Hello all,

I've been looking around here to get a feel for the place - haven't been here in a long, long time. Not sure if anyone here (still here) would remember me.

Never thought I'd ever be back. Hysterically, just last month I considered signing on to let the ones freshly wounded know that there IS hope.

What a laugh.

This has been going on for at least 6 months.

It's been 5 or 6 years?

I have NO ONE to talk to.

So I'm here.

Just found out yesterday that WH hooked back up with his girlfriend.

I can't begin to relate the whole in my heart. I'm borderline insane right now. One moment I want to curl up into a ball and cry, cry , cry. The next I want to kick and hit a spit. In between, I find myself remarkably removed from it and find it comical and absurd.

I can't go through this again. And I can never trust him again. I told him back then if he so much as ever spoke to her again, it is over.

Our 29th anniversary is Thursday.

How very sad.....

I'm so sorry.....

{{{{{{{{{{{Restarting}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

I am so sorry that you have found yourself back here again.

Do you think that you would be able to do a short Plan A and then quickly into a Plan B? The short Plan A would just be to get your Plan B sorted out.

Have you exposed your WH's affair? Was it exposed before? Did you two follow the MB program?

Welcome back. Take a look around some more, you may find some much needed help.

So sorry you are back here, restarting.

I would follow Dr Harley's advice and a) expose the affair wide and far, b) DEMAND that he end all contact for life or this will lead to divorce, and c) prepare for Plan B. I would make it clear to him that if he doesn't end his affair, he needs to move out. This should be a very, very short Plan A, so that conversation needs to take place now. Harley only recommends 3-4 weeks of Plan A to women when experiencing the FIRST affair. You are on affair #2, so it is even detrimental that you remove yourself as soon as possible.

Is this the same skank as before?

Restarting,

Did your WH ever recover from your affair?

God Bless
Gamma

I told him back then if he so much as ever spoke to her again, it is over.

Okay, that was then. What are you feelings about what you want to do now?

Obviously your major decision is whether to give him yet another chance to honor your marriage, or to end it now. We here can't make that choice for you. ML has laid out your opening moves if you choose the first. I will guarantee before this evening, someone else will try to guide you the other way.

Before the flurry happens, look into yourself and decide:

• If you think you owe him another chance,
• If you think he'll agree to all the affair-ending initiatives he'll be compelled to perform
• If you think he'll actually succeed in all those actions
• If you can ever view him as a husband again, if the first three are met to your satisfaction

You'll need four "Yes" answers to make this work, friend.

We don't know him or your marital condition. You do. Tell us how we can help you besides just saying we're sorry.

I discovered another affair last year after thinking we were in a pretty solid recovery for almost four years so I can somewhat relate to what you are going through.

Even though the new dday killed any desire on my part to recover the M, I was encouraged to follow the expose/plan a/plan b route just in the small chance that I changed my mind, not to mention that Plan B was the best thing to do for my emotional health...so I would encourage you to do the same.

{{{{{Restarting}}}}}}}

It is with sadness that I say "welcome back", Restarting.

I have spent some time reading your history and it seems that your sorry tale is a lot like mine. My H's affair started in March 2003 and I discovered it about 6 weeks later. I thought we had agreed for him to end the affair and for us to work on our marriage, but in 2005 I found out that the affair had simply gone underground and their commitment to each other was very deep and strong. (Indeed today, 26th March, is D Day.) I endured many false recoveries - about 6 - after that, until he changed jobs in 2006 and stopped travelling to her country.

In 2007 I began reading on MB and exposed their continued phone calls (via work, where I could not monitor them - he confessed these) to OWH, and the affair appeared to finally break down amid angry words between them about his unwillingness to leave me and his throwing her under the bus.

However, in 2011, I discovered that OW had been phoning my H (at work) roughly every six months to "see how he was" - and to see whether the door was still open for her. They hadn't seen each other for five years by then. The total time of the affair was 8 years - 3.5 years PA, the rest, the EA via phone calls. So, it seems that my timeframe is similar to yours, and the inability to end the affair is similar also.

My H has retired. Only this gives me the assurance that contact via work can no longer happen. He has no mobile phone or laptop and our PC is monitored. Equally important, we are coaching with Dr Harley via the online MB course, and I am happy with my H's recovery efforts. Of course, I cannot guarantee that contact will never again take place, but we have taken all the steps that Dr Harley outlines in his articles on surviving an affair, with the crucial one being to change the conditions that made the affair possible. My H was able to run a secret second life through his workplace, and now that he no longer goes out to work, that particular avenue is closed.

It is only because my H is now at home all day and because he is working the MB programme with enthusiasm that I feel able to work on recovery after all the false recoveries. I know you will appreciate how the false recoveries broke my heart. I think that, unless you have reason to be similarly confident that the conditions that facilitated the affair can be and are ended, you should separate from your H right now.

Only when he demonstrates to you that there can be no further contact with his whore should you consider reconciling. If he cannot demonstrate that for any reason, you should accept that your marriage is over.

I'm so sorry, Restarting.

As I was reading your history, I saw that in 2004, your H slapped you in the face when you told him to leave the house, after finding that he was still enthusiastically in contact with OW:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1216106#Post1216106

You need to take care that this does not happen again. I see that you have a married daughter and a son who must be in his early 20s. Can you arrange for them to be there when you talk to your H?

If your H lays a finger on you, call the police.

There is a lot about your story that you haven't told us.

You appear to have planned to separate (or to have actually separated?) more than once before. You have discovered your H visiting OW in jail, and giving her money. You have discovered letters written after your false recoveries, where he states that she is the love of his life. I cannot fill in the gaps in your story that led you away from separation and towards taking him back. What convinced you to take him back?

Also, what led to your discovery this time? If you were doing anything like spying on his phone or his emails, you must not tell him how you know. You need to keep your spying sources secret - and to institute some new ones. Do you have a keylogger on the PC, and on his laptop? Do you have spyware on his phone? If not, visit the forum Operation Investigate to learn more about what you should be doing.

Did this single OW ever marry or move in with another man? Has she been single and waiting for him all these years? Does she still live in your vicinity - and has she continued to be in and out of jail?

Tell us more about the circumstances and backdrop.

How much does your WH know about MB, both as a concept and as a site?

Thanks so much for the quick replies. I'd like to start with the last one and work my way back to the 1st:
Believe me when I say I chewed all these things over way back when. One of the most pressing issues I that (as I told him today) if he could justify it 6 months ago, then he has been justifying it for longer than that. On top of which, he tried to blame ME for it, as well. Fortunately for me, PTSD does a good job of pre-arming you even after a 6 year hiatus.

I had the full Library back then, but have since disposed of them (took me about 3 years of 'recovery' before I'd tossed them. I will have to review.

I know the thing to do is get on a Plan A, if only for me. The thing I worry about is EXPOSURE again. It would truly devastate his image in his children's eyes and my own immediate family.

He immediately called me today and told me when she called him and read here texts to me over the phone. Even HE remembers the requirements I'd given him back then. He also swore to let me go through his phones every night to check.

I can't be sure if he's cake-eating, tho, or sincere.

Given 6 months of hiding, however, and the fact that it was the same women, whom he has supposedly had no contact with for 6 years, I have some pretty serious doubts.

Filling in a few missing facts:

At the risk of alienating more than a few, I was an unfaithful spouse. Multiple times. I justified my philanderings as what a girl's gotta do to get ahead (Yes, I was sorely mistaken on several levels). When I first arrived here in 2004, I didn't confess that and as a result, despite my very real pain at D day and an ongoing E/P A of WH, many, many BH/Ws here felt just as much betrayed by ME. H had suspected, but never knew - until I confessed all.

He was "in love" and went to extraordinary lengths to see her and talk to her and whatever back then. It was a very tough battle. **His most recent text of "I miss you, too was only on THURSDAY"

We are in Atlanta, and she is in Tampa. There has been one trip to Tampa when he took my son (aged 25) to find a room to rent when he got a job (FINALLY, after 8 mo living unemployed with us) in Tampa. I think I remember him being out of touch and unreachable by my son for about a hour to hour 1/2 one evening. That may have been a meet up.

Come to think of it, he's been scheming for an excuse to make a trip down there for some time. (Damn. That slipped my mind.)

In his efforts at confession, he claims she found him. On Facebook. But he has no contact info on FB. He says she called his workplace (huge corporation) and got his work cell. That is the only phone with evidence of contact. (Calls, texts, pics.) There are at least FIVE different huge outfits under that name in just Atlanta. More outside Atlanta. I can't imagine her being that persistent and diligent in her search.

I am unemployed and a late returnee to college. Now what? Well, I can go back to work (can always find sales jobs) to support myself, so that is do-able. It'll be rough, tho.

Lastly, no, I am not at all sure I will ever be able to trust him again.

I was relieved after 4 years when the "Tmobile Jingle" (The phone I had back during my fight to end his A) finally didn't set my heart thumping in panic.

I'm not back to square 1, emotionally, but pretty darn close.

I do have to make a decision about exposure. I've considered asking him to do it himself.

I don't know about anyone else, but I had already seen in your past posts that you were a WS, as well. As awful as that was, it in no way justifies him subjecting you to the abuse of infidelity, too, and more than once besides.

As to exposure, his image is already ruined, his kids just don't know it yet. You aren't doing him any favors by joining his secrecy, whether you choose to R or not.

It sounds like NC would be very tough to verify, if it even occurred, since you already lived far apart and he likely had to search diligently for her. I think a quick prep for Plan B and a good while dark would be beneficial for you, even if he says right away that he will meet all your conditions. This A is very entrenched, and you don't want to risk your heart again without knowing that it's truly dead.

You will find the advice given on this board unrecognisable from when you were here years ago.

You will be told by absolutely everybody here that you must expose this affair. You must do this right away, to you children and to your wider families, and you must do this yourself. There is simply no point posting on MB if you are not going to take Dr Harley's advice.

There is no reason why you should not expose to your grown children. Indeed, there is every reason why they should know the truth about what their father is doing, daily, to threaten their family life. Why would you consider for a moment lying to them to protect his image in their eyes? Is his image worthy of protection? You would not have anything to expose if he had not been unfaithful to you. It is the adultery that rightfully destroys his image, not its exposure.

I wonder, though, whether you have put up with his ill-treatment because of your own rampant (at one time) infidelity. Do your children know about this? Is your unwillingness to expose your H due to the fact that you know your own past would have to come out?

Can you tell us about your own adulteries - or provide a link to a thread where you revealed this, please?

When did you confess your affairs to your H?

When did they take place, and how many were there?

Sugar,

I personally did all the hitting last night. I struck his arm bc it was too close to the pillow I was thrashing at in rage.

He did, however, break down our apartment door when he stomped out and I locked it behind him. He is mortified over that. Maintenance is repairing it right now.

With today's technology, I am not sure that reviewing his phone after work would even matter. He can just delete.

I discovered this in a weird way. He had been cleaning and organizing like a madman for about an hour in our little apartment while I studied (usually I am the one who does that.) Then, I get a call from him that he had decided to go get his work van cleaned. That was weird.

Both unusual things. Out of character.

Then he struck out on a bike ride (biking enthusuiest). That's usually one hour.

Two weeks previous, I'd woken to find him porn surfing in the middle of the night. This was his "gateway" drug before.... So I decided to investigate.

Local "escorts" were accessed and viewed just prior to him leaving the house.

I was SHAKING in PTSD. Decided to quit studying, go out and get a relaxing bottle of wine, to mull on it. AFTER I kept checking our bank account and CCards to see if there were any cash withdrawals.

Also, AFTER I'd checked his personal cell and home phone for those escort numbers.

As I approach my car, for some reason it occurred to me to check his van - to see if he'd actually cleaned it. Usually he locks it. I looked inside to see if it was clean inside. Then I saw the work phone.

I took it with me to my car, just in case he should return early. I was looking for the escort numbers.

My heart fell through the floor.

But you haven't told me what you found. Please be a bit clearer!

The physical abuse by either of you must not happen again. He is just as much within his rights to call the police on YOU if you ever touch him again, and you will most certainly find yourself on a domestic abuse charge, and possibly end up with a criminal record.

We have asked you a lot of questions. Could you try to answer them all quickly?

I confessed them sporadically and what was "safe" for me. I did not come totally clean until March of 2006, when my own OM keyed my car and threatened to get me fired when I refused to "take him back" after being out of the A for a year and 1/2.

I'd finally bitten the bullet, and decided within myself, that I could not live with myself if I did not confess everything. I left the decision to stay together in his hands. I accepted, in advance, that all my efforts to split up his A might have been worth nothing without the confession.

It was the hardest thing I ever did.

I'd say 10 OM.

Yeah. Dirtbag,POS.

I am still ashamed.

OH.

I found texts between them and records of calls.

The texts were, "why dont u call??" "R U ignoring me" a pic of bare breasts being held up to the phone porn style.

He had texted, "I sent 20 dollars" "I miss you too" and "I'll be leaving Columbas soon, I'll call then" "I'm at my favorite place (a HS he can't stand"

All far, far too chummy and familiar in current events for sporadic "I didn't want her to call" calls.

The thing about sending money really was terrible. She cost us a lot back in '04 and '05.

Restarting, you should not ask your H to expose himself. Exposure should be done with no forewarning at all. Telling him up front will only lead to a completely unncessary fight and defeat the purpose. Part of the reason your husband has remained in a semi fog all these years is because the affair was kept secret. Affairs thrive on secrecy and keeping it a secret keeps the fantasy alive. Keeping it secret hurts your husband, you, everyone. There is absolutely no valid reason to ever hide an affair. In fact, Dr Harley calls that "enabling" when a BS fails to expose and says "its very hard to save a marriage when you are an enabler.

So, don't hurt your husband by hiding this affair. Expose it to your kids, your family, close friends, everyone. Everyone should know what he is doing. Go read the link in my signature about how and why you should expose. Dr Harley beats this drum every day on his radio show: expose, expose, expose!

And most importantly, Plan A is not supposed to last more than 3 to 4 weeks so you need to work on wrapping this up and figure out how you can get him to move out so you can go into Plan B. 3 to 4 weeks in Plan A is way too long for a second affair. You already demonstrated to your H that you would be willing to meet his needs so you are way past that point.