Jaded -

You yourself might be married, but your "husband" is not.

He has clearly and repeatedly shown you that the concept of marriage/loyalty/monogamy means nothing to him.

How can you make him care for you and want to be married to you?

You can't. That's the whole point of the answers you are getting. Sure, you can offer him your best self and hope it's enough to make him stop chasing other women, but you cannot "make" somebody care about you when they just don't.

I agree that's he's perfectly content being himself, as is. You can do nothing to change this.

The only power you have here is to remove yourself from his neglect and emotional abuse so that he can't hurt you anymore. On rare occasions, that can jolt an adulterer into changing his/her ways. But I don't think that will happen here.

If you won't tolerate his being a player and a serial cheater, he'll just find somebody else who will.

I'm sorry this has happened to you. If you want a genuine marriage, you wil almost certainly have to look elsewhere for a man who wants a genuine marriage as much as you do. This guy ain't it.

Jaded, Pepperband is correct, you have no grounds on which to complain. The problem is not your husband's skanky behavior, [you married him knowing he was like this] but your refusal to man up and take accountability FOR YOUR BAD CHOICES. You CHOSE to marry a man who lies and cheats, and you knew that going in. You have no right to complain and blame others for a choice YOU MADE. You are not a victim, but a VOLUNTEER.

You are doing nothing more than complaining about the consequences of YOUR CHOICES.

Take accountability for YOUR DUMB CHOICES and either suck it up or leave and accept that you can'T change another person against his will. Take accountability, Jaded. Put on your big gurl panties.

I just wanted to address this. I don't believe you have a good point of reference for what a good man, father, or person is.

A good man does NOT sleep with a married woman.
A good man does NOT drink to the point of not being able to remember his actions.
A good man does NOT act inappropriately around women no matter how drunk - a good man wouldn't even get THAT drunk.

A good father does NOT sleep with a married woman with CHILDREN. He has already shown your children from a previous marriage that THEY DO NOT MATTER TO HIM! If their happiness mattered to him he would not have played a part in the destruction of their family. Believe me, this wonderful, amazing family you THINK you have - you DON'T.

My mother left my father for her affair partner. They've been married for 25 years and have other children. I'm sure she thought that at 2 years old I wouldn't remember or mind the situation they'd created and accept that she just wanted to be happy. Guess what, I have no respect for my mother and am positively disgusted at the destruction she and her adultery partner wrought on my family. The man she married is NOT a good father - not to me. I'd be surprised if your kids thought your new man was all that great - oh they won't tell you, not to your face, but it will haunt them the rest of their lives.

A good father LOVES, RESPECTS AND HONORS his wife, because THAT is what children NEED. They need a safe, happy marriage. A good marriage is the FOUNDATION of a happy and safe family. This man you married is ROBBING your children of that safe and happy family.

A good father models proper behavior to his children, so they know what a good marriage is - so that it can be the basis on which those children model their future relationships.

A good person does not lie. A good person does not get fall down drunk.

The man you are with is NOT a good father, man or person. If you think he is you do not know what that is.

By all means if you want to save this affairage, I'm sure it can be done. You came into this KNOWING all this about him - you really can't complain. You gotta stuff it all and make do. This place has tools you can use to make it somewhat better. But do not be under the impression that you are in this with a good person, not matter how 'fun' he is or how good he makes you feel.

The people I truly feel for are your poor children. They might act fine and dandy now - but when they grow up and realized what you robbed them of, they will not be so forgiving.

This is the problem when parents teach children that wrong is right; the kids sometimes grow up and figure out they were misled, conned. And you are right, they are not so forgiving.

Great post, Vibrassa.

I've lived it - 25 years has not made it any easier or any less horrible... I need to walk away - I'm a bit too angered by what this woman is doing to her children....

I agree, while married to my WH - during the good 11.5 years. We watched his XWW (she cheated on him, he is a former BS) anyway, we watched his XW do the same thing again with her 2nd husband and the kids have watched her do this twice now. They have no respect for her, they are learning what not to do and if they should become "cheaters" they have learned first hand how to do it. Now they have lost respect for their father - my WH.
At some point - the selfish ones need to wake up, grow up, and look at how their actions and choices affect everyone else. JMHO

I would like to nominate Vibrissa's post for the "Notable Posts" thread.

I can't believe I have reached the point in which it seems reasonable to seek advice from strangers, but I have nothing to lose. The absolute truth of this last clause is incredible. You have nothing to lose. The marriage - it was "nothing". Consider that these words were the words that YOU chose. Read on.

So a quick history on DH and I. We met at the very tail end of my previous marriage. I had already decided to leave, but in the interest of ownership I will call it what it was: an affair. Within three days of this affair I left my then husband for the man I am married to now. Do you find it at all interesting that you CHOSE, within 3 days, to leave a marriage for this man? That this man's abilities to "charm" you were so skilled that you were overwhelmed in 3 days? This should have been a red flag - because it generally means he is able to = what = get women to believe what he says rather easily.....and you did.....were you "special"??? We have been together three years now.

In that time there have been a series of betrayals by my husband. He betrayed your marriage when he walked in the door on DAY ONE. And had you do the same as his co-conspirator. Your failure to recognize this is something to address in YOUR LIFE. Because it is important to my inability to move on, WAIT!!!!!!! You are already wanting to gloss this whole thing over!!!!! You are nowhere NEAR ready to MOVE ON. I am completely convinced you used these same words with your betrayed husband - "We need to move on" only your ex-husband was probably completely blindsided. I want to list the major ones.

You moved too quickly to the list of your husband's problems. Do you see yourself looking back to the mistakes you made in marriage number one? AT ALL? Because....the issues you had in THAT MARRIAGE followed you...there are HERE...you dragged them with you.

And you walked into this marriage for


What was it again?

What did this man offer you? What was it that your ex-husband did NOT HAVE that this man DID?

Because, given the list below, I'M not seeing it.


� kept and hid a homemade porn with his ex (and in my opinion the woman who still has his heart) after I moved in. I found it, watched it, and threw it away. He was furious.

� got mad at me and told me he considered calling his ex. I told him I would be devastated if he did. Within a week he picked a fight and not only called her, but took her out for drinks at "our bar." He admitted he would have slept with her if he had the chance. He contacted her once more after that.

� We took a road trip to see another ex of his and by the end of the night he was wasted. We were all in a hot tub and he kept putting his face in her boobs and grabbing her crotch and flat out refused to sit by me. I convinced him to get out and go upstairs to change. He was too drunk to pull up his pants so I left him exposed and went downstairs to advise his ex of my plight. She walks upstairs and goes to the room where he lay nude and locked the door. They did not emerge for over 20 minutes. He says he can't remember anything but thinks they might have kissed. And, YOU handled this so very well. From the moment you decided to get into the hot tub...to the letting another woman enter the room with the husband nude part. Yep.

� He has contacted several other exes when we are fighting despite promises he won't do it again.

� after all this, we got married.

Right in here, is there anywhere that you see anything you did wrong? Anything at all? Do the drugs and alcohol you did with him ring any bells whatsoever? Does the porn problem and the multiple previous marriages pose any problem for you? Or, is the fact that he might have had a little money really make the difference in the grand decision?


� less than 9 months into our marriage, we got into a huge fight I lost count on the number of fights. Have you? and he ended up going to stay at a friends apartment. The next morning he called and the number on caller ID was another woman. Was this a surprise to you? Really? I begged him to come home and he refused. He spent all day with this girl (who by the way is a stripper) getting wasted. You know this did not surprise you. You have been participating in the drug activity with him, and now you are complaining. The complaints cannot be taken seriously - the issue here cannot be, "Oh, he gets MORE WASTED THAN I DO." It just does not hold water. He always swore nothing happened other than he slept next to her, danced with her, etc. I decided to contact her and though she denied actual intercourse admitted she gave him oral sex. Somehow this sounds as stupid as it looks in writing, right? Did you believe it then? Did it make you FEEL better? Probably not, right? So, why did you STAY?

Money?


SO... My plight is that as foolish as I am sure I look for wanting to stick by this man, I really do want to. money However, I can't trust him and as a result I question him when he gets home late, don't let him drink outside of the house, he does anyway and lies to you and don't allow any contact with any of his exes. he does anyway and lies to you He feels controlled he rebels and lies to you and I need reassurance he will do whatever it takes to prove he has changed. he won't - he will do what it takes to make you BELIEVE what you want to believe - and he will continue to do what he wants and LIE TO YOU In the mean time I end up obsessing and become paranoid and hurt all over again. I want to move on, but HOW?? iNTERESTING QUESTION. We are back to those little words, "MOVE ON".


You cannot MOVE ON until you move on.


You have a choice to make.

Live in your little "move on" world and continue to bury your head in the sand. Move on, pretend that things are fine while you party, have a man who skrews around on you and you fake like he doesn't and you fake like he is a "good man" because you LIKE HIS MONEY. You can move on and fake your life, fake your feelings, and he can fake like he has a home and a wife and a family that is all sunshine and lollipops.

He can have his women on the side. You can have your fake life, too. Move on.


Or, you can choose to fix the mess you made when you walked out of your marriage into the arms of this idiot.

You can walk OUT OF THIS FAKE MARRIAGE and recover your own life. You can figure out what the he// went wrong with your thinking, why you ever ONCE even for a moment thought that this guy was for real, and you can recover your sense of pride and dignity.

Because this affairage is exactly what you called it in the first paragraph. It is not a marriage at all - at least not in your "husband's" eyes. He never had a first marriage, or a second one, and this third? one either. He doesn't really get what a marriage is. He is still playing the field.

Take yourself out of his game. You said you had NOTHING to lose.

You were right on that count.

Thanks for reading. I appreciate any input.

Why? Really look into yourself and ask WHY? Is it because he's so wonderful? From all the information YOU'VE given that is far from apparent. Because the relationship is wonderful? I doubt you'd say that. Is it because you love him despite his abuse of you? Because it's what's best for your children? That didn't seem to factor in when you destroyed their family....

Or is it pride? Is it because you don't want to admit you made a mistake? Is it because you don't want to admit you may have wasted the last 3 years of your life and drug your children through the mud with this man? Read up on the Sunk Cost Fallacy before you commit more resources to this situation.

You know, now I understand why I never sought advice from strangers before now and will NEVER make that mistake again. You can all shout from your high and mighty roof tops but the fact is, you wouldn't be here if your life was not everybit as screwed up as mine. I am a Christian woman and intend to keep my vows of "until death do us part." yes, I am a sinner and have made big mistakes...so is he...and so are ALL of you. Notice I didn't pass judgement on any of your trysts or those of your wandering spouses. But yet I come here asking only for one thing (advice on how to heal) and you all systematically judged and attacked me. So much for marriage builders... I firmly believe you all simply want to perpetuate misery not work to move past it. And I am not interested in advice from people who act so cruel to someone. Some day you are all going to end up leading someone desperate for support to drastic measures. Maybe you should learn a little about love, compassion, forgiveness and grace. That is what I'm after...

Jaded, my suggestion would be to keep an open mind and drop the self righteous indignation. You asked for opinions and that is exactly what you got. If you were just looking for validation for a continuation of the same practices that led you to this terrible predicament, you are in the wrong place. Your best thinking has screwed up your life, after all.

Keep in mind that most of the people who are posting to you are not miserable, [you are] but are either in fully recovered marriages or are divorced. [in many cases, divorce is the definition of success]

Anyway, you asked for opinions, take what you need and leave the rest. Best of luck to you.

Read some of our stories before you cast stones. The ingredient in them that is missing in yours is repentance. My DH was a one time adulterer. I am a one time forgiver. We are recovered almost three years and me, I hang around this forum once in awhile trying to see if I may be able to help someone just a tiny little bit as they learn from my unwanted experience and mistakes.

You can't heal from an ongoing situation, Jaded. It's like trying to heal from a knife wound while the knife is still in your body. We asked you alot of questions. You answered none. We offered help to change your M and stop the abuse. You came back spitting venom.

It embarasses me that after every thing that you have told us, you still consider yourself a Christian woman.


God luck with the healing.

God's Blessings,

Say

Embarrases you I consider myself a Christian woman? Wow. I have a personal relationship with Jesus and for you to suggest that is laughable is a slap in the Lord's face, not mine. Afterall, the whole idea of Christianity is FORGIVENESS, remember?

My husband wants to change and we are working on rebuilding our marriage and I make no apologies for that. I answered the questions that were asked of me in a kind manner but why would I respond to someone who is attacking me? I mean really.

Anyway, I get it... I came to the wrong place. Fortunately, I will be fine, but literally one day all your hate-filled comments are going to lead someone desperate for support to suicide.

No, you came to the RIGHT place.

I for one and neither a betrayed spouse, or a wayward spouse. I have never in my life cheated. I have sinned, grievously, but fortunately I have never committed the sin of Adultery.

I never said I was better than you, or implied it. I simply held a mirror up to your situation. If you don't like what was shown, LOOK INSIDE YOURSELF to figure out why.

It's amazing that all of a sudden, NOW the vows you made matter when they never mattered before.

I don't care about your relationship with Jesus, I am not your judge. However YOU ASKED FOR OPINIONS AND ADVICE. If you don't like what you get and when EVERYONE is saying the same thing... maybe the problem isn't us.

But self-introspection is hard. It is easier to blame imaginary people on the other end of the computer of being miserable, horrible people - rather than look at yourself and your 'spouse'. I get that.

My responses were not filled with hate, rather they were filled with compassion for your children.

You say you will be fine - you wont. So your husband is willing to change. MARRIAGE BUILDERS has the best program I've ever seen for creating love filled, passionate, romantic marriages. But those things require WORK, introspection and a willingness to be humble and admit your mistakes.

No one here (with maybe a few exceptions) is HATE filled. But that doesn't mean you wont hear hard truths. The wicked always take truth to be hard - and I include myself in that statement. Hard truths are what make you grow and a better person.

But, by all means, if it makes you feel better about yourself, label us hate-filled... saves you from actually having to DO anything.

You're wrong - read my story.