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MJ,

Man, I don't know where you're at on the racetrack but if things are heading to court, you need to have your ducks lined up. IMVHO, lining things up for court is more like plan A than plan B. I know this is a marriage building site, but if your marriage is gone then you need to do what's best for the kids. If you make it difficult to co-parent, the court will take that into account when ordering visitation. If you start a pattern of communicating with them via telephone, the court will take that into consideration. Honestly, Plan B will screw you in court pretty much most of the time.

My youngest was 6 when I divorced and I never missed a day of communicating with her and we have an awesome relationship today. Anywho, I think you really need to evaluate where you're at and where you're realistically going and make a battle plan to get there.....


Hugz, Thoughtz, & Prayerz

Bill
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You can request that there be set times for phone calls in any order the court issues. Get 50/50 in custody. If that happens, then it isn�t so bad to wait till you see the kids to hear from them.

I know my kids love me. I don�t hear from them when they�re with their mom. I try to call, but my calls are often ignored. I could make a massive deal out of it, but I also know that it�s often out of their control. Once they get older, however, they�ll be free to call anytime. Also, they�ll know how to take care of a phone, and will be able to use it.

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Honey left me a voicemail at work; I saw her work number pop up on my phone. I will notify my IM and have him ask her the nature of her request, though I can guess what it's about (money). Leaving a message on the work phone is an old WS trick, right?

-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless; just broke)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer twice; hate it
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife has NOT filed

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Originally Posted by MichaelJan
Honey left me a voicemail at work; I saw her work number pop up on my phone. I will notify my IM and have him ask her the nature of her request, though I can guess what it's about (money). Leaving a message on the work phone is an old WS trick, right?

-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless; just broke)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer twice; hate it
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife has NOT filed

I would not ask IM to respond. WW knows she has to go through IM. Do not let WW chip away at NC.

TheRoad #2447922 12/01/10 04:29 PM
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I would not ask IM to respond. WW knows she has to go through IM. Do not let WW chip away at NC.

Will do; or in this case, not do. Thanks, The Road. My IM liked your idea, FWIW.

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Glad to hear that you are staying dark laugh very smart move!!

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Sapphire,

Thanks for the encouragement. FWIW, I like Plan B. It's easier on me than Plan A was in the last month or two months. I concentrate on my improvements without worrying about my Honey's craziness.

By the way, Honey called me at 9:30 last night. I picked up, as my land line doesn't have caller ID. She said hello and my name. I hung up. She didn't call back. I don't like hanging up on her; it's probably a LB. But I felt confident afterward. Going forward, I need to get caller ID.


-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless; just broke)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer twice; hate it
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife has NOT filed

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By the way, Honey called me at 9:30 last night. I picked up, as my land line doesn't have caller ID. She said hello and my name. I hung up. She didn't call back. I don't like hanging up on her; it's probably a LB. But I felt confident afterward. Going forward, I need to get caller ID.


WW, welcome to Reality. This isn't an LB, it's an enforcement of your boundaries. And I have to believe it made an impression on your WW. People with self-respect would behave like you did. They don't talk to people who are dangerous to them. She's got to have some respect for you after that.

Good job.


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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Originally Posted by MichaelJan
I like Plan B. It's easier on me than Plan A was in the last month or two months. I concentrate on my improvements without worrying about my Honey's craziness.

Hi Michael, yes I love Plan B too, I felt quite high initially too taking control and having such peace around me. Enjoy. Although I found I hit a wall about 6 weeks in when it got tough. Make the most of this time to concentrate on you.

Harmony


BW/FWW 34 (Harmony)
BH/WH 36

Feb 2009 - Affair starts, physical for 9 days on business trip.
Mar 2009 - Separate from H, live alone
Apr 2009 - realise I have made big mistake and attempt reconciliation with H, establish NC with OM.
Jun 2009 - H physical and emotional serial A start right upto present day.
Jul 2009 - NC with OM broken and becomes EA
Mar 2010 - H reads email and discovers A
Jul 2010 - Discover MB
Aug 2010 - Plan A starts
Oct 2010 - Plan B starts
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Bad news: My WW picked our daughters up early from work tonight and won't give them up until I agree to abandon Plan B. She says that she needs to talk with me about our kids and that if I want an intermediary, I should hire a court-appointed mediator. She says she doesn't feel comfortable talking with a third-person about our kids. Riiigghht. It couldn't be that she's lost control of the situation could it?

This is craziness. Tonight is my night to pick up the kids from day care; I have them, this weekend, till 7 on Saturday. I was really looking forward to seeing them, as I haven't seen them since the weekend before Thanksgiving. Instead, she's decided to take the kids. What a woman.

Not seeing the kids is painful; I feel like I got punched in the gut. But I'm not backing down from Plan B. My plan is to pick them up early from daycare tomorrow and tell Honey that she can pick them up on Sunday from one of my IM's.

Your thoughts about my sitch are appreciated. My sense now is that I should have filed for legal separation, though I don't think that legal separation determines custody in her state or mine. However, I could also let things blow over after this weekend. Honey doesn't have many vacation days left at work.

-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless; just broke)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer twice; hate it
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife has NOT filed

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Don't break Plan B. Obviously she hates it.

Itty-boo.



This is a normal response to Plan B, for the WS to try to do things to antagonize and rile the BS. Don't fall for it. She hates losing her power over you.

You are operating from a position of strength.

Call an attorney, and get some sort of custody thing in place. You need to beat her to the judge.


Call tomorrow. Get it done, fast. And too bad if she doesn't like the intermediary. Fact is, there are not that many true EMERGENCIES that require the two of you to talk directly.

Block her from your email, and make them bounce to the IM. Let the IM handle her. She will get used to it. After all, she got used to walking all over you, right?

SB


Lucky to be where I am, in a safe place to get marriage-related support.
Recovered.
Happy.
Most recent D-day Fall 2005
Our new marriage began that day. Not easily, but it did happen.
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She says that she needs to talk with me about our kids and that if I want an intermediary, I should hire a court-appointed mediator. She says she doesn't feel comfortable talking with a third-person about our kids.
She doesn't want to talk through an IM? What the heck does she think a court-appointed mediator is? crazy

Plan B is working. Very good.

So, hire a court-appointed mediator. Off to an attorney with ye, sir.


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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Schoolbus and Maritalbliss,

Why the hell does a WS hate Plan B? Wouldn't he or she WANT to turn to her AP?

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Forget the reasons why a WS hates plan B. You're pondering the formation of icebergs when you just hit one and are taking on water.

Forget why icebergs form. Get an attorney. File for a "pendente lite" hearing, which simply means "pending litigation". Then, get a temporary order putting the custody situation in writing.

I would recommend filing for abandonment and spousal support while you're at it.

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Originally Posted by MichaelJan
Schoolbus and Maritalbliss,

Why the hell does a WS hate Plan B? Wouldn't he or she WANT to turn to her AP?
They want both worlds. Simple as that. They feel entitled to have it all. Plan B cuts out a lot of one of those worlds. Their AP isn't meeting all their needs.

A well-crafted Plan B is one of the best things you can do, MJ.

Picture this: remember the Wicked Witch of the West, in the Wizard of Oz? Remember the part where Dorothy throws water on the Witch, and she starts screaming and melts? Your addicted WW is the Witch. A proper Plan B is the water.

Hie thee to an attorney, got it? (Can anyone guess what literary period I've been helping DS with? grin )



D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

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help,

I understand your point: forget the reason for the problem; attempt to solve the problem. How many hours would a good attorney spend filing a legal separation?

Maritalbliss,

The AP isn't meeting her needs: I knew it, I knew it. And he won't meet all of her needs.

To everyone else,

For tomorrow, I plan to pick up the kids before Honey does. I got one car seat and will ask around for another. I suspect she'll leave work early tomorrow. Of course, she may take the kids tomorrow too, but that would be another two days of vacation time for her. She couldn't do this next Thursday and Friday.


-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless; just broke)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer twice; hate it
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife has NOT filed

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schoolbus,

I forgot to ask, why do I need to file first? Why is doing so critical? And by filing, I presume you mean filing for legal separation.

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Originally Posted by MichaelJan
schoolbus,

I forgot to ask, why do I need to file first? Why is doing so critical? And by filing, I presume you mean filing for legal separation.

He who files first gets temporay custody whether full or most. Then the nice judge will award CS.

So if you have no problem with WW getting a shot at full custody where you don't get to see your kids and have to pay CS, or one better WW moves to another state and files there.

You want to be the screwer or the screwee?

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For tomorrow, I plan to pick up the kids before Honey does. I got one car seat and will ask around for another. I suspect she'll leave work early tomorrow. Of course, she may take the kids tomorrow too, but that would be another two days of vacation time for her. She couldn't do this next Thursday and Friday.


I am concerned that your children will become pawns in an emotional tug-of-war. Please see an attorney so that you don't get to a place where you're speeding to day care to beat your WW, and vice-versa. This is not good for your kids.


D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!

TheRoad #2448431 12/03/10 09:01 AM
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The odds are much higher for you if you file. You would advocate that the kids stay in the marital home.

How long does it take an attorney? Months.

The family court system is slow unless you file an emergency motion, and it better be a real emergency.

What�s going to happen is that you will go to the attorney and will request a formal custody arrangement.

This is where you ask for it all. Request sole physical and legal custody, file for abandonment, request child support, and that the kids be kept in the marital home. Will you get all of that? No. But you ask for it. It will be shocking to your WW.

Request a Guardian Ad Litem. This attorney will represent the children, not you. Present yourself as an involved parent who only cares for the children and their wellbeing. Do not attack your ex, focus on your own strengths and what you bring to the table for them. Attacking your ex will give the impression that you do the same in front of the children, which is a turnoff to the family court system.

What�s going to happen is that you�ll get a scheduling conference, where they bring you in and look at the calendar and try to set future dates for litigation. They�ll encourage you to come to a settlement in the hallways of the courthouse at that time.

You�ll be given a date for mediation, will likely get a parenting coordinator assigned, and will then have a future date set for a pendente lite hearing, which will establish the temporary custody arrangement. It�s not really temporary. What�s established on that date will likely be what you end up with. So ask for the most. If you get 50/50 offered from her, settle. Don�t litigate more. You risk too much. Unless she�s abusive, you�re not likely to be given primary.

Once a schedule is set, then you don�t have much to argue with her. If she takes the kids when she�s not supposed to, then you can go to the cops with your court order and get them back.

The parenting coordinator will be the IM regarding kid issues.

This will all take months

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