Hi....I have been here before.

5 years ago my wife had an affair....she had wanted to leave me.

I now sort of realize that when it all came out the love rejected her, and then we were able to survive with me using marriage builders as a resource.

We had 2 kids at that time....as things improved we decided to have another. Then one more right after that became twins. Then we failed at NFP and had a 6th...she is mostly ok but has a bunch of health issues and is delayed.

Whatever the case our youngest is not even a year old and I have discovered she had an affair with an old boyfriend she found on facebook. She doesn't want to leave this time...apparently the guy is a criminal on parole who doesn't even have a car...they are both 30 years old. He has nothing really to offer and she doesn't want the shame of the thing becoming public.

Trying to make the story short...I got suspicious and found out about it. It had been physical for about 2 weeks when I found out and the relationship had been about 6 weeks of communication. I have continued to be better at investigating then her hiding it....she hasnt been able to see him but she is continually trying to contact him behind my back....she strokes his ego...it's all very bad. I am confuse...she just had marriage tattoos "till death do us part" immediately before the affair went physical. I realize she has been under tons of stress with the 6 kids and out youngest ones special needs, oh yeah in a 2 bedroom condo with the 2 working parents and her having a schedule from hell...

I am sort of at a loss of what to do. I think it's about time for plan B, I think that would work well (they wouldnt last very long) but I don't know if I should take her back. I have reached out to a lawyer but won't consult till wednesday....it might be hard to play along and not confront her till then. I want to keep the kids insulated from this as much as possible.

She has a secret prepaid phone she uses that I can't find to call him anytime she is alone. We have been trying the extraordinary precautions to avoid the lover, but with out her honesty it still is'nt working.

Blaze, Sorry you have found yourself back here. I just wanted to say that as this is way over my level of advice. The vets will be along soon.
I will say however that you have to plan A before you can ever hope for Plan B to work. Even if its a short Plan A.

Hi blase, if you are familiar with MB then you know the routine. Expose the affair wide and far. Call her parents, close family, friends, everyone. Is this bum married? If so, expose to his spouse. Expose to his friends on facebook. DEMAND that she end her affair today and turn over the affair phone. Raise as much hell as possible in this affair.

Call his parole officer, even if he can't do anything.

Is this really the best thing?

I am familiar with MB and have survived an affair once before, but she is definitely ashamed of this one. She even didn't like it how I told my psychiatrist and asked to have some privacy with my doctor.

Anyway today I confronted her about the cell phone....she reveals nothing unless I make her. I had recorded conversations and asked for the cel...she did not produce it until she was convinced I was going to look through the car until I found it...about 30 minutes of searching. It confirmed the recorded conversation with the lover were the only ones she had since I confronted her on the affair.

I was trying to go to Plan B, but she basically refuses to leave and I have been told that my leaving would be bad and hurt my position with the kids if it came to the courts. I have a legal consult on Friday and I am unsure if the recorded conversations are useful or even if I could get in trouble for them...I don't know the laws in California on this matter.

Basically she is just confused I think...I told her that she should leave and we can make up a cover story and I will stop spying on her. She just left with the secret phone and to clear her head and I have no idea where or what she is going to do....I am sure she will try to contact him. I don't know if I should keep trying to spy on her even though I said I wouldn't. She is addicted to the affair...our marriage was not awful when this happened. It was more the stress of all the kids and the small house. He is an escape from that.

She did say to him on the recorded conversation that there is only one place she wants to be and that it was with him. At the same time she can't make the choice to leave me and her kids and deal with the shame.

More people know about it now....most of my family I think does although I only told my mom and brother in law. One friend of hers does....the one who clued me in on the previous affair actually. My doctor. I told her mom too, but her mom is fixated on that I had/have mental health issues and wonders how much of it is that I am paranoid or whatever.

So far I told her I don't know how we can stick with plan A after she continues to be dishonestly try to contact him....about 4 times in 2 weeks. I was feeling like the only way to go to Plan B would be to legally divorce her. I am Catholic however but that wouldn't stop me (but it would likely stop me from ever remarrying without an annullment).

Really? Is that the MB advice....I had felt like doing this, but with 6 kids I felt it was a bad idea.

Yes it is marriage builders advice. The only chance for the survival of your marriage is for the affair to end, and end soon. Exposing the affair will destroy it as it can only flourish in secrecy. Make the sneaky affair based on lies not a safe place anymore. EXPOSE

Why does it matter how many kids you have when it comes to ending your W's affair? We have 4 kids and it never crossed my mind that I shouldn't expose because we have 4 of them...in fact it helped CONVINCE me that I needed to expose in order to attempt to save their family.

Expose today. There's no reason to wait. My H's affair ended the very day I exposed.

She had an affair 5 yrs ago that you never exposed...and here she is again, having another affair...doesn't that answer your question? Part of what you did wrong the first time around is you protected her from the consequences of her A, didn't expose and she remained wayward...

The fact that she desperately wants it kept secret should be another big clue that exposure will work for you...

P.S. Never shield a WS from the consequences of their affair.

Exposure and the subsequent, well-earned humiliation is a consequence of the A. Do not shield her from that. It will help de-fog her.

You told her about Plan A? What else have you said about Marriage Builders? I would keep this to yourself right now. Don't tell her you are 'Plan A'ing' her, just do it.

You don't have a clear view of the marriagebuilder plans. It seems from those of us who do that you have a vague idea of them.
You don't share them with the wayward. They are your tools until a recovery time when the wayward is completley ready to take their place as a partner in rebuilding the relationship.
You don't need her permission to expose. You don't tell her you will. You just do it.
She won't leave the marriage because you exposed her misdeeds and embarassed or shamed her. She might leave cause she can't bear having to stop misbehaving or she might not be up to being a truly loyal, dedicated spouse. Her actions might end the marriage not yours in fighting her betrayel.
You need to study the plan a lot more and regroup what you will do to deal with it. You need to stop trying to make her behave and instead you need to lead the family as the head of household.
In CA you can phone several attorneys to get an idea of how to get her to leave the home. They will tell you over the phone for free. They want your potential business if there is a legal separation or divorce. They will give you direction in your state.

Wow,you guys have opened my eyes a bit....is there a link explaining why exposing is proper?

Would it be appropriate to post to her facebook?

Everyone knows about the last affair.

We used marriage builders in recovery on that one, I was trying to use it again before I realized how bad it was. We were trying to follow the extraordinary precautions to avoid the lover, she was on board with giving him and fixing this. She never wanted to leave. blah blah blah.

I have given up on monitoring her for now...thats why I say I am basically in plan B. She is out free to do whatever right now....gathering her thoughts. I'll let you guys know what she says when she gets back.

She realizes she has a problem, she didn't mean for this to happen.

I am telling her I want to help her.

She says that it doesnt help when we try.

I say we need counselling, that she needs a counsellor...we need a professional. she resists.....

I think she might just leave me on her own.

How did you use MB to recover the first one? The initial actions to kill it? What about the time after it was dead and the new one started? Did you two spend 15 hours of quality time together, just you two meeting each others' most important emotional needs? Did you create a life that was built on all the other important factors in a healthy marriage?
You can not use MB to kill an affair and then let the marriage go to pot again.

You are not in plan B if you are in contact with her and communicating with her (as in letting us know what she says when she gets back). You will need to do plan A and then go dark. Dark to her. Dark of her. On without her as though she is gone for good unless she decides you are her most important mate and she and you create a new marriage with each other.

Study up on plan A. Figure out what it IS. Once you are in plan A you can study up on what plan B is.Then you can follow a plan. Your posts sounds so all over the place with little understanding of the plans.

Do you have the books Surviving An Affair, Love Busters and His Needs/Her Needs?

Welcome back blaze. You asked about exposure, here ya go:


From chapter 13 HNHN's by Dr. Harley

"Step 1: End the Affair

The first step on the path to surviving an affair is for it to end. An affair ends when the straying spouse ceases all contact with his or her lover and never sees or talks to that person again. Time and again I've watched what happens when a drastic and decisive break with a lover is not made. They try to remain "friends" and maintain casual social contact. But inevitably they find their way back to their lover's arms. It seems that when it comes to this one person, they exhibit incredibly flawed judgment and almost irresistible force draws them back.

But even if there were to be no risk of rekindling an affair, if any contact continues, the affair still remains alive in the mind of the betrayed spouse. Since an affair is the most hurtful and selfish act that one spouse can inflict on the other, any contact restores the memory and perpetuates the pain. Wives have told me that their husband's affair was worse than being raped. Men have said their wife s affair was worse than losing a child. It's the ultimate betrayal.

For some, the affair ends the right way. The unfaithful spouse sends a letter to the lover that communicates how much suffering the affair caused the betrayed spouse and how thoughtless it was, a desire to rebuild the marriage, and that all contact would be terminated forever. The betrayed spouse reads the letter and approves of it before it's sent. After the letter is sent, extraordinary precautions that I'll explain in the next step are taken to avoid future contact with the lover.

But most affairs end the wrong way -- they die a natural death. Instead of taking control of the situation, and making a decision to end it, most unfaithful spouses continue in the relationship as long as possible. Affairs, however, don't usually last very long. I estimate that 95% of them don't last two years. Those few who eventually marry are extremely fragile -- much more likely to divorce than the average couple. So if an affair doesn't end the right way, it will almost always end, even if it's the wrong way.

If your unfaithful spouse is unwilling to end an affair the right way, I know of a way to help speed up its demise: Expose it. Your own family should know: Your parents, your siblings, and even your children. The family of your spouse s lover should also know, especially the lover's spouse. The pastor of your church should be informed as well. Exposure of an affair is like opening a moldy closet to the light of day. Affairs do well when they're conducted in secret, but when they're in full view for all to see, they appear as they are -- incredibly foolish and thoughtless.

Even if exposure were to be ineffective in ending an affair, I'd recommend it anyway. The betrayed spouse needs as much support as possible, and exposure helps friends and relatives understand what's going on. Keeping an affair secret is no real help to anyone. But I've been amazed at how well it dismantles the illusion that affairs rest upon. Instead of assuming that the relationship is made in heaven, an unfaithful spouse quickly senses that it's a one-way ticket to hell on earth.

The first reaction of an unfaithful spouse to exposure is to try to turn the tables on the betrayed spouse. "I will never be able to forgive you for hurting me this way. Don't you ever think about how I'd be affected by this?" Of course, it's really the affair that hurts. The exposure simply identifies the source of the pain. The unfaithful spouse should be the one begging for forgiveness.

In spite of the suffering that an affair inflicts on a betrayed spouse, during this period of exposure he or she should try to make as many Love Bank deposits and as few withdrawals as possible. If you argue about the affair, you'll damage recovery. Insist on the unfaithful spouse s complete separation from the lover (no contact for life), but don't fight about it. I call this strategy to end the affair Plan A.

If exposure itself doesn't end the affair immediately, my advice regarding what to do next is usually different for husbands and wives. I encourage husbands to try to stick to avoiding arguments and meeting their unfaithful wives' basic needs (Plan A) as long as possible (six months to a year). But I usually encourage wives to separate after about three weeks if their husband is still in contact with his lover. My experience has taught me that the health of most women deteriorates quickly and significantly while living with an unfaithful husband. Men, on the other hand, tend to be able to weather the storm longer with fewer emotional or physical effects. I call the strategy of complete separation Plan B.

In addition to avoiding health problems, a separation also helps a betrayed spouse hang on to what remains in their spouse's Love Bank account. Daily interaction with an unfaithful spouse causes such large withdrawals, that a separation with no contact between spouses can actually help the marriage by temporarily freezing the betrayed spouse's Love Bank. When the affair is over, the betrayed spouse is less likely to divorce when the unfaithful spouse wants to give the marriage a chance to recover.

Yet another advantage to separation is that some of the basic needs met by the betrayed spouse suddenly disappear. This is especially true when a couple has children. An unfaithful spouse often overlooks the betrayed spouse's contribution to the family. While the lover may meet two basic needs that were unmet by the betrayed spouse, the betrayed spouse may have been meeting the other three that cannot be easily met by the lover. During a separation, the unfaithful spouse can become acutely aware of what he or she is missing."

Dr Harley has spoken about it plenty on his radio show. You can search the archives here for "exposure":
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/radio_program/radio_programs.cfm

It's a no-brainer. Expose this and kill it, the same day. It happened for me and our marriage. DO IT.

It is the best thing for everyone. Affairs thrive on secrecy so this is the best thing. And of course she won't like it. Just as a crack head doesn't like it when you bring onlookers into the crack house, she won't like others looking at her. But that is therapeutic and is the best weapon you have against the affair.

We have had many affairs end when they were exposed. Here is what Harley says about exposure:

here




I agree you shouldn't leave. What you should do is PLAN A, which means you expose the hell out of the affair and start shaking up the OM. You want to save your marriage? Then start raising hell and fighting for it!

Having 6 kids should make it MORE imperative that you expose the affair. I would start with the kids. And then branch out and expose the affair wide and far.