marriage Counseling," and read inside the book; read the first few pages, and you will read this story. Marriage Builders is completely in line with my evangelical Christian beliefs, and I'd be happy to show you that from the Bible if you have any objections. One more thing. I see bits and pieces of MB concepts from you, but not the detailed knowledge I would hope you would acquire and use. You need it for your PLAN!
Larry Yes, you need to LEARN! Read EVERYTHING on this site! And every book you can get your hands on!
If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app! Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8. Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010 If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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[He did not compromise his religious beliefs in any way I know in finding out what had changed and how he needed to counsel differently. Markos, Dr Harley told me to my face at the MB weekend, very matter of factly, that he got this program in a "prophecy from God."
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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