The reason you interfere with the natural dying process is that you want to eliminate her desire to ever get into another affair. You need to change her mindset completely. If you let this die a natural death, the lesson she learns is that affairs are fun until she gets tired of them. What's to stop her from looking up other old boyfriends or meeting people at the gym or at work or anywhere.

By doing a nuclear exposure, you shatter her world. She will experience massive amount of pain which will prevent her from ever getting in another affair. She gets to experience all the embarassment and shame from her friends and family. She gets to experience rejection from her peers. She feels the full force of the negative aspects of her affair. That's what will end the affair and prevent her from ever starting one up again.

Have you read all of DrH's articles and advice on EXPOSURE? There is a lot of info on it out there and I find it interesting that you continue to cherry pick what you seem fits your sitch. your sitch is the same as a lot of other ones. Have you read a lot of other people's threads and see that this isn't something that is suggested every once in a while? Do you see how it suggested to each and every poster over and over again. I haven't found ONE, NOT ONE poster who exposed, and after the WS got over the initial anger, said that they regretted it. There are countless who have talked about how they didn't expose, exposed too late or trickle exposed and how they regretted THAT.

What are you afraid will happen if you expose? What is the worst thing that will happen? If you are afraid that your WW will leave you then she still has the power in this marriage. Do you see this? Do you see how she is still driving this bus. She is the one driving this marriage into the ground.

If you really feel like DrH would suggest that your sitch is different and that he would suggest no exposure, why not call the coaching center and asking them for their professional advice?

This is exactly right. He doesn't understand that this is more than just ending the affair. Sure, the affair may end, but unless he stops enabling her fantasy, he will be facing other affairs because her mindset will never change.



The fantasy mindset is your biggest enemy, Humble. Letting this die a "natural death" does nothing to lift the fog and facilitate recovery. Ending the affair is NOT recovery, it is just the start.

My fear for you is that your enabling has created false expectations of entitlement that will not serve you well in the future. As someone who a) is a former wayward and b) who is in a happy, recovered marriage, I have to point out that your instincts are not serving you well. Everyone here wants the best for you, but there is nothing we can do if you don't follow the advice.

Exposure also prevents the A from reigniting in the future which is half the battle in "ending" it.

Just because OM is lovebustering doesn't mean that your WW has lost the feelings of being "in love" with him. That will linger for a VERY long time.

Dr H has said before he has seen the affair end, the couple recover their marriage, the WS say they don't ever want to compromise the M again, and ends up leaving the BS for the OP five years after the affair ended because it was reignited.

You are underestimating the power of the A. Even if it died a natural death, even if you expose and she ends it, you need to be watching on both ends and EPs need to be put in place. OMW plays a HUGE role here, watching on her end and repairing her M.

You are going to have to be looking over your shoulder carefully for years the way that you are doing this...not only for reigniting this A but for the start of a new one.

Humble, in all the quotes you posted, Dr Harley NEVER says to allow the affair to die a natural death. Dr Harley is a strong advocate of exposure:




radio segment

Question.....do you EVER plan to expose? Like, after the two weeks is up and lets say....she does end it.....do you plan to expose then?

You mentioned as part of your reasoning that you wanted to try and do this without your kids being hurt......even though this is BAD....your kids are already hurt. They will continue to be hurt and your wife needs to see that. For many WW's that is the ONE thing that finally GRABS them....is knowing that they have hurt their children and having to face it.

If your plan is to NEVER expose I see a life of misery for you. You say that you will deal with false recoveries, or setbacks. WHY would you be okay with that if you might could prevent it with EXPOSURE.

Granted, I am no expert but I promise these people here have been there and done that.

When you say that you will pick and choose what you want to use from this website it is like picking parts of a weight loss program like....I will eat less but im not going to excercise YA KNOW???? The program works because its a WHOLE program.

Good luck to you!

IMO, you are observing two lovers squabbling. It's a part of the A dynamic that actually adds spice to the relationship - the push-me pull-you. You've heard the old joke about how make-up sex is the best sex, right? The same idea applies to affairees and their squabbles. They trade barbs, then agonize over whether the OP really meant it, etc. It's pretty immature, but there you go.

But I hope I'm wrong and you're right.

Hey, Humbled - maybe you should read Iamdown2010's thread. It's very similar to yours. And, in a similar fashion, he has refused to listen to any of the poster's advice. Five months into the long distance EA, and it's now PA. His WW has stated that she's confused, that she should be put in a mental institution, and that he flew to town while he was travelling and they engaged in a lot of sex. See how the addiction plays with a wayward's mind? Oh, and he's allegedly bi-sexual. So there's that nasty possibility of AIDS on top of all the other STDs. He just can't seem to wrap his mind around the MB concepts.

I think it's must reading for you.

I can understand why you'd think that but I didn't explain fully. She is watching everything he does and she is testing him. She has been listening to me, my counselors, and the few people in our life who know and who have told her he's a typical MM and is just trying to get in her pants. So she is testing him. And she is noticing when she writes him a sexy message he writes her back. And when she doesn't, he doesn't. It seems to be breaking the illusion and is really making her not like him. And I feel like if he is just continuing to self-destruct, why shouldn't I let it happen a little more? It's just going to make it easier for her to come out of the fog. I could be wrong, but it seems to be helping...meanwhile, I am the wondeful husband on Plan A who is meeting her ENs and paying attention to her both when sex is on the table and when it is not.

What did that take, 2 days? I owe you all a massive apology. I'm sorry and I WAS WRONG.

Today started great. WW slept in guest room for second night last night (supposedly still mad) and woke up depressed. I aksed if she needed a hug, she asked me if I did. We hugged. She immediately perked up and got happy. OM only wrote WW once today (LB for her), and she spent most of day looking at OMW FB page and my page (usually a sign that she is considering ending it). I got home and she hugged and kissed me and told me she might need "my body" tonight (playfully), and then admitted she almost came back to our bed the night before because she already missed me. Said sleeping in the guest room was working already and making her miss me more. We watched TV together and had sex. Everything was great.

Then she made a comment about talking to OM on FB until February of next year (apparently she decided this is how long she needs). When I seemed surprised and said I thought it was for 1-2 more weeks, it got ugly and turned into a discussion that just ended (it's 2:30am). Now she is fully talking D, and says she will pursue affair with him if she is D'd, etc. She said again that if he goes, I go. She said smugly that she gets him either way, so she has all the power (meaning if she stays or goes). Then she nicely mentioned that if she stays with me while she talks to him it improves our chances. She also intimated that she is not sure if she could actually physically cheat on me or not (she has always sworn she couldn't).

I feel so stupid. You were all right. I will full expose. She will go ballistic. I admit it, I am scared and weak. I really don't want to do this or go through it. I know you are all right and it is the right thing to do in the long run, but I am already so emotionally drained from working the Carrot of Plan A for 3 months and living in this alone that I just want the comfort of her and I back. I wish I had not said anything tonight so I could've enjoyed one last night - she probably would have cuddled with me. I miss my DW so much (not my WW). My DW shows up sometimes and when she does I realize how very much I miss her. It makes me want to fall apart and do stupid things just to see her once in awhile. I know it's pathetic so please no tough love on this part - I'm just venting feelings. Sometimes its tempting to just keep my mouth shut just to have all those good moments with her.

I will full expose now. We'll see how that interferes with her "I get him either way" attitude. All of a sudden now even getting a D won't get her her fix if OMW and family are watching him like a hawk. On the other hand, she really might D me anyway. She sounded really adamant that she is going to do it either way.

I am SO scared to do this and deal with the massive conflict, fallout, and upheaval it will cause in my and my children's lives. I don't want her to go. I love her.

Do not be scared. You are doing the right thing. Your children will thank you in future, it is the best thing that their father could do in that kind of situation.

Your WW will be furious, of course. But you are prepared. Actually, you already know exactly what she's gonna say.

Do not warn WW or OM. Do not hesitate. Expose now.

Be strong and angry.

I know the place where you are right now but let me courage you - the days after exposure were actually the first days when I felt normal person after many months.

All a ruse.



Now you know why she was acting that way. Your DW likely never showed up.

Good luck with your exposure plans.

Humbled, I am very sorry you are in this place. I truly am.


There really is a difference between the two, huh? You have a good chance of getting your wife back if you are strong and courageous. If you stand up for yourself, your family, and the woman your wife once was.

Realize that your wife is in an addiction. There really is no other parallel that describes her right now. She is addicted to the rush of emotions she gets from the OM. You need to help her JUST the same as if she were addicted to drugs or alcohol, because the end result is going to be the same: this addiction will destroy her family, her marriage, and in the end her own soul.

You need the help and support of all those that love you both. You need to approach this with just that mindset. Let them know that your wife is in an affair, that she and your marriage need their help. You, and those that love your wife and support your marriage must intervene and give her a good dose of reality to shock her out of this affair. Let your wife know that you are willing and able to become the husband she needs, let her know that you will not tolerate her addiction. That is what Plan A IS. It isn't vengeful, it isn't dirty laundry, it is helping your wife to see the dangerous situation she is in, and offering her the promise of a better life.

Because Exposure is so hurtful to your wife, because it will make her so angry, do it QUICK, and WIDE. Expose to ALL your targets in one day. Include members of OMs family: his parents, spouse, friends along with your important family members and friends. Anyone with influence over the two. Get a list together to make it easy to do all at once.

You get 1 chance to do this right, so do it right. Everyone, at one time.

When the spitfire arrives, realize she is the crack addict who's pipe just got taken away. Lovingly let her know that "I will do what it takes to save my marriage." and "This marriage cannot withstand a third person." Do not speak about it any more than that. You don't have to explain yourself further.

Be a broken record.

You are standing for your family.

You CAN do this!

Also - and you're probably gonna balk at this, but trust me - if you have children, exposure MUST include them. They MUST be the ones told and YOU must be the one to do it. Trying to include your wife here will only provide her an opportunity to LIE to your children.

Mel has about a gazillion quotes on WHY this is the right thing to do. Trust me, EVERY BS argues this point but if you're going to Expose, your children must know.

Thank you. I'm sorry I was in stubborn denial before. I don't want to be here. I can't believe this happened to us. We have always been "BH & WW", you know? Even during the affair, she said we always would be. God, I miss her so much already. I can't stop crying or shaking. I just want my wife back. I want the mother of my children back, for me and them. Please help me find the strength - I'm trying, I really am.

I have never been afraid of much in my life. The only thing I've ever been afraid of is losing my DW or kids. Literally, nothing else. I always feared if it happened, it would be to a car wreck or something. But never like this. It hurts so much I don't know how to process this pain. She was my soulmate. And now she not only says she isn't anymore, she says she never was. I don't understand how anyone can live through this. I gave her everything I had to give and more. She made me feel a level of love I had never felt before in my life.

I will fully expose ASAP because what else do I have to lose. I give up. I have no place else to turn. You are all right. My plan obviously wasn't working. I hope it's not too late to do it correctly. I'm sorry I was defensive.

I need to open a new bank account and transfer funds.
I need to make copies of evidence without giving away my intel.
I need to make a list on all sides and fully expose.
What else?

Do I block her internet and cellphone yet or let her and the OM talk during the fallout from the full exposure before I do so? In other words, do I let them end on a high note or let the reality hit them while they're in contact?

My kids are 5 and 2. What do I say?

Humbled, the threats will get worse when you expose. But you can't let that scare you, friend. They are meaningless. Liken it to taking the crack pipe away from a crack head. He goes crazy with rage, but when he sobers up and experiences sobriety, he is grateful you did that for him.


Conflict avoidance causes more conflict. This short term conflict is the most likely thing to lead to the salvation of your marriage and your children's family. Avoiding conflict now will lead to the breakup of your family when your wife leaves you for the OM or her next OM.

Humbled, when you expose, please start with the OM's wife and go down your list. That might be the bullet that kills this affair.

When you are finished and all hell breaks loose with your wife, I would tell her that you love her and will do what it takes to save your marriage. Because of that, you must insist she end her affair TODAY.

We will be here for you, Humbled. Be strong and move forward!

I think I'll tell her I'm working today but take the day off work and go to Starbucks to work on this (free wi-fi). I need to make my lists and open a new account. Then I'll start exposing. Do I need to contact a lawyer yet?

I really need your support today. I'm not strong enough to do this alone. I love her so much and it makes me so weak for her, and the damn WW she is now knows it. Luckily she is weak for me too - I guess I should be glad for that. I'll be on here all day - I really need some encouragement. My wife is my whole world. We can talk about how unhealthy that is later