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The honesty here is brutal but appreciated. I am beginning to see some of the excuses and rationalizations i have used to justify the affair. I am ashamed of what i have done and want to move forward with re-establishing a loving relationship with my wife. I am willing to take all the criticism you can throw at me but is there anyone out there that is ready to give me advice on how to move forward? Is Dr Harleys services a good place to start? What about local marriage counselors? They just seem a dime a dozen. How do you know you are going to get one that can really help?
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I found this quote from Dr Harley about this issue. I also wanted to point out that people can and do die from adultery. [indirectly] We know of people who have committed suicide and others who have committed homicide. So yes, people do die in the fallout from adultery. "After having counseled thousands of couples with hundreds of marital conflicts, I am completely convinced that a spouse's unfaithfulness is the most painful experience that can be inflicted in marriage. Those I've counseled who have had the tragic misfortune of having experienced rape, physical abuse, sexual abuse of their children, and infidelity have consistently reported to me that their spouse's unfaithfulness was their very worst experience. To be convinced of the devastating impact of infidelity, you only need to go through it once." here
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Thank you for the welcome marital. I am also sorry you have been thru what you have. I understand that my view is different from most and maybe it is simply because this is what I am going thru currently. I in no way meant that adultery isn't hurtful or abusive because it is. I have been in that boat too.
As far as leaving him, I am making my exit plan as we speak and have been for some time. Maybe I should start my own thread, I sure could use some guidance right now. Anyway, thanks again.
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The honesty here is brutal but appreciated. I am beginning to see some of the excuses and rationalizations i have used to justify the affair. I am ashamed of what i have done and want to move forward with re-establishing a loving relationship with my wife. I am willing to take all the criticism you can throw at me but is there anyone out there that is ready to give me advice on how to move forward? Is Dr Harleys services a good place to start? What about local marriage counselors? They just seem a dime a dozen. How do you know you are going to get one that can really help? We are giving you advice on how to move forward. Getting honest is the first step. Traditional marriage counselors have an 84% failure rate and have no idea how to save marriages. They have a higher personal divorce rate than the general population. The MB program is completely different in that its goal is to restore the romantic love to the marriage [traditional marriage counselors don't believe this is possible] and it has a very specific plan to achieve that. Those of us here who have used this program have romantic passionate marriages as a result. Some did the program outlined in Surviving an Affair at home, others availed themselves of phone counseling wtih the Harleys and some, like my H and I, went through the Marriage Builders program. When you sign up for the MB program, they assign you a coach and give you weekly lessons. There is weekly follow up to see if you completed the lessons and if you understand them. They give you tests on regular basis to make sure the program is achieving its goal, which is to restore the romantic love. IMO, the MB program is the fastest horse. It is pricey, $1000, but it is worth every penny. Many here have used it and we are extremely happy with the results. Most marriages do not recover from affairs. They limp along in a crippled state of the pre-affair marriage, worse off than before the affair. But if you use this program, you don't have to be one of those statistics.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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You need to establish extraordinary precautions for your wife. When discussing EPs, Dr. Harley addresses that the following areas need to change:
A) Blocking all communication with Affair Partners (AP�s)
B) Accounting for all of your time
C) Accounting for all money
D) Spending your leisure time with your wife.
EP�s are put into place to protect your spouse.
Protection = Care
EP�s are also designed to ELIMINATE the opportunity to have a secret second life.
Ok, so let�s talk about two different categories you need to create in your list of EP�s.
The first category is a list of one-time EPs that you will need to make sure you complete quickly.
The second category is a list of EPs that you will follow for a lifetime.
So let�s start with the first category items.
(what follows are SUGGESTIONS, remember this is going to be YOUR list)
Category #1
A) Change cell phone number and give password & account access to your spouse.
B) Change email account.
C) Eliminate all social networking accounts (i.e., Face book, Classmates, My Space, etc.)
D) Take a polygraph
E) Make a copy of my vehicle keys and any other keys my spouse does not have and give to them (i.e., safe deposit boxes, business keys, storage cabinets/lockers, etc.)
F) List out passwords for all business and personal computer logins, and any other passwords my spouse does not have access to.
G) Give my spouse access to any banking/financial accounts, business and personal.
H) Install software that tracks all internet use, giving my spouse administrative access.
I) Install a webcam/security cameras for while at work that my spouse can access.
J) I will contact an attorney that will work on my spouse�s behalf and write a post-nuptial agreement.
K) Sell the house/purchase a new one.
L) Sell any vehicle AP was in and replace them.
Some of these things you may have already done. But these are one time things that you set up and they stay this way with little or no maintenance.
Include completed items on this list as well as items still in process on your list.
Category #2 is a little more along the lines of EPs that you need to maintain on a continuous, consistent basis.
A) I will protect my spouse and their feelings above all else.
B) I will not participate in any one-on-one meetings with anyone of the opposite sex.
C) I will not discuss my personal marriage issues with anyone of the opposite sex.
D) I will not attend clubs, strip joints, or any such establishment
E) I agree to use POJA as a basis for all decisions.
F) I will be open and honest with my spouse at all times about the past and present.
G) I will provide my spouse a daily schedule of all appointments and contact information.
H) If I need to make an adjustment to my schedule, I will notify my spouse of the change immediately.
I) I will make my spouse�s phone calls my highest priority by answering them or returning them immediately.
J) I will avoid all chat rooms, porn, member sites, etc.
K) I will trade phones with my spouse at any time they request, NO questions asked.
L) I will leave my phone accessible to my spouse at night/or anytime I�m home.
M) I will commit to at least 15 hours of undivided attention with my spouse to meet each other�s ENs every week (time working together does not count toward those 15 hours).
N) If AP finds a way to make contact, I will immediately end the contact and notify my spouse about it immediately after.
O) I will install a keylogger, GPS, or any other tracking system my spouse may request.
P) Anytime I have the thought, �I don�t want my spouse to know about��.�, I will call my spouse immediately and tell them my thoughts.
Q) Anything else my spouse wants as a boundary.
Use this as a starting point for working further on your EPs. Add and change items that suit your situation.
Whatever you do, put your list together and post it on your own thread and then allow for some feedback from those that have been through this exercise. We want you to perfect your list before offering it to your spouse. There is so very little that a wayward can truly offer as compensation for the huge amount of damage caused by such a selfish act as adultery that we want to make sure this is done well. The continuation of your marriage is riding on these actions!
Last edited by itistoughlove; 09/15/11 05:21 PM.
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GW, start with this article: here
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Once you Establish EPs that make her feel safe you will then need to start the marital recovery. 1) NO CONTACT FOR LIFE WITH OW (DESTROY ANYTHING ASSOCIATED TO OW IMMEDIATELY) 2) COMPLETE HONESTY WITH YOUR WIFE 3) ESTABLISH EPs 4) READ SURVIVING AN AFFAIR TO ESTABLISH THE FOUR RULES TO A SUCCESSFUL MARRIAGE Successful Marriage a) Rule of Care b) Rule of Honesty c) Rule of Time d) Rule of Protection
Last edited by itistoughlove; 09/15/11 05:26 PM.
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The honesty here is brutal but appreciated. Call it Tough Love.  GW, you're in the best place you could possibly be right now, although you may feel on the Hot Seat more than once before it's over. We don't dislike YOU - we HATE that you've damaged your precious marriage in such a cavalier and uncaring way! We want you to be a success story! You can do that if you stay with us and really listen AND ACT on what we have to say, okay? Having said that: is there anyone out there that is ready to give me advice on how to move forward? What do you mean, "is there anyone out there that is ready to give me advice on how to move forward?" ???? Go back and read the first post that was made to you - that was from me, and I told you what you needed to do to get started on recovery. And there were more posters after me, saying the same thing. I want you to explain why you asked this. I told you in my first post: You and/or the OW need to leave that job. You CANNOT WORK TOGETHER. You must establish complete NO CONTACT with her! You need to come clean to your poor wife and explain the reality of her marriage for the past six years. You need to call the OW's ex and explain to him that your affair with his wife spanned a period of six years and more than likely caused the demise of their marriage. You stuck your nose into someone else's MARRIAGE, GW - did you think there would be NO repercussions from that?? Did you think the affair was a 9-5 deal, where the OW forgot about you until the next work day? Your affair poisoned their relationship and became a toxic part of their marital fabric. After you tell your poor wife about your adulterous actions, expect shock, tears, anger, and more. Tell her that there is a place online that can help her, and send her here. Tell her you've been here and told us about your affair, and we want to help her. I told you there would be some work involved. It's going to be tough, but it's worth it. Now. Are you going to do it, or not? Because if you're not willing to do the heavy lifting required, let me/us know now. 
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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Thank you for the welcome marital. I am also sorry you have been thru what you have. I understand that my view is different from most and maybe it is simply because this is what I am going thru currently. I in no way meant that adultery isn't hurtful or abusive because it is. I have been in that boat too.
As far as leaving him, I am making my exit plan as we speak and have been for some time. Maybe I should start my own thread, I sure could use some guidance right now. Anyway, thanks again. Excellent idea, blueheart! Please start your own thread. I look forward to reading it - there are many here who can help you.
D-Day 2-10-2009
Fully Recovered and Better Than Ever!
Thank you Marriage Builders!
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... Had I not been a participant in the affair, would they have gotten a divorce? Chances are 99.9% certain they would have. While there was not any evidence of physical abuse, there was plenty of verbal and mental abuse. Friends and relatives had urged her to leave him before I came into the picture, but she stayed for the kids. Pastoral couseling was not successful and pastor even suggested the marriage was not salvagable. ...
Sir, you played a role in ending another man's marriage. A man who, chances are, had never done you any wrong. Please don't do yourself the further indignity of trying to downplay that role. The main point is, you should never have had any role whatsoever to begin with. OWN this.
Fact is, their marriage was hanging on before you came along. Maybe not thriving, yet breathing all the same. But she sure wasn't investing in her marriage while she was conversing with & shagging you, was she? You sure weren't helping her to invest in her marriage.
You don't have a chance of saving your own marriage until you start fully OWNING your stuff, and this is just one of the many things you'll need to own & live with if you ever want to become the kind of person to whom your wife might want to consider giving another chance.
I have walked in exactly the same shoes you're wearing. My OW's marriage broke up. Yes, she'd had another affair before me. Yeah, she made the first moves. And yeah, she confided that her husband was a workaholic, inattentive, a drinker, that she'd thought of calling it quits, that she'd slept with an ex-BF of hers out of frustration, yadda yadda & etc. But so what? It wasn't my business to be listening to any of that. I should never have played any role in their marriage at all. None.
You & I haven't even started talking about your wife. How do you figure your investment of time & energy & attention on OW affected your marriage? How do you think thay may have affected your wife's willingness & interest in opening up & being vulnerable to you? Do you think you've been giving 100% to your marriage while you've been in the affair? 75% Maybe less? And here you are, feeling so bad -- not about how you deceived the girl who took your ring on her finger, but about not seeing a way forward with your affair partner? Really?
You're in luck, 'cuz I am gonna hang out here and dog you on every piece of b.s. that comes out of your mouth here, until you start owning your stuff. You can get out of the affair & you can help make your marriage better than what you had before. But are you up for it? What's your goal here?
Last edited by GloveOil; 09/16/11 05:09 AM. Reason: more fog than I can shake a stick at
Me: FWH, 50
My BW: Trust_Will_Come, 52, tall, beautiful & heart of gold
DD23, DS19
EA-then-PA Oct'08-Jan'09
Broke it off & confessed to BW (after OW's H found out) Jan.7 2009
Married 25 years & counting.
Grateful for forgiveness. Working to be a better husband.
"I wear the chain I forged in life... I made it link by link, and yard by yard" ~Jacob Marley's ghost, A Christmas Carol
"Do it again & you're out on your [bum]." ~My BW, Jan.7 2009
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GW6,
If you read nothing else first, read what GloveOil is posting to you.
What will be harder than owning your stuff in the mirror every day in the short term is seeing GloveOil in the mirror every day if you care to listen.
Man up and accept his and everyone's help, please.
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The pain in my heart right now is tremendous. I cant think clearly at work and I am moody and distant when I am home. I have no one to talk to so I have turned to this forum for advice and comfort. How long will the pain last? What should I do? Sorry you're here, GW6... but this is the place you need to be. MB principles can save your M, as long as you stay the course precisely (the very narrow path to recovery). You have to follow it all. Your withdrawal from your A will be difficult, as you've already predicted. Your BS needs to understand what has happened and what you're going through. You need to tell her about the A. It will be devastating for her.... and it will be devastating for you, once you fully realize what you've done to her. You don't fully understand that now, but the pain will be fierce. So when does the pain go away, you ask? It never goes away, because it will change from what you think you're losing now to what you risked losing for 6 years. I do hope you will stick around here for advice and encouragement. Follow MB, and get through your withdrawal. Expect for the whole process to be a lot of hard work. Best... grace
FWW - me (41)
BS - (42)
EA turned PA (2+ years)
DD - age 5
DS - age 7
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I just realized that GloveOil's on this thread... GW6, stick around and learn! If anyone can help you out of the fog, he can.
FWW - me (41)
BS - (42)
EA turned PA (2+ years)
DD - age 5
DS - age 7
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Reading the direct posts from gloveoil and others, I would have expected to feel angry from the things that have been said...but I am not. Everytime I read and re-read the previous posts I begin to see the past 6 years from a little differently, from the point of view of other BS. I know it will be difficult and painful to begin the healing process with my wife but it will be worth it. Am considering early retirement since I simply cant leave a company with 35 years of service. I realize I must avoid all contact with the OW. Recently I have moved to another city and we are no longer in the same Division which does not cause our paths to cross for business purposes any longer. However as everyone here knows you can make "opportunities" to get together even if the work environment does not provide such. I am committed to eliminating those "opportunities" so she can pursue the relationship she has recently developed with a divorced doctor. Someone she has told me can take care of her. I am trying folks. Keep up the encouragement and the direct criticisms. I deserve it and I can take it. By the way, I am not familiar with all the abbreviations and acronyms. Can someone point me to the meanings?
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I would strongly suggest apologizing to the OW betrayed husband (BH).
You never know what may come out of you gesture. If he isn't remarried and the OW isn't remarried there may be an opportunity for them to heal with each other as long as you stay out of their lives forever.
We have seen it happen on the forum throughout the years.
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Link to the list of commonly used Marriage Builder forum abbreviations: MB abbreviations
Married 1980
DDay Nov 2010
Recovered thanks to Marriage Builders
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I have been reading along. Get out of the fog.
You should not be "eliminating those "opportunities" so she can pursue the relationship she has recently developed with a divorced doctor. Someone she has told me can take care of her."
If you still are looking at it as you nobly backing away so she can move on, then you don't get it. You had no business there to begin with.
You are married. You are doing it to start honoring your wife.
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When will you be telling your wife?
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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but is there anyone out there that is ready to give me advice on how to move forward? The FIRST STEP has been given to you over and over. To recap from the first page of your thread: If you have been reading here, you probably know what comes next. You will have to come clean with your wife and family, as well as your employer. I would strongly encourage you to tell your wife today. That is the first step is making this right. and there is not much we can do to help you if you don't go NC and tell your wife THE TRUTH about her life and how you have been hurting her behind her back... As a wise poster has written here before: It's the lies that are the real poison arrows. The rest of it doesn't matter if you don't MAN UP and tell your wife the WHOLE truth about her life. Today.
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Sorry, T/J
BlueHeart, it is your experience that your abuse hurt more than cheating. And that is your truth and that cannot be wrong. ((((BlueHeart))) Do start your own thread.
end T/J
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