Hi, everybody. <P>Well, instead of my usual whining, I wanted to throw out a few questions my H has asked over the last months. My answers weren't enough, so since they've come up again, thought I'd put them to you.<P>If given the opportunity, what would you sit down and say to a betrayer who:<P>1. Thinks they may want to come home, but can't find the courage.<BR>2. Is afraid that they will "fail" again.<BR>3. Is afraid they will never make a good spouse (OK almost the same as #2).<BR>4. Worries that things will be great, but only for a while. ("What about in 5 years? 10 years?")<BR>5. Wonders if marriages can really last, if love can really last.<BR>6. Wonders if this affair and separation will irreversibly damage the marriage.<P>And, I guess any other thoughts or advice about all the fears that we all have faced. Kat1, DMac, Suse - all you vets - I could use some advice from you too!!<P>Thanks a lot guys.<P>Lori

I would say that the betrayer would never know unless he tried and is he doing anything more productive with his time than worrying over failing when you are open to actually working things out with him? This is a win-win situation. You want to work things out, he does too. It's ok to be scared, everyone is. But you'll never know unless you try and it may be better to work at things than to wait 5-10 years later and regret that you never even tried. <BR>Also, I have found that the best things in life are ones that you had to work the hardest to obtain. Good Luck and God Bless!<P>------------------<BR>Chick's <BR>Bren<P>You won't see things until your ready to not be blind!<P><BR>

I am certainly NO veteran, but I do recoomend the Book "Affair the Affair" by Janis Abrahms Spring. It answers most of the questions posed by your husbadn.<P>Another thing, I saw Phil McGraw, PhD on Oprah - I guess last week or so -my friend who doesn't work taped it for me. Anyway, it was about infidelity. In reference to the betrayers and betrayed, he said people want one of 3 things:<P>1) To change their behavior (I think for betrayers - the cheating and lying; for betrayed - the forgiving and trusting)<BR>2) To justify their current actions (same as above, I think)<BR>3) People are looking for a guarantee that they will not be hurt in thew future. Phil told the guests that there is a guarantee - that YOU WILL BE HURT AND DISILLUSIONED IN TH FUTURE BECAUSE REALTIONSHIPS ARE NOT PERFECT. This applies to staying in the marriage or moving on to another relationship, whether it is the affair or some other relationship. Phil put it plainly - people don't think exactly alike or what and expect exactly the same things and thet is why we get disappointed and disillusioned. He did want people to realize THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU CAN'T BE HAPPY - BUT, IT WON"T BE PERFECT!!!!!<P>Hope this helps....<P>Roll Me Away

Lori--<P>He wants to know if you can forgive him. He hears you, but it hasn't sunk in.<P>He wants to know if he can forgive himself because he's ashamed of his mishandling of his worries. His shame results in disbelief of YOUR forgiveness--because he himself can't imagine forgiving the same set of circumstances...but I'll bet he could...<P>He's sure made a fine mess of things. With your help he's got a leap back into the original frying pan (lol) and not expect guarantees of happiness but to simply find ways to BE happy in your marriage. Has he forgotten--"in sickness and in health, for richer/for poorer..." We're reminded of NOT so good times even in our wedding vows! It's life. <P>Sounds to me like he's realllllly thinking about things. (and waffling, fairly typical from what I've been reading generally) Hang in there, Lori...your Plan A is indeed working.<P>Laura

Thanks, Chicks, Roll Me Away, Lucks.<P>Hey, Lucks, How're YOU doing? Keep your fingers crossed!<P>Up to the top!<P>Lori

Oh, RMA, almost forgot. Can't get him to read ANYTHING. Don't know why. Trying some old "success story" posts for starters. Maybe if I break him in gently..........??<P>Don't you just LOVE Phil McGraw??<P>Chicks - at least he's thinking now. At first, he wasn't even doing that!!! Thanks for the encouragement.<P>Lori

hi Lori!!<P>thanks for asking, we're on a nice uphill ride again. I'm at work now...will post at greater length tonight.

Lostva,<BR>No real answers because my H is asking the same things. I think his biggest question is how to live and not regret - not regret what has happened to our marriage AND not regret what might have been-but never should have been with OW. I do not feel it is my place to answer these questions for him - just more controlling behavior on my part, but to support and forgive (IF I truly and honestly can) while he works them through himself.<P>It is NOT at all easy, but I think the fact that he is asking them is very positive. In my own situation I feel it will lead either to an honest and examined reconciliation or dissolution. And either is preferable to unexamined limbo.<P>(Of course it would be better if OW were already out of the picture which is not the case here - and to me that impeaches the "honesty" element a bit.)<P>Good luck,<BR>Starpony

thanks, Starpony, Our OW is still hanging on tight, too. But one can always hope....<P>Good luck to you, too.<P>To the top!<P>Lori

Lostva,<P>I take a stab at this because all of the questions really apply to life in general not just an affair. People who lose jobs, friends, loved ones, you name it ask very similar questions.<P>1. Thinks they may want to come home, but can't find the courage.<P>It does not take so much courage as humility. If he can admit he was wrong, will you accept that and go forward. If so tell him that. You do love him.<P> <BR>2. Is afraid that they will "fail" again.<P>Boy, this is a good one. I say something on TV the other night. I believe it was a sports person could have been a politician but it really struck home. He "thanked God that he had had the chance to fail". You and he will fail again. Maybe at marriage, maybe at work, maybe as a friend. But if you try anything where you can succeed you will fail sometimes. There is nothing wrong with this. I tell people that I don't mind being wrong so much, but I hate staying wrong. Tell you H to thank God he has a chance to fail and he should take it.<P>3. Is afraid they will never make a good spouse (OK almost the same as #2).<P>Ask him what a good spouse is. Then tell him what you think a good spouse is. You obviously think he was a good spouse before this started so he clearly was one and can be one. Tell him that.<P>4. Worries that things will be great, but only for a while. ("What about in 5 years? 10 years?")<P>Tell him not to worry about 5,10,... years. One or both of you may be dead. Seriously, look at Payne Stewart. Go for it now. The years just fly by. Deal with problems 10 years from now at Oh! about 10 1/2 years from now.<P>5. Wonders if marriages can really last, if love can really last.<P>Obviously, marriages last. So does love, but it is constantly changing. If you expect the same feeling as when engaged or newly married forget it. You don't even feel the same way about a car or truck as you did when you bought it. In fact many people become more attached to old/very old cars and trucks and they clearly cannot perform as they used to or a newer model. It can be done.<P>6. Wonders if this affair and separation will irreversibly damage the marriage.<P>Yes, in my opinion the affair did irreversible damage/change. However, just because you cannot go back in time does not mean that the marriage cannot be changed into something better. THe old marriage is dead in one sense but a new one can and has (see Suse and Dunc, and many more) been built on the old roadbed. If you can forgive him, and realize that you both want the same things, it seems to me it is not a question of someone beholding to another but simply people agreeing to give to each other. If he can give and you can give, then a detour around damage can be built and the road up ahead can be traveled.<P>Seems to me these are reasonable questions. Your answers will depend on how you feel, but they surely are not show stoppers.<P>Give him you best shot.<P>Good Luck and God Bless You

Maybe this is his side of the trust equation.<BR> <BR> Simone

Just Learning - thanks for the insight. You're right. You know, I am trying my best to be there for him. He has always been a wonderful and remarkable man. I like everything that you said. BTW - humility is NOT his strong suite!!! Pride is one of our biggest enemies here. <P>Simone - Very good. Something to think about. I don't doubt it if you want to know the truth. That will be hard for both of us, I think. But certainly not insurmountable. Not for me, anyway. Thanks.