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Folks,
although changing jobs is something we se as a necessity, her BS has said that he will not accept her leaving her job unless she has another job lined up first. Just wanted to note that she has not made any effort whatsoever to change jobs. Or anything else as far as I can see. She doesn't even understand or accept the necessity. I know Mel, but until her BS asks for this, all we are doing is beating a dead horse.... Her BH does not need to ask for this. And what her BH is asking for is a BH that does not know what he is asking for. Why do you think the phrase of Aesop's, 620-564 BC, be careful of what you ask for is still spoken today? A BS does not need permission to expose. A WS does not need permission to end an affair, send NC letter, go NC. These are things that must be done.
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Copied the quote below from the multiple affair thread. Note what's highlighted in red..... The BS has made his position clear. Right or wrong, he lives with decision. I lieu of Senninpa's decision, I'd hope to see Senninpa's wife sending resume's out continually and seeking a job as if her life depended on it... AS for EPs and affair proofing our marriage, with the exception of the job situation we have gone leaps and bounds in this area. As I am seeing it, I am unable to continue any discussion or participation on this forum without her job being the focal point of the continued bashing I am receiving.
I'm sure I will hear the "We did it and it all worked out", but I will say this again; I cannot encourage or permit my WW to leave her job until there is an available position that will continue to at least keep us above water. WE Just spent our ENTIRE LIFE SAVINGS buying this house, we have two houses that we are paying mortgages, utilities, and insurance on. We are broke, and are just staying afloat. WE are trying to sell one house, but as everyone in the world knows, houses aren't selling. WE don't have the money at this point in our lives to just up and quite a job in an area that doesn't have a lot of jobs available. Now it would be easy to suggest to someone that that would be the best thing for them, but sit in my chair and then tell me how easy that decision would be. I am walking a tightrope here and I can't make rash decisions.
If you think my attitude is to save what I have over the marriage, you aren't to far off.
If we put ourselves in a position that I have to take a second job to make up the difference, would that be better? How about we get to the point we start loosing a car, then the house, would our marriage come out better. If our marriage fails and we lose everything, as many do, so what, at least we tried. If we lose everything to save the marriage, The marriage would almost certainly fail, as currently there isn't much of a marriage to save.
I have taken this advice, and we are taking steps toward changing our working arrangements, either I will work with her, or she will find another job, but that will not happen overnight, and to continue to toss the "you haven't done anything" bs at me is getting old.
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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I lieu of Senninpa's decision, I'd hope to see Senninpa's wife sending resume's out continually and seeking a job as if her life depended on it... I am not disagreeing with you. However, they have no intention of taking any steps to get her out of there. They don't think it is a problem, which is why nothing has been done. They have taken NO STEPS to remedy this situation. She is not looking for a job and doesn't understand that it is a problem to work with all men and work on an opposite shift frmo her husband. They don't even the spend the nights together. The affair happened because while her H was working, she was OFF work free to chase men all day. In that environment, she has actually had TWO affairs. She did his best friend in their home and also had a fling with their MARRIED car repair man. Did you know they don't even spend the nights together? She goes to work at 10pm and he goes to work in the mornings. Like I said, they don't get it.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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Like I said, they don't get it. Nope, not at all.
Every man I meet is in some way my superior; and in that I can learn of him.
-Ralph Waldo Emerson
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H tried to get back in but they returned with a different shift meaning 2nd which defeats the purpose so unless I can get on first then he could get on 3rd shift. I have been praying to be on first shift since the day I started.
Living in the sticks is very difficult finding a decent job let alone one that pays well. We live over two hours away from any big city.
I understand what you are saying about the environment at work. Call it an excuse all you want. But there are far and few jobs with only women around here. I can think of one Curves.. any others????? Please don't mention a church because we already know someone who left her husband from someone from her church. And to stay home would be grand if only it was financially sound.
I am the WS
BH, love him dearly
~It's not easy taking my problems one at a time when they refuse to get in line. ~Ashleigh Brilliant
~When you come to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on. ~Franklin D. Roosevelt
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SPW,
I've been reading your story for awhile. First, I must say I envy you. You actually have a chance at having your marriage succeed in spite of all the trials and tribulations you've encountered.
You see, I've lost my family because my H decided that it wasn't important enough to him. Ask me what I would be willing to sacrifice to have the same opportunity as you have. If you could make it happen, I would personally write you the balance of my bank account. I would quit my job tomorrow. I would move across the world. I would do whatever is asked of me because my family is my life, nothing else matters because it's just STUFF.
I have to ask you what you would do tomorrow if you couldn't work. Imagine your child with a terminal illness, maybe even yourself. What if there was no job? There is no doubt in my mind you would find a way to make it work. How do you feel about your M?
The problem here is the same for all, only the perspective changes. You aren't making excuses, you just haven't decided your M is your priority, therefore your decisions are based on the priorities you have set. You and your H have decided that all the other STUFF is more important than your M. There is a big difference between can't and won't.
I sit here in my huge house with all the luxuries of life, money in the bank, a well paying job and ALONE (with my DS). I would trade it all (not DS!) and live in my car if my H was at my side and to have my family intact. How long would I hesitate in making this decision? About 5 secs. But you see, my perspective is different from yours, my family is my life.
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2H4M, It's a perspective to think about. I'm so sorry and my heart breaks to hear this cause this could be us at any time. Can I say it would be like comparing oranges to apples. If I had terminal ill family member I imagine in our community there are fund-raisers like spaghetti dinners and bake sales to help out financially. As for the rest of our STUFF, your right we probably could sell our cars for an older late models. I would fear that an older car would break down between his hour to work and an hour back. We bought our dream house that has been in his family for two generations. So I guess we are working on our M through our house. Your perspective is something to certainly think hard about, and thank you for sharing it with me. 
I am the WS
BH, love him dearly
~It's not easy taking my problems one at a time when they refuse to get in line. ~Ashleigh Brilliant
~When you come to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on. ~Franklin D. Roosevelt
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H tried to get back in but they returned with a different shift meaning 2nd which defeats the purpose so unless I can get on first then he could get on 3rd shift. I have been praying to be on first shift since the day I started.
Living in the sticks is very difficult finding a decent job let alone one that pays well. We live over two hours away from any big city.
I understand what you are saying about the environment at work. Call it an excuse all you want. But there are far and few jobs with only women around here. I can think of one Curves.. any others????? Please don't mention a church because we already know someone who left her husband from someone from her church. And to stay home would be grand if only it was financially sound. Start a business together with your husband. Or sell the house and move to the area with better job opportunities. Are you actually looking for another and more suitable job for you right now or not?
Me, FWW: 43
Mr_Recon6mo, FWH: 44
DD20 and DS23
3 cats
Married 23 years, together 24
Divorcing
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Senninpa's wife, It's a perspective to think about. I'm so sorry and my heart breaks to hear this cause this could be us at any time.
Can I say it would be like comparing oranges to apples. If I had terminal ill family member I imagine in our community there are fund-raisers like spaghetti dinners and bake sales to help out financially. NO, you cannot say it's like comparing apples to oranges...  You need to re-read her post.... You've missed the point entirely. On a different note; There are at least 75 unanswered questions on your thread. I would like to know if you have any interest in actually answering any of them?
Recovery began 10/07;
Meeting my wife's EN's is my "thank you" that refuses to be silenced.
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2H4M & tst are right - it is a question of priorities.
My H is back home with me, at least for the present. We have the big, beautiful house...but does it make sense when I say that it's not a home anymore? It's just a place. It's just full of STUFF. And all that stuff will never make you happy. It will never fill the hole inside you - or senn, for that matter.
H and I are living on one income now, not b/c of choice, but b/c he lost his job last fall. I have a FT job and I picked up PT work that I am able to do from home. I realize that's not an option for everyone, but there are ways to figure this out. I sell stuff we no longer need on craigslist when I need some quick cash.
It's not only your work environment, but the fact that you work opposite shifts, b/c that cuts into your UA time. Trust me, you need that UA time to fall in love with each other again. When you do not get that UA time together, the in-love feelings will begin to disappear.
I don't have much else to add, and I kinda feel like I am beating a dead horse on the topic of your work environment/hours, but I feel like you and senn have a chance *IF* you are willing to do the work, b/c right now, he's on the boards, he's posting, he's willing...once he's no longer willing, you just might end up like me, and trust me, it is not where you want to be.
FWW
"Snow and adolescence are the only problems that disappear if you ignore them long enough." ~ Earl Wilson
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2H4M & tst are right - it is a question of priorities.
My H is back home with me, at least for the present. We have the big, beautiful house...but does it make sense when I say that it's not a home anymore? It's just a place. It's just full of STUFF. And all that stuff will never make you happy. It will never fill the hole inside you - or senn, for that matter.
H and I are living on one income now, not b/c of choice, but b/c he lost his job last fall. I have a FT job and I picked up PT work that I am able to do from home. I realize that's not an option for everyone, but there are ways to figure this out. I sell stuff we no longer need on craigslist when I need some quick cash.
It's not only your work environment, but the fact that you work opposite shifts, b/c that cuts into your UA time. Trust me, you need that UA time to fall in love with each other again. When you do not get that UA time together, the in-love feelings will begin to disappear.
I don't have much else to add, and I kinda feel like I am beating a dead horse on the topic of your work environment/hours, but I feel like you and senn have a chance *IF* you are willing to do the work, b/c right now, he's on the boards, he's posting, he's willing...once he's no longer willing, you just might end up like me, and trust me, it is not where you want to be. Time for a thread jack: YOUR BH IS LIVING AT HOME! How did I miss that point. You better be plan A'ing your butt off. No relationship talk, but make his have a home life that he won't want to miss out on. Get some family activies going. He refuses to join in do them any way to let him see the good times he can join in on. He may not act receptive but he is looking to see if the changes you talked about are being done. And, done consistently.
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Time for a thread jack:
YOUR BH IS LIVING AT HOME! How did I miss that point. You better be plan A'ing your butt off.
No relationship talk, but make his have a home life that he won't want to miss out on. Get some family activies going. He refuses to join in do them any way to let him see the good times he can join in on. He may not act receptive but he is looking to see if the changes you talked about are being done. And, done consistently. sorry for the t/j, SIPW - yes, H moved back home after my Dad died at the end of August. I posted about it over on my thread. I think at first it was to help with the kids, but then a month later he lost his job and the stepmom (who he was living with) is letting her house go into foreclosure and moving in with her sister. He has made it clear that he did not come home to recover the marriage, and my attempts to meet needs are rebuffed, for the most part. I'm feeling resentful and depressed, most of the time, for lots of reasons, not only our M and my unmet needs, but grief over Dad's death and dealing with my increased family responsibilities, job stress, etc. I still maintain EP's, b/c I have learned over time that they are not solely to help H feel safe, but maintaining EP's and healthy boundaries are for me, too, and ensuring that I am the woman-wife-mother I want to be. I prayed for walls & doors (thanx, MM) and the following morning received this email from Divorce Care: When attempting to reconcile with your spouse, the reality is that what you desire to happen may not happen.
"Reconciliation was something I had wanted more than anything in my life, " shares (a wife), "and until I realized I was the only person who wanted this reconciliation, I still held on to it..." I haven't been posting much lately, just felt drawn to the sitch of senn & his WW. Sorry for the t/j...now, back to you, SIPW: On a different note;
There are at least 75 unanswered questions on your thread.
I would like to know if you have any interest in actually answering any of them? People would not be posting to you if we didn't see hope in your sitch, but you have to show folks that you are listening...
FWW
"Snow and adolescence are the only problems that disappear if you ignore them long enough." ~ Earl Wilson
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Yes I'm currently reading SA. and Boundaries.
You mentioned that I haven't answered 75 questions. I have gone back through trying to find them to answer them.
I haven't read HNHN & LB'ers in years. It's on my to do list.
I am the WS
BH, love him dearly
~It's not easy taking my problems one at a time when they refuse to get in line. ~Ashleigh Brilliant
~When you come to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on. ~Franklin D. Roosevelt
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sorry for the t/j, SIPW - yes, H moved back home after my Dad died at the end of August. I posted about it over on my thread. I think at first it was to help with the kids, but then a month later he lost his job and the stepmom (who he was living with) is letting her house go into foreclosure and moving in with her sister. He has made it clear that he did not come home to recover the marriage, and my attempts to meet needs are rebuffed, for the most part. I'm feeling resentful and depressed, most of the time, for lots of reasons, not only our M and my unmet needs, but grief over Dad's death and dealing with my increased family responsibilities, job stress, etc. I still maintain EP's, b/c I have learned over time that they are not solely to help H feel safe, but maintaining EP's and healthy boundaries are for me, too, and ensuring that I am the woman-wife-mother I want to be.
~You make a great point and it's something I really need to concentrate on. I don't know how much longer H is going to be able to put up with me or my past failures.
"Reconciliation was something I had wanted more than anything in my life, " shares (a wife), "and until I realized I was the only person who wanted this reconciliation, I still held on to it..." I haven't been posting much lately, just felt drawn to the sitch of senn & his WW. Sorry for the t/j...now, back to you, SIPW: On a different note;
There are at least 75 unanswered questions on your thread.
I would like to know if you have any interest in actually answering any of them? People would not be posting to you if we didn't see hope in your sitch, but you have to show folks that you are listening... [/quote] ~Your most certainly right. I am a better listener than poster. Thank you for taking time to post!
I am the WS
BH, love him dearly
~It's not easy taking my problems one at a time when they refuse to get in line. ~Ashleigh Brilliant
~When you come to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on. ~Franklin D. Roosevelt
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Your theory is Its not perfect but we are not worried and we are not doing anything to change it, so that's that. The truth is Time apart is your enemy, without time together you will drift further apart and the breach in your M caused by the A will not heal. Your addiction to cheating will return with a vengeance and your whole persona will be lost to another affair. Is it not worth doing without a few shekels to avoid that? Are you both BRAINSTORMING ways to make up the money? We bought our dream house that has been in his family for two generations. So I guess we are working on our M through our house. I dont see how it is possible to work on your marriage 'through' a house. If you dont see each other bc you work opposite shifts, then you cannot rebuild love. When each of you returns home, you do not return home to each other... you return home to .....a house. Just a house. And thats all you will have when it falls to bits, who will get to live in it I wonder? Loving a house is not the same as loving each other. Honestly I feel like the two of you are in a business arrangement where the bank balance comes first and you expect the feelings of love to be magicked up on their own without any time or input from you. I have read on your H's thread that you have two houses. Can you sell one to make up the income? Rent it? Can you move somewhere with better job prospects? Can you live off a smaller budget, tighten your belts for a while? Can you rent out the dream house temporarily to pay for a place closer to better jobs, with the plan of returning when there are approporiate job opportunities? You have to work on the mariage NOW and the 'dream house' later. Because the window of opportnity for saing the M is about to vanish due to the neglect it is suffering
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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Great suggestions from indiegirl. I hope the effort isn't wasted like all of my previous posts. When I find I am more serious about recovery than the person to whom I am posting it is time to step away. Senn and his wife fall into that category.
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt Exposure 101
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People would not be posting to you if we didn't see hope in your sitch, but you have to show folks that you are listening... ~Your most certainly right. I am a better listener than poster. Thank you for taking time to post! Here's the 76th - how you are going to show that you are listening? Or is it a show time now? 
Me, FWW: 43
Mr_Recon6mo, FWH: 44
DD20 and DS23
3 cats
Married 23 years, together 24
Divorcing
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[ quote=indiegirl]Your theory is
Its not perfect but we are not worried and we are not doing anything to change it, so that's that.
The truth is
Time apart is your enemy, without time together you will drift further apart and the breach in your M caused by the A will not heal. Your addiction to cheating will return with a vengeance and your whole persona will be lost to another affair.
Is it not worth doing without a few shekels to avoid that?
I agree with you but I'm completely clueless on where to start. H opinion thinks my work place is fine and IMO I will be on days by fall of this year. We spend every waking moment together from the time he gets off we r on the phone together and running errands together. Are you both BRAINSTORMING ways to make up the money?
Have been thinking but probably not as hard as we could.
We bought our dream house that has been in his family for two generations. So I guess we are working on our M through our house. I have read on your H's thread that you have two houses. Can you sell one to make up the income? Rent it? We have the house on the market, have had three prospects but they were unable to get financing. Renting is next but the area it's unlikely to get decent renters that take care of anything. Can you move somewhere with better job prospects? We probably could but our family loves where we are now.
Can you live off a smaller budget, tighten your belts for a while? We are not very big spenders to begin with and I'm sure we could tighten our belts but not enough to live on one income. Especially when we have to keep replacing necessities.Can you rent out the dream house temporarily to pay for a place closer to better jobs, with the plan of returning when there are approporiate job opportunities? It's a thought to ponder, but I am not so sure our kids would be so keen on moving once again. But that's somethiong to think about. You have to work on the mariage NOW and the 'dream house' later. Because the window of opportnity for saing the M is about to vanish due to the neglect it is suffering [/quote][/size]
And when H doesn't know if he wants to save the M, and is thinking about finding another woman by going to the bar or some stupid dating site.... I not try to have any angry moments. Shoot I can't seem to show any emotions cause it can trigger him to think of the "What If's"
:lightbulb: oh this is why we should be on same schedule so less "what if's!!!
Even making love every night seems to be a LB. 
I asked him what am I doing wrong, what can I work on? H said it's not what your doing it's what you've done! How do fix that????
I am the WS
BH, love him dearly
~It's not easy taking my problems one at a time when they refuse to get in line. ~Ashleigh Brilliant
~When you come to the end of your rope, tie a knot and hang on. ~Franklin D. Roosevelt
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SPW
Are you christian or practice any particular faith?
nESRE
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[ quote=indiegirl]Your theory is
Its not perfect but we are not worried and we are not doing anything to change it, so that's that.
The truth is
Time apart is your enemy, without time together you will drift further apart and the breach in your M caused by the A will not heal. Your addiction to cheating will return with a vengeance and your whole persona will be lost to another affair.
Is it not worth doing without a few shekels to avoid that?
I agree with you but I'm completely clueless on where to start. H opinion thinks my work place is fine and IMO I will be on days by fall of this year. We spend every waking moment together from the time he gets off we r on the phone together and running errands together. Are you both BRAINSTORMING ways to make up the money?
Have been thinking but probably not as hard as we could.
We bought our dream house that has been in his family for two generations. So I guess we are working on our M through our house. I have read on your H's thread that you have two houses. Can you sell one to make up the income? Rent it? We have the house on the market, have had three prospects but they were unable to get financing. Renting is next but the area it's unlikely to get decent renters that take care of anything. Can you move somewhere with better job prospects? We probably could but our family loves where we are now.
Can you live off a smaller budget, tighten your belts for a while? We are not very big spenders to begin with and I'm sure we could tighten our belts but not enough to live on one income. Especially when we have to keep replacing necessities.Can you rent out the dream house temporarily to pay for a place closer to better jobs, with the plan of returning when there are approporiate job opportunities? It's a thought to ponder, but I am not so sure our kids would be so keen on moving once again. But that's somethiong to think about. You have to work on the mariage NOW and the 'dream house' later. Because the window of opportnity for saing the M is about to vanish due to the neglect it is suffering [/size]
And when H doesn't know if he wants to save the M, and is thinking about finding another woman by going to the bar or some stupid dating site.... I not try to have any angry moments. Shoot I can't seem to show any emotions cause it can trigger him to think of the "What If's"
:lightbulb: oh this is why we should be on same schedule so less "what if's!!!
Even making love every night seems to be a LB.
I asked him what am I doing wrong, what can I work on? H said it's not what your doing it's what you've done! How do fix that????Well you can ponder, and think, and consider all you like, but try boiling an egg that way and guess what - the job dont get done by thought-power. I agree with you but I'm completely clueless on where to start. H opinion thinks my work place is fine and IMO I will be on days by fall of this year. We spend every waking moment together from the time he gets off we r on the phone together and running errands together. [/size] Basically you spend no time with each other, there is no prospect of that happening until MONTHS away, by which time you will both be beyond help. Fall is EONS away. You are headed towards the rocks and have numerous paddles to choose from, but dont act. You dont have time to be so complacent, about what your kids prefer or whether renters will care for the house! Get insurance! I asked him what am I doing wrong, what can I work on? H said it's not what[/size] your doing it's what you've done! How do fix that????[/color][/i] Actions. Actions did it. Actions will undo it. Try this action - GET A PLAN Are you both BRAINSTORMING ways to make up the money?
Have been thinking but probably not as hard as we could.
I just find it massively disturbing that you arent trying at all. Sit down with your H and put as many ideas as you can down on paper for ways to get you in a safe work environment and spending CRITICAL time with each other. Put down everything you can think of, no matter how crazy. If your H wont, say ok and go off and do your own list and ask him to review it. Make it clear you will do ANYTHING- make any financial scarifice, move, whatever to get the job done. He is waiting for you to take the lead.
Last edited by indiegirl; 01/26/12 04:38 PM.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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