His test is NOT legally admissable, but his attny submitted it anyways. His attny will possibly use that as evidence to support a ruling for a legal DNA test to be done. There's always that chance that they'll reject his request. Even if they do grant his DNA test, that gives him nothing yet. He then has to de-legitimate and re-legitimate OC, which is done before a jury. That's why we're not too afraid to play hardball and end up in court, because there's always that chance we'll keep him out (until OCs 18, at least). And yes, BH is on BC.

The only reason we're willing to negotiate out of court is because we can't be sure which way court will go. It's like a terrible game of chess. If we can keep him down to 1 overnight every other weekend, we can live with that and it would be better than the worst case the courts may award him. Plus going to court will likely cost about $50,000. Big bucks... It's a lot of money to gamble with, yknow?

My BH did a background check, and he's got a record, which we can use against him.

I like the idea of no overnights until 2. OC's still really a baby and can't even be without me for more than a couple hours at most right now. And she's a total daddy's girl; crazy about BH and wakes up every morning to his face.

Well, I think at this point we're willing to accept 1 overnight every other weekend--starting at age 2--and if he doesn't accept we'll take our chances in court. We don't care about the cs $; that's not a point of contention for us if it will help persuade OM to give up an extra overnight. I think it's a more than fair offer...especially if OM doesn't want to be sued by BH, which we've also been recommended to do by BH's attny.

If it were me and my child, I would fight it all the way. It's in the best interests of everyone involved to keep the OM out of your lives. If there was a possibility that could happen, I would go to court and fight it all the way. There aren't a lot of marriages that could survive having OM in the picture, so if it's possible to keep him out, I would suggest you do that.

I know it's a huge gamble. I've been there. Many years ago, I was involved in a custody battle with my ex. We were not married, but we lived together and had two kids together (now 18 and 20). He was pushing hard for joint legal and physical custody, even though he had nowhere to live (was living in his car and on friends' couches) and also had a criminal record. The battle was long and scary and, yes, expensive. But in the end, it was worth it. He was ultimately given only supervised visitation (due to his past and instability) and disappeared soon after the judgement was made. This was a man I thought would never give up and go away, but he eventually did. He re-materialized a few years ago, and my kids chose to meet him. They now regret that decision, refuse to have anything to do with him, and thank me for keeping this person out of their lives.

You really don't know anything about this OM. Your BH is the only father your OC has ever known. I think most judges are going to take this sort of thing into consideration. Your BH is the OC's legal father right now. Do not just give that up without a fight! If you give in now and just allow the OM to have rights without having to fight for them, you are willingly placing your BH, your marriage, your family, and your OC in danger. Your BH may think he can handle having OM in the picture now, but what if he can't when it comes right down to it? I doubt my marriage would have survived something like that.

want, please reconsider negotiating with OM and fight for your OC an family! OM has a HUGE uphill battle to get your H off the BC and de-ligitmize your OC. He is NOT the father in the eyes of the law and an at home DNA does not count in the eyes of the law.

Thank you for the encouragement to fight. The more I think about it, I really think you're right. It's a chance of keeping him out, and a chance is enough to make the gamble worth it. My BH and I never felt "good" about negotiating anyways. We only considered it to avoid a worst case scenario, but what about the best case scenario? We can't forget that we could keep him out for good. I'll talk to my hubby about it and see what he says, and I'll let you know. I feel so much stronger after getting your encouragement!

**************Pops, how does your OC handle shifting between families?*************

She handles it fine now and has for about 3 - 4 years i quess. before that there was some of the worst heartache i have known and that includes being a bh.

***********Does she seem okay with it?*************

yes, one of the biggest factors was om got a new gf that was nice to her. om's new gf became preg quickly baby and oc loves her new 1/2 brother. all she sees is that she has 7 bro/sis at our house and 3 bro/sis at om house. she doesn't separate them just says she is lucky to have 10 bo/sis.

************How do you explain it to new people you meet?********

I don't even try to explain it unless someone asks. when people see us together it is assumed that i am the father/dad b/c of how close oc and me are. if someone does ask i simply tell them that she is my w had a brief A during a rough time in our marriage. that we worked our way thru it and are doing fine.

funny you ask that. on thursday a friend of ours asked me at oc's soccer practice "how fh and me were doing". i said what do you mean. with the economy, $$ is tight but we are getting by.

she said no about oc and our marriage. I said that all that is behind us now and we are doing just fine. and we are

**********Does everyone know she's an OC, or does that not come up much?**********

most everyone knows about what happened. it is so long ago and we have been around all our friends as a happy family that is raely brought up or questioned

i am the kind of person that has to move forward. i cannot linger in the past. life is what it is. we have to deal with whatever God hands us and move on. if he gives us lemons, let's make lemonade.

quite frankly i like having my enemies where i can see them

want

negotiating with om is doing you no good in this situation. that will only give ammunition to om should it go to court.

he will use it as "they were admitting that he was the bio and that you were willing to deal". not good for you.

i say force him to persue it thru the courts.

Writer, thanks for the terminology i was looking for joint or sole legal and/or physical custody.

want if it should come down to this you want "sole physical custody" and om gets visitation only. this is by far the most important thing you can do for you and your h. like i said before use "joint legal" as a bargaining chip if needed to make om think he is getting something.

Want, I feel so much better reading this. I think this is the right attitude. I hope you can develop an acute case of amnesia In all matters related to OM � I hope you can treat him as a stranger who is trying to maliciously invade and disrupt your family. Make him earn what he thinks he�s entitled to because he�s really entitled to nothing. Was he even TRYING to make a baby? I doubt it. Did he LOVE you? I think not. He already got what he wanted � you in the sack. He deserves nothing more and it�s NOT valiant to make believe he should be involved with YOUR daughter.

Sorry if I get a little emotional. I don�t hold OM�s in much esteem. And I was one once.

opt
Edit: **after I posted I realized I actually was never a om, but a wh. I don't hold either in much regard. **

WH,

Did you expose OM to his workplace, clients, parents, siblings, church community and others? This might take the wind out of his sails, and eliminate the terror you might feel of others finding out. Exposure being less expensive than lawyers.

Although I am in favor generally of a child knowing their social background and genetic heritage, I also believe everything should be done in the open.

God Bless
Gamma

Gamma, OM doesn't care about exposure. Everyone knows, and he isn't the least bit concerned what people think of him or the situation. I think he thinks he's being an upstanding guy by trying to get involved. So exposure hasn't detered him in any way, and while I believe in openness and honesty, I think that each decision regarding OC should be made with the bigger picture in mind. I don't think he sees the bigger picture.

wanthealing, I wanted to move your post here that you posted on the "befriending the OW" thread so you would see it here.

wanthealing, I believe this can probably be changed. I would ask your attorney if a replacement can be named and if not, what it will take to make that happen. Your H should not be put in that in position or he will be perpetually triggered by the reminder of the affair. If you need it, you might could even enlist Dr Harley to write a letter for the court. But there is no good reason, and lots of bad reasons why your H should be placed in this position. I would get this changed.

I am sorry the OM got any rights at all.

I agree. I would definitely try to have this changed. Even finding another family member to do it would be better. This really seems like way too much to expect from your BH. I'm not sure if he volunteered to be the one to act as mediator, thinking he would be able to handle it, but I think it's a very bad idea to have your H have to interact directly with the OM on a regular basis. Did you ask for a paid, third-party mediator? Usually such a request will be granted if you request it, though you and your H may have to pay half of the costs involved. That would still be far better than the alternative.

Are you getting CS from the OM? I would pursue this aggressively and get as much as possible. Also, was OM given any custodial rights, or just visitation? Who has legal/primary physical custody of the OC? Will your H be allowed to remain on the birth certificate?

I am very sorry you are having to go through this. Maybe your situation will turn out like mine. When my ex was granted supervised visitation (with a mediator he had to help pay for) and ordered to start paying CS, he promptly disappeared and didn't try to contact the kids for 15 years. This was someone who dragged me through court for 2 years and fought for both physical and legal custody and swore he would never back down. So there is always hope.

wanthealing, I am so, so sorry that POSOM got any rights. Our courts have gone too far in their being determined to destroy the basis of a good society...the family unit. This interloper has no business in your marriage at all. As the others already stated please do what you can do undo this "order" for your BH to have to interact with xOM. Please also continue to work the program to rebuild your M.

What was the decision regarding CS and visitation?

Agree, FF.

wanthealing, it has been my experience after 10 years of watching legal actions from the sidelines over on the SAA board that most attorneys will take the path of least resistance if allowed. Their goal is to make everything easy FOR THEM and get you to go along with it. They tend to be lazy.

For that reason, you have to TELL HIM what you need and tell him to make that happen. He works for you, after all. In my experience on the SAA board, when it is presented that way to most attorneys, they tend to move their [censored] and act on your behalf. Some have even hired different attorneys but many got what they wanted.

For example, we always tell BS's in Plan B to not allow their children to be exposed to the OP when with the WS. Almost every attorney says "that can't be done." But when the BS tells the attorney to MAKE THAT HAPPEN! suddenly it gets done and is negotiated as part and parcel of the separation agreement! Another favorite lazy tactic is to say "the judge won't like that!!" The attorney should be told to use his skills get it through.

You just have to be assertive with your attorney and don't accept "that can't be done," the most famous motto of conflict avoider attorneys.

We hired the most aggressive attny we could find, but unfortunately I live in a VERY pro-bio state. We even looked to move, but we were told that we could be extradited if we did and our state would most likely grant OM more custody than what we ended up with (every other weekend). BH decided he would rather do every other weekend and deal with OM than risk losing OC for weeks at a time.

We ended up hiring two other attnys to help push OM out, but he's got $ and was able to push back. Now he has legal rights and visitation.

BH will still be on BC, but only as my husband, not bio father.

I was thinking we could have FIL handle supervised visits, since he's very close with OC, but it's a lot of time to ask of him, since at the beginning it's a lot of hours just sitting with OM and OC. I mean, how awkward is THAT? And the reason the courts ordered us to supervise was because OC really gets bad sep anxiety when away from me and felt it was in "best interest" of child, which is what they base everything on nowadays...even if it's to detriment of M. But the supervision will only last for a few months until OC adjusts. Then perhaps we can arrange for OC to be picked up at FIL's house so that we don't have to deal with OM. But I still will check on having a mediator.

I'm praying for OM to decide this isn't what he hoped it would be and ends up going away, writer!

Oh, and yes, OM is responsible for CS. We didn't end up railing him there, mainly because we had the option for more CS and a 50/50 arrangement or less CS and he only gets every other weekend. We wanted more OC and less $.

My prayers are with you, wanthealing

Thanks, FF. I sure need 'em!

you need to get "primary physical custody".

if push comes to shove allow om "joint legal custody"

That would be much preferable to having your H deal with this. It would better for all involved if your FIL could do this. It will be horrendous for your H to have to sit there with the OM. Like Dr Harley said, its like inviting your rapist to Thanksgiving dinner for the BS to be exposed to the OP. Your marriage has already been through hell and I would do what you have to do in order to protect it. That is in the best interest of your child.