I do agree that's a great phrase to say...

He called again and we talked more. I don't know if he's gaslighing me or what but he's apologetic, he's telling me he does love me and he hates himself for doing what he has done..and that he does love me. And that he knows if he came home right now he will fall in love with me.

He actually called to tell me that he saw the banner that we made with the FRG and my kids contributions. And to thank me even though I demoted him when I wrote his rank Lol oops.

We did talk about us, how horrible he feels he asked why do I still want to be with him after everything stuff like that and then we ended it on a good note.

I don't know by the way he's talking sounds like the fog has lifted but it's too early to tell. him going to his parents is not set in stone.

Hi Smiley,
Has your WH established NC yet? By all calling card records he has not. He is still going to be foggy until NC is established.

I'm worried that your WH hasn't committed to coming home to you and his children while on home for R&R. He can blame it on guilt, but in my eyes he's gaslighting you. You just had a baby girl. He hasn't been home to see her yet and he's going to stay with his parents?!


You know they're saying that Game 7 tomorrow might be one for the ages. It could be the 11th NBA title for Lakers coach Phil Jackson. I think I'm pulling for the Lakers only because Phil Jackson coached Michael Jordan and the Bulls to 6 NBA Championships.

How can we establish NC and for me to believe him this time? I can't just take his word for it so what can I do? He is saying there is no contact. With my situation what can I do besides talk to him and say those phrases, get him to agree that his ideal scenario is to be in love with the mother of his kids. And get him to see what we can do to research this.

Do I ask him to do a NC letter? how do i see it and send it myself?

Even though I'm from CA I'm pullng for Boston just because. My family are Lakers fans and it's fun talking crap to them lol

He can give you his password to email accounts, FB and the like. Is his FB de-activated? He can't get into his army email still so he has another email he's using right? Also I think that his ACTIONS would speak louder than anything else.

For the NC letter, have him email it to you, you approve it and he can email it to OW and you together. Obviously he can find ways around that but let his actions speak.

Is your only way to snoop via the calling card? I forgot.



Ewwwww, rooting for the other team just to drive the family nuts!!

FB is deactivated. Can't get into his Army one unless it's a govt computer. He says he doesn't have any other email account but I know of one and can get into it I have that password not by him but by chance. He got rid of the other one that I had access to but that's ok. I can still snoop through calling card but I doubt he is using that card still.

You are right I can do all that though. I think I have to do what Steve told me to do first at least the first part and then establish NC

I'm still around. No changes on my end. Still saying he's going to his hometown. I told him this morning that we can't postpone this until he gets back, it's just going to get so built up and then what?

He said he's not coming there for her, that he told his mom he doesn't want anyone to know he's there and I have a hard time believing that they are not going to make a big deal out of him being there. He is a very big deal with his family.

He says he thinks about that all the time, about missing out on the kids on the baby's first year. And that nothing is set in stone. I do still believe he will come here instead but I'm preparing for him not to be.

For the last week he's been talking to me, almost every day and sounded good talking to me. Says if he were to come now, we'd end up sweeping things under the rug and things will seem fine. He says he doesn't know if he could committ (not his words he said he doesnt' know if he would repeat his actions or not) and I said you make the choice to committ. He asked do you think it's that easy just make the decision not to cheat and then not do it. I said well I will do my part in making our marriage not be where it was, where you felt like you could cheat.

There was an issue/non issue about funds. I knew that if I don't bring him any clothes that he will have to buy clothes for himself and I'm okay with that. He started being ugly about it saying I better figure out how much we were making before and he's taking all of the extra money etc etc. I told him that's fine just let me know when you are taking leave (he says he doesn't know) and I'll put it in your account but he kept being ugly about it and saying he will take the extra money I better make it work until finally I said I'm putting 400-500 in your account what are we arguing for when I'm agreeing with you??

Anyways, like I said we were having good deep conversations about us, and I feel good after talking to him still. He got upset after I told him about how if we were to get seperated I wouldn't be able to talk to him because I would need to get over him, I know I'd still be in love with him and until I lose those feelings he'd have to go through someone if he has to contact me.

Well that's not how this conversation came about - I told him awhile back that if we were to D I'm not going to be his friend, I"m not going to talk to you etc. He does not want to cut me out of his life and ever since we talked about it he seems..different. I told him we're not going to talk about it anymore because if we reach that point then we can deal with it but if not there's no point.

Nothing is set in stone, he could still change his mind and instead of nagging him about it what else can I do? I mean my pyshatrist will say he knows you want him him so there s no need to talk about it every conversation.

getting ready for my trip. I"m still around just reading what else is going on here.

He is not going to come see he beautiful new baby?

Had a great vacay visiting his family. I got worried when I didn't hear from him for 4 days- I started imagining things that could be happening over there. When he finally called I was so relieved I started crying. He said he knew I was on a trip and didn't want to take away my fun by calling. But he felt bad that I was so worried, and has been calling almost every day since. I was thinking about calling the FRG or something I was that worried- I mean I wasn't home if something happened to him I wouldn't know about it. However he asked me for over 1K to fund his R&R time for his clothes shopping, food, etc since I refused to send him clothes to his parents house. I really don't know how I'm going to swing that amount with school shopping just around the corner. Had a little fight about it but right now it's an ongoing conversation. Still hoping he will come home instead.

Tell him when he comes home you can go shopping together.

Time for an update. It's been since July but here goes.

I am in Plan A. When I talked to Steve H. he said my long distance Plan A isn't going to have enough impact if/when I do Plan B. So it's an extended Plan A.

We've been talking, emailing, calling, I send him things. My Plan A has not been stellar though, not as I would like. Due to money situations I haven't been able to send him much of anyhthing.

By our talks, it seems as though the A is over. He tells me he loves me, he wants to wait until March to recover our marriage he's been saying that for awhile.

Unfortunately his mom and i had a small fallingout.It's seems as though she's been waiting for me to mess up/ talk bad about her son or something so that she can officially be on his side. She thinks the worse of me that I would take the kids away from him.

He convinced me to send clothes to his mom. I did it because I thought it would fulfill somethithing, be part of Plan A. I felt horrible doing it. He made some threats if I didn't that he would take this and that away, and he was just mean. Then he apologized etc.

I told him I didn't want to know where he was going for his R&R. He had already told me that he wasn't going to be with his parents, but with a friend who knows about the situation and is letting him stay with him. I didn't even want to know when he goes on his R&R. Part of me still was hoping to see him at our front door. He let it slip that if he went to Texas he would come see us but then he took it back saying he doesn't want to get our hopes up.


Well he told me last Saturday he left Iraq, starting R&R. He's been saying he's miserable, and hates himself for what he's doing and can't wait to be home with us once deployment is over. Main reason why he said not coming home for R&R doesnt want to come home be with me, have us act like nothing is wrong and then when he gets back he will double think his actions over here and he doesn't want to do that.


Anyways I beleived he would come home- imagine my disappointment when he hasn't. I didn't hear from him for 4 days and I started imagining the worse - that he's with her. I lost sleep, apetite, basicaly driving myself crazy.

He finally goes on FB to leave me a on sentence message. He said he's glad I'm okay, he's miserable and he misses us so much. One sentence.


I wrote him back that I'm imaginng the worse is happening and all of my fears. He hasn't responded to that.

I get a phone call from a private number yesterday morning. It's him. first thing out of his mouth is "let me talk to the kids". I asked him waht's going on, where is he, I'm freaking out are you with her. He kept saying let me talk to the kids. I said not until you tell me if you are with her or not. He hangs up on me. I break down crying, and my son walks in on me. I didnt hear or see him. Only afterwards he told me. Then the private number calls back and he said are you really not letting me talk to the kids? and he said if you don't you won't hear from. me. I said just anwer my question - are you with her and he said no matter what I say you you won't believe me. I said just answer the question yes or no yes or no yes or no (yes I really did say it that many times) he finally said No and I said I don't believe you. he said see what I mean.

I did let him talk to the kids, and by the time they were done, he hung up the phone. My daughter said he did ask for the phone to be passed to me but by the time I got it and made sure all of the phones were hung up, we just heard the dialtone. He hung up already. He didnt call back.

My worse fear - he was with her during that phone call. He has been spending time with her, and her kids that it made him think about not being with ours. He felt bad so he called realy early in the morning. By the way he talked to me the aabrupt way he demanded to talk to the kids.That is not how he talks to me. We talk for a very long time, and then I ask him can he talk to the kids. Or usually he asks if he could. but not like that.

Plus the clothes I packed gave me the impression he is going out. He said he is not , he just doesn't have any good clothes.

My love bank is low and I am afraid of doing something drastic. I am thinking of doing Plan B even though Steve H and I have talked about it,and doing a long distance Plan A is not the same as a regular Plan A>

I'm been hestitant of posting here because of the backlash of not following Plan A. I've been written off for not following the plan for Exposure to his job. Even Steve H agreed with me that if exposure is going to be determental to our ablility to support 4 kids then I shouldn' go to his command. Money is tight right now as it is. WHen I left for my vacation I thought things were good but it snowballed and I got bill collectors calling me. I missed a payment, or didn't pay enough of the minimum payment that I got the late fee docked on, and etc etc. I shouldn't have gone to vacation at all.

I'm thinking about doing a Plan B. I want to give him another chance to come home and be with us as a family if he doesn't do it by the end of the week when his Plan B is over then I think I will.

I want to send him a phone number of a cell phone I will get just for the kids. I will give him instructions to call my IM (most likely my sister in law) before calling that number to talk to the kids because otherwise the hphone will be turned off. I will disconnect my home phone, cable internet most likely. I will turn off my FB page, erase any email addresses he has a hold of. get my cell phone taken out. Get me one of those prepaid ones. And move out of our home end of December beginning of January. Either we go live in one of those extended stay places that we stayed at when we firt got to this duty station or we will move to San Antonio and live in one of those apartments. I will sell both cars if I can find thepapers to the truck we paid off (more like we added the remaining payments for the truck on to our existing car) sell them both and get me one car that I can pay in full. I do want to wait until after income taxes to do this. I do not have the funds at all now due to my stupidity.Either sell our stuff or move it into storage. Idk. Then be in Plan B. Be dark. I have visions of meeting him when he gets home, during the ceremony though. That wouln'dt be plan B would it. I dont even want to tell hiim we moved. So that once we drop him off at a hotel room he will know.

ANyways thats what's going through my head right now. I reallly do not want to start Plan B yet without a great PlanA.

I have NO proof guys, there is no way to get any more intel. I exhaused all of my resources.

If he does not come home by end of this week looks like Plan B it is, unless I get oppposing opinions. I''m willing to look at other options other than Plan C or Plan D.

You've got your proof, smiley. It's right there in your post. Re-read, please:

He's buying time to keep both of you. A wayward who wants to come home will come home.

Huh? He hates himself for what he's doing, but he doesn't want to be with you? So he's going to continue doing what he hates himself for doing?

You know it's probable that he's with her. No one dodges a question like that unless they're trying to avoid giving you an answer you don't want to hear. Then you force him to lie to you, which accomplished nothing, as he told you. You had no plans to believe anything except that he was with the OW. So why ask?

How do you think your financial sitch will be if he leaves you for OW?

So when do you plan to start this great Plan A?

By the way...I just went and looked at a couple of your first posts back in 2007 and it appears next March will be your 10th anniversary.

No matter what happens...make that 10 year mark as I'm pretty sure (and maybe this has already been talked about) but after 10 years of marriage to a serviceman you are entitled to half his pension or something.

Seems unlikely now that he could ever push a divorce through in time to prevent this from occurring but wanted to make sure YOU were well aware.

Sorry if this was already mentioned.

Good luck...Mr. W

I was sort of aware of the 10 year thing. I remember something about it I will have to research it.

Ook so how can Plan A work from long distance? Anyone you know had a successful Plan A from afar? I've tried looking and I don't see any.


Yes I know it's pointed out that he's probably with her. Ok.

WHat else can I do? I'm SORRY this isn't the typcial affair since it involves the military and that no one agrees with Steve H that if it's detrimental (sorry I am mispelling that again), if it's going to cause more harm than anything then I should do it and isn't Steve H the expert?

I'm looking for support here please I don't know how much I can take of this.

Look at Geerkaguard's thread. He did a pretty darn good Plan A from Afghanistan.

But he's no longer doing it. And I have - he gave up the dog to fulfill one of her needs just like I did with his clothes. And I think he is trying to move on last I checked.

Either way I decided to erase my FB page - his typical way to contact me. I unplugged the phone, turned off my cell. FOund my IM in my SIL - she sent him a message to contact me through her.I have to read the IM training thread.

Found his other FB page with the name Logan. My SIL looked at the POSOW FB page and saw her hometown is Logan. Looks like that's where he got it from. Guess the A was never over, just more hidden.

So feels like it's Plan B now. What do u guys think.

Plan B letter time - I need some help. Should I email it to him or handwrite it?

type it up, pack up his things and when he is leaving give him the letter

hmm ok I don't know when he is leaving..he is on his R&R (2 week break so packing his things to go where?

send his things to his mom.

Smileygirl,

I am sorry you are in the place where you are. It appears that this extended Plan A has gone on for two long...now he thinks that you will wait for him and he can do what he wants without any consequences, because he can. Why wait until the end of the week in case he comes home?

You have to start taking your life back for you, not trying to inflict pain on him to see if that will change his actions.

You should make plans that suit you and your children, perhaps closer to a support system of friends/family?

I thought that this spring you had a new little one? Has your WH seen the baby in person yet? How could he come to this country after being away so long an not see his kids? Do you really want to hold out hope for someone who makes them so low a priority?

I don't mean to be down on you but it seems that the Plan A just dragged this out and perhaps made you a little more clingy/needy instead of clarified things for you.

I sincerely wish you all the best,

ba