Uuuuugh! I'm so sorry to hear this Stretch. I've been following your story closely. At least it sounds like YOU are doing well... if only WW was. Sigh.

Hang in there, buddy, take a deep breath and don't do anything rash just yet.

Wish I had better advice, but I'm rooting for you.

Sorry stretch, really. Mine did something similar to me in December and thats when i exposed killing it.

So I know what you are going through. Months of progress killed.

Does she know you know about it?

I'm sitting here, seething, so I can't fathom what you are going through.

But let's take this in flash-back mode, back to d-day:

WW: "I cannot promise to not write him an email. I have this ridiculous urge. And I can't make it stop."
S123: "....................................................."

Tell us, Stretch, tell us WHAT you said when she out-and-out told you, promised you, she was planning on renewing her affair at some time in the future, pending HIS inclination to take up with a desperate, pathetic, middle-aged, tart-in-waiting.

When you tell us that, we'll have the information at hand to help you construct a response, if that's what you what you're asking for from us.

I was an emotional basket case bacnk then. It was exposure plus a couple days. I knew this day woud come. She has told me for weeks the urge is strong.

I believe I said, "that hurts"
"That will hurt me badly"

Stretch - just want to say that I'm rooting for you during this difficult time. Hang in there!

I dk when to expose. I talked to my sisters and to my PC and to our MC tonight. No specific advice. But this won't linger long. I am curious to watch her and see how she behaves. Very delightful and loving now. Is that camouflage?
Her depression makes her confused. What is fun about the fantasy POS Dude?

1 - I was an emotional basket case back then. It was exposure plus a couple days.

2 - I knew this day woud come. She has told me for weeks the urge is strong.

So you told her it WOULD hurt, and she did it anyway. And more to the point, and this wasn't clear until just now, SHE TOLD YOU RECENTLY THAT SHE WAS GOING AHEAD WITH CONTACTING HIM, and you did..............?

You understand, right, that she has learned NOTHING from your discovery and activities since D-day. I should say she learned NOTHING GOOD. She did learn that she can tell you she's still in the affair in her heart, that she'd want OM to respond to her advances, and that she's planning to hurt you, and that you're so desperately clinging to the hope that that ridiculous line in your epilogue had some basis in fact, that you would act like a frat pledge with your pants pulled down, holding your ankles, pathetically begging, "Please WW, may I have another?" while she wielded the paddle.

This is not a case in which she tried to sneak something and got caught. SHE DID IT AFTER TELLING YOU SHE WAS GOING TO DO IT! It's a straight marital power-play now. She has just asked you, "How desperately do you to be married, just for the sake of saying you're married?"

BTW: You've betrayed OUR trust here, too, keeping her recent scuzzy "urge" threats from us so we couldn't help.

Actually thats a really good point. Maybe if someone here knew this could have been headed off.

I would be very interested to see what Mel would tell you, but I think you are at the point of full marriage or full divorce with her. Its been months..

I have been clear here that she has not left the fog and maintained hrr infatuation with this fantasy. Have I never told the group that she has the urge to email him? I have no energy to review all the posts and defend myself. Because I KNOW I have been a doormat.

I couldn't even breath for weeks. The fact that I am emotionally composed tonight tells me I have the strength to finally nut up.

Just this afternoon my PC was telling me its decision time on the not to distant horizon. But I have to start being honest to myself. Tell her I am not happy with marriage this way. (Duh... clearly she knows this. But its important to express my feelings honestly and not be afraid.) I cannot be married like this. I won't be uncommitted and unloved and in fear of her breaking my trust with another man. I just can't take that for very long.

NG
I understand what that means. Thanks. Its from another thread.

Last night I explained the ugly to her. I am done with doormat ugly. I believe in either the good or the bad.

Long talk last night. Will post more about it later today

Sorry to hear this, stretch.

The thing about her saying she wanted to email him--that rings a bell and I think you must have mentioned it somewhere in these 50+ pages.

Since this is, basically, a groupie-band member kind of thing, surely this fantasy would pop before too long?

She needs to either commit or file for a divorce and I think you should tell her that.

That's right, Stretch.

From this point on, you need to establish, maintain, and defend your boundaries. It is paramount to your recovery, be it with or without the marriage.

But the fantasy won't pop. She asks herself: "Why do I do it?"

You would think this fantasy would be easier to let go, wouldn't you? AM I wrong to assume that there are BH's on this forum dealing with long, entagled PA's that wish they only dealt with a brief EA as we are? That wish they dealt with OM that always refused to make contact with WW?

I count my blessings. She was ready and eager to jump into a PA and whatever forces stopped that. Our A problem seems pathetic compared to others sometimes.

So... let me have it for that moment of self depreciation. I am wrong for minimizing the problem. Go on. Chastise me.

Long talk last night. She saw her PC today. We talked more. I am working from home for the day. We have appt with MC tomorrow. My sisters have been helpful on the phone and email with me.

Her words below. There are openings in here for me to fill. There is honesty here. Its not a bunch of fogbabble. I am heartbroken she doesn't love me, doesn't feel like being married right now. But if I really stop Plan doormat and make a better Plan A (keep on the meds, keep on the exercise, get my work done, remain emotionally stable) I will be strongwer for this while we figure this out. She needs time still to build the $LB and come back to me. She is still here. Still caring for each other. Still physical. Still loving actions towards each other every day. True feelings.

--�When you are now present in conversation� I feel like you are trying too hard. You are trying super hard to demonstrate listening and being present. It�s difficult to feel you trying so hard and overshooting the mark.�
--�I don�t know why it won�t come to me (love). I sit back and wonder why it�s not coming. Is it me resisting? Is it you? Why won�t I feel the love coming to me?�
--�You have made a lot of changes Stretch� but if I want to be ugly, blunt and crass: It�s like you have become a much better roommate. You have reduced thoughtless behaviors� you help with the kids� you are thoughtful about sharing our home and spending time with the family. But the nourishment and feeding I need are more than a decent roommate. I don�t feel fed by talking to you.�
--�My instinct when this gets so hard is to just run! I know I have run away from other things when they are hard. Why does my marriage and relationship have to be so hard?! Why do I feel like crap when I have a conversation with you?!�
--�I remember a time when I just felt free. I didn�t feel trapped. I felt like I could be myself. It was only at most�. Eight to ten hours of conversation with him. But I felt good. And I really loved watching him perform. I know we didn�t know each other. I know we had no baggage -- we could share stories without a bunch a crap from our past.�
--�Monday night�. I read something from Martha Beck : Things in your life that make you feel trapped need to be changed. So I know that Monday when I went out, to see my sorority friends, I was about to walk into the restaurant to have fun with them� and I didn�t feel trapped. Song was on the radio... reminded me of him... my fingers typed an email. Its a release valve. A pressure valve. He will never answer. He never has.�
--�I want the urge to email him to be gone. I want to stop thinking about the fantasy. My therapist says I need to go through the grief of loss. Maybe these emails are part of the process for grieving the loss.�
--�Sending him an email was selfish. I did not think of you. I did not think about how it hurts my husband. It�s selfish and its wrong and I do want to stop.�
--�I know you can never have the �transference� and measure up to a fantasy. It�s not fair. You can�t become him because he is a perfect fantasy. Just a fantasy. Not reality. No history. No failures, fights, letdowns. I just felt free of any burdens or pain when I talked to him.�

It is, most certainly, fogbabble, Stretch.

Don't fool yourself. She tried to reestablish contact. She is still foggy, she is still pining.

Big time babble and the simple result of her comparing you to someone else. Are you sure he didn't respond?

She's going to have to "get" that you won't stay married or put up with the waffling forever, you know. That part, and if/when you get there, is up to you.

Shoot, hoss, have you read my thread? I bisch and fuss all the time and can throw one helluva pity party, so at least you aren't acting like I do sometimes

I don't think all this can be dismissed as fogbabble. I actually reviewed this with my sisters. There is honesty here. There is good stuff. Read below for what I think are honest things to hear and NOT fogbabble. If you want fogbabble, I can give you things she said in the past. For the record, there are no angry outbursts from either of us. We are working on communicating all of this absent of LB's.