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Joined: Dec 2009
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Sigh.

Many of you know I'm remarried. My wife is a great woman.

I want to annul my marriage to my WXW and then validate my current marriage.

I found out the stance of the church and it's been a little bit of a bummer, but I understand where it's coming from.

I don't particularly care to start a Bible war here. I'm just expressing some stress.

The Catholic church still considers me married to my WXW. I am therefore technically committing adultery by Catholic Church standards by being remarried.

I can't take communion until this is resolved.

Resolving it can take a loooooooong time, especially if the WXW doesn't cooperate.

The only way that the Church will gran an annulment is if I can prove that there was some condition prior to our marriage that rendered the marriage invalid.

What happened after the marriage isn't as important as what happened before it. Adultery is not grounds for annulment in the Catholic Church. The justification is that the New Testament reset the Old and the New Testament statements about marriage and divorce made by Jesus are the ones that apply to marriage.

So what can I get an annulment for?

Examples: If a man is gay and doesn't tell his bride to be that he intends to continue that lifestyle after marriage, then it shows he was incapable of meeting marital responsibilities.

If a man cheats on his fiance and continues to cheat on his wife after marriage, then it shows he never really intended to abide by the sacrament of marriage (This applied to my parents).

If there is a mental disorder that prevents an understanding of the sacrament, then that may be grounds.

If a person can't have kids but withholds this fromt their future partner, that's grounds for annulment.

So one of the things I have to argue is that my WXW had childhood abuse issues that she never revealed to me until after our D. These issues were a major problem in our marriage. The lightbulb for me didn't go off until she told me about it. All our problems made sense after I did my research into the matter.

The tough part is for me to prove that I didn't know until after our D if she doesn't confess to that.

I think I may be able to build a circumstancial case, but that's going to be tough unless my ex owns up to the fact that she didn't tell me until after we were divorced. I have witnesses that can attest to her depression and anxiety problems stemming from this, but none of us knew that this was really the source of the problems.

The issue isn't that she was abused. The issue is that this wasn't disclosed, it is not treated, and hinders her ability to really commit in full to the sacrament of marriage since her trauma is untreated and unresolved.

My wife won't be allowed to convert until this matter is resolved since she has to get an annulment as well. Hers may be easier since she was Protestant and her ex is being cooperative.

It's tough for us since we so wish to have our marriage blessed by the Church and receive communion.

Anyone been through this process? I've heard that some people have had to go in front of a board of Bishops to argue their case.

There's a lot of misconceptions out there about this process. It's neither easy nor simple.

Our Deacon explained that the Church feels so strongly about marriage that it was willing to lose the most powerful nation on Earth over the matter and actually did so when Henry VIII sought an annulment because his wife couldn't bear him a son. The church said that wasn't a reason to annul a marriage and denied him.

He split, formed the Church of England, made himself the head of it, and granted himself an annulment.

The Catholic church stood it's ground on the matter.

So I have my work cutout for me.

Any advice from anyone on this?


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This might help somewhat:

How did Ted Kennedy get an annulment from the Catholic Church from his first marriage to Joan?


Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_did_T...his_first_marriage_to_Joan#ixzz1EI7S5a75


"Joan later said that Kennedy requested the annulment, which she did not oppose, on grounds that his marriage vow to be faithful had not been honestly made, Clymer said."



Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_did_T...his_first_marriage_to_Joan#ixzz1EI7S5a75

All of the above and a big fat checkbook went a long way.

All Blessings,
Jerry



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help writes,

Quote
The issue isn't that she was abused. The issue is that this wasn't disclosed, it is not treated, and hinders her ability to really commit in full to the sacrament of marriage since her trauma is untreated and unresolved.

"A grave lack of discretion" about the rights and duties of marriage is the Church's term for the problem facing your wife. Were your wife's powers of judgment on the wedding day so clouded by her untreated abuse that she was incapable of consenting to the marriage? That's the question the tribunal wants to know.

You may well need the testimony of psychologists and psychiatric experts. All this is courtesy of "Annulment: The Wedding That Was" by Michael Smith Foster.

I may be dealing with a similar issue with my wife, by the way.

-----------------------------------------------
Me: BH, 40 (and no longer jobless)
Her: WW, 33
Never lived together
Married 6 years; together 10 years
2 young kids (DD3.5 and DD1.8)
Her EA: Fall '08
She moves out of our home: 10/16/09
Informally separated
D-day: 01/22/10
D-day #2: 06/28/10
Exposed to 12 of my WW's and the OM's friends and family members plus all of my immediate family members and some extended family
In plan A at Dr. Bill Harley's advice since May '10; about to go to Plan B
Have talked with lawyer
Her region is a 50/50 custody area
OM stopped working with her 08/10
Wife asks lawyer for legal separation 12/10
Wife files for D: 02/10/11

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Originally Posted by helpthelostdads
Sigh.

Many of you know I'm remarried. My wife is a great woman.

I want to annul my marriage to my WXW and then validate my current marriage.

I found out the stance of the church and it's been a little bit of a bummer, but I understand where it's coming from.

I don't particularly care to start a Bible war here. I'm just expressing some stress.

The Catholic church still considers me married to my WXW. I am therefore technically committing adultery by Catholic Church standards by being remarried.

I can't take communion until this is resolved.

Resolving it can take a loooooooong time, especially if the WXW doesn't cooperate.

The only way that the Church will gran an annulment is if I can prove that there was some condition prior to our marriage that rendered the marriage invalid.

What happened after the marriage isn't as important as what happened before it. Adultery is not grounds for annulment in the Catholic Church. The justification is that the New Testament reset the Old and the New Testament statements about marriage and divorce made by Jesus are the ones that apply to marriage.

So what can I get an annulment for?

Examples: If a man is gay and doesn't tell his bride to be that he intends to continue that lifestyle after marriage, then it shows he was incapable of meeting marital responsibilities.

If a man cheats on his fiance and continues to cheat on his wife after marriage, then it shows he never really intended to abide by the sacrament of marriage (This applied to my parents).

If there is a mental disorder that prevents an understanding of the sacrament, then that may be grounds.

If a person can't have kids but withholds this fromt their future partner, that's grounds for annulment.

So one of the things I have to argue is that my WXW had childhood abuse issues that she never revealed to me until after our D. These issues were a major problem in our marriage. The lightbulb for me didn't go off until she told me about it. All our problems made sense after I did my research into the matter.

The tough part is for me to prove that I didn't know until after our D if she doesn't confess to that.

I think I may be able to build a circumstancial case, but that's going to be tough unless my ex owns up to the fact that she didn't tell me until after we were divorced. I have witnesses that can attest to her depression and anxiety problems stemming from this, but none of us knew that this was really the source of the problems.

The issue isn't that she was abused. The issue is that this wasn't disclosed, it is not treated, and hinders her ability to really commit in full to the sacrament of marriage since her trauma is untreated and unresolved.

My wife won't be allowed to convert until this matter is resolved since she has to get an annulment as well. Hers may be easier since she was Protestant and her ex is being cooperative.

It's tough for us since we so wish to have our marriage blessed by the Church and receive communion.

Anyone been through this process? I've heard that some people have had to go in front of a board of Bishops to argue their case.

There's a lot of misconceptions out there about this process. It's neither easy nor simple.

Our Deacon explained that the Church feels so strongly about marriage that it was willing to lose the most powerful nation on Earth over the matter and actually did so when Henry VIII sought an annulment because his wife couldn't bear him a son. The church said that wasn't a reason to annul a marriage and denied him.

He split, formed the Church of England, made himself the head of it, and granted himself an annulment.

The Catholic church stood it's ground on the matter.

So I have my work cutout for me.

Any advice from anyone on this?


Have you just read this list some where or have you talked with a priest to start the process?

Today the church still maintains the image that getting an annulment is not easy, when in reality it is. The conditions to be met are now worded so that a reason for meeting them can be worked out. You have your XW mental conditon rendering her not able to enter a contract " my WXW had childhood abuse issues that she never revealed to me until after our D."

Stop dumping bricks into your pants.

Put on some clean underwear.

Then get the ball rolling.

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The ball gets rolling today when I start filling out the papers.

I believe I can show a history of the mental illness, but will have a very difficult time proving that I dind't know about this stuff until after we were divorced.


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HTLD,

I am a cradle Catholic who attended a Catholic womens college that provided me smidgen of background in Canon law. Once I became a lawyer, I became fascinated by Canon Law and even considered becoming a Canon lawyer. My now XH converted to Catholicism when we were dating. Because he was divorced, before he and I could marry in the church, his first marriage had to be annulled. Large parishes usually have a deacon who is trained in preparing annulment papers. Unfortunately, at the time, we lived in a very rural, small parish (imagine hearing the cows mooing during Mass). I did a little research and found the following book: Annulment: A Step by Step Guide for Divorced Catholics (Divorce & Remarriage) by Rev. Ronald T. Smith. It is a wonderful step by step guide on how to answer the questions on the annulment petition and what the Church is looking for in order to grant an annulment. If you follow the advice in this book, you significantly increase the likelihood your petition will be granted. You will learn things to include that you might have thought insignificant or irrelevant that could greatly influence your petition.

You can buy the book on Amazon for less than $10.


Last edited by Brits_Brat; 02/18/11 09:34 AM.
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Originally Posted by helpthelostdads
The ball gets rolling today when I start filling out the papers.

I believe I can show a history of the mental illness, but will have a very difficult time proving that I dind't know about this stuff until after we were divorced.

You don't have to prove that you didn't know about it until after the divorce. An annulment is a decree by the Church that a Sacramental marriage never existed. In order to establish that, the Marriage Tribunal looks for evidence that the conditions for a valid, sacramental marriage did not exist - not just before, but during the Marriage, as well. The following is a quote from the book I recommended, above (yes, I went out in the garage and dug it out):

"There are many things that can cause a union of a man and woman not to be a valid, sacramental marriage. Annulmentsare granted when it is clear that the couple could not effect a mature, permanent marital relationship. The following are some of the situations that indicate a marriage may not be a valid sacramental marriage:

1. When one of the spouses is always responsible for the maintenance of the relationship and there is never a reasonable discussion of issues....

2. When there is a history of substance abuse...and the individual refuses to seek help.

3. When there is a pattern of physical and verbal abuse and the person refuses counseling.

4. When there is a pattern of infidelity that indicates a person is incapabe of maintaining an exclusive marital commitment.

5. When the person is completely closed to the possibility of having children....

BTW, for most Diocese, the annulment form asks VERY general, broad, open-ended questons. The book I recommended provides detailed questions you should be answering in response to the not at all detailed questions Diocese asks. If you answer the questions outlined in the book in your responses to the Diocese questions, you increase your likelihood of providing the type of evidence the Church needs to find in your favor.

Last edited by Brits_Brat; 02/18/11 10:10 AM.
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HTLD -

I am also Catholic. You'll get the annullment if you persist. its been kind of an open secret that annullments are for sale for decades. sorry to sound so cynical, but as a lifelong Catholic and one who was educated in Catholic institutions I think this is not far from the truth.


BS (me) 49
WW 49
married 6 years
dday1 8/23/10 NC 9/3/10
NC broken 12/10
dday2 2/6/11
NC2 3/5/11
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I guess I'll find out. I'm told that I really have to make a case, though looking at our marital history before and after it shouldn't be too hard.


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