BH - Just a quicky to say I am all for you going to Plan B. I'm surprised you've survived this long to be honest. Your WH is so full of excuses and, IMHO, just plain lazy and seemingly unwilling to put in any effort at all. Plan B may be the wakeup call he needs. And if he never wakes up, you may just be better off without him in the end. I'm so sorry for your struggle. I can't begin to imagine the pain and heartache that you've suffered. But one thing is for certain; regardless of how your marriage turns out, YOU will be a better person in the end.

aBetterMe

I am at that stage, I am out of steam and starting to get vengful and hatefl feelings for WH and thats just not me. I dont like being bitter, i dont like being angry and I really dont like feeling hopeless.
Either way Plan B works out its an END, its an end to the M or an end to bad behaviour.

Just listening to DR H radio show, the taker giver section is spot on, I am the giver 80% of the time.
Yes WS is great at helping around the house and is supportive with the household chores, I love that about him. We work as a team there isnt the male ego thing going on and I really really appreciate that. especially when the days of chronic fatigue syndrome is kicking in. I am petrified of the exhaustion that will come from taking on looking after 4 boys alone and doing all the housework alone. But if I achieve this then I will feel so proud of myslef and thats what I am looking forward to.

I have a couple of questions regarding plan B now.

1) whats the best approach to packing stuff, should he do it or should i pack for him?

2) Is there a way where the nesting approach would work, Ie he lives at the house with the kids thursday to saturday, then he goes and I live with the children sun-wednesday and stay at a friends the other nights as those are my hectic work days i would be out from 8am till 11pm so will only need a place to sleep. Would this be a bad idea as he would get to live in the house 3 days a week even though it will still be without contact with me.

3) Do I tell people we are separated? trial separation? I just dont know. From my point of view I am scared of unwanted male attention when stating that I am separated. I dont want anyone else I dont want dates or anyone making advances.

4)Whats the best way to explain this to the children, I have already asked the oldest one how would he feel if dad was to move out for a bit he seems indifferent to the notion.

5)I plan to delete him from FB and ask friends not to tell me waht he is updating his status to as it will get to me. Is that a good idea?

6)How do I stop myself from crying like a baby as he is walking out.

I just think that if you allow your H to be home he will never experience the loss of his family.He will still have contact with his kids and his home so he will not suffer a full blown plan B.
Furthermore, how come you work such long hours? You said you have chronic fatigue. If you go into plan B, do you have a support system, family who can move in with you for a while and help you?
You doing the moving around allowing your H to stay with the kids some times during the week will exhaust your energy. Guaranteed.
Blessing

1) I'd say pack it for him. The essentials. If there's something else he wants, he can ask for it through the IM and get it from the IM.

2) Like atena said, if he's in the house half the time he'll never get a true feeling of loss for family and marriage. He should move out, you stay at home.

3) Tell people whatever you like and if there are male advances make it clear you are not on the market.

4) Explain to your children that Daddy has made mistakes and has broken promises to Mommy and that while you love them very much and Daddy loves them very much, right now Daddy cannot live at home until he makes and keeps some new promises (adjust for age level).

5) Yes, delete him from Facebook and tell everyone you don't want to know what or how he is doing.

6) You must be strong and you CAN be strong. Make sure you have an emotional support team you can lean on after he moves out and going forward. And keep coming here too! We can be great cheerleaders to get you through this.

{{{{{{BH}}}}}}}

in answer to your question about what you tell others about your marital status...until divorce your response is "I'm married" and you drop it like a hot rock, because it is nobody's business.

Your WH is there, he knows you are going into Plan B; he knows there is a deadline...have him pack his stuff while you are there and then leave. You hand him the Plan B letter as he goes.

Is there any way that you can change your work schedule? It sounds grueling and you will have children and home to take care of. Do you have some support...friends and family, to help lighten the load for you when you need a breather?

I wouldn't do the house sharing thing. It will take it's toll on you at a time when you really need to settle in to this new change. Work out a visitation schedule, have the children go with their dad. This will give you much needed time to decompress in your own home. The first couple of weeks are difficult, and the privacy and comfort of your own home will be a blessing. Remember, Plan B can go on for some time...years...and you want to be ready for the long haul, not just tomorrow or this month. Treat it like your WH does not exist.

Be honest, in an age appropriate way, with your children.

Block him from your facebook and explain to your friends and family that you would appreciate if they could keep your progress to themselves.

Hey

I agree with not house sharing I aske the question because WS brought it up today so was getting an opinion, Him living here will lessen the effect of plan B somewhat and I already explained that children wise he needs to see them outside of the house. So im glad my gut instinct was accurate on this.

Telling people im separated came up as I had an unexpectedly strange episode today at work. Was talking to a female colleague about H possibly moving out tomorrow and I would not be available for work (im not due in to work but they do call me consantly to come in and do extra shifts) I was unaware that my male boss was behing me and he later made me feel uncomfortable by showing an interest in me. I was totally unaware he felt anything for me, I am glad today was his last day on the job he is being moved to a different store and today was his last day so wont have to see or deal with him again. Have told him in no uncertain terms I loved my H and him moving out was not the end of my marriage. Seriousely had no idea the boss was interested in me. Havent told WS about this incident yet dont know what to make of it. So yeah random strangers I can deal with others now im nervouse.

Cronic fatigue wise I used to work 7 days a week 2 hours in the morning at two different hospitals and on three of those days would work 5 hours in the evening at second job. In the spirit of simplyfing life and making more time for quality time with WS I agreed to work 3 days a week and cover both hospitals in the same day then go onto evening job this leaves me 4 days off and it crams all in one day so it works out at 4-5 hours in the morning and 5 hours in the evening I get a brake in the middle so can recover and have caffeine tablets to help along with the fatigue. I cant change my schedules again as work finally got the right cover in place to accomodate my first request for change.

Family support - absolutely none. no mum no dad no siblings (well twin brothers who are 13). His parents will want us together so they wont be a good support as will pass messages lobby on his behalf to let him come home unchanged. Friends, local friends, I have one good friend who is pregnant, I dont know if any of you remember my last thread she gave bith in December and baby passed away 3 minutes after birth, so I really dont want to stress her out as of her current pregnancy the stress is high enough. Other friends live far away from the area, so i am alone. I like being able to depend on myself and although scared of being alone it cant be worse than what I am going through now.

No it won't because you won't be IN Plan B. Plan B is absolute, total darkness with no possibility of contact other than through an IM.

What you're describing is not Dr. H's Plan B. I'm not sure what it is.

It was something i came accross called nesting where separated couples share house and kids half the week each. It was designed to avoid moving kids around too much. so the kids stay in one place the parents move around.

I agree it would not be appropriate in my case was making sure I got that right.

What an exhausting day! Plan B was well underway and I really was prepared this time. Wrote letter, sealed the envelope.
WS came back from work wanting to talk (at 2am!) was sweet and seamed really lost by all this and felt really bad for him. Asked for another chance, explained I just didnt trust him to do anything that he promised. Explained that there are 3 things I needed more than anything and he keeps saying he doesent get them so I cant work with that, the 3 things I asked for were.

1)Family Loyalty/protectivness
2)Boundries that are kept stictly
3)my EN's met

Thats it, thats the start that I could work with and cant take any less. Told him to have a good think about that and as I was very exhausted told him I needed time to think and a good night sleep.

Woke up to WS in tears, got the following message on FB

"I feel so humble that you have stuck by me through the years when goodbye would have been easier but today and everyday from here forward because of you I get to tell you and show you how much I love and adore you.

Your everything to me babe...s and I love you more than my words could ever say xx"

I just didnt have the heart to plan B him. It was hard as I was all set, cold and detached and then in one day he shows what I needed to see for a long time. Humility, regret, love and emotion. How can I plan B him after that?

I almost felt a loss at having to let go of plan B for the time being. I really dont know if I did the right thing but I feel good about seeing where this new attitude leads.

Spent the morning listening to the MB radio show (it is really really good) and then WS sat me down to work out 15 hours of UA time (unfortunately we could only find 11 hours but we are still looking to make the changes). He has suggested that he is writing a new set of boundries that he will write on his own and then run them past me to see if they are what I need and would agree to. His theory is if he wrote them alone then it will show the understanding he has rather than when he did it with steve on autopilot.
He wanted more details about my ENs I took time to explain what my expectations were and he seams surprised as in his head he thought it was so much more complicated that it transpired. Promised to meet EN's and communicate about them in order to seek better understanding.
Family loyalty he thought i wanted him to go up to random strangers and verbally abuse them if they looked badly at our family (seriousely i dont know where he gets this stuff from) I explained that it involved being loyal as in not badmouthing family or agree with people that do (referring to the student incident). Putting family fist and protecting them aginst hurt.
Sort of gets it but not quite yet.

He then wanted to do a few more things regaring involving the children and behaviour charts, did that and asked him to have a brake as was feeling really tiered by then.

Was really affectionate verbally and phisically all day. It was nice to see him like that.

And thats it from me now going to zone out watching a movie while he is at work need to rest my brain for a bit.

sigh...sounded like he planned the WHOLE thing. Oh well, what's done is done, good luck on another FR.

BH28, my main concern is that your WH is just trying to stay his execution in whatever manipulative way he can. I don't believe this will last. I expect that he will go thru the motions long enough to get you fully rooted in attempted recovery and then let it all go again.

Sorry. This does not sound like a contrite man. You are on your way to another FR.

BH...you are allowing yourself to be snowed. I think you should still go Plan B. What he is doing is not enough...and you are too close to see it.

He wakes you up at 2am? Why? For the drama of it...to put you in that place where you doubt yourself, INSTEAD of just making the changes in behavior without provocation...without you telling him how to change...HE SHOULD be towing the line..not you. This is all just smoke and mirrors, IMO.

You could all be very very right. Plan B is not extinct, all the preparations and the hard slog I have put into it dont just havnish into thin air howerver it feels impossible to implement while WS is behaving well.
Should the previous outragious behavior reoccur then it will be a swift non dramatic Plan B in place before he can even look sorry.

I really get plan B when a wayward is still involved in A or misbehaving, I just dont know how to relate it to a usually emoionless looking H who is crying in the morning.

I also have a very valid financial reason (got a call this morning regarding my grandmothers inheritance finally coming through talked about this in previous thread but it was still on hold due to legal reasons) I need appropriate time to safeguard this before starting a cold war on WH. His behaviour was changed before the phone call.

I am disappointed with myself but also looking forward to having some deposits in my love bank should I go to plan B at a later date it would be easyer as if I did it today feeling the way I do there would be no mountain high enough he could have climbed to get back to the marriage.

Time will tell, if he is genuine then all is better if not then he hasnt got the patience to keep up a pretence long enough and Plan B will stand.

I dunno, BH, about that no mountain high enough...if that were true you wouldn't quickly accept, as you have, what your WH has to offer right now.

What will happen when WH lets you down is all those deposits will spill out of your sieve of a bank, and you will become indifferent. You won't NEED plan B at that time, except to not have to deal with your erratic WH. You won't need to preserve love because you will have shut that down.

...or maybe not...maybe you can take more punishment. I know I did---three years of it. I lived in a very similar situation to yours, with someone who sure could talk a good game to weasel his way back in, and then sit on his dead [censored] waiting for it all just to work itself out...doing the minimum to get by (except I did not find MB until nearly a year into a false recovery).

I really do hope that this is it for you, Atena. I hope your WH really does step up. I would set a time limit instead of waiting for him to just fail. You need a PLAN.

I do have a time limit but dont want him to know about it simply because he might use it as an excuse or might behave just to give me a false sense of security during that time limit and when he has me on the hook then revert to Bad behaviour.

I get the love bank comment and thinking about it you are right I am in a place where no matter how many deposits he makes one bad withdrawal will cause total banktruptsy.

The thing is with my H is that he does not back down EVER for anything. I have threatened to make his life a living hell (and he is well aware I am capable of following through with that threat) if he didnt apologise for something he is well aware he did wrong in the past and guess what he stood defiant. I cant make the guy do anything he does not want to do. I wish I could or I would have done it by now. He never fully beleived I would go through with plan B as I kept the details to myself (very unlike me normally I would be shouting it from the rooftops). It seams that the anniversary of our 10th wedding anniversary was the reason for his emotional state today.

I still dont trust is genuine but wouldnt his life be alot easyer if he just woke up this morning and said " I get everything and things will be great". He didnt do that he was upset/emotional and opened up about his fears and actually communicated with me. It gave me a good idea as to what his brain is translating my needs as and they are very distorted.
Like for example he thinks he has to buy me original never bought before things, do original never done before things. thats just not possible we have been together 10 years.
My dream night is him hiring a DVD that I have been waiting to watch (this is easy I keep a list on the pc, when I see a trailer I like I put the name of the movie on a list and tick it off when i see it and no not many of the ones on the list are girly movies) order pizza delivery and icecream and just cuddle to watch it. He was genuinley confused and baffled thats what I thought was a great night, he thought it cant really be that easy. well it is. it shows organisation, thought and just enough care to show he has thought about me by doing a DVD night like that.

I was really taken back by how overcomplicating his brain can be.

Silent what happened to your marriage? did you recover? what changed his attitude? did you plan B? how did you manage to plan B when he had his game face on.

BH, I used to have my whole story in my sig line but I can give you a quick synopsis.

WH had an EA with supervisor at work, and it was all downhill from there. Their affair ended but his waywardness did not. I found MB about a year after the first A. I continued to make a lot of demands with a WH that never really showed any signs of desiring to RECOVER his marriage, but did desire having me as the soft place to fall. Your WH's WORDS sound like the same script my WH was reading from, except my WH was not nearly as enthusiastic about staying in the marriage. He pretty much did whatever I told him to do EXCEPT implement MB.

I am divorced. I have done a lot of work toward personal recovery; Plan B has helped give me the breathing room to make that happen.


I had a PLAN...and didn't veer far from it. I had been thinking about Plan B for some months prior to implementing it. My situation was different than yours...my WH was drinking heavily and avoiding me. It was an easy choice by the time it came to make it.

I understand not disclosing your new date or plan...as long as you have one

Silent
sorry to hear what happened to you. If I was to be even half as well recovered as you after 3 years of being messed about I would be very proud of myself. What is your XWS doing now, has he even started to sort his life out? Is he atleast a good dad to your son? Are you in total no contact with him?
Its so sad to think that these men who walk not only walk from a family but walk from someone who loved them enough to beleive in them and that they can be a better person. Who does he have now that has that kind of love for him.

the thing with my WS is that he thinks he know it all about me so when I act uncharacteristically it throws him off. The way I calmly went about organising Plan B freacked him out and this could be a temportary state of mind. Also he probably expects me to lower my standards of what I want from him but I made it clear thats not going to happen.

I know this might sound harsh but I was true to myself today. Didnt acknowledge much of the anniversary didnt give him a card or make a big deal of it because I dont want to celebrate 10 years that didnt matter enough to him and that he threw away with the A. We had good things very good things in the first 8 years but its almost like they were written off by the A. I wasnt disrispectful or made any remarks to him about the A I just said I rather look forwards and celebrate when I felt it appropirate. I cant help it but im just not in that place right now.

I have a plan, I am giving him enough space to go wrong shoud he choose to do so but unlike other times where I was unprepared I am very prepared this time. I didnt start to think Plan B was appropriate until about a month ago when I came back to MB now Its in my head it makes more sense than living like I have been. I cant help want to see if what he is doing now is genuine or I would have driven myself insane thinking about it during plan B.

I do not have contact with my WxH. He talks to DS8. I get info here and there about his new women from DS. That's about it. It's the beauty of Plan B. I don't care much whether he gets it or not. It would serve him to 'get' it and make his future relationships better, but it's not my business anymore.

I used to care about WxH getting it. I no longer do.


I understand this. You will STILL drive yourself a little crazy with some what if's in Plan B, but it is always good to know you exhausted your every effort.

Here's the thing. I see his actions as proving he's capable of meeting your emotional needs, expressing remorse, etc.

But until he's up against the wall and past deadline for change, he can't muster the motivation.

Therefore, my guess is that he will revert to his bassackwards schtick as soon as forgiveness is extended.

His "disability" is a FRAUD. He's just patently LAZY!!!!

Sorry BH I been AWOL with a sick baby. I completely agree with KA. You are setting yourself up for big resenetment and may lose the little love you have left.

Make sure you have a plan. Set a date but don't tell him when it is . He needs to make real changes not last minute pleads for another chance. Don't trust his words. Watch his actions.

I'll come back when I can. I'm praying for you.

Hi Vibressa

Really hope baby gets better soon.
I have a plan, and I am watching him but not in his face, givng him enough rope to hang himself so to speack.