Believer,I'm with you 100% on that.What does anger me about OW is that she is a mother herself,doesn't she feel guilt for taking their father away from them?

I could not do that to someone elses kids....maybe the OW doesn't have much for brains...I dunno..can't fathom it out...

I do know she had nothing financially and was desperate so maybe she was thinking of her own families needs?

Most healthy women would think twice about having an affair with a married man. There is kind of a code between women that you just don't do that. So you know that she is NOT healthy.

Obviously WH spun her a story about being unhappily married etc...but if I was in her position I'd know that theres 2 sides to every story....

Also WH's friend informed me at the beginning of this year that WH had told OW that he was unsure of what he wanted to do.OW had been confiding in this friends girlfriend!..thats how he knew this info.

I wouldn't let a man live with me for a year with him saying that to me!!! Just shows me how much she needed him financially...and I think he knew it.Put him in a position of power too, knowing that I wanted him back as well.Yuck!!

I will never proactively work to forgive OW. I will try to think of her less and less, but will not forgive. When my FWH broke it off with OW and told her how they were both incredibly stupid and had brought such hurt and devastation into the lives of their families, her response was they could still be together because I would divorce him and people would get over it. She then went into HER big plan of how I, the BS, was going to do this and I was going to do that so it would be easy to have a future together and that she still "loved" him. Whatever residual fog was still in FWH's brain about her being a half way decent person prior to this conversation...was now gone, gone, gone and so was she. She will always be trash to me.

NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER....
AND IF THAT'S EVEN A LITTLE CONFUSING....

[size:20pt] NEVER!!! [/size]

Don't know from OW...

OM is as close to forgiven as he's likely to get...

He is still alive...

For now anyway.

I love what you posted lildog! I am around the 20 month mark - close to two years. For the last several weeks my IC has had me working on writing a letter (that will never get sent) to OW to pen down and tell her the hurt that has been caused to me and to tell her how I have come to forgive her.

I value myself enough to not carry around the bitterness, I was not created to be a wheelbarrow, carrying around the baggage - it only ends up hurting me - so she wins (or the evil if you will ) that was able to penetrate the vulnerabilities in my marriage wins - the longer I allow it to agitate, and the more I regurgitate it, ect.

This is a letter that I have tried writing around 8 or 9 times (but never finish) I get frustrated and tear them up and delete them from my computer. - and for some reason - I feel I am lowering myself by just engaging in this letter and speaking to her. (even though it will not be sent)

Your post lildog, has reminded me of hurt I have caused to others in my life. A perspective that I needed in order to really complete this important assignment. I realize that many stages of the healing of myself individually, and my marriage have been a series of processes. I have chosen to embrace each process. This forgiveness process of the OW is important for me - it is a gift to myself.

I believe that we have made such great progress - that we have a whole new marriage - I don't have my old marriage, and old husband back - I have a whole new marriage - new plans - new goals - new respect - new love - new boundaries - new dreams.

I feel that there is so much more ahead. I have a scar that will always be there no matter how sorry my husband is, no matter what type of IC we receive, or steps we take - I have to accept it. This has been one of the hardest things to do. I want to be free from the ravages of the OW in every way - the only thing I can do at this point is work through the forgiveness process as difficult as it may be - for me and move on.

There is so much waiting on the other side - I will not allow her or the memories of her - or bitterness I was feeling to hold me any longer or keep me in the muck or mire. I'm done with that whole gig.

Thank you so much for posting!

God Bless!

In my case...OW is a teacher...a profession which supposedly cares about children....she actually taught at my boys' school....well....I guess she was having a bad day when she figured out a way to justify having an A with WS...

I agree with Believer, though, if WS couldn't respect his committment to BS, why would OP?

I don't expect to forgive OP...I don't ever plan on crossing her path (by choice)....but it doesn't 'consume' me... as I can only imagine the pain when she ever has the odd occasional 'lucid moment' of realizing what she has DONE! ....(like blood on one's hands that's hard to wash off no matter how often you wash them!) ...I am certain of that....and I think that's punishment enough! ...and if not...I don't really CARE!

..it's not that I don't I have the POTENTIAL to be an OP....we all can... but I do think it may be a form of self-hate.... because I would have a hard time living with myself afterwards... especially if kids were involved! :RollieEyes:

...I'd much rather work on ways to be proud to look at myself in the mirror!

When I read the the original article for the first time, I thought NO WAY!! I was NOT going to ever forgive that DIRTY little WH*RE, and many other nasty names.
A couple of days later I was thinking about my reaction and I realised that firstly that is not me, I don't hate like that. H3ll I don't even think of my mother like that!

And a scripture kept coming to me "The measure you use will be measured to you".
Now if your not a Christian, the following will be boring and uninteresting to you.

When I first started to suspect Flick of having an A, I spent some time querying God. This lead me to read the book of Hosea, where God asks him to marry a prostitute. At the time I felt God was telling me that the way I felt Flick felt, about OW was rather how God felt about a couple of things I was more focused on than Him.

So I looked again at the scripture the other day. I have a study bible, and there is a point made for Hosea 2:16,17,19,20 about how forgiveness can save a marriage.

So while thinking on my reaction I realised that
1. how I judge her is how God will judge me.
2. I might not be having an A, but since all fall short of the glory of God and even our rightouness is like dirty rags in His sight I have nothing to skite about
3. that this scripture shows how God not only loves Isreal but also shows the depth and power in a marriage bond.

I refuse to spend the rest of my life allowing someone who ultamatey will have to answer to God for her actions, to have the power to make me so angry for the rest of my life.
That's my mums job

I posted the original article thinking there might be others on the same path as me, but futher along.

So for the poeple who didnt like the post, I am sorry, and I hope you can work thru it for yourself one day. For those who it helped even a little, thank you for your comments, it gives me hope that one day I will get there all the way. Right now I am only just scratching the surface.

Ding ! Ding ! Ding !

I can barely remember what OM looks like. He owed me no more than any scumbag in society does.

It is Squid I need to forgive.

Hi Lil,


Lil...I don't think there is a need to apologize... we are here to share... and we wouldn't be here unless we are open for 'food for thought'....

so, thank you for bringing up the issue of OP...as you can see.... we are at different stages on that topic... and bottom line...the discussion of ANY TOPIC can be used to move us along in our PERSONAL journeys...

Personally, I don't HATE OP.... I don't KNOW her.... I sometimes feel ANGER towards her... these days it's closer to indifference, and sometimes even PITY... I would NOT want to be in her shoes....wake up everyday KNOWING how much she has probably HURT those she loves around her....contributing to the destruction of WS's family... I would probably work very hard, like she probably does, at FINDING excuses to JUSTIFY my actions...or blame it on someone else...

Like BOB and Believer.... the biggest BEEF I have is with WS!
...he FAILED to protect his weaknesses (...because in a longterm R....issues will come up!....but WSs CHOOSE to use them to JUSTIFY their UNJUSTIFIABLE actions....no wonder both WSs and OPs work hard at believing their own lies and staying in laland... that does not make for a strong connection! :crosseyedcrazy:

...but I do continue to believe that for both WSs and OPs...an A is a short-term fix.... the problems they are avoiding WILL be back once the fog lifts...and they will be BIGGER and MORE OF THEM! :RollieEyes:

This is so true and why I firmly believe any and all WS's and/or OP's should seek IC to find out what is missing in them that helped lead them to make the poor choices to have an A so they can fix it once and for all.

On a side note, I find this discussion very interesting. My DH has told me in the past he doesn't think about my FOM ever, but he also has said he will never forgive him.

Because I knew FOM's W, during exposure (Jan 2005) I offered an apology which she said she was not able to accept, understandably. I know many feel when an OW apologizes it is to alleviate their own guilt. My apology was an honest attempt to show her I really did care, saw how wrong it was that I hurt her and had no right to invade her marriage.

Out of the blue at the end of March 2005 I received a note in the mail from her offering forgiveness. She is very religious, tied it to Easter and I can see how that forgiveness was for her sake not mine. It actually confused me quite a bit because I could not understand how she could forgive me when I was nowhere near able to forgive myself. She is a good woman to be able to do that, I have a great deal of respect for her and I hope it gave her peace.

LC

Personally, I don't believe it's a slippery slope for the OP. At least it wasn't in the case of our OW (at least I don't think so). The wh*re was twice divorced, three kids she didn't have custody of, was in a relationship. She knew damn well what she was doing and did it anyway. What makes me feel better is knowing that her life was a mess before, and her life will continue to be a mess. Karma can be a real b*tch sometimes.

I dont know if i will ever not be able to hate first OW. She is the only person in life that I have ever felt this way. I know my husband lied to her and told her that we were over and he was sleeping on the couch. Fine, but I can not accept that she sent money to my husband to leave his wife and 2 kids with the concept of never seeing them again. What person does that? THen when he left her to come back to them because he missed them, still contacted. Both of them are crazy. I have gotten to a point of not wanting to contact her or running her over at least. So who knows what is to come. I would love to forgive her and tell her, because I am sure it would tick her off, but of course doing it for that reason isnt good haha.


2nd OW... I pity her. We spoke, I begged her not to take him away from his kids. I told her that he was not logical and he was going to miss his family. I appealed to her motherly side. She still also paid for him to move to her. NOW she dumped him because he missed his family and she wanted to have his heart whole. DUH. She is going to wake up everyday knowing what she did. Her family is going to remind her.


My husband. I dont know. I am beyond angry at him for both of them. He gave up our children, and I have a hard time with that. I also have a hard time with how he treated me while he was screwing around and the lying.

Forgiveness.

For me it was/is about forgiving my ExH AND also forgiving myself for whatever part I played in a less than ideal marriage. For compromising my standards along the way.

OW was and always will be a nonentity to me. I did not have a relationship of any sort with her, therefore I owe her nothing. I will not give her any of my emotional energy and therefore my personal power. To me, it is not about her, it is about my Ex. Like Believer said, he is the one that held vows with me.

KiwiJen,
You are misunderstanding. It is not about receiving forgiveness from someone, it is about giving forgiveness. In the case of a wayward spouse, it is about forgiving yourself.

I have a hard time really hating my OW. WH met her in another state while on an assignment. When I finally called her, she told me that he told everyone there he was D'd. She said that people kept telling her that they suspected he was M'd, and she said that she did too after a few months.

She said that she would stay away from him but of course she didn't. I think he pursued her, however now I think she finally dropped him for someone else. The reality of the lies that he told her probably sunk in big time.

So I had a hard time blaming her. Like Bob P, I blame WH, and he is the one I struggle to forgive.....

Dear lifeschoice-

i so respect you for apologizing the the BS. when a WS apologizes, it says that they have grown to a place that says the recognize the pain they have caused another person, and they reget it.

However - i think you are a rarity.

My FWH had 12 affairs with different women- 2 of which i was good friends with - one my best friend. the others- i was friends or acquantances with all except 1.

We confronted the 2 close friends in person- one ( my BF) apologized only after i refused to listen to anything else she said.

Out of the others- NONE have apologized.

How easy would it be to send an e mail, or even a letter???? i know that an in person apology is more difficult, but they all have my e mail and address.

Instead - they deny, or avoid, or act aggressive, or ignore, or file law suits against me, ( for sending her a letter telling her what i thought of her) , or.......

That is why OP are who they are - they dont know how to empathize with someone else - or else they woudnt be an OP!!!!

So..if an OP grows to become whole and centered- the will want to apologize.

i congratulate you that you did that. You can not possibly know how much it means to the BS.

SF

SF,


Thank you.

I still get a little annoyed when I read posters say "An OW only apologizes to rid herself of guilt" because that was not the case for me.

I always taught my children if they did something wrong to someone they needed to apologize, but I also taught them the importance of actually meaning the apology. I told them if they didn''t mean it, then it wasn't worth the words and they may as well say "pink paper" instead of "I'm sorry". I taught then to think about how the other person felt then decide what a proper apology should be.

Many months after I ended the A, my own words to my children played over and over in my head. I thought about all I taught them and I knew I needed to apologize to FOM's DW. She most certainly deserved an apology because I did a really rotten thing to her. I knew she may not accept the apology (undertandably), but I still wanted to apologize. I did not expect she would send me a note offering forgiveness, let alone send it so soon after my DH talked to her to be sure she knew.

She is a big person and I have a great deal of respect for her for being able to do what she did. I hope my apology helped her in some way and I hope she knows I offered it for the right reasons and not to rid myself of guilt.

LC

LC-

The ow in my life were many and two were close friends.

if they aplogized- it would mean to me that they recognize the meanness of their behavior.

i am working to forgive them- as so many people said here- resentment is a poison i drink myself.

i want to live a happy life.

i am working on forgiving them in my heart- but i dont know about actually forgiving them. i cant imagine telling them i forgive them when they never apologized.

i may just write a letter to them and burn it.

SF

I started this thread such a long time ago. I don't know I could say I have forgiven OW, just she is nothing to me. I prolly would still deck her if I saw her, but she certainly is well down my list of people who tick me off

I 'forgave' DH a long time ago. He is my honey