No, DO NOT put words in my mouth. I have faith that ANY and EVERY marriage CAN be saved, as long at the WS, and BS follow MB to a T. You can't a la carte it. You need to do EVERYTHING that is described in the articles and pages for you to SUCCEED. I would DEFINITELY tell your wife not to settle for anything LESS than NC FOR LIFE with OW.

But in effect you are doing some good....
because you are driving my passion to prove you wrong...
in that my marriage is unrecoverable because I am not willing to work on it.
So for that I thank you....
You have fueled my agression towards that....

Your advice may be perfectly good.... and it is based on things that work. And I respect that.

And yes I will take that with me as I work on my marriage and walk down my path.

I do feel I can be successful in this.... I actually feel it now more than I ever have in the past.... since you have stirred up all this emotion.

ace, I say this sincerely and not to be mean, but you are a very foggy, confused individual. The very idea that you can restore your marriage by doing the same things you did before is truly insane.

And what is even more insane is that you call doing the same stupid things "thinking outside of the box." Do you see the shocked reaction of others to your crazy thinking?

It is that insanity that will prevent you ever recovering your marriage. You don't understand that your continued contact with the OW is keeping you foggy. And until you cut off contact, foggy you will remain.

I am hoping that your wife is a little less foggy and that if you send her here we can help her help you. Because you are too far gone to help, my friend. Your posts are some of the foggiest I have seen here.

A drunk man is not a good driver, my friend.

When you tell your wife, tonight, I would also tell her that you wish her to post here. If you truly want to save your marriage, this would be a VERY important step.

No, we want your marriage to SUCCEED. Which is why we are telling you abandon your losing strategy. You want your marriage to fail, because you stubbornly refuse to give up your affair.

Confusion reigns! Let's examine your statement here:

Yes the advice on this site is proven and works. Is that while this way in its entirety works. There are as many was to reconcile a marriage as there are stars in the sky. and one would be nieve(sic) to think that this is the only way to make it work. And they each work in their own way.

Really? Then why are you here asking for advice on repairing your situation, which you have to concede is atrocious.

I simply choose to gather information from all of them... and formulate my own plan from there. And while I have gained most of my ideas from this site....I do have other information from other sources that has also helped me to think about a plan.

Hey! No question about it, there are scores of "experts" and "systems" out there which purport to supply a roadmap for successful marriages. (Shall we discuss sharia-based controls on male/female interaction as as legitimate as any?) The point is that none of them have the proven record of success that the MB program does, and the MB program, as a start, requires NC and EP. (Extraordinary precautions. You're welcome!) You came to the nexus of MB philosophy to ask advice, and then immediately reject it. (Hey, I foresaw your rejection, as I knew what your baseline intent was.)

HA, THAT ain't gonna happen!!

It's worth a TRY. I'm nothing if not persistent.

Yes it is my intent to tell my wife tonight that I spent time here.
I am not sure she will actually jin the forums as she is not big on the computer or in online activities.

But for sure I will tell her about the site.

I know you are all trying to help.... but in effect it feels like you are trying to make sure I get her here...so you can force that wedge in.
You have actually said it.... that you would like to get her here so you can show her that she needs to leave me and that I am not worth it.
Then in a later post you say you want to get her here so you can help her help me. So which is it?

I am not denying that my head is not clear and that it is a mess inside.... but at least I do have a goal that I do want to get to.
Just that I feel no one understands or recognizes that yes I do feel that we can get there..... A guy can take only so much failure... and yes failure by my doing.
So I came here because it is time I do something to make the change happen.
But feel no respect...for me at least doing that.
Only doubt.

Does a suffering alcoholic seek help from a falling down drunk or from someone who is sober and uses a plan that has helped thousands of people lead sober lives? Which would you chose to ask for help?

The leads to my next question.

How many marriages have you saved with your "advice?"

How many has Dr. Bill Harley saved with these tactics over his 40 year career?

You are terrified for her to speak to us and I understand why. If she comes here we might tell her that your affair has to end. And you don't want it to end.

That is your biggest fear. Not that your marriage will end, but that your AFFAIR will end.

You want to hang onto your affair at all cost.

Ace, would you mind linking just one of those sites that advocates it's okay for affair partners to continue to see each other on a regular basis and still have a healthy marriage to their spouses? I feel like being entertained today and would love to read more of that site's mindless drivel just for a chuckle or 2.

Thanks

If you decide to keep the OW as one of your options....

Know that your wife has the option to drop YOU due to your staggering lack of care for her.

You cant juggle two women in the air like this without falling on your [censored].

We are trying to STOP you from failing. Dont you see?

I dont worry about your wife, despite the heartrending pain you are putting her through.

Becuase she will get out. She will have to, given your attitude, for sheer survival.

But you will lose.

In wayward land, making the same mistake over and over again is "thinking outside of the box."

In wayward land, a WS can continue contact with his OW because he "knows someone" who has made it work, when he already knows it hasn't worked for him. He says this in spite of REPEATED resumptions of the affair. But he tells us it can work for him.

That is true insanity, making the same mistake over and over and over again and calling it "thinking outside of the box."

This is how your thinking appears to rational, objective observers, ace.

I wish you could realize how ridiculous it sounds.

You are a recently cheating husband who thinks you know how to save a marriage better than the Harleys. If you knew 1/100th of it, you wouldn't have gotten into one in the first place.

You claim financial hardship is more pressing than no contact yet you bought a new travel trailer and love to travel in it. Give us a break. Most betrayed wives will live in a 1 room flat with a faithful husband.

The bottom line is that NOBODY will help you dupe your poor wife into a false recovery.

You don't want to do anything that is hard. You didn't want to work out your issues with your wife rather than seek another woman, you don't want to leave your job, you just want to sweep this all under the rug and pretend it's going to be okay.

You, you, you. And no regard for your wife. You are not remorseful, give us a break.

Doing it "your" way has gotten you into this mess. How is it working for you?

I am worried for Mrs. ACE1974....many of us know HER pain...and what pain is coming if you do not follow this plan.

Listen to the vets. They know what they are talking about.

BUT, you see, in my telling her that if you didn't agree to PROTECT her and END your affair, that I would tell her to LEAVE you, I would be HELPING HER. I would even be helping YOUR marriage, and YOU. What I will NOT do is stand by and watch YOU destroy your WIFE.

Are you going to tell your boss? Are you going to tell your family? Are you going to tell you in-laws? Are you going to tell your GOOD friends(the ones who will kick you in the butt for having an affair, not the ones who will encourage you to continue down this route)? Are you going to tell OW's husband?

In helping your wife stand up for herself, and her marriage against her WH(YOU) I would be helping HER. She needs to see that ANY contact with OW will RUIN your marriage, as you have already proven 3 times. How many more years of torture will you put your wife through?

I am not in any way saying that the advice from Dr H does not work. Yes it is proven. And I have said... that time and time again the advice is good.
So please do not say that I said that.
When you know that I have not.

As for your question on my advice.... I never claimed to give advice... only that I know what I have tried in the past has not worked which is why I am searching for advice from a multitude of sources.

The only thing that I said that I saw possible... was what I have observed from what my friends went through and are going through.

I fully know to get to my end goal it will require a huge committment and a massive amount of will power and discipline on my part.

Just would like to recive a little positive reinforcement instead of feeling like I am being put down.

I thought that is what helping meant.

All who you mention telling about it have already been told over a year ago... both families as well as friends.

As for the employer.... the OW and me both agree that it will not be necessary to bring any others into it... when we talked about ending the whole thing recently.

As for the OW husband.... in my first post I said she is no longer married and was already planning to seperate from him before this all ever started.

When you get serious about saving your marriage you will give up your affair. But you refuse to do that. You are looking for a plan that protects your affair and there is no such plan. You want BOTH.

You are taking your own advice by selectively cherry picking parts of programs you like and don't like so you can protect your affair. You have cobbled together an unworkable plan by taking bits and pieces from other programs. Like a drunk cherry picking his own "plan" in a way that protects his drinking.

Nothing can save your marriage as long as you hang onto your affair. What you are seeking does not exist. You want to protect your affair while hanging onto your marriage.

No one will give you "positive reinforcement" for a crazy plan to protect your affair. We are here to support marriages, not affairs.