Yeah and the Instant messenger has to be told to log convos. Its default setting is not to, so why did she set it like that? To entrap him of course.

I thought that AIM or whatever IM he uses might have a transcript available alao. WOW keeps thier server texting for a couple months,(yes they see it all), and can pull up any convo made on the server.

If they can identify his screenname on the PC logs she has it still isn't proof yet. The service will have to prove it, but the warning is, maybe the court wont go that far and verify it. They might just take the IMs she turned in at face value. They really can't take that chance with this lawyer, he has allready shown his colors, he will do the least amout of work possible for his 5G.

I would before it to late writer call that number someone linked to you. At least you can hear from real lawyers what can be done to protect your son and it will be free. They might be able to give you some pointers.


In Mass back in the 70s at least a minor girl was not questioned at her word in the case of stat. rape. I knew a guy who went to prison for two years because he acceptted certain sexual favors from a 16 year old girl who was well known for this in the neigborhood. Didn't matter, his lawyer could not even cross-examine her, and because he was slow and an easy target, he went to jail. Yeah he was guilty and deserved it, but her story was not the way it happened, and everyone else who did the same with her walked away. She was an evil little B**&th and loved it, but the waterworks came out in court and she cried rape. This girl did not see justice done or even get help for herself, she just had a new angle to explain why her marks were bad. The simpleton,(he was barly smart enough to have a job, he really was simple), only went with her once. The minor girl got pregnant by one of her minor boyfriends and didn't want to get in trouble for having sex so said she was raped by this guy who had a target on his back.

The court tends to listen to the girls version.


See above the story about the "sealed", records and bouncing expungments.

Its going to be tough any way you look at it. A lifetime of hoping the records are sealed and don't jump up and bite him, ( if the plea goes thru), or a well prepared battle in the courts to get the truth out.

I would look into that number and see what they can help you with before they close today. Its 3:00 PM there now. At least they will be on your side writer.

Thats what I thought Meggy, but doesn't that just prove that the original message came from someone, and not show editing? tell me it shows editing!!

And of course we will be dealing with hand picked communication too of course.. They will need to go into public servers to get it all. I don't believe the court is going to do this easily or with this lawyers request anyways. There will have to be more muscle

Its been a long long time since I took Criminal Procedure in law school, but I am almost certain Rules of Criminal Procedure for every state include Discovery provisions. Your son's lawyer should be able to get everything the prosecution intends to use as evidence at trial and should have made this request LONG ago. The prosecution is also legally bound to turn over anything that could raise reasonable doubt. I don't have time right this second but when I have a sec, I will look at CA's Rules of Criminal Procedure to see what you can and can't get. I strongly suspect you will be able to use legal maneuverings to find out if the intend to introduce a forensic analysis of your son's computer. If not, the print out of the IM conversation would have to be authenticated by the girl and she would be subject to cross examination by your son's attorney. Also, your son's attorney could put on an IT professional to explain how print outs from IM work and how the can be adulterated/created simply by using Word Perfect.

DISCLAIMER: I am not licensed to practice law in the State of California and the following should not be construed as legal advice. What follows is simply a cut and paste of text from the California Penal Code. Any and all legal advice and interpretation of the following text should be obtained from and attorney licensed to practice law in the State of California.

DIRECTLY FROM THE CALIFORNIA PENAL CODE

1054.1. The prosecuting attorney shall disclose to the defendant or
his or her attorney all of the following materials and information,if it is in the possession of the prosecuting attorney or if the
prosecuting attorney knows it to be in the possession of the
investigating agencies:
(a) The names and addresses of persons the prosecutor intends to
call as witnesses at trial.
(b) Statements of all defendants.
(c) All relevant real evidence seized or obtained as a part of the
investigation of the offenses charged. (d) The existence of a felony conviction of any material witness
whose credibility is likely to be critical to the outcome of the
trial.
(e) Any exculpatory evidence.
(f) Relevant written or recorded statements of witnesses or
reports of the statements of witnesses whom the prosecutor intends to
call at the trial, including any reports or statements of experts
made in conjunction with the case, including the results of physical
or mental examinations, scientific tests, experiments, or comparisons
which the prosecutor intends to offer in evidence at the trial.


Writer, if I were you, I'd be asking your son's attorney if he's done this and what is there regarding proof of the IM conversations. If there was no forensic review, that girl's authentication of the print out is attackable by anyone with an IT background bys imply explainin how the file is convered to a Word document and after that, it is subject to edit by anyone with access to the Word file.

I don't know anything about the law, but would it be better to allow the prosecuting attorney to screw up and bring these things up without disclosing them first?

Could anything brought in like this without notice to the defense be permanently disqualified as evidence to the prosecution?

Soolee,

I will leave strategy to an attorney licensed to practice in CA.

http://www.nnedv.org/internetsafety.html

About IM trails I guess

It was just an open ended question to whomever.

Like I said, I don't know anything about the law.

Ah Brits,
She is supposed to hear from her Atty, who by the way, if you read back some, is not wanting to take this to court. He wants a plea deal, and IMO is not a good atty for her.

But they are going to hear about the plea deal tommorow, and the judge wont continue the case, even because her atty did not show up last time. She already had changed from a bad PD

I don't think the atty even looked at what the DA had. At least that was my impression. His advice was it would be his word against hers, and he wasn't confident that the judge would believe her son.

Writer and her son are going to take the plea as it stands now, as long as he delivers what he promised. Tommorow I think.

Im glad you posted this info, it might help if they do go to trial, and at least she can tell if her lawyer is doing all he can and should for her.

We will know tommorow the news anyway

If something was braught up that wasn't disclosed to writers atty beforehand it wouldn't be admissable I don't think.

It is up to writers atty to look into the DAs case against them. Which we don't know how much work he has done towards this. we just know that he doesn't feel he can stop the girl and her family from putting a blot on her sons reputation, we don't know all the details why, just that he can't find a way to fight it. IMO, he isn't gonna bother.

Read back on this Brits, see if you agree, I think the lawyer is lazy, not because hes a lawyer, but because he can be.

It was a good question

Hi Writer,

Just thought I would like to check in on your story. I am not an attorney, and it sounds like Brits_Brat had an excellent suggestion, but it seems like you are down to the 11th hour now on deciding. Even so, although it seems likely you cannot possibly afford (on your own, and not with any unlikely financial help form the OM) to retain the current attorney, if you AND YOUR son decide to have this case tried even at the 11th hour I would consider a PD IF you and your son decide this is the best option. Okay, so the judge gets p.o.'d on July 29 without legal representation, I cannot believe that a local or municipal judge could proceed with a trial, when even at the last minute and for lack of finances, a defendent decides at the last minute that he (your son) does not have adequate legal counsel. My point in saying this is simply this. As you are well aware, people with less financial resources are charged and convicted of crimes to a much higher degree than people with more. So, please do not come down to the wire and allow your current financial situation to determine the best legal remedy for your son. Lt's face it Wirter, if you had $100k to allocate to his case this would not be stressing you nearly as much because you would have been able to afford the best and highest defense. I just feel that by this current attorney not even having the consideration of keeping you posted and in the loop for the last two months he has now allowed a good family to dangle in the wind. You would definitely need some advice from someone in the legal profession, either online here or in person.

That being said Writer, know what, I am concerned about you and your family too now as lurioosi2 is. So okay, just a few suggestions for your menu. Kraft Classic tangy spahgetti - comes in a box for $1.89. Only other thing required is a $0.79 can of tomato paste. Feeds four (lightly). So double it and for $6.00 you have a really full meal for at least four. I lived on this when I was in college - at least 3 times a week. And, tuna - canned about $.99 per can and failry high in protein and served with pasta a good meal. Or, 70% or 75% ground beef (maybe mixed with a small amout of 85% lean) - add a can of cream of mushroom soup and a can or two of cut green beans and is filling. Even add some torn up bread to the hamburger mix before you fry or grill it. And yea another of my favorites from college..franks. Just boil the beef franks, slit down the middle, not in two tho, use the cheese you got from the food bank to slice little strips and put into the franks...microwave or oven bake for about two minutes and serve with inexpensive macaroni salad or also inexpensive potatoe salad. And yes, there is Chef-Boy-Ardee (sp) in a box for about $3.89 here. Makes two pizzas serving 6. Sprinkle top with chopped and fried ground round and and chopped onion and maybe a few diced olvies and there you go for a nutritional and filling meal for a Sat. night when you guys watch a dvd movie that you checked out from your local library.

I am not being facetioous (sp) toward you Writer or in any way disresepctful toward you. Just saying that I would rare back now on the legal situation ( if only it is in your son's best interest) and trying to help you in anyway I can even tho I realize it is in very tiny chunks.

By way, as regarding cooking and food. Except when I go out with friends or my son or wife (who is in a nursing home now and that does not happen much) I have eaten one meal a day - primarily supper - for last five years. Partly because back in 2005 I had to pay off her hospital bill Not covered by ins. and partly because I have gotten used to it. Am still alive and feeling good at age 68.

Well can offer you no more except a special prayer for you and your family tonight as you face this crisis and decision.

My Best to You and Yous,

Tom

Thanks CP. I think I've been watching too many Boston Legal reruns.

Sorry, but I'm back thinking about a lie detector test.

Son insists that nothing happened. The authorities have his computer to verify.

Son is agreeable to a plea bargain.

Sorry, I've been gone all day. We decided to take the day off from freaking out and go swimming. Wouldn't you know it, the attorney called while we were gone even though he wasn't supposed to call until tomorrow. I tried calling him back when we got home and he was already gone. Ugh. Guess I'll have to wait until tomorrow to find out what's going on.

On the positive side, I feel a bit more relaxed and the sunburn isn't hurting too bad yet.

I need to catch up on all these posts.

Update, what did the atty call about?

He left a message saying he wanted to talk to us about our payment plan and something that he spoke to the probation department about. He didn't mention anything about talking to the DA, so I don't know if he's spoken with them yet. I probably won't be able to talk to him until later today since he's almost always in court in the morning. I hate waiting.

So he calls when it's about HIM but doesn't call when you're in need? Hmmmm--do you think you might express your frustration to the guy who gave you the referral? Does the attorney KNOW you were a referral?

I think the main point of his call is to discuss something that he spoke to the probation department about regarding our case, but we'll have to wait and see what that is.

Thinking of you today writer.

Thanks Luri.

And thank you for the encouraging (and funny) words yesterday. You always make me laugh.