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Originally Posted by stretch123
NG and HHH,
Thanks for checking in. Watch this space. I will post some updates eventually. Feel free to enjoy a thread jack if you feel so inclined.

Maybe this will start something.

We have our first stretch of decent cold weather in a while here in MN. Its finally single digits and I have been able to get the backyard skating rink back into shape. Flooded it several times last night. So the kids and I are going out back to skate this weekend. This winter had been really soft. Hardly any snow. Warm temps.

Is there any sort of Canadian TJ linkage or men's clubhouse tangent you can entertain yourselves with whilst I am busy fathering?

Will be back soon



Hey Stretch

Just wanted to say I have read along with your sitch the whole time you have been here but haven't responded since you had great support all along.

Just wanted to let you know I appreciate your passing along the info from Steve and how you are following the advice.

Just got on the ice myself-3 weeks ago- probably in your back yard.

If the kids need about 3500 acres of skating rink and a place to catch walleye/perch/northerns I know where there is one available for you to go-free. I have pretty much been living in the fish house since the ice became safe enough.

I think in this great state you have to be "served" with the papers.

nESRE





M 29 yrs
DS 28 DD 18
Me 53 FWH FBS
MTA signed 5/11/2011
D final 5/16/2011

Free.... and going wherever the big guy wants me to go......
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Ya hey dere Ole. Nice meetin ya dontcha know.

She chose not to serve. Save money I think. I guess I am supposed to notarize the lawyers letter or something. No matter. Steve says, drag your feet. Dont participate cooperatively in an action you feel is wrong. If it comes to a server and a deadline, my lawyer said we'll just give name, rank and serial number. We will prepare all right. Prepare very well. But don't push the D.

Anyway, as I say, this is MB site. Not D advise site. Even though D is staring me in the face, and many days it is tempting, I believe its not our answer. It is wrong. And with Steve's help and help from the fine peiple here, I will follow MB and keep trying to save our M.


Me: 43
ExWW: 44
Married 16yrs. 4 children

EA (ExWW): May-Nov 2009 + Aug-Dec 2010
D-DAY JAN 30, 2011
Exposure: FEB 7, 2011
Contact Again: Apr 25, 2011
Divorce Final Sept 2012

"I want to be married and stay married. Now I uunderstand the kind of marriage I want and we all deserve. But I also know it takes two to want to Build that Marriage."
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Originally Posted by stretch123
You're on the right track TryingEverything. She is visiting her Dad up north this weekend however. But I like your idea. It's what Steve told me. "Show her the value. Persuade her that this M is good through my actions."


Isn't what Steve is saying to do plan A? That is all a BH can do is damn the torpedos and full steam ahead and plan A all out.

There have been times in my life and other peoples lives where it looks like they may lose their job or will not make it through the selection process to get the job that they really want.

You see the red flags. You see where things look good as well.
Thing is you try not to build false hope, or give up the fight because the Fat Lady has not started to sing. Whether you maybe getting fired or looking to get hired fof the job you wany so you don't give up.

And it is tough to fight when you hear the Fat Lady gargling.
But you fight because that is what you must do.

Then you hear the Fat Lady warming up with some scales.
You still fight because not to will definetly mean defeat.

Then the Fat Lady lets loose, your toast.

Thing is why do we fight against the odds?
Because you can't win if you don't fight.

This is why after defeat you can walk away knowing you did all that you can.

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Originally Posted by stretch123
Ya hey dere Ole. Nice meetin ya dontcha know.

rotflmao


Wanna meet up at the Walmarts for some coffees?


"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr

"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer

"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Target country up here


Me: 43
ExWW: 44
Married 16yrs. 4 children

EA (ExWW): May-Nov 2009 + Aug-Dec 2010
D-DAY JAN 30, 2011
Exposure: FEB 7, 2011
Contact Again: Apr 25, 2011
Divorce Final Sept 2012

"I want to be married and stay married. Now I uunderstand the kind of marriage I want and we all deserve. But I also know it takes two to want to Build that Marriage."
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@TheRoad
Thanks. Good post. Its what we do here at MB. Keep on fighting for the M. Not the D.

But I am done "hoping, wishing and pleading". More stable, secure and active than that.

You know, in a relationship, sometimes it comes to a point where people could say, "she ain't that into you anymore." Or, "her heart isn't into it." Or, "its just too hard." Or, "trust your feelings. And, you dont have to explain your feelings."

I have heard all that. Even from MC's!!

But, this isn't just a relationship that is a temporary stop in life. Its a Marriage. Its a vow. Its a promise to God, our family and our friends. Its worthy of our best effort.

Relativistic gobbledy [censored] like, "her hearts not into it. She doesnt have the energy anymore. Go with your feelings...." were nowhere to be found in our vows. Society makes D so easy and normal.

We have a chance at something great here.


Me: 43
ExWW: 44
Married 16yrs. 4 children

EA (ExWW): May-Nov 2009 + Aug-Dec 2010
D-DAY JAN 30, 2011
Exposure: FEB 7, 2011
Contact Again: Apr 25, 2011
Divorce Final Sept 2012

"I want to be married and stay married. Now I uunderstand the kind of marriage I want and we all deserve. But I also know it takes two to want to Build that Marriage."
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Originally Posted by stretch123
@TheRoad
Thanks. Good post. Its what we do here at MB. Keep on fighting for the M. Not the D.

But I am done "hoping, wishing and pleading". More stable, secure and active than that.

You know, in a relationship, sometimes it comes to a point where people could say, "she ain't that into you anymore." Or, "her heart isn't into it." Or, "its just too hard." Or, "trust your feelings. And, you dont have to explain your feelings."

I have heard all that. Even from MC's!!

But, this isn't just a relationship that is a temporary stop in life. Its a Marriage. Its a vow. Its a promise to God, our family and our friends. Its worthy of our best effort.

Relativistic gobbledy [censored] like, "her hearts not into it. She doesnt have the energy anymore. Go with your feelings...." were nowhere to be found in our vows. Society makes D so easy and normal.

We have a chance at something great here.


No, stretch.


YOU have a chance at something great. It's up to her to make the decision to join you. Then she has a chance, too.


"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr

"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer

"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Thanks bud. I WILL have something great. I figured that out a few months back. Appreciate the reminder.

Lessons from this thread include:
"All in or all out."
"Full marriage or full divorce."
"Good or Bad. But no Ugly"

On the path with her, would be the best.
Or on the path without her, which is tempting and easy -- but I don't believe its the right way.

Excellence awaits either way.

For her right now, she sees sadness and struggle on either path. She is scared and uncertain. But still wants to go the D route.


Me: 43
ExWW: 44
Married 16yrs. 4 children

EA (ExWW): May-Nov 2009 + Aug-Dec 2010
D-DAY JAN 30, 2011
Exposure: FEB 7, 2011
Contact Again: Apr 25, 2011
Divorce Final Sept 2012

"I want to be married and stay married. Now I uunderstand the kind of marriage I want and we all deserve. But I also know it takes two to want to Build that Marriage."
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Stubbornness and pride go hand in hand. You're right, she's scared to come back because she's afraid how you will treat her. She's afraid to continue because she could lose everything, which is what's happening. The easy route is to keep running and falling deeper into sickness. WS do that because it's the norm for them right now. It will take effort to change that and stubbornness and pride keep her from doing anything different. The easy route is just temporary, but she doesn't realize that yet.


Me: BH 36
Her: WW 34
Kids: D 14, S 12, S 9
DDay 1-6/2009
DDay 2-9/2011
DDay 3-11/2011
Filed for D 10/2011-Papers Served 11/2011
Divorce final May 24, 2012
My Story



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Originally Posted by GJM
Stubbornness and pride go hand in hand. You're right, she's scared to come back because she's afraid how you will treat her. She's afraid to continue because she could lose everything, which is what's happening.
Yes this is true, and it has its base in fear. And also, what is the price I will eventually pay.

Thing is, is her own pain for what she has done to who she loved, the ultimate price or is there more?


Originally Posted by GJM
The easy route is to keep running and falling deeper into sickness. WS do that because it's the norm for them right now. It will take effort to change that and stubbornness and pride keep her from doing anything different. The easy route is just temporary, but she doesn't realize that yet.


Yes it seems easy, but it is just running away. That never works in the long run. You gotta face yourself and fix your issues, and the hard part, is proving that you did, and yes, you have to prove it


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
DD-29 with DGDs 5 and 1yr
DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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Yes it seems easy, but it is just running away. That never works in the long run. You gotta face yourself and fix your issues...

Here's the problem, CP. (And I HATE presenting a problem without an accompanying solution.) Here in 21st century USA (and all of the developed world?), it is not evident that running away from issues will not work (at least in a long enough run to render the decision moot).

Read the stories here, specifically the WW/BH variety. The feeling of externally-protected invulnerability within these WWs who obstinately refuse to accept their duties to try to recover their damaged marriages (even when, as with Stretch's WW, the OM is no longer an issue) is astounding and disheartening. They KNOW that SOMEONE will take their side against the BH to neuter and blunt his efforts to bring pressure on her to act responsibly. That "someone" in most cases is your over-involved, tyrannical government - executive, legislative and especially judicial. If "it takes a village" to raise a child, apparently "it takes a State" to encourage/support the extraordinary growth in female skankhood.

One element that confounds any possibility of the WW giving up her skank-fantasy and returning to her avowed union is that to do so would be to admit that she was in error. Horrors! That cannot be! Since she was a child, she has been assured by the treatment accorded her by parents, teachers, traffic cops, college application procedures, hiring practices, television and cinema, she (personally and as a gender) can NEVER be wrong, and will ALWAYS be accorded exceptional consideration.

And where does that leave BHs? Well, experientially, when was the last report of a BH whose Plan B did ANYTHING except delay the eventual Plan D? The only recent noticeable trend has been that Plan B angers the WW to a point that she lashes out at the BH to HIS DISCOMFITURE.

So, WWs just decide to answer their avowed duties of care, affection, fidelity, companionship, etc, owed their BHs by saying "I don't wanna." Those BHs, betrayed (sold out?) by their representatives to the interest of militant feminism, could expect exactly what treatment by those bodies if their answer to the duty to support their skank-WWs financially was "I don't wanna."

Too bad: destitution and starvation might at long last be the necessary lessons for some of these "ladies" that their choices do have consequences.

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Your telling me NG? Lol. I agree with you about how the Cinderella complex has been told and how it has effected so many people, especially the way it should be, boohoo, life is so hard..

Even the people who have had hard lives, still believe that the circumstances they have fallen into, are not fair, and life should be different...that�s the4 basis for their looking for love in all the wrong places.

I went through two years with my second wife, where I was convinced she was a victim, and her alcoholism was not her fault, and i wanted to be the knight in shining armor, who would come to her emotional rescue,(thanks Mic Jagger).

It wasnt till it got so bad I left her, and called it over, and just asked her to take care of herself, and I still loved her, that after 6 mos of falling down drunkenness, she started to realize, the party was over, and all her friends were just fair weather

It took another year and a half, my serious involvement with a new woman, her hitting her knees and prayer, buddying up with her church, to get me back. Honestly I would not have come back except the other girl dropped me. Just as well for her, I was a mess.

And event then, in her head, she didn't need AA, any counseling, any help from anyone, she had a relationship with God, and God let her do what she wanted, when she wanted it.

I came back with hope for us, but I came back to fight for my children�s lives, and be with them, through anything, because I loved them, and I didn't want them to think that drinking and acting like a little child was the right way to deal with life.

I covered her when she fell, and she still wouldn't get counsel, there was allways God, and yes there is, and He is real as you allow him to be in your life, but people have a way to change what he said to them to their benefit, and convenience too.

Well the point is, is that until I called it quits, and was serious about it too, she did not waver from expecting me to come back. I owed it to her, she was the queen, and she was perfect, all that fairy tale tripe. Even when I did return, it was business as usual, and she had to make me understand...

What a cruel joke, what a loss to all of us, because of pride and pain, and the insistance that life go her way, and she called it faith

I can stand in a garage all day and have faith that I am a car, and I am still a human at the end. You can't fake that till you make it.

Yeah destitution and starvation will work, but when its all the guys fault, because he "didn't understand, it could have been done differently" even when they tried all the ways they could to help..It still ends up His fault sometimes. or can we get mad at God? Get even with him, and hurt what he loves?

That�s how a brat acts, a teenager, and it always has to end sometime.

A nurse I was talking to in the hospital when my wife was dieing from cancer, brought on from the effects of heroin and her self abuse, (and of course at that point, i was a mess, and I still felt responsible), told me something when I shared the story.

My wife was high on dilaudid, and I knew how her activities had brought her to this place, and it weighed heavily on my conscience. As I told her the story, she pointed out that it is always the ones who love who suffer, the addicts, the ones in pain and on medication, do not feel the loss as the ones on the outside do.

I am a compassionate man, and at this point, there was nothing left to do, but fight with chemotherapy, so when the one time I saw her scared, and her hands started trembling, and she clutched mine and mentioned my name, i calmed her down and comforted her.

On the last day she was alive, she was talking to her late pastors son, and making the statement that many lovers of a married man probably made to their sons, "I never bothered you guys when you were together as a family, I left you alone"

No surprise for me, I met her after that bullcrqp went on, there was enough signs to read between the lines

I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, this son, who is also a pastor, has had numerous affairs, and to think he used to teach the marriage relationship classes. I just trust he comforted my wife at the time.

You would think that I want pity or empathy from people because I tell this story, but I don't. I just want to say, that feeling sorry for people who play like they have no control, its all everyone elses fault, and victims, is sometimes the worse thing you can do for them.

The prefrontal cortex, the part of the brain that makes decisions, and is in the front of the brain, and responsible for depression, is literally offline during drug use. It is the part of the brain where we make choices, and where we think of others, and the effect on them that our decisions make also. The depression is there along with the process of creativity, of change, and to take medication to make it all go away, can stunt a persons growth emotionally. Like many of lifes lessons, you have to go through it, even if it wasn�t your fault, and it wasn�t fair, we have to deal with it fairly and put he lesson behind

Dr Amen of Amen clinics uses SPECT Scans to look at brains. He has scanned 1,000s of brains, because he is a psychiatrist who wanted to really help people instead of giving out drugs that are really unreliable at best. He says that most Drs rely on what they hear from the patients, and prescribe meds on that basis. Also 65% of medication is given from general practioners, not psychiatrists.

The Spect scans that can be found on his website that he has taken from drug addicts, are horrifying. Most of there brain is not functioning at all, and the prefrontal cortex just is a blank, but these people are everywhere.

He also talks about the quality of thoughts people have, and its effect on the brain/mindset of people. He is a proponent of natural healing and supplements first, and I respect his views.

People will get depressed when tough times come upon them, and they need to go through it, with good counsel and friends, like this site affords, many churches, and of course, the Man upstairs. Running away from those times, can be a total rip-off of your own growth.

And yes, some people just are used to the drama, and they would feel lost without it, and even create it so they can feel normal.

Go figure


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
DD-29 with DGDs 5 and 1yr
DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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Classic CP, you almost need a bookmark:)



FBH,Dad
No half measures, in anything.
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Really enjoy CP's lonf posts. Thank you.
@NG, my wife is surrounded by those enablers everywhere. "Its gonna be okay honey. Follow your feelings. You aren't wrong. We never judge."

I am getting stronger. I swear I am watching her get weaker and more worn out. Fighting demons.

I am just here. A listener. No advice unless I am asked. Avoiding the DJ LBs. And I am not playing along with this D.

She sent legal papers. Got them on Valentines Day. No deadline. No official summons. And she never mentioned them. Never asked. Just gonna drag my feet like Steve said. And keep working on the M.

Stinks though. Now I need to pay a lawyer and use his counsel. Waste of money. Its a shame.


Me: 43
ExWW: 44
Married 16yrs. 4 children

EA (ExWW): May-Nov 2009 + Aug-Dec 2010
D-DAY JAN 30, 2011
Exposure: FEB 7, 2011
Contact Again: Apr 25, 2011
Divorce Final Sept 2012

"I want to be married and stay married. Now I uunderstand the kind of marriage I want and we all deserve. But I also know it takes two to want to Build that Marriage."
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If I ever recover my marriage, I could put a $50k price tag on it. That is how much it has cost me so far ... so if the loof comes back ... his adultery will have one heck of a high price tag.

Actually I will put a "2 googol" price tag on it because my kids losing their father approaches an almost limitless debt.

I.E. googol is the large number, that is, the digit 1 followed by 100 zeros

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Googolplex? Yeah some things are just priceless

Valentines day? Lol, what a heart she has..

Oh I know, its an evil holiday, just like halloween.

But to the pure all things are pure, and its perception that we all have, or don't have, that counts.

Keep hangin in there, you are not alone.


Me 56 Former BS
Widowed 5-17-09 --married 25 years.
4 children
DS-35 previous marriage--18-22 DGrandSons 6 and 4
Me former BS
DD-29 with DGDs 5 and 1yr
DSs 26 and 23
Teilhard de Chardin..“We are not human beings having a spiritual experience. We are spiritual beings having a human experience.” ...Sounds about right to me.
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To be clear, I like CPs posts too, plus when we were all over at the mens thread he was one of the guys that really kept that going...so many guys from that are now vanished..I hate that.

And yeah delivered on Valentines day. Whatever lawyer arranged that just has zero tact.


FBH,Dad
No half measures, in anything.
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She sent legal papers. Got them on Valentines Day. No deadline. No official summons. And she never mentioned them. Never asked. Just gonna drag my feet like Steve said. And keep working on the M.

Just checking on you, Stretch. How are you doing?

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Originally Posted by stretch123
She sent legal papers. Got them on Valentines Day. No deadline. No official summons. And she never mentioned them.

These were divorce papers, right?

Are y'all just going about your days around the house and ignoring what has to be the biggest elephant of all? What do you mean that neither of you mentioned them?


Me (BH)
FWW
Married 2000, DS 8, DD 6, DD 2

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You still out there Stretch? Still at a stalemate?


FBH,Dad
No half measures, in anything.
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