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Originally Posted by Gack1
IIRC, Dr Harley advocates attempting to save a marriage, even if it is the product of an affair.

Where did you see this? The writing of his that I have seen does not say that he advocates it but states that he will try to help folks who come to him in an affairage but that despite his efforts he hasn't had much success.


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Originally Posted by Neak
.. 2 And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.

3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?

4 And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.

5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept...

I allways think of this, even being cheated on, and remember its the law, and that the law was asked for so we could usurp Gods place of judgement.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Wrong or right, we have all fallen short, we can divorce because of adultry, but it is a provision because of the hardness of our hearts. Has anyone bothered to mention that if we sin in any, we are guilty of all?

God wants repentance, that is change, but people want vengence, and that is supposed to be Gods job. I wouldn't want a child molester living in my nieborhood, and I wont forgive them either, rather I would want them strung up by thier privates. I have no respect for adulterers, and find them screwwed up and selfish beyond contempt, and would trust them around my kids either. So don't think I approve of this marriage, not in my eyes, but its not my eyes that matter, its Gods.

I find it troubling that people want this woman to give up her marriage now because of how it started, when many marriages have started when people have unprotected sex out of wedlock, and then go to God as they realize they have to grow up when pregnancy results. But I can understand she put a target on her back coming here. I wonder how many Christians who are here stepped over the line and had sex before marriage, and then realized it was wrong, and went to God for forgivness, and are still encouraged to have a full life and marriage, while getting thier head out of their butt. I wonder if someone like that would be helped, or turned away.

Her story is one nobody is surprised with, affairage marriages are ussually doomed from the start, based on the character of the people involved, but instead of helping her understand her mistakes, and helping her to teach others from them, we are telling her to make it right,(Which is impossible), she must undo what can't be undone,(Also impossible). Maybe it needs to be said that Moses, (The Law), and Paul,(Transformation thru Grace), were both murderers.

I think it took a lot of guts coming here, and I hope your post helps others to understand and avoid the foolishness of affairs, and the fallout that you now are experiencing. Seek what God leads you, and don't be dis-heartened. Stick around and read, learn how to help others, and know that is what God would want.

Just don't expect to much mercy here, as you shouldn't right?


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
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DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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CP, Jesus told the adulterous woman to go, and sin no more. He ABSOLVED HER. Because He knew her Heart. AND IT WAS ACCEPTABLE TO HIM.

As a BW, I am appalled at the vitriol displayed to this woman!!

We are not without sin! Throw the first stone, Constant.

Last edited by maritalbliss; 02/17/11 08:48 PM.

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
CP, Jesus told the adulterous woman to go, and sin no more. He ABSOLVED HER. Because He knew her Heart. AND IT WAS ACCEPTABLE TO HIM.

As a BW, I am appalled at the vitriol displayed to this woman!!

We are not without sin! Throw the first stone, Constant.

You must have misread my post or misunderstood it. I accually wish to support her in her efforts. Maybe I was not clear Im sorry

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Sorry the idea that a OW suddenly finds Christ AFTER they're done destroying a marriage and committing adultery has always rang hollow to me.

My dad married his OW, who conveniently found Jesus after my parents split.

My dad asked me if I would ever be ok with the OW visiting me or for me to come see him when she was there. My answer was that she could start floating in air, grow a halo, start performing miracles and I STILL wouldn't want anything to do with her.

Your finding of Christ AFTER you destroyed a marriage is nothing more than a "cover my [censored] so I don't go to hell where I belong".

Only God knows what's truly in your heart and can decide your eternal place that way.

Otherwise, as a child of a broken family and as a BS, I say assuage your guilt another way.

The BEST thing that could happen is that you get a taste of your own medicine so you can finally understand the he11 you put her through. No apology can ever compensate for what you destroyed. Let the woman be.

I read your other post and think it was a good warning, but an apology accomplishes nothing and might simply trigger her.

What I do know is that when my dad divorced the OW I got him back and rebuilt a new relationship with him. Wouldn't have been possible with OW in the picture since I was never going to let her into my life, see my kids, or be around me or my family in any way. Actually, I had fantasies of water boarding her before anyone even knew what that was.

My brother scratched up her car and yelled at her. My sister never saw her or was around her.

This went on for years.

I know you're seeking forgiveness. You'll trigger some of us here and I'm sure you are trying to calm that guilt, but the only real way to make things right is to divorce the man you married and disappear from his life forever.

It's the only way I was able to rebuild my relationship with my dad. Sounds harsh, but that's the truth.

You'll remove all of that stress in your H's life and his kid's life.

BUT, if you're not willing to D him, then I say you need to remove yourself from those functions where he's there with his biological kids and his family and the BW's family.

Do that out of respect and set your need to show your place as the new wife aside.

This allowed my dad to have some level of participation in our lives.

Granted, all of this stuff happened when we were grown (except for my brother, who was 15).

Grown kids can make life a bit more he11 for the AP than a kid with no options can by simply excluding them and demanding the AP not come to anything.

I'd say that may be in your future in terms of weddings and other celebrations.

Maybe, maybe not.


Last edited by helpthelostdads; 02/17/11 09:11 PM.
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Quote
Sorry the idea that a OW suddenly finds Christ AFTER they're done destroying a marriage and committing adultery has always rang hollow to me.
Huh. Jesus told His fellow sufferers on the cross that they endured that He would see them in Heaven. He didn't seem to have a BIG PROBLEM WITH THEIR SINS. OR THE FACT THAT THEY HADN'T QUITE COMMITTED TO A FAITH.




Last edited by maritalbliss; 02/17/11 09:02 PM.

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Originally Posted by helpthelostdads
Sorry the idea that a OW suddenly finds Christ AFTER they're done destroying a marriage and committing adultery has always rang hollow to me.

As it should, me too.

But these people have no respect for marraige, they don't even realize what it is, and they don't even respect God do they?

If I remember right, she was 18 when she had the affair resulting in this marraige. I don't think she even had squat together at that age, and who knows what she was raised in either.

At 18 you want a relationship but have no idea the most important one you should have first is with God. How many here can say they were so different. I was married at 18 to my GF since 16, and she was the one who had an affair when I was 20, we eventually divorced 3 years later, but by the time I was 40 I knew it was the hardness of my own heart why we did, even though adultry gave me a get-out-of-marriage-free card.

I wish I had marriage builders then, or had just had the guts to fight for the marriage, instead of run away in pain and anger. But I did not know God then either, as I do now.

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Only God can judge if the sudden discovery of Jesus is genuine or if it's a "cover my a$$ so I don't go to he11 for adultery".

For me, a human, I'm skeptical.

Sorry if you don't agree.

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To everyone, I came here fully aware that some people would not appreciate my posting or believe in my repentance or my forgiveness. That is okay.

Some of you have been unbelievably gracious and wonderful to me. Supporting me in my attempt to let my mistakes serve some small good by warning others. And welcoming me in Christ. To you I am so very grateful.

I have laid it all out there as truthfully as I can. These are not things I am proud to admit for sure!

One thing I really don't want is to cause any strife on the boards between those of you who already fellowship together here. Thank you to those attempting to defend me. I will not melt from the scorching remarks, I did come here braced for them.

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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
As a BW, I am appalled at the vitriol displayed to this woman!!

Really? Due to the traumatic nature of infidelity, I can easily understand that there are some who will be angered/upset/triggered by someone in an affairage...no matter how remorseful they may seem...


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NewCreation, it is a tough road. I have come to realize that there will always be people for whom bitterness holds more appeal than grace. And given the pain that adultery causes....I can as a human understand that.

That being said....I know whom I have believed. I know I belong to him. I know I have been fully forgiven, by God and by my DH. I realized a couple of months ago that trying to convince others of that fact was just going to keep me paralyzed in a guilt Christ already paid the price for....and thus harm the M that has recovered.

I am accountable to my God, My DH, and myself for what I did in the past and how I conduct my heart and life today and from this day forward. In the end, that is all that matters. Whatever you decide, keep your focus. I lost my focus on the one man whose opinion of me matters right before Christmas because I was so busy trying to convince the rest of the world of what he and I both know to be true. DH almost intervened. Now I have another boundary to enforce....the boundary of allowing others' bitterness to harm me, and by default, my M. I will not allow that to happen....ever.

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Also, I am not sure where it came from that I was 18 but I was 24. I wish I could claim that I was only 18 as a defense but I am trying to be completely honest.

I married the first time at 16, I know it sounds strange but it was normal in my family. I got pregnant six months later and was divorced with 2 children by 24. Yes, I was divorced before I met my now husband. Unfortunately he wasn't, and here I am.

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So trash an 18 year old, Constant. Now that she is a grown woman who has put her sins out her for us, a bunch of flawed humans, to scrutinize and belittle. Is that what you want? She has ALREADY DONE THIS VOLUNTARILY. What else would you like for her to do?

You wish you'd had MB in your sitch. This woman does.

What would you like to do with her now. With all of your knowledge.



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Wow. Thanks Tawandabelle. Once again I find comfort and grace in your words. I needed that reminder of where my salvation comes from. You are right, though I may care as a human, others judgements of me do not matter in eternity. Deep breath! :-)

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Constant, for some really weird reason, I believe that God has this woman in His arms. And I think she just might be one of His favored children right now.





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Originally Posted by Tawandabelle
I have come to realize that there will always be people for whom bitterness holds more appeal than grace.

This is uncalled for.


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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
So trash an 18 year old, Constant. Now that she is a grown woman who has put her sins out her for us, a bunch of flawed humans, to scrutinize and belittle. Is that what you want? She has ALREADY DONE THIS VOLUNTARILY. What else would you like for her to do?

You wish you'd had MB in your sitch. This woman does.

What would you like to do with her now. With all of your knowledge.

MB, this sounds like you are suggesting she get help for saving her affairage here...that is not what you are suggesting is it?

I think she is doing a great job of helping other's understand what a true repentant OW in an affairage looks like. THAT is the best help she can get here, IMHO.


Me,BW - 42; FWH-46
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D-Day #3~Feb.27, 2007 (we'd been in a FR)
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Oh no, I hate to see posters that I love on here, fighting....I am gonna stop reading....Dont let it make you guys not like each other...its like watching family members fight...which is okay as long as it doesnt make you all dislike each other...You are all such good people...


BW me-41
WH -39
DS - 9
married 12 Yrs together(?) 18 yrs when A discovered
DDay aug 2007
found MB dec 2007
Moved out april 2008
still seeing OW
Plan B

Okay I fixed the ages, it was looking screwy. smile
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Originally Posted by maritalbliss
So trash an 18 year old, Constant. Now that she is a grown woman who has put her sins out her for us, a bunch of flawed humans, to scrutinize and belittle. Is that what you want? She has ALREADY DONE THIS VOLUNTARILY. What else would you like for her to do?

You wish you'd had MB in your sitch. This woman does.

What would you like to do with her now. With all of your knowledge.

Wow MB, I am supporting her, and my heart goes out to her, are you serious that you think I am bashing her?

Please re-read my posts and pull up quotes and show me how you came to the conclusion I was bashing her for being here.

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It just goes to show that A's can cause discord in all things...


Me: FBH (2010) and FWH (1996): 40
Her: FWW and FBW: 40

2011: In recovery

A's are merely chocolate-covered cancer lollipops.
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