Not so much in the ring. I already knew this was going to be his tactic, but when we got back to my house he said he was going to take the babysitter home and then go back to his apartment because he was "still tired from his race." (Ran a 10 mile race yesterday morning). I KNOW you said to stop checking the phone bill, but I was too curious and checked this morning. He called her the second he got into his apartment and they spent two and a half hours on the phone and then another half hour texting. It's almost funny.

However, I looked smokin' hot last night. And earlier in the night I suggested that after we got home we have some "adult hot tub time" (meaning alone without the kids) because I won't be able to use the hot tub for probably 6 weeks after my surgery, but I knew he would pass on it when I suggested it. So at the end of the night, when he said he was going home, I couldn't help but sweetly say "I can't believe you're passing up your last chance for adult hot tub time..." His foggy-foggy response? "It's not the last chance, just for a few weeks." He is SO in denial.

After the two conversations I had with him this week about her and him subsequently spending hours on the phone with her each night this week, he still thinks I'm going to let things go on this way? I can't believe that he hasn't figured out that at this point I'm using him for my surgery. And it can't come soon enough.

The next four days are going to be very hard not to love bust when I don't even want to look at him or be around him.

Just assume he is phone calling and texting her and practice NOT looking (for when you go to plan B....you ought not to look to create your own peace of mind)
Assume, asssume, assume BUT don't even let it sway you and your plans.'

Awesome on the invite to the hot tub. He will recall it once you go dark on him.

Since the phone calls and texts are so very dear to them.....why don't you up your own calls and texts to him while still in plan A? If you don't do them much....start doing them. Sweet ones. Romantic ones. Practical ones. Lots of them.
If he asks why? Say.... I love you so very much and want to hear your voice/connect with you more. (something like that).
Don't say ....I know you are doing it with her and I am mad or anything like that. Don't let him know you have seen his phone records. That would be detrimental to your cause.

He is foggy. You are pissed (taker). You just utilize the man til you can go to plan B after you recover from your surgery and plant seeds of love to harvest in the future should the affair ever crash and burn (eventually it will.....sooner or later....you can't control that).

Enjoy your moments with your H while he is still around and then prepare to release him and to refocus on YOU.

I would also find her family and expose to them too. There is no need to worry about "libel/slander" except to HOPE that she would be stupid enough to bring a suit. The truth is a defense to libel and slander, so she would be hanging herself. But you can't allow yourself to be paralyzed by such fears.

Do you have her family information?


Yes, I would expose to them too. Additionally, I would RE-EXPOSE to all of his family and all your friends. Tell them your H won't end his affair with OW and ask them to use their influence to persuade him to end his affair. Be sure and give the OW's name so they know the name of the homewrecker so she won't be welcome in his family. When you get the exposures done, contact the OW and tell her that there is no future in her affair because she will be eternally hated by your children and by the in-laws. Tell her you will never allow her around your children because she is an unfit adult.

Hyacinth, have you set a date for Plan B and a date for exposure? I would do your exposures all on the same date for maximum effect.

I haven't set a firm date because I'm waiting to see how I heal after my surgery. Basically, as SOON as I feel I can take care of my kids without him, I'm going into Plan B. Originally, I had planned to start Plan B at the end of February, but this surgery messed up that plan.

I need help with exposure. A couple of posts back I described what I did to expose back in December, but like I said, he convinced his family she wasn't the problem, just a symptom. I'm not sure how to proceed now, what exactly to do to convince them otherwise. All I really have are wireless phone records at this point. Do I print them out for everyone or just describe them or what?

As for her family, I have only been able to find one name, who I may be her father, but no address or phone number for him yet. She's 2,000 miles away, so it's been hard to dig up dirt on her. I did a background check, but it yielded very little for all it cost.

Here is what you say when you re-expose to both of your families:

Dear Family,

I am heartbroken and trying to save my M. WH and I have been trying to reconcile since the beginning of January. He has been coming to me saying he wants to reconcile and I have agreed ~ however, behind my back he is still in contact with the OW, spending hours on the phone with her, all the while telling me he wants to reconcile. The hurt I feel from this is unbearable at times.

I am asking for your help ~ our children deserve an intact family and I am willing to forgive him but he MUST end all contact with (POSOW's name). Please use your influence to encourage him to end his affair and give our children the family they deserve.

Until he does this I cannot have any contact with him ~ it's causing me undue stress and emotional trauma. Please pray for us while we separate and encourage him to end his affair so that we can repair our marriage.

Thank you for any help you are willing to give,

Hyacinth

Send this the day you go into Plan B. Until then, Plan A the best you can. I know it's hard and painful but you are almost there!

Have you written your PBL and do you have an IM? Is your addendum written out?

When is your surgery?

My surgery is this Thursday. Even though I have a friend who I already arranged to take me, stay and then bring me home (long drive), the timing worked out that WH has the option to come along and stay for the whole thing and he has chosen to do just that, even though I was very casual about that option so he could opt out. (A friend offered to him to pick the kids up from daycare and stay with them because we won't get home until later, so he can come.) His wanting to come doesn�t actually make much sense to me, because he's in so deep with OW these days.

I have edited my PBL pretty much as suggested here because after my discussion with WH last week where I had my epiphany about just how foggy he is, I totally understand why shortening it was suggested. I'll post the new version and I have some more questions about giving the letter.

Addendum � I�m working on it. I�ll post my notes soon to ask for suggestions/improvements.

Intermediaries are lined up. I need to give them instructions, though. One issue is that my intermediaries can�t help with exchange of the kids (for visitation) because they live too far away, however, there are a couple of different friends who love closer to me who I think will help. I still need to ask them, though.

Good girl. Stay the course, Hyacinth and we will help you through this. You are doing good getting all your ducks in a row.

Here's my Plan B letter (with MB edits ) :

Dear WH ~

I�m working hard to be a person I can be happy and proud of being. I want you to know that, even though I also sometimes have doubts and I�m also struggling with all of this, I love you. You are the smartest, funniest, sexiest man I know. If we really try, we can make this work. I believe in you, in me, and in us. I�m willing to put the past behind us and do whatever it takes to make this the marriage we�ve both always wanted. I have confidence that you have the capacity to do the same.

The pain that I suffer on a daily basis is becoming almost too much to bear. We�ve taken no measurable steps toward recovery or healing; in fact, I feel like we�re standing still. I need to be treated with love and respect. When you are ready to offer your openness and honesty to me and willingness to move forward together, I�m ready to talk about what we both think this will take. This means that I need you to be ready to commit to an active plan of recovery for our marriage. This also means that you have to be ready to end any and all communication and connection with her permanently. As long as you are keeping a place for her in your life, there is no room for me. When you end your affair and commit to the recovery of our marriage, please let me know. Until then, I will have no contact with you.

Until we are actively working on a plan of recovery and have determined a way to measure our progress, we need to keep our distance from each other. I hope that you understand that I am not doing this to hurt you or punish you, but to protect myself and preserve my feelings for you.

It�s not too late. We still have a chance to be happy together. I want to grow old with you. I loved you more I think you ever knew while we were together and I continue to do so as I write this. When you find yourself ready to truly and fully commit to me and our family, to work on a plan for our recovery, and to be open, honest and loving with me, I am ready and willing to discuss our future.

Love,
Me

What do you think?

Here's one more thing that doesn't quite make sense to me. The past two nights he has started chats with me right after the kids bedtime (we use the same program for both our phones and computers) and we've chatted until LATE in the night. This is very unusual for us. We chat, but sporadically and usually it's somewhat brief.

Sunday night he sent the first message at 7:22 p.m. We chatted until 1 a.m. when I finally had to go to bed (my bedtime is usually 9 or 10). 390 lines in that chat.

Then yesterday he messaged me at work and we chatted and emailed off and on all day. (178 lines plus emails)

And then again last night, he messaged me at 9:00 p.m. and we chatted until 2 a.m. (510 lines) Again, I was the one who had to say goodnight to go to bed. Thank goodness I have a short week because of my surgery because I don't function very well on so little sleep.

Today we emailed and chatted off and on all day, but I had a busy day and couldn't sit in front of my computer.

I have no illusions that he's given her up. However, I have no idea how much contact they're having because I haven't checked the wireless account in two days. (Very proud of myself for that!) So what is this about? Is this him having his cake and eating it too? Is he just enjoying getting attention from two women? Because he did not come to dinner last night or tonight, even though he told me he would come one of these two nights when I was meal planning/grocery shopping on Sunday. (He backed out tonight claiming working late as an excuse. Too cliche!) Is it that communication with me that's not face to face is more comfortable for him?

Or do I just need to stop analyzing this nutjob? Nothing he does ever makes sense to me anymore and I hate not being able to figure things out.

Stop analyzing him. Just know that he is following the wayward play book.

That's what I thought. It just goes against my grain - I am always looking for the answers to everything.

Yep to all of those and, to me, it's a good thing that he's still needing something from you.

With all of the chat/attention that he's throwing at you, it sounds as though your Plan B will be at an opportune moment. Take care of yourself, hope the surgery goes well for you.

Well, my surgery went well and I finally feel like I'm getting back to normal. Today is my first day back to work.

WH has been staying at the house for the past week, every since surgery day, helping take care of the kids and do household stuff I couldn't do. As a result, my house is trashed because he's terrible at it. He and I have been getting along very well, but I'm not deceived by it. I have evidence that things are still business as usual with him and OW, although I think he believes that they're finally sneaky enough that I don't know it.

Anyway, I'm just sick and tired of it all. As long as I still feel physically up to it (assuming starting work again doesn't set me back), this weekend I am going to start Plan B but I still have some questions and things I need help with.

My first question is: How do I go about actually initiating Plan B? Do I have a talk with him about staying away and then give him the letter, or do I just hand him the letter and tell him to get out? I know that might seem like a silly question, but neither option really seems right to me.

I'll post more later some questions I still have about logistics. This whole thing just has me sick, since it's not my first choice of how I wish things would go (obviously), but it's the only option I have left.

Thanks everyone!

You could tell him "I love you very much. Your affair is causing me too much emotional pain. You need to move out. Today" and let him find his own solution to where he goes.
If he says he isn't going. Repeat the above statement (as often as needed).
If he still states he isn't going.....tell him 'I neeeeeed you to leave."

With firmness, with not angry outbursts. With eye contact. With resoluteness.

If he still doesn't go.......come back here for more advice on that. (Mine left with the above scenario)

I would, personally, have him leave and wait a week or so to give him the plan B letter. He will try to push boundaries once he does leave and it could be easier to have a leeway of WH being gone and then receiving the actual plan B letter. Then,be prepared for going truly dark to him.

BS have done both:
give right at waywards departure
and a bit after.

The thing is, he has already moved out, he has an apartment he's been living in since I first kicked him out in December. He's only been staying with me the past week to help me because of my surgery. So if I tell him to leave, he will leave and just go back to his apartment. But this time I need to make sure that he knows I mean STAY AWAY and no contact, because he's been coming and going at my house as he pleases, visiting the kids, doing his laundry at the house, eating dinner with us, etc, since we started being friendly again in January.

I do like the idea of telling him to stay away and then a few days later driving the point home with the letter. That way it might really sink in that I mean it.

I forgot! (sorry).

I think that you could make the statement
"Thank you for being here for me as I recover from my surgery. I feel stronger now. I love you very much. Your affair is causing me too much emotional pain. As long as you continue it....I am suffering. I need you to leave. I love you, but I need you to leave."

then send him the plan B letter a few days later.

Then, do not respond to him other than factually about important child or finance issues through the IM who you designate in the letter.

This is what I did. I would NOT tell him to stay away and then a few days later give him the PBL. That makes no sense. You are saying "I want NC with you" and then you are having C with him.

PLEASE...just give him the dang PBL. This has been going on for waaaaaay too long. You are dragging your feet unnecessarily.

Just give him the letter already and go to a DARK Plan B. DO NOT BREAK PLAN B ONCE YOU ARE IN IT. This is a grave mistake that many people make.

I too gave my WH the Plan B letter as he was leaving.

If you had not been doing this for so long already, there might be some reason to wait, but in your case, I would just do it all at once. It's like pulling off a bandaid.

I realized something early on around here. Most of MB seems counter-intuitive at first. If I read someone's post, in the beginning, and I thought, "Yea, that's what I should do," it usually meant that it was what I was already doing, which was getting me NO WHERE. So, I really started to pay attention to the posts that had me questioning myself a bit more. I have only regretted a few things about my plan B, and that was mostly that I didn't stick to it as well as I should have.

You're all set up otherwise though, right?

How are you preparing yourself emotionally? Do you have IRL support? Weekends tend to be slow around here, so you will need someone IRL(even over the phone) to support you for a bit. Don't be discouraged. It's the right thing. Most things that are the right thing to do are the hardest to do.

Hang tough.

One of my problems is that I do NOT have everything for Plan B set up to go and stay completely dark. My surgery was ten days ago and I've been laid up since then (and going to work Friday apparently was pushing myself too hard and I paid for it this weekend, so I haven't gotten anything else accomplished). And for a couple of weeks before my surgery, I was trying to simultaneously prepare for surgery/being immobile afterward and also get ready for Plan B. Everyone here keeps saying be 100% ready for Plan B so you don't break it once you start and I am not 100% ready with the practical details. Emotionally, I feel about 90% ready, which I think is about as ready as I'll ever be.

Here's what I have for my Plan B logistics so far, with a few questions I need help working out:

No Contact/Intermediaries:
1. He is not to come to the house.
2. He is not to make phone calls, texts, chat messages or emails to me � all contact must go through intermediaries
3. I have friends (a married couple) who will be intermediaries
-- I need to give them directions on what to do/how to do it
-- He may call, email or text them (include their phone numbers and email addresses in the addendum)
4. He may only contact them regarding children and finances
5. His mail will be delivered to work by one of our other friends who is also his coworker (haven�t asked this friend yet, but I�m pretty sure he will do it). Also, he needs to start changing his mailing address on things because I will not do this indefinitely.
5. What about emergencies? (I realize this is a potential loophole)
6. Do I say he can feel free to contact me only re: recovery/reconciliation? Or not? (I know this is another potential loophole, but I�ve seen it done both ways here on MB.)

Kids:
1. I will take them to daycare in the morning. I haven�t been able to design a scenario that doesn�t involve him in my house. (I hope this one doesn�t end up killing me; it�s a TON of extra work. But, only 50 days of school left this year. )
2. Visitation (and drop off/pick up of kids):
-- On days he has visitation, he will pick them up at daycare
-- Drop off: possibly with local friends? I haven�t asked them yet and I'm not sure if they will do it. What should I do if I can't find anyone to help with this?
-- "Right of First Refusal" (I have to do this as it is from the co-parenting agreement we have from before the attempted reconciliation). So I'm giving him a list of dates and he needs to indicate if he wants the kids on these dates or do I need to arrange a babysitter? If I do not hear from him within (time frame?), I will assume that means he doesn�t want them and I will get a babysitter
2. Other than that, I'm not mentioning a visitation schedule; he can arrange his visitation with the kids � that�s his problem
3. What do I do if he shows up at our son's soccer practice or games? (I won�t give him the full schedule, but he needs to take our older son to Saturday soccer games on his weekends - if he has any weekends, that is.)

Miscellaneous:
1. PBL letter is ready.
2. The details above will be listed in the PBL Addendum
3. Change locks on house. My dad will help me with this if I need it.
4. Working on separating our finances. This is a huge mess and I don't know how long it will ultimately take, but I am starting.
5. Don�t push him to get his stuff � that�s his problem. (He has his clothes and essentials already and I am NOT packing the rest for him. He has too much stuff. Worse comes to worst and he can pack his stuff some weekend while my dad watches over him -- he'll hate that)


What details am I missing? What else needs to be arranged?