What I was trying to get at is HOW did you have an AFFAIR with you spending so much UA time together? How was it POSSIBLE to keep it a secret? Your BH should have known where you were.

Also, I don't really understand what you are here for? By that I mean, why are you on THIS forum? You seem to want to either argue with other posters and tell them how right YOU are, or you are explaining how you can't do things the way that it is set out. What do you want from this board?

If what you want is to learn how to use MB to save your marriage after YOUR AFFAIR, we can help you with that. If you want a place where you can journal, let us know. It's not wrong, we will just stop discussing your life in MB terms.

BUT........the steps for recovery are not different. And without a plan to recover, your marriage won't recover. No plan is a plan for failure. Here is how Dr Harley describes his plan for recovery:

here

What I was trying to get at is HOW did you have an AFFAIR with you spending so much UA time together? How was it POSSIBLE to keep it a secret? Your BH should have known where you were.
The thing is I work at a private school. So does the OM. We had breaks and would meet up for food and such. BH actually knew about it, I never hid the fact we had gone for lunch/dinner on breaks. We all have known each other for 1.5 years. (As a side note, there has been no contact after D-day with OM, just run ins as we live in a small city. No words were exchanged, I would just leave immediately). BS knows about any sightings I have had (total of 3-4x in the past 3 months)The OM doesn't work at my school but another one a block away.

Sorry would've responded sooner but our anniversary was approaching and passed and i felt kind of depressed about it.

What do you want from this board? I am not trying to show how right I am, just voicing my situation. I just want advice on how to handle it with the circumstances and how willing BS is willing to follow them. As well as getting advice on what to do when the BS doesn't want to follow the prescription of Dr. Harley and posters here. I am really not trying to argue but I realize that posting on forums you cannot hear the tone of voice or properly explain yourself. I have nothing against the advice that has been given to me, just giving information about his feelings, his family and what he is/isn't comfortable with. I am doing as much as I can from my end, but I can't force him to do something he doesn't want. He is willing to listen and consider things though.

So we are working on not love busting and policy of joint agreement. We are doing fine being open and honest, negotiations (we've been pleasant about it unlike earlier). We're spending time together doing things we both enjoy. The only problem is the not spending nights apart. I've brought it up a few times, he's been firm that he should have his time and space.

I realize that MB has a guideline on how things should be done to have a high success rate. I have talked to my husband about these things but there is nothing I can do when I have brought up the topic several times about not spending any time apart aside from work. I obviously don't want to push the issue with him if it makes him angry or if it makes him feel like I am rushing his recovery. We have been spending more time together lately and have done a few things together outside of our home which is a step forward.

He's been happier recently and more motivated. Well happier but not happy. Not sure how to explain it. Anyhow, he was in the process of working on his degree when things fell apart. Now 3 months later, he's been putting in effort and I am helping him with anything he needs like discussing his assignments together or looking over them. For 3 months, he didn't crack a book open nor did I pressure him.

I just want to know if it is normal for the BS to be confused about what he/she wants. And how do I help him when he won't share all of his feelings? Sometimes he just clams up and doesn't feel that he can trust me, other times he'll open up.

Right now he is not sure if he wants to work things out or not. He says things like if I didn't think we would have a healthy relationship again. So some comments he makes are on a positive note. On a social networking site he just listed me as a friend and another mutual friend as close friend. I asked him why it was that way and if his feelings would change about our relationship and friendship as we used to be each others best friend. He said he would've gotten a divorce if he didn't feel that it would change (that we would be close again). He told me I could be a 10 in his eyes again in the future but right now I am not. Personality is a huge factor for him. But then he goes to say that he is confused, he doesn't know what he wants. But in the same conversation, we were discussing with a our future plans for the next 10 years such as our moving plans (We are ESL teachers). So I am confused and so is he? Is this normal? Should I expect these things? Are they bad signs/good signs?

I do apologize if I have come off as argumentative. That is not my intention. As well, please realize I am doing the best I can. I am trying to let BS know about all this information. He is willing to listen but he disagrees with some of Dr. Harley's advice. I guess it's better than him not listening but I wish he would be more open to the advice I've read.

Also, I am not looking for sympathy. I just want to help my husband through this the best I can in a healthy manner
Sorry this is long...just been a while.

I am in desperate need of advice. My husband and I cannot afford the counseling that Hurley offers. We have been following his 15 hours of UA, being open and honest, POJA, making changes to our marriage that led to me having an affair. As well, we live in a foreign country where we don't speak the language.

But last night he said he didn't think this was going to work out, that he couldn't give me all the love, affection and attention I wanted. That he just didn't care. Does that mean it's over?

I feel like he is pushing me away which he used to in the first few years of our relationship where he would shut down for a day and try to push me away and get me to leave him. For example, one time when I was in school and he was barely making enough for us to live on, he planned a big move and told me he didn't think long distance would work. But all that stopped years ago.

Now I feel like it's back and he's shutting down emotionally. Or is this a normal reaction? He is telling me he cares for me a lot. But he just doesn't feel like he can put the time, effort that I want. Should I continue with Plan A ( I have to admit we had a bad last week as my PMS symptoms have simply made me more sensitive over the last 2 years which may have contributed to it as well...)
Any hope? Any advice from WW and their experiences?

Or have I just lost the best thing that happened to me by being selfish, stupid, inconsiderate....

I'm confused, and I think there is more to the story than we're hearing. Please update us on what's been going on.

In November, you told us your H was spending every 'd-day night' and every weekend with friends. Is that still happening?

In December, you said you were spending adequate amounts of UA time together. Doing what, exactly?

Can you give us examples of how you used POJA to strengthen your M?

And this confuses me. You said:

And then you said:

And now you say:

You guys have been married for three years, right?

I'm trying to figure out if there was ever a point where the two of you actually considered yourself in love?

Would your BH consider coming here? If not to post, at least to read Dr. Harley's concepts?

Have you considered emailing Dr. H. about the possibility of talking to him during one of his radio broadcasts? This is free.

Have you purchased any of the books on this site? Consider His Needs, Her Needs and Surviving an Affair. Click on the 'Bookstore' link.

It's not at all unusual for him to still be hurt and upset. If you could get him here we might be able to help him.

Sorry for the first few years he would be okay and then have a moment where he pushed me away...it lasted for an hour or up to a day and occured every few months. Halfway through the relationship he stopped doing that.

We haven't been spending D-day night apart in Dec after the first week.

For example, I have been wanting to do more things outside of the apartment so we picked a few things that we do that we both enjoy such as skiing (he will be my instructor), going for walks when it gets warmer and getting food together.

He won't come here and I haven't ordered the book. He won't even read the website. But he will let me summarize it for him.

My PMS symptoms make me moody so I get sensitive about things and start crying ...don't think that is helping any.

I still love him but I don't think he loves me anymore right now. His pushing me away he explained was because he was scared of getting close to someone (rightfully so since I hurt him in the worse way possible).

He does little things for me that shows he cares such as making me meals, cuddling me when I feel like crap, etc.

He isn't completely shut down but on his way...I want to help.

Anyhow, I am sending him an email in hopes to reach out to him so he can see it in front of him. We did so much talking last night...

Sorry if I am incoherent, didn't sleep well last night.

Except for the food, this is all stuff you're talking about doing in the future. What have you been doing for the past month?

And can you explain how you use POJA?

Why have you not seen your doctor about your PMS?

This is very good!

The country I am in doesn't take PMS seriously. I am on the pill and generally they think only girls who sleep around a lot take it:S

Past month we've been going out for food, movies and shopping.

When we have an issue we discuss it and try to come up with a solution where we are both satisfied. I was not happy about not doing things outside of the apartment and he was fine. So we came up with activities that would be be good for both us to start with. When we are unhappy about something we talk about it and consider the different solutions...it does take us days to finalize a solution though. Right now there is the whole moving thing and it's going to be a week before we finalize that.

So what do I do now...

He has told me he doesn't want to work it out but is sticking around here. That he might spend another year in this relationship if I take another contract. But he is telling me he can't make himself care, he doesn't want to put in time and effort...He just can't do it. He doesn't see it working out and the affair is no longer a problem...

Desperately need advice.

He said will thinking about couseling, think about giving this relationship another year

What do you do when the other person refuses to try, to put in effort, to give it a chance.

So what do I do now...

He has told me he doesn't want to work it out but is sticking around here. That he might spend another year in this relationship if I take another contract. But he is telling me he can't make himself care, he doesn't want to put in time and effort...He just can't do it. He doesn't see it working out and the affair is no longer a problem...

We've been married 3 years and together 7 years. It's been 4 months since D-day. But when things get tough the idea of divorce is thrown in my face. I've been reading Harley's books recently, just found that I could get e-books from Amazon. But he doesn't want to read them.

is it over?:(

Sometimes even if people want to feel something they just don't. All you can do is work on yourself and hope that he changes his feelings. I do think you have put in the effort, but the effects of cheating are never fortellable. Good luck.

I thought we could work this out but he slowly just gave up the last little bit.

I even suggested we get Harley's coaching which we could for a few sessions as I am working extra hours. But he said there is no point to it if he makes us a program and he refuses to follow it.

This week we are planning more activities like playing crib and other card games where we can have more conversation and time to do fun things together.

he says he's willing to put in as much effort as he does with friendship because right now I am just a good friend to him not a lover. Any advice? I am getting desperate here and know that it's my fault. I gave him a reason to give up.

In all the years we've been together, he goes through stages where he wants to give up the relationship but turns around in a couple of days. This isn't one of them He's been like this all week.

He says he cares, but not in the same way. We haven't really had much affection at all, he was never affectionate and feels like he practices it like Harley says it's just fake and not real.

What to do? My heart is breaking again...it broke when I realized the damage I had done and now that hope is lost it's happening again:(

LL - I'm glad you've found MB. This place can help you - can provide a plan. It isn't over, the fat lady ain't even warming up her pipes yet.

I suggest you hit notify, on your post, and request this be moved to the Surviving an Affair forum. Then read through your Harley book - pay attention to Surviving an Affair.

Some preliminary questions:

Who was the Other Woman (OW)?
How did they meet?
Has the affair ended?
Do your H and the OW still contact one another?
Was she married?
If so does her spouse/ significant other know?
How long was the affair?
Was it emotional?
Was it physical?
Do you have children?

I'm sorry - the affair IS a problem. 3 months is no where near long enough

Now some more questions for you to ponder, you don't have to answer these just now.

What do you want?
What does success look like to you?
If you want to stay in this marriage, why?
What are you willing to do to reclaim this marriage?
Recovery will take about 2 years - do you think you are willing to work at it for that long if you've only been married 3?


((((LL))))

^ That's a Hug.

People will be by to help. It may be tomorrow morning, the board is kind of slow right now.

We can help you. Read all you can here.

Here is a good place to start.

Vibrissa
What do you want? I want this relationship to work.
What does success look like to you? Where we are both fulfilling each other's needs and we are both happy.
If you want to stay in this marriage, why? I love this man and want to have new experiences with him, raise a family.
What are you willing to do to reclaim this marriage? Reading books, trying Harley's coaching alone to have a program created, asked him today what things he wants me to do that will make him happy. He said it probably won't help the relationship but it will make him happy. So I am hoping that will make deposits. He said give him his space, to not bombard him with talks, quizzes and lists all the time and to not make him do things he doesn't want to such as the counseling. What do you guys think about this?
Recovery will take about 2 years - do you think you are willing to work at it for that long if you've only been married 3? I am willing to do it but is he....

Can a marriage be saved when the other person is unwilling? When the other person has checked out the marriage or says it is like winning the lottery that we work it out...not because of anything I have done but because he is done with it and doesn't want to deal with a relationship.

I am really thinking of doing a few session of Harley on my own but seems like a waste of money on my own. I was thinking if I just don't love bust, and follow the things that will make him happy. He didn't say it would help teh relationship but that it would make him happy if I gave him space, not push him, not make him make lists, fill out forms constantly and talk about it and that I don't make him do anything he is not comfortable with such as going to Dr. Harley....

He tells me he can't give me what I want, his love and affection... I love busted by pushing him too much i think with all the talks about the relationship so much. It got pushed in his face too much and I think maybe I have lost him....he told me it would be good if I would just let go.

Sorry I guess I do have a thread over there and thought it should be moved here. And I was the one who had the affair:(

LL, I asked you this and didn't get a response:
What have the two of you been doing to get 25-30 hours of UA time in each week?

What have the two of you been doing to get 25-30 hours of UA time in each week?
We have conversations, lots of them such as world events, interests, our day, silly questions like what would you do if.... and discuss things daily, play card games weekly, SF 1-2x a week, cuddles rarely, cooking together, sometimes getting food together (only happened recently). I think we spend most of our time together at home though. Recently started going shopping together, not a frequent occurrence. Short walks and working out together at home. We usually do short workouts that range from 10-20min 4-5x a week.

We also spend some of that time discussing our relationship which I think has been making it worse:(

Would the online program that Harley offers be worth doing or better to try coaching?

I'm sorry, I might have missed this - have the two of you filled out the EN Questionnaire?

Yea we did that a month or so ago. He wanted me to be honest, open, respectful, time and his space as he put it, conversation.

But he's stopped caring, he is pretty much dead set on divorce telling me that it working out is the same as winning the lotto. That he's only putting in as much effort as he puts into this relationship as his other friendships. That I am just a friend....

He says he cares about me but only as a friend. That the chances of him falling in love with me again is so slim.

He said no more forms, lists, talks, he wants his space and he doesn't want me to ask him to do things he doesn't want to.

He says he is only here as he likes the country we are in and cannot afford to live on his own. I am the full time worker and he is a student/ PT working.

We still share the same bed and have sex sometimes. He spends most of his waking hours with me aside from work and school.

He thinks I read too much into things when I get him to get stuff from the store, or the odd time he initiates cuddling or when he is excited to be talking to me about something interesting that happens to him.

He basically has checked out I think:(

I want to try coaching or the online program but I think it takes two?

I wondered about that. It seems like everytime I asked you about UA time, your response involved talking. There are a lot of guys who don't have the need for all that talking. Especially relationship talk!

What physical things does he like to do? Bowling? Shopping? Antique-hunting? Let's figure that out first.

I don't want to be mean, here, LL, but it sounds to me like your heart is in the right place and you just can't figure out how to get your butt in gear to make it happen.