Have you tried to snoop and find her side...That would put a lot more pressure on the A....

I think her sister and her husband knows but not sure about anything else!

How did you find out that they know?....

My Husband just called me to ask me how therapy went. I didn't pick up the phone right away because I was in a heated phone conversation with the OW because her husband is still making threats.

I called her and I told her I will not do this with them anymore that I cant believe I am having this conversation with her again!
That I felt scared and that I do not want her husband coming to my house for anything.

I hung up on her and called my WH back needless to say he was not happy that I did not call or text him 2 hrs earlier when he wanted to know about my session. I calmly told him I needed the time to process what had transpired during session.

He asked me who was so important I wouldn't answer the phone I just changed the subject!


He demanded to know who I was talking to and I told him I refuse to engage in an argument because I do not want to be on the roller coaster, he then backed off and said he doesn't have a right to ask anyway

He then went on to ask me and I told him about the treatment plan they have which includes AD and anxiety meds. They gave me crisis plans to help control my emotions. He also told me that his therapist told him that every-time we have an episode it just sets him back to square one in his process.

He also told me that when he sees my number on his phone and a text he cringes cause he doesn't know what to expect. I said that makes me sad that he feels like he doesn't know when the next explosion is coming! That the last 2 weeks have been soo stressful because of my behavior. and that I say I want the truth but when he gives it to me I cant handle it.

I told him the truth hurts and yes I would prefer the truth and that I know that some of my behavior is not ok.

I said we are in different positions and have different temperaments so we will deal with the problems differently as well as the fact that i see things differently because I feel like I had the things done to me.

I don't even know how I kept my kool since I said all of this in the same tone of voice!!

He went on to tell me that he did speak to his friends wife and that she talk about her stuff and he felt she wanted to just talk to get stuff off her chest and that he got very little from it! Wow talk about totally different point of view!

He also said she told him to take this separation to really think about what he wants and to use the time to maybe see other people so he can make sure this is what he wants.

I had a tiny AO... I said she said what? You want to do what?
He was silent and said he didn't want to talk anymore!

I apologized and said that just took me off guard because that's not what I expected you to say!

He then kept talking and just the garbage that came out of his mouth.... He then said oh I don't know exactly how she put it but that's how I understood the piece of advice. That we need to make the most of this time apart because if we get back together it should be for good.

I was shocked silent! I then calmly told him well I for one did not agree to that in this separation.

He got angry and was like that's not what I said I was going to do or what I wanted right now! you always jump to conclusions!
He said its just a piece of advice

Well i said in my monotone voice ok i'm not saying she said that but I for one am not even ready to contemplate anything of the sort as a matter of fact that is unacceptable to me.
I said put yourself in my shoes can you imagine me with someone else/
He was like well if that's what we agreed upon I cant say anything to you!

I said ok so it wouldn't hurt you to imagine me with some one else all hugged up?

He said well yes it would probably bother me but if we agreed to it I cant say anything to you.

I was just speechless I told him I can not continue this conversation I do love you but I need to get off the phone.

He said well you keep saying that!

He doesn't know that I spoke to her today and she told me she said that this separation is for him to work on himself not for him to be with different women to see what he likes!

I really feel shocked he would even suggest this! I know he is a fog but that is just messed up!

I am so screwed up right now! I keep trying to do the right steps and failing to do so!

HELP!

What's going on?

The OW caught me and her husband talking and went ballistic!
She told me she is calling WH to put an end to all this bull crap because she just wants to move-on with her-life and the fact that me and her husband are talking is unacceptable to her.

My husband found out I spoke to her and to her Husband and thretened that if I contact them again that its completely over and that if I want any kind of chance that I need to stop all contact!

He said the damage is done that there is little chance of him comming back home now.


I think I really messed up this time!

ok. Let her be upset. YOU did nothing wrong. Don't let her bully you. Too bad that she thinks it's unacceptable. And what does she think what she did was? acceptable?

You've got to step back from the drama. Stop talking with OW, it'll get you nowhere. They spew venom.

Breath lisa. You're not in the wrong here.

Yes but now she is feeding WH all kinds of lies and he wants to cut all ties with me!

See part of an A is the DRAMA. Alot of OWs LOVE drama. It's what fuels the A. I know she was your BF but she isn't any longer and never will be again. You need NC with her just as your WH does. Don't give her a place in your life or validate her importance in your M by talking to her. She is nothing now, just some skank. The sooner you stop communicating with her the better. And better still...it'll drive her crazy!

Got it?

lisa you can't control him. He's going to do what he's going to do. He's having an A. It's par for the course. You can't let what he does/she does get you in a tizzy. You can only control you and your mental state. So we need to look at this plan A timeframe of yours. How long can you go on if you REACT to every cr@ppy thing they do? Especially all the cr@ppy things that OW does? Becasue she is going to do ALOT of cr@ppy things to you. She is TRYING to hurt you. And the fact that she was a friend is worse because she KNOWS what hurts you.

If you can't back away from it all, you're going to have to do a VERY short plan A. You will literally have a breakdown if this all continues as it is. I'm not trying to scold you I'm just trying to protect you. You've got to see that EVERYTHING that they do and say is what ALL APs do and say. And it will hurt if you listen to it all. Don't. Your WH is looking for ANY excuse to stay away from home. ANY. So don't give him any.

What's your plan A timeframe? When do you plan on going into plan B?

I know, I know I don't know why I keep talking and arguing with her!

WH told me that this is not his wife that this is a crazy person that he always told me it didn't have anything to do with her but
that he is fed up and has reached his tipping point with all my crap.

Now she gets to be the calm rational one! Again!

WH is furious with me and if I continue then its over for good!

My heart is in 2 pieces! How can he cause all this drama and then blame me for everything!

I know I have had some extremes this past week but we have been going at it for 2 weeks so after 2 weeks he is ready to chuck it all!

I am my own worst enemy it seems!

Okay, Lisa, you wanted some tough love and here it is(a little anyways). You tell us that you want to try to save your marriage, and then...... Well, then your actions go against that. You can't just talk the talk, you have to walk the walk. I don't think it is a matter of you not understanding the material. I think that logically, you "get it." Your problem is that you react to things very emotionally. This causes you to do things that go AGAINST you goal.

I don't know why you do the things you do. That is something you will have to figure out for yourself.

Now as far as the conversations you had. First, don't call OW. Second, don't agree to date other people. Married people don't date other people. Explain to your WH that you are married and that you believe that married people don't date. You wanted to gage his reaction to the fact that you would date. He kept saying that he would be upset but he couldn't say anything to you if that is what you agreed to. What you should have said is, "I am married I will NEVER agree to us "dating" other people, want a cookie?"

Now, as far as what your therapist says to you and your treatments, I think that he is fishing to see how well you are handling things. You have to ACT strong. No crying, no begging at all. He needs to see a strong person.

Think about back to when you started dating. How did you act? Were you clingy? Did you talk about dating other people? What attracted him to you? Think about how YOU can be a GREAT wife and mother. That is what Plan A is about. It isn't about WH. It is about YOU. Get it? You need to change YOU. You CAN'T change your WH. You need to control YOURSELF. Devise your plan. Take it one day at a time.

Today, you need to do a few things.

1. Eat.
2. Sleep.
3. Take care of your kiddos.
4. Look HOT.
5. Don't call OW.
6. If you talk to WH, be upbeat and happy(even though inside you are dieing).
7. Take a break and get a mani/pedi.
8. DON't add to the drama of your life today.(How can you do this? Don't call OW. Don't talk to OWH today)

My plan A time frame was 3 weeks but now I don't know If I can even implement it with him being so pissed off right now and in that frame of mind that he cant deal with me!

Im afraid to do plan B because of all the negative things that have gone on! Did you read my posts from last night?

You are right Scotland I need to stop with the emotional crap! I have to just let it go and concentrate on me! This is so much harder because I do not want to let go I think!

When we first dated he was always calling me and I was very happy go lucky and independent!

Keep the tough love coming! I need the harsh truth do not sugar coat it because I am sliding down a slippery slope that will end in divorce.

He is PLAYING pissed off because it's his way of JUSTIFYING his actions. I'm sure if you looked at him the wrong way today he would blow a gasket. Don't panic. This is another WS tactic to get you off of their back. That's all. See he says that he is FURIOUS, PISSED OFF BEYOND WORDS...and what do you do? You back off and play right into his hands by believing that YOU did wrong. He WANTS you to think this way. Then the blame is on you.

YOU have to remember that HE is having the A. Set this bar HIGH hon. And step away from the drama.

Lisa,

Plan A does not depend on anything he does. Plan A depends only on what you do. Stop trying to find the right magic bullet and execute about 10 solid days of Plan A as already outlined for you a couple of times.

Stop trying to control anyone and everyone else and get yourself under control. You are making yourself crazy by your own actions. Get a grip, girl...

The reason you keep floundering is because you are still trying to change what is happening around you. You have no control over other people. You can only control yourself. Right now you are working at it in the exact opposite and attempting to control what you have no control over and allowing yourself to get out of control...

Meet his ENs
Avoid Love Busters.

That's it, Lisa. That is the sum total of what you have to be able to do for about 10 days in a row. You don't have to answer his bull-crap questions. You don't have to discuss OWH's threats or the drama of the affair or the price of oil on the spot market or anything else. You don't even have to discuss what you are doing right now. All you have to do it...

Meet his ENs and avoid Love Busters...

And stop trying to control what other people are doing.

I'm starting to see a situation where he gives YOU conditions for his return. It MUST be the other way around.

Stupid, me...I know the OWH knows already...anyway this doesnt matter right now....Right now your Plan A is not a Plan A....Listen to what everyone is posting and pay special attention to what Mark just posted...Your WH has complete control of this sitch, that needs to change...

Lisa,

You've been trying to shame him into coming home. You've tried coercing him into coming home. You've tried bribing him into coming home. You tried to drive OW away so that he will come home. So how's all that been working for ya?

Give him a reason to come home, Lisa. That reason has to be YOU. I do NOT mean something you say, something you make happen or any other single solution that if you find it will make everything alright and the planets will all be aligned and the universe will stabilize...

The universe doesn't revolve around you anyway, so let's look at what will bring him home. What will accomplish that will be if he is in love with you and more in love with you than he is with OW, any other OW and even more than he is in love with the idea of being single.

Turn yourself into the woman he can't live without, Lisa. THAT is what you have to do to win this. Stop making him hurt and start trying to make him notice that you can make him happy instead. Don't tell him you will do this; show him by what you do that you can do this.

The longer you keep trying to leverage this into what you expect and want, the less time you actually get to do what you need to do. When I say that you need to meet his ENs and avoid Love Busters, that is exactly what I mean and not that AND anything else. That is all you have to do. It is when you try to do other things that you lose focus on those two and do the opposite. You end up piling on Love Busters and failing to meet his ENs at all. You are depleting his Love Bank with every interaction and that is to say nothing about your own Love Bank's condition.

This isn't a logic puzzle, Lisa. It is an execution problem. All you need to do at this point is stop Love Busting him and try to meet his ENs as already identified. Ignore what he says and does for a while and certainly avoid any contact with OW and her husband.

Just get control over what you are doing, Lisa. That is ALL you can do and ALL you need to do.